A NON-CHARISMATIC UNDERSTANDING OF TONGUES

[obedienttogod]

No, they think it is the Holy Spirit, and have missidentified that the false miracles of KUNDALINI, as miracles of the Holy Spirit. You said it backwards. Most people NEVER claim it of KUNDALINI, because they are DECIEVED. Read it for yourself.


Matthew 24:24-25 (HCSB)
24 False messiahs and false prophets will arise and perform great signs and wonders to lead astray, if possible, even the elect.
25 Take note: I have told you in advance.

1 Timothy 4:1-2 (NKJV)
1 Now the Spirit expressly says that in latter times some will depart from the faith, giving heed to deceiving spirits and doctrines of demons,
2 speaking lies in hypocrisy, having their own conscience seared with a hot iron,

2 Thessalonians 2:9-11 (NIV)
9 The coming of the lawless one will be in accordance with the work of Satan displayed in all kinds of counterfeit miracles, signs and wonders,
10 and in every sort of evil that deceives those who are perishing. They perish because they refused to love the truth and so be saved.
11 For this reason God sends them a powerful delusion so that they will believe the lie


We currently have a Generation of people in the CHURCH that will TRUST THEIR EYES, and not the WORD OF GOD. THAT TICKLES SATAN, because NOW he has them believing every sign, is of the Holy Spirit. THAT generation has forgotten that Satan can do Miracles too.

I watched that entire video and have to say, I do not know of any Pentecostal church I know of doing anything remotely close to this. They had Kenneth Copeland (not Pentecostal), Oral Roberts (Methodist), and the big church in Florida also is not Pentecostal. I am confused then why the Pentecostal's are being connected to this movement?

I will agree, that I am not familiar with every Pentecostal movement. But i am familiar with Assemblies of God, Church of God, Assemblies of the Lord Jesus Christ, United Pentecostal, some independent Pentecostal churches, Oneness Pentecostal, Trinity Pentecostal, and NONE OF THEM are doing what I saw on that video.

And the American churches shown are not remotely associated with the Pentecostals.

Kind of irritating, because the video's host claimed to be a part of the Charismatic movement, which is not a Pentecostal format at all. And then the host connects the Charismatic with the Pentecostal's.

I am sorry, but that man might be correct about the Charismatics, but connecting it to the Pentecostal's, I would love to meet him and ask why he did such a thing

 

[Dino246]

You know what, Dino...

If someone believes a real believer, a brother or sister in Christ is of the Devil, that person is the dumbest human alive.

Get over it.

When it comes to the TRUTH, I follow the example of Yeshua, "I did not come to bring Peace, but to bring Division!!

That is what Yeshua did to his Denominations of His day, he brought them DIVISION, because they were not of the TRUTH!!

Me saying STUPID is no different than saying you are full of vipers and dead bones.

In fact, that is worse than stupid could ever be!!

You claim to follow Yeshua, but were not sent to bring division, any more than you were sent to die for the sins of another. You're just venting because you're offended. Jesus didn't do that.

 

[obedienttogod]

You claim to follow Yeshua, but were not sent to bring division, any more than you were sent to die for the sins of another. You're just venting because you're offended. Jesus didn't do that.

Nah, I come from a long line of preachers that understood Yeshua showed us, we can stand up for the TRUTH!! A preacher should never be a used car salesman, but someone genuine, that never withholds the Truth about any situation or scenario from you. They should be the epitome of tough love. And whenever they see something scripturally incorrect, that another person is using to make false claims concerning scripture, their Brother/Sister in Christ. They should immediately recognize the underline workings of the pits of hell in action, and rebuke it!! And when the pits of hell are working underline through a believer, all bets are off and politically correctness needs to be tossed out of the window!!

 

[Dino246]

Nah, I come from a long line of preachers that understood Yeshua showed us, we can stand up for the TRUTH!! A preacher should never be a used car salesman, but someone genuine, that never withholds the Truth about any situation or scenario from you. They should be the epitome of tough love. And whenever they see something scripturally incorrect, that another person is using to make false claims concerning scripture, their Brother/Sister in Christ. They should immediately recognize the underline workings of the pits of hell in action, and rebuke it!! And when the pits of hell are working underline through a believer, all bets are off and politically correctness needs to be tossed out of the window!!

