Did Jesus ever tell us that we no longer need to keep the law of Moses?

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
Feb 28, 2016
11,311
2,972
113
Why would Paul be followed? That does not make sense? Paul is a fallible man... Jesus is King and Lord!
================================================================
John 10:14-16, - I Am The Good Shepherd. I know my own and my own know me, 15 just as the Father knows me and I know the Father; and I lay down my life for the sheep. 16 And I have other sheep that are not of this fold. I must bring them also, and they will listen to my voice. So there will be one flock, one shepherd.
============================================
1COR. 11:1.
Be you followers of Me, even as I also am of Christ. - the reason that Paul says this is because these are absolutely
'babies-in-Christ', - he is not 'usurping Christ, he is most certainly 'serving Him', he had the 'road of Damscus conversion!,
he is a most 'loyal-servant', he describes himself as the most evil-sinner among all men, and yet, Christ 'chose him', for
his 'mis-directed zealousness'!!! He loved him so much that He pointed and appointed him to become His most faithful
and powerful servant as His representative for ALL OF THE WORLD!!!
(Paul never disagrees with Jesus Christ), but Paul is difficult to 'understand'...
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
How could you lose salvation if you are working Gods Laws? NOT THAT I AM (which I am really starting to resent typing), it just strikes me as a very strange statement. Cause it would sound like this

"I am following all of Gods Laws so that I do not lose the free gift of salvation that God gave me" Then that person gets in front of God and God says " You gifted me with salvation yet I still followed your laws so you wouldn't take it back. And God says "I gifted you salvation, yet you followed all my laws, so you are out of here"
Because you believe failure to obey causes loss of salvation
 

RickStudies

Active member
Sep 10, 2019
782
222
43
Well considering your not really contributing anything thats not hard to do

As i said before, i will comment on stuff you claim if i disagree, and call you out when you lie about others
I haven`t seen much to comment on. Most of you just keep repeating the same things and the majority of that is just name calling and slurs.At this point I`m just looking at this board when I get a little bored while I`m resting my knee. I stopped trying to put up new topics to talk about.
 

RickStudies

Active member
Sep 10, 2019
782
222
43
Because you believe failure to obey causes loss of salvation

Some of the seeds in the parable sprouted and came to life for awhile. They had life so they had a temporary salvation of some kind. The sprouts that didn`t make it had no fruit and it goes without saying that they disobeyed.


14 The sower soweth the word.

15 And these are they by the way side, where the word is sown; but when they have heard, Satan cometh immediately, and taketh away the word that was sown in their hearts.

16 And these are they likewise which are sown on stony ground; who, when they have heard the word, immediately receive it with gladness;

17 And have no root in themselves, and so endure but for a time: afterward, when affliction or persecution ariseth for the word's sake, immediately they are offended.

18 And these are they which are sown among thorns; such as hear the word,

19 And the cares of this world, and the deceitfulness of riches, and the lusts of other things entering in, choke the word, and it becometh unfruitful.

20 And these are they which are sown on good ground; such as hear the word, and receive it, and bring forth fruit, some thirtyfold, some sixty, and some an hundred.
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
Going back to find the meanins of Yoke and burden, clears up any misconception, I hope. bondage or servitude and obligations.

Matthew 11:29 Take my yoke upon you, and learn of me for I am meek and lowly in heart and ye shall find (not receive immediately) rest unto your souls.

