Prophesying Forbidden

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yellowcanary

Junior Member
#261
May 22, 2018
122
78
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#261
Absolutely said:
....and of course modern Christendom has no knowledge. Lets get it straight. You cherry pick into silly nothingness. Cessationism is a joke. It is a lie.

But what an impasse.
Since ,as you point out tongues,knowledge and prophecy has ceased,and i suppose cessationists have ceased pursuing those 3 things,that segment of the Lord's body has more or less paralysed itself.

But since they believe knowledge has also ceased(by implication), they have anointed themselves with invincible ignorance.

...which they themselves readily display.
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Childish rantings .. but not unexpected. The undeniable consequence of your logic concludes that "knowledge will vanish (along with tongues and prophecy) upon Christ's return ... given that you assert that Christ Himself is the perfect "when that which is perfect is come". Is our abode with Christ in heaven to be a place void of knowledge ?

"That which is perfect" is a neuter gender reference to "that which is complete". It is in contrast to "that which is in part .. or incomplete". Was Christ "in part or incomplete" at His first coming ? Of course not.

All three of the gifts we are speaking of were "supernatural gifts". None of them could have or would have occurred without God divinely imparting them upon whom He chose to give them ... and for His purpose. Your childish assertion and conclusion that those who believe as I do can only mean to us that, ... "modern Christendom has no knowledge" reeks of desperation and ignorance itself ... and reflects poorly on your own understanding of God's Word and the context of what has been given us.
 
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presidente

Senior Member
#262
May 29, 2013
9,164
1,794
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#262
yellowcanary said:
The undeniable consequence of your logic concludes that "knowledge will vanish (along with tongues and prophecy) upon Christ's return ... given that you assert that Christ Himself is the perfect "when that which is perfect is come". Is our abode with Christ in heaven to be a place void of knowledge ?
Click to expand...
If you think knowledge has ceased, would the undeniable conclusion for your own position be that you have no knowledge?

My understanding is that the type of incomplete knowledge that we have now will be replaced by full knowledge. "Now I know in part; then I shall know fully, even as I am fully known. "

If we had full knowledge, why would we have discussions in which we express disagreement over these and a myriad of other issues?

"That which is perfect" is a neuter gender reference to "that which is complete". It is in contrast to "that which is in part .. or incomplete". Was Christ "in part or incomplete" at His first coming ? Of course not.
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This appears to be a strawman argument. Christ's return ushers in something 'complete'. He brings completeness and wholeness to us. It seems like you might be looking for a substantive referent to the word 'that' in KJV English when 'that which is perfect' translates two words counting a definite article and there is no word that corresponds to 'that' in the KJV translation.
 
Gregoryp

Gregoryp

Banned
#263
Jul 20, 2019
1,228
882
113
#263
So I gather from all of those posts , that your arguing that there are no need for prophets , as the bible has all the information needed? And speaking in tongues is bad? I beg to differ on both counts, as I am having profound experiences on a daily basis. This has been going on for sometime now. I know and perceive the truth.
 
Gregoryp

Gregoryp

Banned
#264
Jul 20, 2019
1,228
882
113
#264
stillness said:
I have shared openly here the words the Lord gave me and no one has objected. It may be that objections are for those who entertain them, after all none of us are for real appart from the Love of God. "From now on we regard no man according to the flesh." Better to see only God as real, but we still have trouble in this world. Here are some words the Lord gave me when i was seeking to meet Him face to face:
Directions received in preparation for Journey:
"We will give ourselves to prayer."
Withhold nothing, take nothing, you have to be determined to succeed. Your prayer life must increase, content to participate in the mystery of God. Go, this is a time of prayer; it’s the only way you'll succeed. Keep yourself in the Love of God, don't give up: you’re not ready. Be still: know that I Am with you. "Wait on the Lord and He will strengthen your heart." Your prayer life has to extend in all areas of your life. What you do not realize is that the war is accomplished: it's not as simple as you getting the power, you have to Love the Truth. Give up your life, no more going back to idols.
Don't be afraid, above all surrender (give Him your fear). Don’t stay outside, don’t worry, Psalm 118. Be Faithful unto death. Seek Me more than your necessary food. Don’t fight against the Holy Ghost, give yourself to prayer. Give yourself to Him, you need to change, no longer desire earthly things, come and be reconciled. Make the most of your time, live in Prayer, don't want anything else. Don’t forget.
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this is very similar to what I hear! "your body is my temple" 'Your tongue will be like a two edged sword" "live in the truth, physically, emotionally and spiritual" "put the word of God at the front of your mind" And much more!
 