Calling someone a moron or an imbecile is not "rebuking". Instead, it's inherently evil. You are without excuse.

 

[VCO]

I watched that entire video and have to say, I do not know of any Pentecostal church I know of doing anything remotely close to this. They had Kenneth Copeland (not Pentecostal), Oral Roberts (Methodist), and the big church in Florida also is not Pentecostal. I am confused then why the Pentecostal's are being connected to this movement?

I will agree, that I am not familiar with every Pentecostal movement. But i am familiar with Assemblies of God, Church of God, Assemblies of the Lord Jesus Christ, United Pentecostal, some independent Pentecostal churches, Oneness Pentecostal, Trinity Pentecostal, and NONE OF THEM are doing what I saw on that video.

And the American churches shown are not remotely associated with the Pentecostals.

Kind of irritating, because the video's host claimed to be a part of the Charismatic movement, which is not a Pentecostal format at all. And then the host connects the Charismatic with the Pentecostal's.

I am sorry, but that man might be correct about the Charismatics, but connecting it to the Pentecostal's, I would love to meet him and ask why he did such a thing

It is obvious that You are from a protected part of the Country that has not been invaded, yet. Because you have been protected, know the spiritual warfare is coming. He did not say that EVERY part of the Country or World has been invaded, but MANY. In California most of the Charismatic and Pentecostal Churches, MANY have merged on the subject of OUT OF CONTROL with what they thought was the Holy Spirit, but when you seriously look at it, it is obviously Kundalini spirit. My wife's Sister was in that Church big Church in Redding, California. Her Sister (My Wife) tried to get her out, but she refused. She also wanted to believe she had been Healed of Diabetes, and stopped her medicines. She died of Diabetes Complications, about a year later.

People have forgotten that Satan can do miracles TOO. Remember Jannes and Jambres, Pharaoh's magicians turned their Staffs into real snakes, too. So beware of anything that you perceive to Be OUT OF CONTROL, or Not Done Decently and in Order.

I know some Pentecostals Pastors can see right through the Counterfeits, but MANY CANNOT. I have a Friend in California that fits that Catagory, and he is a Pentecostal Pastor, and is a sharp critic of the phoniness he sees in the average Charismatic Church, and the Oneness Pentecostals. I think the Problem is when they SEE the Miraculous, they ASSUME IT HAS TO BE THE HOLY SPIRIT, instead of searching the Scriptures to SEE IF IT IS OF GOD. One person posted "WHERE TWO OR THEIR ARE GATHERED TOGETHER"; thinking that verse makes them immune to the Devil's Deception. How many people did Moses have with him when He went to Pharaoh ?

Exodus 7:10-13 (HCSB)
10 So Moses and Aaron went in to Pharaoh and did just as the LORD had commanded. Aaron threw down his staff before Pharaoh and his officials, and it became a serpent.
11 But then Pharaoh called the wise men and sorcerers—the magicians of Egypt, and they also did the same thing by their occult practices.
12 Each one threw down his staff, and it became a serpent. But Aaron’s staff swallowed their staffs.
13 However, Pharaoh’s heart hardened, and he did not listen to them, as the LORD had said.


See it? SATAN can do MIRACLES, even in a Church. In fact he loves to imitate the MIRACLES OF GOD, and most of the Charismatic and Pentecostals have forgotten that FACT.

 

[obedienttogod]

Calling someone a moron or an imbecile is not "rebuking". Instead, it's inherently evil. You are without excuse.

And you act like a whiny bickering person that is not getting their way with me!!

And if someone calls a true believer of the Devil, there are no real correct words for just how ignorant that actually is.
And yet, I do not see your whiny self speaking to them.
That's because you believe as them.
So when I say stupid, imbecile, moron, you know I am speaking to YOU as well!!