Matthew 11:30 For my yoke is easy, and my burden is light


2218 zugos
metaphorically, used of any burden or bondage as that of slavery

the name is so transferred to the commands of Christ as to contrast them with the commands of the Pharisees which were a veritable 'yoke'; yet even Christ's commands must be submitted to, though easier to be kept

From the root of zeugnumi (to join, especially by a "yoke"); a coupling, i.e. (figuratively) servitude (a law or obligation)

5413 phortion
of the obligations Christ lays upon his followers, and styles a 'burden' by way of contrast to the precepts of the Pharisees the observance of which was most oppressive
For he has not given us a spirit of fear, but of sound mind

Where would fear come from?
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
I haven`t seen much to comment on. Most of you just keep repeating the same things and the majority of that is just name calling and slurs.At this point I`m just looking at this board when I get a little bored while I`m resting my knee. I stopped trying to put up new topics to talk about.
Well you must be bored, to the point you just want to argue with me for some reason.
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
Some of the seeds in the parable sprouted and came to life for awhile. They had life so they had a temporary salvation of some kind. The sprouts that didn`t make it had no fruit and it goes without saying that they disobeyed.


14 The sower soweth the word.

15 And these are they by the way side, where the word is sown; but when they have heard, Satan cometh immediately, and taketh away the word that was sown in their hearts.

16 And these are they likewise which are sown on stony ground; who, when they have heard the word, immediately receive it with gladness;

17 And have no root in themselves, and so endure but for a time: afterward, when affliction or persecution ariseth for the word's sake, immediately they are offended.

18 And these are they which are sown among thorns; such as hear the word,

19 And the cares of this world, and the deceitfulness of riches, and the lusts of other things entering in, choke the word, and it becometh unfruitful.

20 And these are they which are sown on good ground; such as hear the word, and receive it, and bring forth fruit, some thirtyfold, some sixty, and some an hundred.
They had no fruit because they were never saved

True children produce fruit, false children do not, because their faith is dead (see james 2)
 

RickStudies

Active member
Sep 10, 2019
782
222
43
Well you must be bored, to the point you just want to argue with me for some reason.
I don`t care about talking with you at all. The post was for DeighAnn`s benefit.

Also, if I were having discussion with reasonable, polite, honest people I would be interested in their thoughts about the life in the sprout that died.

Christians that fail often have the touch of God in them for a season and the conditional salvation position has it`s scriptures. I`ve never been fully satisfied in rejecting it, not that I expect to see anything good on the topic by you or some of your cronies.

With the right people I would enjoy considering some opinions about it. And I don`t mean the standard that`s wrong Judah nonsense I see in here all time. I mean real opinions by people who have different views on the topic.
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
I don`t care about talking with you at all. The post was for DeighAnn`s benefit.

Also, if I were having discussion with reasonable, polite, honest people I would be interested in their thoughts about the life in the sprout that died.

Christians that fail often have the touch of God in them for a season and the conditional salvation position has it`s scriptures. I`ve never been fully satisfied in rejecting it, not that I expect to see anything good on the topic by you or some of your cronies.

With the right people I would enjoy considering some opinions about it. And I don`t mean the standard that`s wrong Judah nonsense I see in here all time. I mean real opinions by people who have different views on the topic.
You can’t expect people to be polite and reasonable when you are not.

You really need to look in a mirror my friend
 

RickStudies

Active member
Sep 10, 2019
782
222
43
You can’t expect people to be polite and reasonable when you are not.

You really need to look in a mirror my friend
I have been polite and always reasonable for quite awhile now. I quit retaliating when I gave up trying to contribute new topics. You just don`t realize it.
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
I`ve made an effort to be nice to you, you just don`t have the insight to see it.
I would not call what you did this afternoon being nice.

I would call it trying to pick a fight. Felt like high school
 

RickStudies

Active member
Sep 10, 2019
782
222
43
I would not call what you did this afternoon being nice.

I would call it trying to pick a fight. Felt like high school
You take things that I say the wrong way. It`s also interesting to note that you boast about how you will post when you disagree with me but you don`t like it when I disagree with you.
 

Grandpa

Senior Member
Jun 24, 2011
11,551
3,190
113
I find it hard to discuss things with you because you often seem impolite, If we were talking Bible face to face I don`t think you`d jump on me with the false accusation and name calling like you did here.

I keep getting called a legalist Judaizer by you and some of the others here. That isn`t having a conversation, it`s just dishonest.
You seem to endorse the things the other legalists and judaizers are saying.

