Rapture

[JohnR7]

We are told that: "Christ loved the church and gave Himself up for her to sanctify her, cleansing her by the washing with water through the word, and to present her to Himself as a glorious church, without stain or wrinkle or any such blemish, but holy and blameless" (Ephesians 5:26,27)

If Jesus is coming for His Bride - then are we not told that the Bride will be living free from sin. She will be without spot - blemish or wrinkle.

I believe the church age began on the day of Pentecost in the year 29 ad. So that means that 2029 would be the 2,000 year anniversary or birthday of the church. We know that Jesus began His ministry in the year 26 at a wedding with the new wine. So is it possible that God could begin a work in His church to wash and cleanse her, so three years later He can present the Bride to His Son?

Does anyone believe that the Church is in a condition that Jesus would want her in the condition that she is currently in?

 

[Adstar]

I believe the Atonement of Jesus is Constantly cleaning us so that at all times we appear spotless and without blemish to the LORD..

I believe the start of the Church was in 30AD so just one year later then you.. It would be interesting to see why you believe it was the year 29..

I provide this link to a site which gives reasons why i believe it was 30ad:: A more sure word

 

[JohnR7]

It would be interesting to see why you believe it was the year 29..

I base this on the Apophis comet and we are told: "There will be signs in the sun and moon and stars, and on the earth dismay among the nations, bewildered by the roaring of the sea and the surging of the waves. Men will faint from fear and anxiety over what is coming upon the earth, for the powers of the heavens will be shaken." (Luke 21:25,26)

"The date of birth of Jesus is not stated in the gospels or in any historical reference, but most theologians assume a year of birth between 6 BC and 4 BC" (Wiki) This means that Jesus would have began His ministry in the year 26 ad when He changed the water into wine at the wedding. So if this were the case then there should be some sort of an symbolic event in 2026 having to do with a wedding and the new wine. Jesus is coming for a Bride that has no spot, blemish or wrinkle. That clearly is not the case now. It could be 2026 is the year God will begin to do a work in the Bride to prepare the Church for the return of Jesus.

The anointing on the Church right now is to bring in the final harvest. To take the gospel to the ends of the world for the final time. Could be the Bride is not even saved yet. Much less without spot blemish or wrinkle.

 

[Adstar]

I base this on the Apophis comet and we are told: "There will be signs in the sun and moon and stars, and on the earth dismay among the nations, bewildered by the roaring of the sea and the surging of the waves. Men will faint from fear and anxiety over what is coming upon the earth, for the powers of the heavens will be shaken." (Luke 21:25,26)

"The date of birth of Jesus is not stated in the gospels or in any historical reference, but most theologians assume a year of birth between 6 BC and 4 BC" (Wiki) This means that Jesus would have began His ministry in the year 26 ad when He changed the water into wine at the wedding. So if this were the case then there should be some sort of an symbolic event in 2026 having to do with a wedding and the new wine. Jesus is coming for a Bride that has no spot, blemish or wrinkle. That clearly is not the case now. It could be 2026 is the year God will begin to do a work in the Bride to prepare the Church for the return of Jesus.

The anointing on the Church right now is to bring in the final harvest. To take the gospel to the ends of the world for the final time. Could be the Bride is not even saved yet. Much less without spot blemish or wrinkle.

Interesting i also believe that the Meteor Apophis will hit the earth in 2029.. Know that the world wide destruction caused by these end times signs happen just before the return of Jesus.. The World will already be darkened and the moon will already be as blood when Jesus comes crashing through the clouds with the sound of a great trumpet.. So for me early 2030 fits this scenario..

I will also remind you that the Bible says that Jesus was ABOUT 30 when He started His ministry.. The huge mistake most famous commentators make is to say that Jesus WAS 30 when he started his ministry... The Bible does not actually give an actual age for Jesus when he started his ministry.. Jesus could have been anywhere from 27 to 33 years old.. No one knows..

I did do a write up a few years ago now about why i believe an asteroid / meteor would bring about most of the devastation that will come upon the earth during the times just before the return of Jesus.. If your interested i will post it here in this thread..

 

[watcher2013]

We are told that: "Christ loved the church and gave Himself up for her to sanctify her, cleansing her by the washing with water through the word, and to present her to Himself as a glorious church, without stain or wrinkle or any such blemish, but holy and blameless" (Ephesians 5:26,27)

If Jesus is coming for His Bride - then are we not told that the Bride will be living free from sin. She will be without spot - blemish or wrinkle.

I believe the church age began on the day of Pentecost in the year 29 ad. So that means that 2029 would be the 2,000 year anniversary or birthday of the church. We know that Jesus began His ministry in the year 26 at a wedding with the new wine. So is it possible that God could begin a work in His church to wash and cleanse her, so three years later He can present the Bride to His Son?

Does anyone believe that the Church is in a condition that Jesus would want her in the condition that she is currently in?

If you apply the logic.
The head of the church is Christ..
You are saying the church is "bride"..
The head of christ is God..
If we apply the same logic...
Christ is the bride of God...

Means this logic is wrong...

To make the logic right...
HeAd means not the relation between husband and wife..but the headship/ authority...

This will be the scenario...

Christ will come down...
Christ will reign...
Gog war of revelation will happen at the end of his reign
End of the world...
Judgement
New heaven and new earth...
The new Jerusalem (with all the saints old testament and new testament) will come down from heaven adorn as a bride..
We live in the new earth With God and Christ...
And we behold the face of God.

 

[JohnR7]

If we apply the same logic...
Christ is the bride of God...