CS1

CS1

Well-known member
#265
May 23, 2012
13,070
4,349
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#265
notuptome said:
Your opinion so what?

The scriptures are the absolute truth. It is not that you cannot know them it is just that you will not know them.

You will pray just like Pelosi prays for Trump. I'm impressed or not.

For the cause of Christ
Roger
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you are not the scriptures nor are you an authority on them. they are your opinions. I don't know how Pelosi prays for Trump. Nor do I care if you are impressed or am I trying to do so.
 
notuptome

notuptome

Senior Member
#266
May 17, 2013
15,050
2,538
113
#266
CS1 said:
you are not the scriptures nor are you an authority on them. they are your opinions. I don't know how Pelosi prays for Trump. Nor do I care if you are impressed or am I trying to do so.
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I never claimed to be the scriptures nor can I perceive how you would draw such a conclusion. The scriptures are the authority of every believer.

Tit 2:1 But speak thou the things which become sound doctrine:

For the cause of Christ
Roger
 
Y

yellowcanary

Junior Member
#267
May 22, 2018
122
78
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#267
presidente said:
If you think knowledge has ceased, would the undeniable conclusion for your own position be that you have no knowledge?

My understanding is that the type of incomplete knowledge that we have now will be replaced by full knowledge. "Now I know in part; then I shall know fully, even as I am fully known. "

If we had full knowledge, why would we have discussions in which we express disagreement over these and a myriad of other issues?
Click to expand...
I don't believe that knowledge itself has ceased. If that were the case, who could learn ? Why would we be encouraged to study to show ourselves approved ?

Divinely gifted "super-natural" knowledge ... IOW's, something being made known to someone by and thru God ... something that couldn't have been known otherwise ... I believe that this is what Paul was talking about. Why else would he have spoken of it in the same context (and sentence) that he did with "super-natural tongues and prophecy" ?

To take it a step further, if "super-natural knowledge" isn't what Paul was referring to, can it then be concluded (and shouldn't it ?) that Paul wasn't talking about "super-natural tongues" either ?

Us knowing fully when we are in Christ's presence seems a foregone conclusion and self-evident.
 
P

presidente

Senior Member
#268
May 29, 2013
9,164
1,794
113
#268
yellowcanary said:
I don't believe that knowledge itself has ceased. If that were the case, who could learn ? Why would we be encouraged to study to show ourselves approved ?

Divinely gifted "super-natural" knowledge ... IOW's, something being made known to someone by and thru God ... something that couldn't have been known otherwise ... I believe that this is what Paul was talking about. Why else would he have spoken of it in the same context (and sentence) that he did with "super-natural tongues and prophecy" ?

To take it a step further, if "super-natural knowledge" isn't what Paul was referring to, can it then be concluded (and shouldn't it ?) that Paul wasn't talking about "super-natural tongues" either ?

Us knowing fully when we are in Christ's presence seems a foregone conclusion and self-evident.
Click to expand...

You were interpreting another person's position in a similar way when you asked, "Is our abode with Christ in heaven to be a place void of knowledge ? "
 
G

garee

Banned
#269
Mar 28, 2016
15,954
1,528
113
#269
yellowcanary said:
Childish rantings .. but not unexpected. The undeniable consequence of your logic concludes that "knowledge will vanish (along with tongues and prophecy) upon Christ's return ... given that you assert that Christ Himself is the perfect "when that which is perfect is come". Is our abode with Christ in heaven to be a place void of knowledge ?