 

[obedienttogod]

It is obvious that You are from a protected part of the Country that has not been invaded, yet. Because you have been protected, know the spiritual warfare is coming. He did not say that EVERY part of the Country or World has been invaded, but MANY. In California most of the Charismatic and Pentecostal Churches, MANY have merged on the subject of OUT OF CONTROL with what they thought was the Holy Spirit, but when you seriously look at it, it is obviously Kundalini spirit. My wife's Sister was in that Church big Church in Redding, California. Her Sister (My Wife) tried to get her out, but she refused. She also wanted to believe she had been Healed of Diabetes, and stopped her medicines. She died of Diabetes Complications, about a year later.

People have forgotten that Satan can do miracles TOO. Remember Jannes and Jambres, Pharaoh's magicians turned their Staffs into real snakes, too. So beware of anything that you perceive to Be OUT OF CONTROL, or Not Done Decently and in Order.

I know some Pentecostals Pastors can see right through the Counterfeits, but MANY CANNOT. I have a Friend in California that fits that Catagory, and he is a Pentecostal Pastor, and is a sharp critic of the phoniness he sees in the average Charismatic Church, and the Oneness Pentecostals. I think the Problem is when they SEE the Miraculous, they ASSUME IT HAS TO BE THE HOLY SPIRIT, instead of searching the Scriptures to SEE IF IT IS OF GOD. One person posted "WHERE TWO OR THEIR ARE GATHERED TOGETHER"; thinking that verse makes them immune to the Devil's Deception. How many people did Moses have with him when He went to Pharaoh ?

Exodus 7:10-13 (HCSB)
10 So Moses and Aaron went in to Pharaoh and did just as the LORD had commanded. Aaron threw down his staff before Pharaoh and his officials, and it became a serpent.
11 But then Pharaoh called the wise men and sorcerers—the magicians of Egypt, and they also did the same thing by their occult practices.
12 Each one threw down his staff, and it became a serpent. But Aaron’s staff swallowed their staffs.
13 However, Pharaoh’s heart hardened, and he did not listen to them, as the LORD had said.


See it? SATAN can do MIRACLES, even in a Church. In fact he loves to imitate the MIRACLES OF GOD, and most of the Charismatic and Pentecostals have forgotten that FACT.

The moment I saw the guy with sleeve tattoos, who left is wife and married the girl he was cheating with while pretending to be a prophet. I immediate had a horrible feeling. Then he shook his head while speaking like he was prophesying. And I was like, that is a literal SNAKE walking upright (just like I imagine in the Garden before God cursed them to crawl on their belly).

Real believers should go and put a stop to that. All it would take is those who have faith and understand how to pray and bind those evil spirits.

The Kansas church is nothing but New Age.

It's literally sickening, and I still can't shake that horrible icky feeling I got from seeing that!!

 

[TooFastTurtle]

Question: How many churches in the Bible were "non-charismatic"?

Answer: 0

Conclusion: We should follow the Biblical example. God is still using people for His glory, and edifying the saints by spiritual gifts, which He gives according to His will.

 

[VCO]

The moment I saw the guy with sleeve tattoos, who left is wife and married the girl he was cheating with while pretending to be a prophet. I immediate had a horrible feeling. Then he shook his head while speaking like he was prophesying. And I was like, that is a literal SNAKE walking upright (just like I imagine in the Garden before God cursed them to crawl on their belly).

Real believers should go and put a stop to that. All it would take is those who have faith and understand how to pray and bind those evil spirits.

The Kansas church is nothing but New Age.

It's literally sickening, and I still can't shake that horrible icky feeling I got from seeing that!!

Thank you, for believing me. THAT IS RARE. I almost gave up on anyone from you side of the Fence, (Pentecostal), actually believing me. They see I do not believe in the modern day tongues movement, AND FLAT TUNE ME OUT. I have a serious warning that needs to be told to every tongues speaker. This was the message on a video by Dave Hunt, when he spoke to Pentecostal Church, on a video about 2 decades ago. Near the end of the video, he said, "The main concern I have your Church is that you are setting yourself up to believe the Great Falling Away." He was referring to the false belief that anything Miraculous that occurred in the Church, had to be of the Holy Spirit. YOU ARE RIGHT, Real believers should go and put a stop to that.

