Not By Works

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eternally-gratefull

Guest
So you responded to chris1975's post of:
"I suspect if the apostles Peter and James were commenting on this forum, you would accuse them of being works salvationists. For it is their scriptures you kick against."

With:

"I suspect you would do the same to Jesus regarding His proclamation that whoever believes in Him shall not perish but have everlasting life."

To which I responded:

"It is written, “Whoever believes in Him is born of God.” “No one who is born of God sins.” So who is really believing in Him? He also said anyone who believed in Him would do what He was doing, referring to His miracles.

Very little of what is called faith and believing really is what the label says. There’s a lot of mental ascent and wishful thinking but not as many lives radically changed. Lots of “church” members but few disciples.

These signs will follow them who believe. The world needs to see some blind eyes opened. He confirms His Word by the signs that accompany it. Let us return to the Lord."

Respond to the post.
People have

stop ignoring people!
 
Dec 6, 2019
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A-HA, so the distinguishing characteristic is this: Those who have faith have obedience to His Word.

You have just admitted to it.
He never said otherwise. Eternally Grateful seems to have good doctrine

I once thought Eternal Security taught liberty to sin. It doesn’t. Not when properly understood. Quite the contrary, when properly understood.

Actually, there’s people in both OSAS and NOSAS that act like we have liberty to do as we please. Believing one can lose their salvation is not the secret to holy heart leading to obedient life. Faith, hope, and love through the Spirit are. Produced by God in us. As we abide in Him

OSAS people who understand OSAS know this. But they are not trusting their ability to be steadfast, rather in the steadfastness of Jesus.
 
Dec 6, 2019
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He never said otherwise. Eternally Grateful seems to have good doctrine

I once thought Eternal Security taught liberty to sin. It doesn’t. Not when properly understood. Quite the contrary, when properly understood.

Actually, there’s people in both OSAS and NOSAS that act like we have liberty to do as we please. Believing one can lose their salvation is not the secret to holy heart leading to obedient life. Faith, hope, and love through the Spirit are. Produced by God in us. As we abide in Him

OSAS people who understand OSAS know this. But they are not trusting their ability to be steadfast, rather in the steadfastness of Jesus.
And holding on to the hope of our confidence to the end is also the result of faith, hope, and love flowing like oil from the throne to our Lamps from Jesus, the High Priest who is the continual provider of oil
 

Lightskin

Well-known member
Aug 16, 2019
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So you responded to chris1975's post of:
"I suspect if the apostles Peter and James were commenting on this forum, you would accuse them of being works salvationists. For it is their scriptures you kick against."

With:

"I suspect you would do the same to Jesus regarding His proclamation that whoever believes in Him shall not perish but have everlasting life."

To which I responded:

"It is written, “Whoever believes in Him is born of God.” “No one who is born of God sins.” So who is really believing in Him? He also said anyone who believed in Him would do what He was doing, referring to His miracles.

Very little of what is called faith and believing really is what the label says. There’s a lot of mental ascent and wishful thinking but not as many lives radically changed. Lots of “church” members but few disciples.

These signs will follow them who believe. The world needs to see some blind eyes opened. He confirms His Word by the signs that accompany it. Let us return to the Lord."

Respond to the post.
I have the utmost faith in Jesus Christ.
I don’t have faith in you whatsoever that you will never drive 26 mph in a 25 mph zone. And you didn’t answer my question; are you a god?
 

Lightskin

Well-known member
Aug 16, 2019
3,165
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If you do not think you Think you are SINLESS, I Have NEWS FOR YOU. YOU ARE AS SINNER LIKE THE REST OF US.

Ecclesiastes 7:20 (NKJV)
20 For there is not a just man on earth who does good And does not sin.

Romans 3:20 (NKJV)
20 Therefore by the deeds of the law no flesh will be justified in His sight, for by the law is the knowledge of sin.


The purpose of the LAW has never been a system to be right with GOD, it has always been to make us Knowledgeable of what all GOD CONSIDERS SIN, to make want and seek a MESSIAH.

