Who is the ones that is taken ? And who is the ones that are left ?

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Jul 23, 2018
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Look at Luke 17....totally prejudgement setting.
28 Likewise also as it was in the days of Lot; they did eat, they drank, they bought, they sold, they planted, they builded;

29 But the same day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven, and destroyed them all.

30 Even thus shall it be in the day when the Son of man is revealed.

31 In that day, he which shall be upon the housetop, and his stuff in the house, let him not come down to take it away: and he that is in the field, let him likewise not return back.

32 Remember Lot's wife.

33 Whosoever shall seek to save his life shall lose it; and whosoever shall lose his life shall preserve it.

34 I tell you, in that night there shall be two men in one bed; the one shall be taken, and the other shall be left.

35 Two women shall be grinding together; the one shall be taken, and the other left.


Pretrib rapture.
 

stonesoffire

Poetic Member
Nov 24, 2013
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I don’t know the timing of the catching up, but my thought is it would be before the wrath of God is poured out.
Does it really matter? What matters imo, is our confidence. Are we secure in our salvation? Our stand with the Lord? Or are we yet tossed to and fro?

Do we know the power of the Cross of the blood sacrifice of Jesus?

Are we walking with Him? Or talking about Him?
 
Jun 10, 2019
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I don’t know the timing of the catching up, but my thought is it would be before the wrath of God is poured out.
Does it really matter? What matters imo, is our confidence. Are we secure in our salvation? Our stand with the Lord? Or are we yet tossed to and fro?

Do we know the power of the Cross of the blood sacrifice of Jesus?

Are we walking with Him? Or talking about Him?
True indeed though the topic does cover a good bit in scripture it’s good to learn I think, Jesus speaks on it it’s probably good to learn about it.
 
Jun 10, 2019
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Of the timing no one but God truly knows not even the Son so there’s that too, lol
 
Sep 3, 2016
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Matthew 24:40 Then shall two be in the field: the one taken and the other one left; Two grinding at the mill; the one shall be taken and the other left.
“40 Then shall two be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left (does not refer to the Rapture as many believe, but rather to the terrible loss of life during the Great Tribulation).

41 Two women shall be grinding at the mill; the one shall be taken, and the other left.

42 Watch therefore (a warning to Israel to be prepared): for you know not what hour your Lord does come (present Believers know that the Second Coming will take place during the Battle of Armageddon [Zech., Chpt. 12] but unredeemed Israel will not know).” Matthew 24

JSM
 

Ahwatukee

Senior Member
Mar 12, 2015
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well I think in Matthew 24 states the carcasses are during the tribulation period because it’s mentioned as such hence 29
Matthew 24
26 Wherefore if they shall say unto you, Behold, he is in the desert; go not forth: behold, he is in the secret chambers; believe it not. 27 For as the lightning cometh out of the east, and shineth even unto the west; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be. 28 For wheresoever the carcase is, there will the eagles be gathered together. 29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:

here is talking about after the sun is darkened in that night This is because the dead have already risen by Luke 17:37
Yes, Matt.24 does mention the carcasses. But my point in using Luke's version was the fact that after Jesus mentions the one taken, the disciples ask "where, Lord." In other words, where are they going to be taken. The one's taken are in-part those who are going to be gathered and taken by the angels whose carcasses the birds are going to eat, mentioned in Rev.19:17-18, 21.
 
Jul 23, 2018
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“40 Then shall two be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left (does not refer to the Rapture as many believe, but rather to the terrible loss of life during the Great Tribulation).

41 Two women shall be grinding at the mill; the one shall be taken, and the other left.

42 Watch therefore (a warning to Israel to be prepared): for you know not what hour your Lord does come (present Believers know that the Second Coming will take place during the Battle of Armageddon [Zech., Chpt. 12] but unredeemed Israel will not know).” Matthew 24

JSM
It says before the flood.

So after the flood we need to watch and be ready to be taken?
 
Jul 23, 2018
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Yes, Matt.24 does mention the carcasses. But my point in using Luke's version was the fact that after Jesus mentions the one taken, the disciples ask "where, Lord." In other words, where are they going to be taken. The one's taken are in-part those who are going to be gathered and taken by the angels whose carcasses the birds are going to eat, mentioned in Rev.19:17-18, 21.
That would be after the flood.

Jesus said before the flood,one taken,one left.
 
Jul 23, 2018
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I don’t know the timing of the catching up, but my thought is it would be before the wrath of God is poured out.
Does it really matter? What matters imo, is our confidence. Are we secure in our salvation? Our stand with the Lord? Or are we yet tossed to and fro?

Do we know the power of the Cross of the blood sacrifice of Jesus?