That guy that had the tattoos totally covering his arms, gave me the CREEPS, TOO. Those horrible feeling should be Normal in a True Believer, BUT THIS GENERATION FALLS for the most part, everything they perceive to be miraculous, had to be the Holy Spirit. In that same Dave Hunt video, he make the following statement at the end, "If a Witch Doctor came in wearing all his paint and feathers, trying to take over the Pulpit; two of you men would get up and grab him by both arms. Then you would carry him to the front door, and throw him into the parking lot. HOWEVER, if that same man came in wearing a suite and tie, toting a Bible, and even quoting from it once in awhile; I FEAR YOU WOULD LISTEN TO HIM ALL DAY LONG."

That is the exact feeling that the guy with his Tattoos all over his arms gave me. They had a WITCH DOCTOR in the Pulpit and they were going to listen to him all day long.

 

[obedienttogod]

Thank you, for believing me. THAT IS RARE. I almost gave up on anyone from you side of the Fence, (Pentecostal), actually believing me. They see I do not believe in the modern day tongues movement, AND FLAT TUNE ME OUT. I have a serious warning that needs to be told to every tongues speaker. This was the message on a video by Dave Hunt, when he spoke to Pentecostal Church, on a video about 2 decades ago. Near the end of the video, he said, "The main concern I have your Church is that you are setting yourself up to believe the Great Falling Away." He was referring to the false belief that anything Miraculous that occurred in the Church, had to be of the Holy Spirit. YOU ARE RIGHT, Real believers should go and put a stop to that.

That guy that had the tattoos totally covering his arms, gave me the CREEPS, TOO. Those horrible feeling should be Normal in a True Believer, BUT THIS GENERATION FALLS for the most part, everything they perceive to be miraculous, had to be the Holy Spirit. In that same Dave Hunt video, he make the following statement at the end, "If a Witch Doctor came in wearing all his paint and feathers, trying to take over the Pulpit; two of you men would get up and grab him by both arms. Then you would carry him to the front door, and throw him into the parking lot. HOWEVER, if that same man came in wearing a suite and tie, toting a Bible, and even quoting from it once in awhile; I FEAR YOU WOULD LISTEN TO HIM ALL DAY LONG."

That is the exact feeling that the guy with his Tattoos all over his arms gave me. They had a WITCH DOCTOR in the Pulpit and they were going to listen to him all day long.

YES, that is him^

I apologize for not getting what you were saying before. It literally took having to watch that video to see specifically what you actually meant. Partially, because it did seem that the Charismatics and Pentecostals were being bunched together as the same. But, My Grandfather was an Old Time preacher (Fire and Brimstone), so we walked the straight and narrow. We even were careful to the point of what kinds of books were allowed in the home, what we watched, what we listened to on the radio, all because spirits attach themselves to objects and can end up in your home. Even our worship, although we did celebrate and enjoy being in the presence of God with speaking in Tongues, my Grandfather held a tight leash on not letting anything get carried away.

Then my Dad was very much like my Grandfather, his Dad. We always believed in not getting under the control of self, but under the control of Yahweh through the Holy Spirit.

And now, I am very much like the both of them were. I keep a tight leash, because God is not going to be MOCKED, on my watch!!

 

[VCO]

YES, that is him^

I apologize for not getting what you were saying before. It literally took having to watch that video to see specifically what you actually meant. Partially, because it did seem that the Charismatics and Pentecostals were being bunched together as the same. But, My Grandfather was an Old Time preacher (Fire and Brimstone), so we walked the straight and narrow. We even were careful to the point of what kinds of books were allowed in the home, what we watched, what we listened to on the radio, all because spirits attach themselves to objects and can end up in your home. Even our worship, although we did celebrate and enjoy being in the presence of God with speaking in Tongues, my Grandfather held a tight leash on not letting anything get carried away.

Then my Dad was very much like my Grandfather, his Dad. We always believed in not getting under the control of self, but under the control of Yahweh through the Holy Spirit.

