Hades / The Grave
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I feel Lazarus and the rich man is a parable despite the proper names. Besides it is just in one place in scripture without a second witness. 2 Cor. 13:1 "This is the third time I am coming to you. In the mouth of two or three witnesses shall every word be established." 
When Jesus speaks out a parable, He usually EXPLAINS IT. Parable of wheat and tares, sheep and goats, different fish, good samaritan. Jesus always explains the parables.
This one Jesus doesn't say its a parable nor does He explain it.
I got this interpretation: FIRE means FIRE, Hell means HELL.
And the quicker we annihilate the annihilationism doctrine of the Jehovah's falsewitnesses and other cults the quicker we get people saved.
Annihilationists agree with atheists, thats what we do know! No afterlife you're out. Thats gonna be like the atheist asking "why should I get saved again? I dont mind that!"
All what is a parable seeing without.. Christ spoke not?
The phrase "as it is written" (not as the eyes see) is a metaphor that indicates a parable is in view.
Comparing the things seen the temporal to that not seen, the eternal. and not those who compare themselves by and to themselve.as did the apostles when thye did not have the spirutl meaning of the parable. Parables teach us how to walk by faith, the unseen eternal
If the signified language of God as his tongue are not parables them what you call them? The literalized tongue?
Revelation 1 King James Version (KJV) The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to shew unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John:
That signified language applies to the whole book Revelation .
Makes me wonder when he does come on the last day will he find faith, the understanding hid in parable.. . .or will men walking after thier own expereinces of thier fleshly minds? I had a dream, I had a vison or out of the body ecxperence..The new age gospel. Did God really say?
The phrase "as it is written" (not as the eyes see) is a metaphor that indicates a parable is in view.
Comparing the things seen the temporal to that not seen, the eternal. and not those who compare themselves by and to themselve.as did the apostles when thye did not have the spirutl meaning of the parable. Parables teach us how to walk by faith, the unseen eternal
If the signified language of God as his tongue are not parables them what you call them? The literalized tongue?
Revelation 1 King James Version (KJV) The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to shew unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John:
That signified language applies to the whole book Revelation .
Makes me wonder when he does come on the last day will he find faith, the understanding hid in parable.. . .or will men walking after thier own expereinces of thier fleshly minds? I had a dream, I had a vison or out of the body ecxperence..The new age gospel. Did God really say?
Traditional theology has taught that this was not an actual event. However when Jesus was speaking to His disciples He did not call it a parable. Believing that this was an actual event demands that you reject the traditional teaching of the resurrection.
The question remains: What will you accept? Does Abraham still remain in the dust of the earth or is he among those captives who were
lead captive by Jesus?
The question remains: What will you accept? Does Abraham still remain in the dust of the earth or is he among those captives who were
lead captive by Jesus?
No it doesn't. "As it is written" is a clear statement that Christ is referring to old testament Scripture.
No; parables teach us about the nature of the kingdom of God, as Jesus tells us. "The kingdom of God is like...."
Parables are not the only kind of "signified language".
It doesn't apply to every word of Revelation, and it certainly doesn't apply to every word of Scripture.
No; parables teach us about the nature of the kingdom of God, as Jesus tells us. "The kingdom of God is like...."
Parables are not the only kind of "signified language".
It doesn't apply to every word of Revelation, and it certainly doesn't apply to every word of Scripture.
"The kingdom of God is like. . . . is a indication a parable is in view . Comparing the things seen the temporal to the things not seen, the eternal . . . . hidden from natural man. Again the right 20/20 prescription must be applied.
2 Corinthians 4:18While we look not at the things which are seen, but at the things which are not seen: for the things which are seen are temporal; but the things which are not seen are eternal.
A loving way to teach us to walk by faith as it is written not seen the eternal. And not by sight that seen the temporal.
Luke 9 beginnig when the disciples were in wonderment confussion...Jesus used it as a oportunity, aiding us in understanding the importance of parables . . again in learning how to walk by faith (the unseen) .
Luke 9: 43-44 And they were all amazed at the mighty power of God. But while they wondered every one at all things which Jesus did, he said unto his disciples,Let these sayings sink down into your ears: for the Son of man shall be delivered into the hands of men.
They did not find the meaning not seen (understood not )
Luke 9: 45 But they understood not this saying, and it was hid from them, that they perceived it not: and they feared to ask him of that saying.
Having not understood the manner of spirit again returned to walking by sight playing the Alpha dog who is the greatest with the greatest being eliminated .they could not understand him . It was like googlygoop, babel as a unknown tongu . ( Jesus is definitely not one of us...