1 Peter 2:13-17 (NKJV)
13 Therefore submit yourselves to every ordinance of man for the Lord's sake, whether to the king as supreme,
14 or to governors, as to those who are sent by him for the punishment of evildoers and for the praise of those who do good.
15 For this is the will of God, that by doing good you may put to silence the ignorance of foolish men--
16 as free, yet not using liberty as a cloak for vice, but as bondservants of God.
17 Honor all people. Love the brotherhood. Fear God. Honor the king. 🖜 That is President Donald Trump, if you are an American.

View attachment 208616
One mile over the Posted Speed Limit, even accidentally, YOU ARE SINNING.

View attachment 208617
Illegally Parked, for any reason, YOU ARE SINNING.



Failure to Leash Your Dog, And Failure to pick up it's poop, YOU ARE SINNING.


Now, you think of how many ORDINANCES OF MAN, you have ignored, and still think you do not sin.

Yes I strive to not violate those simple ordinances of man, as well as GOD's Other Commands, it is my lifestyle,
But I will never imply that I am sinless.
Truth!
 
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EleventhHour

Guest
So you responded to chris1975's post of:
"I suspect if the apostles Peter and James were commenting on this forum, you would accuse them of being works salvationists. For it is their scriptures you kick against."

With:

"I suspect you would do the same to Jesus regarding His proclamation that whoever believes in Him shall not perish but have everlasting life."

To which I responded:

"It is written, “Whoever believes in Him is born of God.” “No one who is born of God sins.” So who is really believing in Him? He also said anyone who believed in Him would do what He was doing, referring to His miracles.

Very little of what is called faith and believing really is what the label says. There’s a lot of mental ascent and wishful thinking but not as many lives radically changed. Lots of “church” members but few disciples.

These signs will follow them who believe. The world needs to see some blind eyes opened. He confirms His Word by the signs that accompany it. Let us return to the Lord."

Respond to the post.
Yes let us return to the Lord by teaching the Gospel of the New Testament ...

The true one that is received as a gift ...not the false one that is earned as a trade off for good works.
 
Dec 12, 2013
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A different definition? So did Paul use a different definition of the word 'sanctified' in 1 Corinthians 7:14? Paul here uses it to specifically refer to unbelievers who are "sanctified" or "set apart" by their believing spouse. *1 Corinthians 7:14 - For the unbelieving husband is sanctified by the wife, and the unbelieving wife is sanctified by the husband; otherwise your children would be unclean, but now they are holy.

Strong's Concordance
hagiazó: to make holy, consecrate, sanctify
Original Word: ἁγιάζω
Part of Speech: Verb
Transliteration: hagiazó
Phonetic Spelling: (hag-ee-ad'-zo)
Definition: to make holy, consecrate, sanctify
Usage: I make holy, treat as holy, set apart as holy, sanctify, hallow, purify.

If the word 'sanctified' in Hebrews 10:29 is used to describe saved people who lost their salvation as you teach, then we have a contradiction because the writer of Hebrews in verse 10 said "sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all" (Hebrews 10:10) and in verse 14, we read, "perfected for all time those who are sanctified." (Hebrews 10:14)

In Hebrews 10:39, the writer of Hebrews sets up a CONTRAST that makes it clear to me that he was referring to unbelievers, not saved people: But WE are not of THOSE who draw back to perdition, but OF THOSE who believe to the saving of the soul. Those who draw back to perdition do not believe to the saving of the soul and those who believe to the saving of the soul do not draw back to perdition.

So after considering the CONTEXT of Hebrews 10, it seems most likely that "he was sanctified" should be understood in the sense of someone who had been "set apart" and was associated and identified with being an active participant in the Hebrew Christian community of believers, but later renounces their identification with these Hebrew believers, by rejecting the "knowledge of the truth" they had received (Hebrews 10:26) and trampling under foot the work and the person of Christ himself, which gives evidence that their identification with the Hebrew Christian community of believers "on the surface" had merely appeared to be real, but after closer examination turned out to be superficial and thus the person was not a genuine believer.
Ralph, PS and the other clown cannot grasp these truths migo....as long as they keep interjecting self they will continue to dwell in darkness.
 