"That which is perfect" is a neuter gender reference to "that which is complete". It is in contrast to "that which is in part .. or incomplete". Was Christ "in part or incomplete" at His first coming ? Of course not.

All three of the gifts we are speaking of were "supernatural gifts". None of them could have or would have occurred without God divinely imparting them upon whom He chose to give them ... and for His purpose. Your childish assertion and conclusion that those who believe as I do can only mean to us that, ... "modern Christendom has no knowledge" reeks of desperation and ignorance itself ... and reflects poorly on your own understanding of God's Word and the context of what has been given us.
Click to expand...
Not upon Christ's return but upon the last words inspired and written down

New knowledge will vanish along with ceasing of new prophecy or tongues, again upon the last words inspired from heaven written by John.

Within the finished book of prophecy all of the knowledge God chose to reveal is revealed the perfect has come .

In the new order when that perfect comes the things earth will not be remembered or ever come to mind ever more. Scripture as to the letter of the law will have served its purpose to create anew creation. Not the temporal one under the Sun.
 
G

garee

Banned
#270
Mar 28, 2016
15,954
1,528
113
#270
presidente said:
You were interpreting another person's position in a similar way when you asked, "Is our abode with Christ in heaven to be a place void of knowledge ? "
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Void knowledge of the things of the Bible, yes. The book of the law as the letter of the law. . .death and hell. It as it is written will be cast into the lake of fire. Never to rise and condemn a whole creation to corruption ever again forever more.

Isaiah 65:17 For, behold, I create new heavens and a new earth: and the former shall not be remembered, nor come into mind.
 
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presidente

Senior Member
#271
May 29, 2013
9,164
1,794
113
#271
garee said:
Not upon Christ's return but upon the last words inspired and written down

New knowledge will vanish along with ceasing of new prophecy or tongues, again upon the last words inspired from heaven written by John.

Within the finished book of prophecy all of the knowledge God chose to reveal is revealed the perfect has come .
Click to expand...
What you are saying does not make sense because the 'perfect law of liberty' was perfect before the canon was completed, back when James mentioned it when he wrote James.

In the new order when that perfect comes the things earth will not be remembered or ever come to mind ever more. Scripture as to the letter of the law will have served its purpose to create anew creation. Not the temporal one under the Sun.
Click to expand...
If you believe that, then why would you think 'that which is perfect' occurs before the time you describe?
 
G

garee

Banned
#272
Mar 28, 2016
15,954
1,528
113
#272
presidente said:
What you are saying does not make sense because the 'perfect law of liberty' was perfect before the canon was completed, back when James mentioned it when he wrote James.


If you believe that, then why would you think 'that which is perfect' occurs before the time you describe?
Click to expand...

The perfect law of liberty is the gospel

Yes, perfect before. Madeits first appearing of presenting the perfect gospel law of liberty (the law of faith) in the book of Genesis .
Abel's who heard the gospel and believed God. His blood cries out for another perfect a new incorruptible body .

The perfect we are talking about is what is written in the volume of the book . There is more that one kind of perfect or complete. When we receive our new bodies that will be another kind of complete perfect.
 
Dino246

Dino246

Senior Member
#273
Jun 30, 2015
25,494
13,800
113
#273
garee said:
The perfect law of liberty is the gospel

Yes, perfect before. Madeits first appearing of presenting the perfect gospel law of liberty (the law of faith) in the book of Genesis .
Abel's who heard the gospel and believed God. His blood cries out for another perfect a new incorruptible body .

The perfect we are talking about is what is written in the volume of the book . There is more that one kind of perfect or complete. When we receive our new bodies that will be another kind of complete perfect.
Click to expand...
You describe three different things that are "perfect" and give no Scripture to support for interpreting the "perfect" of 1 Corinthians 13 as the first.
 
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