Luke 9: 46 Then there arose a reasoning among them, which of them should be greatest.
Again in another parable
Luke 9: 47 And Jesus, perceiving the thought of their heart, took a child, and set him by him,And said unto them, Whosoever shall receive this child in my name receiveth me: and whosoever shall receive me receiveth him that sent me: for he that is least among you all, the same shall be great.
John not understanding the parable (no faith) but rather relying on the flesh as that seen, replied>>>
Luke 9: 49 And John answered and said, Master, we saw one casting out devils in thy name; and we forbad him, because he followeth not with us.
Jesus afforded another opportunity to teach men how to walk by faith and not by sight after the temporal . . . defines the "us" that make us and not the those who went out from us ..because they were not of the us as Christ again defines
Luke 9: 50 And Jesus said unto him, Forbid him not: for he that is not against us is for us.
Again not mixing faith in what they see and hear..
Luke 9: 51-53 And it came to pass, when the time was come that he should be received up, he stedfastly set his face to go to Jerusalem, And sent messengers before his face: and they went, and entered into a village of the Samaritans, to make ready for him.
And they did not receive him, because his face was as though he would go to Jerusalem.
Here they must of thought Jesus had really lost it (no GPS) saying one thing looking one way and doing another. They said just kill the misperceived competition consume them Like Cain with Abel out of sight out of mind .Same theme they follow not us walking by sight
Luke 9: 54 And when his disciples James and John saw this, they said, Lord, wilt thou that we command fire to come down from heaven, and consume them, even as Elias did?
Three times three denoting the end of the manner again jesus to help them understand parables revel that which is hiden form national unconverted man (no faith)
Luke 9: 55 But he turned, and rebuked them, and said, Ye know not "what manner of spirit" ye are of.
2 Corinthians 5:7 (For we walk by faith, not by sight
2 Corinthians 4:18While we look not at the things which are seen, but at the things which are not seen: for the things which are seen are temporal; but the things which are not seen are eternal.
A loving way to teach us to walk by faith as it is written not seen the eternal. And not by sight that seen the temporal.
Luke 9 beginnig when the disciples were in wonderment confussion...Jesus used it as a oportunity, aiding us in understanding the importance of parables . . again in learning how to walk by faith (the unseen) .
Luke 9: 43-44 And they were all amazed at the mighty power of God. But while they wondered every one at all things which Jesus did, he said unto his disciples,Let these sayings sink down into your ears: for the Son of man shall be delivered into the hands of men.
They did not find the meaning not seen (understood not )
Luke 9: 45 But they understood not this saying, and it was hid from them, that they perceived it not: and they feared to ask him of that saying.
Having not understood the manner of spirit again returned to walking by sight playing the Alpha dog who is the greatest with the greatest being eliminated .they could not understand him . It was like googlygoop, babel as a unknown tongu . ( Jesus is definitely not one of us...
Luke 9: 46 Then there arose a reasoning among them, which of them should be greatest.
Again in another parable
Luke 9: 47 And Jesus, perceiving the thought of their heart, took a child, and set him by him,And said unto them, Whosoever shall receive this child in my name receiveth me: and whosoever shall receive me receiveth him that sent me: for he that is least among you all, the same shall be great.
John not understanding the parable (no faith) but rather relying on the flesh as that seen, replied>>>
Luke 9: 49 And John answered and said, Master, we saw one casting out devils in thy name; and we forbad him, because he followeth not with us.
Jesus afforded another opportunity to teach men how to walk by faith and not by sight after the temporal . . . defines the "us" that make us and not the those who went out from us ..because they were not of the us as Christ again defines
Luke 9: 50 And Jesus said unto him, Forbid him not: for he that is not against us is for us.
Again not mixing faith in what they see and hear..
Luke 9: 51-53 And it came to pass, when the time was come that he should be received up, he stedfastly set his face to go to Jerusalem, And sent messengers before his face: and they went, and entered into a village of the Samaritans, to make ready for him.
And they did not receive him, because his face was as though he would go to Jerusalem.
Here they must of thought Jesus had really lost it (no GPS) saying one thing looking one way and doing another. They said just kill the misperceived competition consume them Like Cain with Abel out of sight out of mind .Same theme they follow not us walking by sight
Luke 9: 54 And when his disciples James and John saw this, they said, Lord, wilt thou that we command fire to come down from heaven, and consume them, even as Elias did?
Three times three denoting the end of the manner again jesus to help them understand parables revel that which is hiden form national unconverted man (no faith)
Luke 9: 55 But he turned, and rebuked them, and said, Ye know not "what manner of spirit" ye are of.