And now, I am very much like the both of them were. I keep a tight leash, because God is not going to be MOCKED, on my watch!!

I apologize for making it seem like they were one, and I know better. Pastor Ray was your style of a Pentecostal Pastor that was in the Prison Ministry with me. Sure we disagreed on tongues, but we never let that get in the way of our Friendship. Pastor Ray was a Fire and Brimstone Preacher too. Not my Cup of Tea, but I know some people do not feel like they have been to Church without that old style of Preaching. I lean towards Expository Preaching. Where they explain what the verse meant, other verses that say the same thing, and how it applies to lives. I attend a conservative evangelical Church that happens to be non-denominational. We believe that the TEACHING OF THE WORD, should dominate the Worship Service. So our Pastor limits the song service to 25 minutes, 10 minutes for Prayer, 5 minutes of announcements, followed by a 1 hour of BIBLE TEACHING Sermon. WHY ? ? ? Because HE told Peter to FEED MY SHEEP three times, not SING MY SONGS.

 

[VCO]

YES, that is him^

I apologize for not getting what you were saying before. It literally took having to watch that video to see specifically what you actually meant. Partially, because it did seem that the Charismatics and Pentecostals were being bunched together as the same. But, My Grandfather was an Old Time preacher (Fire and Brimstone), so we walked the straight and narrow. We even were careful to the point of what kinds of books were allowed in the home, what we watched, what we listened to on the radio, all because spirits attach themselves to objects and can end up in your home. Even our worship, although we did celebrate and enjoy being in the presence of God with speaking in Tongues, my Grandfather held a tight leash on not letting anything get carried away.

Then my Dad was very much like my Grandfather, his Dad. We always believed in not getting under the control of self, but under the control of Yahweh through the Holy Spirit.

And now, I am very much like the both of them were. I keep a tight leash, because God is not going to be MOCKED, on my watch!!

I see you met Dino246. I finally had to put him on my IGNORE LIST. All he wants to do is ARGUE. I will pray for your patience with him.

I wonder how he gets around this verses:

Galatians 5:17-21 (HCSB)
17 For the flesh desires what is against the Spirit, and the Spirit desires what is against the flesh; these are opposed to each other, so that you don’t do what you want.
18 But if you are led by the Spirit, you are not under the law.
19 Now the works of the flesh are obvious: sexual immorality, moral impurity, promiscuity,
20 idolatry, sorcery, hatreds, strife, jealousy, outbursts of anger, selfish ambitions, dissensions, factions,
21 envy, drunkenness, carousing, and anything similar. I tell you about these things in advance—as I told you before—that those who practice such things will not inherit the kingdom of God.

2 Corinthians 12:20 (HCSB)
20 For I fear that perhaps when I come I will not find you to be what I want, and I may not be found by you to be what you want; there may be quarreling, jealousy, outbursts of anger, selfish ambitions, slander, gossip, arrogance, and disorder.

Ephesians 4:31 (HCSB)
31 All bitterness, anger and wrath, shouting and slander must be removed from you, along with all malice.

Colossians 3:8 (HCSB)
8 But now you must also put away all the following: anger, wrath, malice, slander, and filthy language from your mouth.

 

[Dino246]

I see you met Dino246. I finally had to put him on my IGNORE LIST. All he wants to do is ARGUE. I will pray for your patience with him.

I wonder how he gets around this verses:

Galatians 5:17-21 (HCSB)
17 For the flesh desires what is against the Spirit, and the Spirit desires what is against the flesh; these are opposed to each other, so that you don’t do what you want.
18 But if you are led by the Spirit, you are not under the law.
19 Now the works of the flesh are obvious: sexual immorality, moral impurity, promiscuity,
20 idolatry, sorcery, hatreds, strife, jealousy, outbursts of anger, selfish ambitions, dissensions, factions,
21 envy, drunkenness, carousing, and anything similar. I tell you about these things in advance—as I told you before—that those who practice such things will not inherit the kingdom of God.

2 Corinthians 12:20 (HCSB)
20 For I fear that perhaps when I come I will not find you to be what I want, and I may not be found by you to be what you want; there may be quarreling, jealousy, outbursts of anger, selfish ambitions, slander, gossip, arrogance, and disorder.