Dec 12, 2013
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Are you using these passages of scripture to teach that man is saved by faith and works? In James 2:14, we read of one who says/claims he has faith but has no works (to validate his claim). That is not genuine faith, but a bare profession of faith. So when James asks, "Can that faith save him?" he is saying nothing against genuine faith, but only against an empty profession of faith/dead faith. *So James does not teach that we are saved "by" works. His concern is to show the reality of the faith professed by the individual (James 2:18) and demonstrate that the faith claimed (James 2:14) by the individual is genuine. Simple! (y)

In James 2:19, we see that the demons believe "mental assent" that "there is one God," but they do not believe/have faith in/trust in/reliance in Jesus Christ for salvation. In other words, they do not believe on the Lord Jesus Christ (Acts 16:31) and are not saved. Their trust and reliance is in Satan, as demonstrated by their rebellion in heaven and continuous evil works.

In James 2:20, "faith without works is dead" does not mean that faith is dead until it produces works and then it becomes a living faith (which is like saying that a tree is dead until it produces fruit and then it becomes a living tree) or that works are the source of life in faith or that we are saved by works. James is simply saying faith that is not accompanied by evidential works is dead. If someone says-claims they have faith but lack resulting evidential works, then he has an empty profession of faith/dead faith and not authentic faith.

Remember that James is discussing the evidence of faith (says-claims to have faith but has no works/I will show you my faith by my works - James 2:14-18) and not the initial act of being accounted as righteous with God (Romans 4:2-3).
Of course he is.....the JEEZUS that he and old Ralph are peddling is NOT in scripture......it is more akin to the Catholic JEEZUS that must be helped by man made self effort and religious hoop jumping....
 

VCO

Senior Member
Oct 14, 2013
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A-HA, so the distinguishing characteristic is this: Those who have faith have obedience to His Word.

You have just admitted to it.


WRONG.

Those who have genuine Faith, will strive to have obediance to HIS WORD, purely out of LOVE FOR HIM.

Obediance is a PRODUCT of GOD's LOVE In US.

Romans 5:5 (HCSB)
5 This hope will not disappoint ⌊us⌋, because God’s love has been poured out in our hearts through the Holy Spirit who was given to us.

John 14:15 (HCSB)
15 If you love Me, you will keep My commands.


That VERB keep is in the A0RIST TENSE. Which we do not have in ENGLISH, the concept of the verb is considered
without regard for past, present, or future time. There is no direct or clear English equivalent for this tense.

IT Does NOT mean PERFECTION, but the DIRECTION of one's LIFESTYLE. In other words, we will keep on striving to keep, tho we are not perfect.
 
Dec 12, 2013
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Working for grace ~~ the ultimate irony.
They have no concept that they are peddling and believing the SAME thing that the MANY will peddle before the throne of God while expecting to enter...

LORD, LORD have WE NOT DONE..........they are all lost and will burn in hell because they conflated and skewed the correct message to the point it had no power to save....

HOW hard is it to just acknowledge JESUS by FAITH and BELIEVE that he gives ETERNAL LIFE based upon what HE HAS DONE and NOT WHAT WE DO or DON'T DO....
 
Dec 12, 2013
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You shall be like God and you will also violate His Word. The same lie Satan has always used ever since Genesis 3.

Yours is the “gospel” I came up in “church” under. It kept me a slave to sin by God’s own definition. In darkness, I had no clue what the Kingdom of God was. I had no real use for the Holy Spirit. I was not a son God for I was not being led by His Spirit. I had “accepted Jesus in to my heart” but I wasn’t born again. O, but I was going to heaven just like everyone else in that building on Sunday morning. We were houses built on sand - we called Him ‘Lord, Lord, but we did not do what He said. We weren’t His disciples for we had not denied ourselves nor did we abide in His Word. We were uncircumcised in heart. The leaven remained. Our bible was about 24 pages long. We were modern American Christians. But Jesus didn’t come to start Christianity. He came to baptize us with the Holy Spirit.

As it is written, “In every nation whoever fears Him and does what is right is accepted by Him.” He inspires us to fear Him so that we will never turn away from Him.

In these days Christians have no king; everyone does as he sees fit. Jesus Christ is Lord, bless His holy name. Salvation ain’t about us. It is about glorifying Him in all we do and say in this Sabbath rest religion has rejected.
Blather alert........!!