So guilt by association I suppose.

Plus, your 2 gospel theory didn't help you too much in that area either. You have to know that, right?
 

RickStudies

Active member
Sep 10, 2019
782
222
43
You seem to endorse the things the other legalists and judaizers are saying.

So guilt by association I suppose.

Plus, your 2 gospel theory didn't help you too much in that area either. You have to know that, right?
I endorse what Paul told Timothy about it.

And the two gospels isn`t a theory, it`s just a simple literal interpretation of certain scriptures in the Bible. Belief in Paul`s gospel is anti legalist. It`s not a reasonable assertion to call someone who believes in Paul`s doctrine a judaizer.
 
Aug 17, 2019
226
167
43
Sorry

But are you still under the schoolmaster?

If your no longer under the schoolmaster, your work at trying to fulfill the commands to receive blessing from god is completed. Because you have stopped trying and repented and came to receive his grace
Because you believe failure to obey causes loss of salvation
If the command does not tell you every possible way to break it how can you know you kept it?
So, through love and sacrificing outpr own needs and putting the needs of ithers above our own, we will be people who are obedient and not break gods commands

I agree

Which is why we do not need the law, the law can not help us do those things,

Why do you think the law was written on our hearts if we do not need it? Did Jesus say that we don't need the law? When He gave the instructions to preach the gospel and teach people to obey whatever He commanded them, does that not include the 10 commandments which were summed up in this one rule: "love your neighbour as yourself"?
Yep...

...Gods people keep his commands why?

B cause they follow the law of love, not the law of moses

We agree, gods people obey him

We disagree how or by what power
In the very same way, these dreamers pollute their own bodies, reject authority and slander celestial beings. But even the archangel Michael, when he was disputing with the devil about the body of Moses, did not dare to bring a slanderous accusation against him, but said, “The Lord rebuke you!” Yet these men speak abusively against whatever they do not understand; and what things they do understand by instinct, like unreasoning animals—these are the very things that destroy them. Woe to them! They have taken the way of Cain; they have rushed for profit into Balaam’s error; they have been destroyed in Korah’s rebellion. These men are blemishes at your love feasts, eating with you without the slightest qualm—shepherds who feed only themselves. They are clouds without rain, blown along by the wind; autumn trees, WITHOUT FRUIT and uprooted—TWICE DEAD. They are wild waves of the sea, foaming up their shame; wandering stars, for whom blackest darkness has been reserved forever. Enoch, the seventh from Adam, prophesied about these men: “See, the Lord is coming with thousands upon thousands of his holy ones to judge everyone, and to convict all the ungodly of all the ungodly acts they have done in the ungodly way, and of all the harsh words ungodly sinners have spoken against him.” These men are grumblers and faultfinders; they follow their own evil desires; they boast about themselves and flatter others for their own advantage. A Call to Persevere But, dear friends, remember what the apostles of our Lord Jesus Christ foretold. They said to you, “In the last times there will be scoffers who will follow their own ungodly desires.” THESE ARE THE MEN WHO DIVIDE YOU, who follow mere natural instincts and do not have the Spirit.
Jude 1:8-19

The Spirit gives life; the flesh counts for nothing. The words I have spoken to you are spirit and they are life John 6:63

“Why do you ask me about what is good?” Jesus replied. “There is only One who is good. If you want to enter life, obey the commandments.” “Which ones?” the man inquired. Jesus replied, “‘Do not murder, do not commit adultery, do not steal, do not give false testimony, honor your father and mother,’ and ‘love your neighbor as yourself.’” Matthew 19:17-19

And this is his command: to believe in the name of his Son, Jesus Christ, and to love one another as he commanded us. Those who obey his commands live in him, and he in them. And this is how we know that he lives in us: We know it by the Spirit he gave us. 1 John 3:23-24

There is only one Lawgiver and Judge, the one who is able to save and destroy. But you—who are you to judge your neighbor? James 4:12

The Master's word/s is a law to His servants, written on their hearts.