2 Corinthians 5:7 (For we walk by faith, not by sight
I would agree not every word just those that are inspired as sent . he signified them using the temporal seen to give us the unseen understanding .. which ones would you say. . looking at the five verses below ..?
I will highlight the ones that I think signify parable. Starting with a angel that has no form. or a literal key which I think signifies the gospel. Some literalist say Peter is the key ?
Revelation 20:1 5 And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand.
And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years,And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season. And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years. But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.
I will highlight the ones that I think signify parable. Starting with a angel that has no form. or a literal key which I think signifies the gospel. Some literalist say Peter is the key ?
Revelation 20:1 5 And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand.
And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years,And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season. And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years. But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.
.
Abraham replied: "Son, remember that in your lifetime you received your
good things" (Luke 16:25)
I should think that one of the negative aspects of hell is memory. How
people down there retain their memories sans the brain cells they left behind
with their corpse, I don't know; but they do, just as the rich man in that
story is able to experience thirst sans a flesh and blood tongue.
The older one gets, the more memories they accumulate, and many of those
memories haunt us with terrible regret. However, people in hell not only
have to cope with their bad memories, but also the good ones too, and I
should think it's remembering the good things they enjoyed in life that
makes their situation only worse in the heat.
If everybody was born and raised in hell; and never once ventured out; that
would be the only life they've ever known, so they wouldn't have a clue what
it's like to really live. For them the old maxim "Ignorance is bliss" would
certainly hold true.
_
Abraham replied: "Son, remember that in your lifetime you received your
good things" (Luke 16:25)
I should think that one of the negative aspects of hell is memory. How
people down there retain their memories sans the brain cells they left behind
with their corpse, I don't know; but they do, just as the rich man in that
story is able to experience thirst sans a flesh and blood tongue.
The older one gets, the more memories they accumulate, and many of those
memories haunt us with terrible regret. However, people in hell not only
have to cope with their bad memories, but also the good ones too, and I
should think it's remembering the good things they enjoyed in life that
makes their situation only worse in the heat.
If everybody was born and raised in hell; and never once ventured out; that
would be the only life they've ever known, so they wouldn't have a clue what
it's like to really live. For them the old maxim "Ignorance is bliss" would
certainly hold true.
_
No I was saying the ones that are signified tongue of God, are inspired.
Which ones in the parable found in Revelation 20:1-5 are signified and which one are literalized? Can a literal chain bind a lying spirit? What kind of key locks the gates of hell, a skeleton key. or the signified understanding. The gospel the binding and loosening authority? .
Which ones in the parable found in Revelation 20:1-5 are signified and which one are literalized? Can a literal chain bind a lying spirit? What kind of key locks the gates of hell, a skeleton key. or the signified understanding. The gospel the binding and loosening authority? .
.
● Luke 16:27-30 . . I beg you, Father, that you send Lazarus to my father's
house-- for I have five brothers --that he may warn them, lest they also
come to this place of torment.
You know what can be even worse than going to hell? Your own children
following you there: and they trusted you.
Here's a sort of cute story I heard once. I don't know if it's true but I guess
it's plausible.
A farmer went out to the barn in the dead of night after a snowfall to sneak
a pull from his liquor bottle. Just as he got to the barn door he heard
something behind him. Turning, the farmer recognized his little boy coming
towards him. In amazement he asked the little guy how he ever managed to
find his way out to the barn in the dark. His son replied: It was easy; I
walked in your footsteps.
One can only imagine the anguish that parents in the netherworld must feel
knowing that they inadvertently raised their children in an ideology that led
them down the road to hell and all the while sincerely believing themselves
doing the right thing. For some families, the only thing they have to look
forward to in the afterlife is a sad reunion in fire and despair.
_
● Luke 16:27-30 . . I beg you, Father, that you send Lazarus to my father's
house-- for I have five brothers --that he may warn them, lest they also
come to this place of torment.
You know what can be even worse than going to hell? Your own children
following you there: and they trusted you.
Here's a sort of cute story I heard once. I don't know if it's true but I guess
it's plausible.
A farmer went out to the barn in the dead of night after a snowfall to sneak
a pull from his liquor bottle. Just as he got to the barn door he heard
something behind him. Turning, the farmer recognized his little boy coming
towards him. In amazement he asked the little guy how he ever managed to
find his way out to the barn in the dark. His son replied: It was easy; I
walked in your footsteps.