Are we walking with Him? Or talking about Him?
I can do both.
I can walk with him and watch and be ready.
 
Jun 10, 2019
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Yes, Matt.24 does mention the carcasses. But my point in using Luke's version was the fact that after Jesus mentions the one taken, the disciples ask "where, Lord." In other words, where are they going to be taken. The one's taken are in-part those who are going to be gathered and taken by the angels whose carcasses the birds are going to eat, mentioned in Rev.19:17-18, 21.
Thanks for replying, I was just reading rev19:17-18 I noticed it saying the birds will gather haven’t read where those ones taken are taken to another place would that be the great battle. I assume those birds are vultures feeding on dead flesh.
 
Jun 10, 2019
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The battle probaly starts in one area yet will ingulf the whole world.
 
Nov 23, 2013
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here’s what I read from that site, seems plausible.

The "eagles" in Matthew 24:28

"24 Then if any man shall say unto you, Lo, here is Christ, or there; believe it not. For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect. 25Behold, I have told you before. 26 Wherefore if they shall say unto you, Behold, he is in the desert; go not forth: behold, he is in the secret chambers; believe it not. 27 For as the lightning cometh out of the east, and shineth even unto the west; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be. 28 For wheresoever the carcase is, there will the eagles be gathered together. 29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken: 30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. 31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other." (Matthew 24:23-31)​

These eagles could refer to angels who will accompany the "dead in Christ" who "shall rise first" at the sounding of "the trump of God" (1 Thessalonians 4:16). From the context, we see that this event (verse 28) occurs before the sounding of the trumpet which prompts the angels to gather the elect from the earth (verse 31). Since the trumpet has not been blown yet, the saints who have died are still dead - hence they are still "carcases" (Prior to 1750, "carcase" could have referred to a human corpse (Online Etymology Dictionary)). Also, this verse about the gathering of eagles immediately follows our Lord's caution that his second coming will be a ubiquitous event (verse 27). If the gathering of eagles refers to the ubiquitous appearance of angels on earth, then verse 28 flows most naturally from verse 27. In conclusion, these eagles could refer to angels who are on stand-by while they wait for the dead saints to rise.

The "eagles" in Luke 17:37

"34 I tell you, in that night there shall be two men in one bed; the one shall be taken, and the other shall be left. 35 Two women shall be grinding together; the one shall be taken, and the other left. 36 Two men shall be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left. 37 And they answered and said unto him, Where, Lord? And he said unto them, Wheresoever the body is, thither will the eagles be gathered together." (Luke 17:34-37)​

Whereas the eagles in Matthew 24:28 gather around carcases, the eagles in Luke 17:37 gather around living bodies. This is because the dead have already risen by Luke 17:37. Verse 37 in Luke immediately follows the description of the rapture of believers (verses 34-36). If the rapture had occurred, then the dead have already risen because Paul says, "the dead in Christ shall rise first: Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air" (1 Thessalonians 4:16-17). Whereas the description of the rapture in Luke occurs before the gathering of eagles, the description of the rapture in Matthew (verses 40-41) occurs after the verse about the gathering of eagles (verse 28). When we carefully examine the context of the verses in question, we begin to understand why one verse says "carcase" while the other says "body."
Conclusion

This article shows that the KJV reading of "eagles" in the end-times prophecies can be interpreted in several ways because of the rich imagery of eagles throughout the Bible. Thus replacing "eagles" with "vultures" could deprive the true meaning of the text. This is not to say that "vultures" is wrong as an interpretation, but it is important to be able to see that other interpretations exist. The KJV, with its commitment to formal equivalency in translation, translates "αετοι" literally and provides the reader with the opportunity to come to his own informed interpretation.
Matthew 24:15-28 and Luke 17:20-37 are the exact SAME STORY. The body in Luke17:37 is the SAME carcase of Matthew 24:28. One tells us that it's a body and the other tells us it's dead.
 
Jun 10, 2019
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Matthew 24:15-28 and Luke 17:20-37 are the exact SAME STORY. The body in Luke17:37 is the SAME carcase of Matthew 24:28. One tells us that it's a body and the other tells us it's dead.
I think the site makes a good case for a before and after.
 
Nov 23, 2013
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I think the site makes a good case for a before and after.
One last point lol. Both of those stories are about the tribulation and coming of the kingdom of God that comes WITHOUT observation.

Luk 17:20 And when he was demanded of the Pharisees, when the kingdom of God should come, he answered them and said, The kingdom of God cometh not with observation:
 
Jun 10, 2019
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One last point lol. Both of those stories are about the tribulation and coming of the kingdom of God that comes WITHOUT observation.