Ephesians 4:31 (HCSB)
31 All bitterness, anger and wrath, shouting and slander must be removed from you, along with all malice.

Colossians 3:8 (HCSB)
8 But now you must also put away all the following: anger, wrath, malice, slander, and filthy language from your mouth.

It's ridiculous that you quoted OTG but directed this post at me. Clearly you didn't read post 1051, or my response to it.

 

[obedienttogod]

I apologize for making it seem like they were one, and I know better. Pastor Ray was your style of a Pentecostal Pastor that was in the Prison Ministry with me. Sure we disagreed on tongues, but we never let that get in the way of our Friendship. Pastor Ray was a Fire and Brimstone Preacher too. Not my Cup of Tea, but I know some people do not feel like they have been to Church without that old style of Preaching. I lean towards Expository Preaching. Where they explain what the verse meant, other verses that say the same thing, and how it applies to lives. I attend a conservative evangelical Church that happens to be non-denominational. We believe that the TEACHING OF THE WORD, should dominate the Worship Service. So our Pastor limits the song service to 25 minutes, 10 minutes for Prayer, 5 minutes of announcements, followed by a 1 hour of BIBLE TEACHING Sermon. WHY ? ? ? Because HE told Peter to FEED MY SHEEP three times, not SING MY SONGS.

Awesome!!

I agree, the WORD is more important while we are here on Earth. In Heaven, we will know everything there ever was to know. And from the example in Revelation's, we will generally be worshiping God in His presence the majority of the time. And yes, I am way more mellow than my Grandfather. He had you riding the altar 24/7. And the other times, people were scared to death back then. His reasoning was, that he was responsible for all of the souls who sat under him. And he wanted to make sure they knew that they knew that they knew they were saved. I can see that point of view, but at the same time, we are saved by Grace. And no matter how much you can try to will someone, ultimately it is up to them, on their own account to keep watch of their Salvation. All we can really do, is be a reminder and feed them so they stay fed and don't go looking to the world for nutrition.

Concerning worship, I limit it to 3 songs. If for some reason, one of the songs ignites people or you just can tell the presence of the Holy Spirit is moving in the worship. Then I wait on the Holy Spirit and let God have His way. Whatever I do, I do not want to quench the Holy Spirit or try to control God.

 

[obedienttogod]

I see you met Dino246. I finally had to put him on my IGNORE LIST. All he wants to do is ARGUE. I will pray for your patience with him.

I wonder how he gets around this verses:

Galatians 5:17-21 (HCSB)
17 For the flesh desires what is against the Spirit, and the Spirit desires what is against the flesh; these are opposed to each other, so that you don’t do what you want.
18 But if you are led by the Spirit, you are not under the law.
19 Now the works of the flesh are obvious: sexual immorality, moral impurity, promiscuity,
20 idolatry, sorcery, hatreds, strife, jealousy, outbursts of anger, selfish ambitions, dissensions, factions,
21 envy, drunkenness, carousing, and anything similar. I tell you about these things in advance—as I told you before—that those who practice such things will not inherit the kingdom of God.

2 Corinthians 12:20 (HCSB)
20 For I fear that perhaps when I come I will not find you to be what I want, and I may not be found by you to be what you want; there may be quarreling, jealousy, outbursts of anger, selfish ambitions, slander, gossip, arrogance, and disorder.

Ephesians 4:31 (HCSB)
31 All bitterness, anger and wrath, shouting and slander must be removed from you, along with all malice.

Colossians 3:8 (HCSB)
8 But now you must also put away all the following: anger, wrath, malice, slander, and filthy language from your mouth.

Even though it did concern me, about this relationship to the Charismatic (and at the time thinking also Pentecostal), being under the spell of seducing spirits. Which then seemed to lead me to think, that believers were thinking true believers were of the Devil due to speaking in Tongues. Dino I feel, was only trying to protect others in his own unique kind of way. I only pushed back, because it appeared he was protecting the side that seem to be attacking me.