One can only imagine the anguish that parents in the netherworld must feel
knowing that they inadvertently raised their children in an ideology that led
them down the road to hell and all the while sincerely believing themselves
doing the right thing. For some families, the only thing they have to look
forward to in the afterlife is a sad reunion in fire and despair.
_
.
Something I've been curious about for some time now is why the rich man in
Luke's narrative arrived in a place of flame and torment while the poor man
was taken to a place of comfort.
Well; one thing I strongly suspect is that at the time of the incident recorded
in Luke 16:19-31, Christ was not yet born in the land of Israel; so then,
there was not yet a gospel to believe in the New Testament.
Abraham mentions the Old Testament's law and its prophets; which
apparently the rich man had not studied, nor taken seriously; consequently
he was impious and a complete failure at complying with the covenant that
Moses' people agreed upon with God as per Exodus, Leviticus, Numbers, and
Deuteronomy. Well, if so; then that was a fatal error.
● Deut 27:26 . . Cursed is the man who does not uphold the words of this
law by carrying them out.
The grammatical tense of that curse is present tense rather than future,
indicating that the curse is instant, i.e. no delay and no waiting period; ergo:
scofflaws are walking dead men; and if they cross over into the next life as
dead men, then their fate will be just as solidly sealed as the rich man's fate.
_
Something I've been curious about for some time now is why the rich man in
Luke's narrative arrived in a place of flame and torment while the poor man
was taken to a place of comfort.
Well; one thing I strongly suspect is that at the time of the incident recorded
in Luke 16:19-31, Christ was not yet born in the land of Israel; so then,
there was not yet a gospel to believe in the New Testament.
Abraham mentions the Old Testament's law and its prophets; which
apparently the rich man had not studied, nor taken seriously; consequently
he was impious and a complete failure at complying with the covenant that
Moses' people agreed upon with God as per Exodus, Leviticus, Numbers, and
Deuteronomy. Well, if so; then that was a fatal error.
● Deut 27:26 . . Cursed is the man who does not uphold the words of this
law by carrying them out.
The grammatical tense of that curse is present tense rather than future,
indicating that the curse is instant, i.e. no delay and no waiting period; ergo:
scofflaws are walking dead men; and if they cross over into the next life as
dead men, then their fate will be just as solidly sealed as the rich man's fate.
_
.
● Luke 16:27-31 . . I beg you, father, send Lazarus to my father's house, for
I have five brothers. Let him warn them, so that they will not also come to
this place of torment.
. . . Abraham replied: They have Moses and the Prophets; let them listen to
them.
. . . No, father Abraham-- he said --but if someone from the dead goes to
them, they will repent.
. . . He said to him: If they do not listen to Moses and the Prophets, they will
not be convinced even if someone rises from the dead.
Abraham was a prophet (Gen 20:7) which means he was an inspired man.
As such, he would be privy to information that would normally be
unavailable to the average rank and file pew warmer. However prophets
aren't meant to keep what they hear from God to themselves; they're
messengers, e.g. Abraham was a teacher/mentor. (Gen 18:19)
So then, I think it's fairly safe to assume the information that Abraham
passed on to the rich man came to Abraham via inspiration; which, if so,
means that our reaction to his remarks should be very different than the rich
man's. He brushed aside what Abraham told him; but we, I should hope, are
wiser than that impious dunce because we know that a prophet's teachings
are the voice of God.
I think it's pretty safe to assert that if people won't listen to Abraham, then
neither will they listen to Jesus.
_
● Luke 16:27-31 . . I beg you, father, send Lazarus to my father's house, for
I have five brothers. Let him warn them, so that they will not also come to
this place of torment.
. . . Abraham replied: They have Moses and the Prophets; let them listen to
them.
. . . No, father Abraham-- he said --but if someone from the dead goes to
them, they will repent.
. . . He said to him: If they do not listen to Moses and the Prophets, they will
not be convinced even if someone rises from the dead.
Abraham was a prophet (Gen 20:7) which means he was an inspired man.
As such, he would be privy to information that would normally be
unavailable to the average rank and file pew warmer. However prophets
aren't meant to keep what they hear from God to themselves; they're
messengers, e.g. Abraham was a teacher/mentor. (Gen 18:19)
So then, I think it's fairly safe to assume the information that Abraham
passed on to the rich man came to Abraham via inspiration; which, if so,
means that our reaction to his remarks should be very different than the rich
man's. He brushed aside what Abraham told him; but we, I should hope, are
wiser than that impious dunce because we know that a prophet's teachings
are the voice of God.
I think it's pretty safe to assert that if people won't listen to Abraham, then
neither will they listen to Jesus.
_