Luk 17:20 And when he was demanded of the Pharisees, when the kingdom of God should come, he answered them and said, The kingdom of God cometh not with observation:
What seems interesting is what is written in Matthew there’s that immediately after the tribulation of those days, Luke I think doesn’t mention things like that or doesn’t it, but in 26 people are going about daily activities it seems not good I know but still. I know somethings are farther beyond face value what’s past the surface but Luke seems different.


26 Wherefore if they shall say unto you, Behold, he is in the desert; go not forth: behold, he is in the secret chambers; believe it not. 27 For as the lightning cometh out of the east, and shineth even unto the west; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be. 28 For wheresoever the carcase is, there will the eagles be gathered together.

29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:
 
Nov 23, 2013
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What seems interesting is what is written in Matthew there’s that immediately after the tribulation of those days, Luke I think doesn’t mention things like that or doesn’t it, but in 26 people are going about daily activities it seems not good I know but still. I know somethings are farther beyond face value what’s past the surface but Luke seems different.


26 Wherefore if they shall say unto you, Behold, he is in the desert; go not forth: behold, he is in the secret chambers; believe it not. 27 For as the lightning cometh out of the east, and shineth even unto the west; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be. 28 For wheresoever the carcase is, there will the eagles be gathered together.

29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:
It's fascinating stuff, I enjoy discussing... especially with people who don't hold the same views I do.

The thing I keep mentioning about "Where Lord?", I had read that hundreds of times before and never realized that it was referring back to those taken. Someone on this forum pointed that out to me a couple of years ago. Most of the things I've learned over the years have come from people I don't agree with lol.

I'm open minded on all things and I know that everyone no matter which side they're on have to something to offer.
 
Jun 10, 2019
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Twenty one is interesting too.

Luke 17
21Neither shall they say, Lo here! or, lo there! for, behold, the kingdom of God is within you.
 
Jun 10, 2019
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It's fascinating stuff, I enjoy discussing... especially with people who don't hold the same views I do.

The thing I keep mentioning about "Where Lord?", I had read that hundreds of times before and never realized that it was referring back to those taken. Someone on this forum pointed that out to me a couple of years ago. Most of the things I've learned over the years have come from people I don't agree with lol.

I'm open minded on all things and I know that everyone no matter which side they're on have to something to offer.
I agree I’m open minded to different views as well hehe, I might not get it the first conversation or i might it may take awhile or I may not agree, but I like doing that I can’t just go one way thinking like I live in a cave if I did that I probably would start naming a soccer ball Wilson also. 😂
 

Ahwatukee

Senior Member
Mar 12, 2015
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Thanks for replying, I was just reading rev19:17-18 I noticed it saying the birds will gather haven’t read where those ones taken are taken to another place would that be the great battle. I assume those birds are vultures feeding on dead flesh.
Yes. Rev.19:11-21 is a detailed account of the Lord's physical and visual return to the earth to end the age and establish His millennial kingdom. Prior to that at the pouring out of the 6th bowl, those three demonic beings that come out of the mouth of the dragon, the beast and the false prophet, go throughout the earth and gather together the kings of the earth and their armies to Armageddon. It is at this time, that the angels will also be going throughout the entire earth gathering the "one taken" group to bring them back to where all of those kings, their generals and their armies will have been gathered. At that same time, the angel of Rev.19:17-18, will be calling all of the birds/vultures of the air to come and gather themselves to the great supper of God to eat their flesh of all of those gathered there.

If you look at the parable of when Jesus returns to the earth in Matt.13:24-29, the harvesters who are symbolic for the angels, will first collect the weeds (one taken) and they will be tied into bundles to be burned, which I believe is speaking about their spirits going down into Hades. Even though some of the wicked make it through the tribulation alive, they will be killed when the Lord returns, which is why the angels will be gathering them.

If we look at the context of the "one taken" scripture, they are being compared to those taken in the flood. Therefore, the comparison is wicked to wicked. It is definitely not referring to the gathering of the church, because "one taken and one left" would be inferring half of the earths population would be caught up, which would not match what Jesus said about the wide gate and many entering in vs. a few who enter in through the narrow gate.

Also, regarding the vultures, the word "aetos" means " an eagle, bird of prey" or more accurately, "thevultur percnopterus," which resembles an eagle.

This is why when Jesus responds to His disciples with "wherever the carcass (dead body) is there will the vultures gather," which I believe is referring to that event which takes place as the Lord is returning to the earth. It's at this same time that the beast and the false prophet are captured and thrown alive into the lake of fire. After that Satan is bound in the Abyss. There will be a lot going on as the Lord returns to the earth.