But I do understand completely what you are saying, about how he does things. Kind of a Barney Fife, wanting to be the sheriff in town. He doesn't bother me one bit. He is after all, my Brother in Christ. And it's like most families, some you get along great with, and then there are the others, which you have to just keep reminding yourself that they are family!!

 

[VCO]

I apologize for making it seem like they were one, and I know better. Pastor Ray was your style of a Pentecostal Pastor that was in the Prison Ministry with me. Sure we disagreed on tongues, but we never let that get in the way of our Friendship. Pastor Ray was a Fire and Brimstone Preacher too. Not my Cup of Tea, but I know some people do not feel like they have been to Church without that old style of Preaching. I lean towards Expository Preaching. Where they explain what the verse meant, other verses that say the same thing, and how it applies to lives. I attend a conservative evangelical Church that happens to be non-denominational. We believe that the TEACHING OF THE WORD, should dominate the Worship Service. So our Pastor limits the song service to 25 minutes, 10 minutes for Prayer, 5 minutes of announcements, followed by a 1 hour of BIBLE TEACHING Sermon. WHY ? ? ? Because HE told Peter to FEED MY SHEEP three times, not SING MY SONGS.

So what do you find funny about that kaylagrl ?

Or are you laughing about your own opportunity to INSULT US ? ? ?

 

[VCO]

Awesome!!

I agree, the WORD is more important while we are here on Earth. In Heaven, we will know everything there ever was to know. And from the example in Revelation's, we will generally be worshiping God in His presence the majority of the time. And yes, I am way more mellow than my Grandfather. He had you riding the altar 24/7. And the other times, people were scared to death back then. His reasoning was, that he was responsible for all of the souls who sat under him. And he wanted to make sure they knew that they knew that they knew they were saved. I can see that point of view, but at the same time, we are saved by Grace. And no matter how much you can try to will someone, ultimately it is up to them, on their own account to keep watch of their Salvation. All we can really do, is be a reminder and feed them so they stay fed and don't go looking to the world for nutrition.

Concerning worship, I limit it to 3 songs. If for some reason, one of the songs ignites people or you just can tell the presence of the Holy Spirit is moving in the worship. Then I wait on the Holy Spirit and let God have His way. Whatever I do, I do not want to quench the Holy Spirit or try to control God.

It sounds like your Grandfather was the same kind of Preacher as the one that my late wife had in the Pentecostal Church that she was raised in. In the service this morning the we has 6 songs. However, we have a large choir and a FULL orchestra. I love it when they have a special Music Contada.

 

[VCO]

Even though it did concern me, about this relationship to the Charismatic (and at the time thinking also Pentecostal), being under the spell of seducing spirits. Which then seemed to lead me to think, that believers were thinking true believers were of the Devil due to speaking in Tongues. Dino I feel, was only trying to protect others in his own unique kind of way. I only pushed back, because it appeared he was protecting the side that seem to be attacking me.

But I do understand completely what you are saying, about how he does things. Kind of a Barney Fife, wanting to be the sheriff in town. He doesn't bother me one bit. He is after all, my Brother in Christ. And it's like most families, some you get along great with, and then there are the others, which you have to just keep reminding yourself that they are family!!

You have got to be close to my age. I am 70, and getting older by the minute. I can relate to Barney Fife.

 

[notuptome]

Question: How many churches in the Bible were "non-charismatic"?

Answer: 0

Conclusion: We should follow the Biblical example. God is still using people for His glory, and edifying the saints by spiritual gifts, which He gives according to His will.

There is no evidence in the bible to support your wild assertation. You demonstrate little knowledge of early church history and completely disregard the cultural and contextual setting of the early church.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

 

[VCO]

Awesome!!

. . . . And from the example in Revelation's, we will generally be worshiping God in His presence the majority of the time. . . . .

Some where between Rev. 3:22 and Rev. 6:10, we will hear the Trumpet of the LORD, and the Archangel SHOUT:

Matthew 25:6 (ESV)
6 But at midnight there was a cry, ‘Here is the bridegroom! Come out to meet him.’


What a GLORIOUS Day that will BE!