Confess Jesus as your Lord and Savior and walk in Love.

God is good and His Love endures forever. Amen.
 

Shekinahglory

Active member
Aug 29, 2019
157
62
28
I don't know. I have mixed feelings here.

On the one hand, it was kind of provoking a fight. And wrong.

On the other, how do you go on a Christian site and say things like Jesus Christ is an abomination to God and not expect a fight?

I guess I'm not mature enough yet to ignore things like this... I try to be nice...
doctrine is a flash point I think for a lot of us. I think you are doing fine and like all of us He hasn't finished the work He began in each of us. When I don't lose my head I try and remember the encounter with Saul and the Lord asked him why he was doing the things to the Lord not the people who were actually attacked by Saul. Whatever is said whatever is done is all done to him. So we will walk this wilderness of sin together and trust we can speak kindly with full truth. Here is one of my other big failures, warn some one who is disruptive and then have nothing to do with them. When you want to run them over its hard to remember be nice. What so nice is He knows exactly how we feel and He loves our spirit He is a wonderful, faithful, merciful < Husband and He has our reward. Our works will be tried at the end and all that isn't done in love and the ministry of reconcilliation I think will be burned and we will suffer loss. Hang in there friend He will get us all through. God bless
 
Jan 12, 2019
7,497
1,399
113
Why would Paul be followed? That does not make sense? Paul is a fallible man... Jesus is King and Lord!

Jesus words are clear:

John 12:48, “He who rejects Me, and does not follow My words has One Who judges him. The word that I have spoken, the same will be used to judge him in the last day.”

John 14:23-26, " 23 Jesus answered him, “If anyone loves me, he will keep my word, and my Father will love him, and we will come to him and make our home with him. 24 Whoever does not love me does not keep my words. And the word that you hear is not mine but the Father's who sent me. 25 “These things I have spoken to you while I am still with you. 26 But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, he will teach you all things and bring to your remembrance all that I have said to you."

This is the first I have heard that we should follow Paul and not Jesus, this is odd to me...

If Jesus says there is ONE Shepherd, how can there be two?

John 10:14-16, " 14 I am the good shepherd. I know my own and my own know me, 15 just as the Father knows me and I know the Father; and I lay down my life for the sheep. 16 And I have other sheep that are not of this fold. I must bring them also, and they will listen to my voice. So there will be one flock, one shepherd.
To understand why Paul is the apostle to the Gentiles, it will help to understand why Moses is the lawgiver, why the entire Law is summed up as the "Law of Moses", even though the Law was given by God.

Even Jesus himself referred to the Law as "The Law of Moses". As he is living under the law, he is also subjected to Moses. (John 5:46, Matthew 19:8, Matthew 23:1, 2, Mark 7:9, 10).

Moses authority has been challenged before by the Jews, who wanted to hear directly from God instead. In the famous story recounted in Numbers 12

And Miriam and Aaron spake against Moses because of the Ethiopian woman whom he had married: for he had married an Ethiopian woman.

2 And they said, Hath the Lord indeed spoken only by Moses? hath he not spoken also by us? And the Lord heard it.

3 (Now the man Moses was very meek, above all the men which were upon the face of the earth.)

8 With him will I speak mouth to mouth, even apparently, and not in dark speeches; and the similitude of the Lord shall he behold: wherefore then were ye not afraid to speak against my servant Moses?

9 And the anger of the Lord was kindled against them; and he departed.

Likewise, almost all of us are Gentiles here. We belong to the Church, and in this age of grace, Paul is our apostle, his importance is equivalent to Moses, as the lawgiver to the Jews.

Paul's words are the words of the ascended Lord Jesus to his Church, and we will do well to follow what Paul is saying, as instructed in 1 Corinthians 14:37

If any man think himself to be a prophet, or spiritual, let him acknowledge that the things that I write unto you are the commandments of the Lord.