Israel is the Bride of God. Even He divorced her. "I gave faithless Israel her certificate of divorce and sent her away because of all her adulteries. Yet I saw that her unfaithful sister Judah had no fear; she also went out and committed adultery." (Jeremiah 3:8) I do not know that the Church and the bride are one and the same. In Rev there are 7 churches: "The mystery of the seven stars that you saw in my right hand and of the seven golden lampstands is this: The seven stars are the angels of the seven churches, and the seven lampstands are the seven churches" (Rev 1:20) Israel is considered to be a friend: "He who has the bride is the groom. But the groom's friend, who stands by and listens for him, rejoices greatly at the groom's voice." (John 3:9)

"Now as the church submits to Christ, so also wives should submit to their husbands in everything. Husbands, love your wives, just as Christ loved the church and gave Himself up for her to sanctify her, cleansing her by the washing with water through the word," (Eph 5:24,25,26)

 

[watcher2013]

Israel is the Bride of God. Even He divorced her. "I gave faithless Israel her certificate of divorce and sent her away because of all her adulteries. Yet I saw that her unfaithful sister Judah had no fear; she also went out and committed adultery." (Jeremiah 3:8) I do not know that the Church and the bride are one and the same. In Rev there are 7 churches: "The mystery of the seven stars that you saw in my right hand and of the seven golden lampstands is this: The seven stars are the angels of the seven churches, and the seven lampstands are the seven churches" (Rev 1:20) Israel is considered to be a friend: "He who has the bride is the groom. But the groom's friend, who stands by and listens for him, rejoices greatly at the groom's voice." (John 3:9)

"Now as the church submits to Christ, so also wives should submit to their husbands in everything. Husbands, love your wives, just as Christ loved the church and gave Himself up for her to sanctify her, cleansing her by the washing with water through the word," (Eph 5:24,25,26)

Eph 5:23-27 KJV 23 For the husband is the head of the wife, even as Christ is the head of the church: and he is the saviour of the body. 24 Therefore as the church is subject unto Christ, so let the wives be to their own husbands in every thing. 25 Husbands, love your wives, even as Christ also loved the church, and gave himself for it; 26 That he might sanctify and cleanse it with the washing of water by the word, 27 That he might present it to himself a glorious church, not having spot, or wrinkle, or any such thing; but that it should be holy and without blemish.

Christ is the Head..in theory male
Body...male...

The bride
Rev 21:10-12 KJV 10 And he carried me away in the spirit to a great and high mountain, and shewed me that great city, the holy Jerusalem, descending out of heaven from God, 11 Having the glory of God: and her light was like unto a stone most precious, even like a jasper stone, clear as crystal; 12 And had a wall great and high, and had twelve gates, and at the gates twelve angels, and names written thereon, which are the names of the twelve tribes of the children of Israel:

See the names of the twelve tribes of the children of Israel..

 

[JohnR7]

I will also remind you that the Bible says that Jesus was ABOUT 30 when He started His ministry..

Numbers are very exact in the Bible. Joseph became second in command in Egypt when he was 30 (Genesis 41:46) David became king at 30 (2Samuel 5:4) Ezekiel became a prophet at 30 (Ezekiel1:1,2) Levites started to serve at 30 Numbers 4:3) 33 is the number for completed work. David ruled over Israel for 33 years.

Jesus began His ministry when he was 26. His first miracle was to turn the water into wine at a wedding. If Jesus is going to come for His Bride in 2029 then He will begin a work in 2026 to purify the church. We are told she will be without spot blemish or wrinkle. (Ephesians 5:27) I do not think anyone would describe the church that way right now. The world will be on the brink of destruction.

 

[JohnR7]

See the names of the twelve tribes of the children of Israel..

The New Jerusalem is 1500 by 1500 by 1500 miles. This is the size of the Arab Continental plate. This gives them mineral rights and airspace.

 

[JaumeJ]

There is one true assembly, church. Look at my avatar, it represents the assemblies around this tired old earth. The light given by all the candles is One Light for all. All who believe God are in the Spirit of the "churches."

Churches are not really denominations, they contain the people of God Yahweh's children.

Those who believe are in this light, even in the darkness of this age. Think about it! How can there be more than one true assembly? (chuirch).

 

[JohnR7]

Look at my avatar, it represents the assemblies around this tired old earth. The light given by all the candles is One Light for all. All who believe God are in the Spirit of the "churches."

The Menorah was carried off by the Romans. It is believed that the stones from the temple of Jerusalem was used in the building of the coliseum. They have found a plaque to that effect.

 

[watcher2013]

The New Jerusalem is 1500 by 1500 by 1500 miles. This is the size of the Arab Continental plate. This gives them mineral rights and airspace.

No need of mineral rights
It will be on the new earth...
Gods kingdom...

 

[JohnR7]

No need of mineral rights

Our physical body comes from the Earth. The resurrection is physical, not just spiritual. "The rest of the dead did not come to life until the thousand years were ended. This is the first resurrection." (Rev20:5)

386 anástasis (from 303 /aná, "up, again" and 2476 /hístēmi, "to stand") – literally, "stand up" (or "stand again"), referring to physical resurrection (of the body).

Christ's physical resurrection is the foundation of Christianity, which also guarantees the future resurrection of all believers (see Jn 6:39,40,44).

[386 /anástasis ("resurrection") refers to the physical, bodily resurrection of Christ – and people (both of the redeemed and the unredeemed).]

 

[watcher2013]

Our physical body comes from the Earth. The resurrection is physical, not just spiritual. "The rest of the dead did not come to life until the thousand years were ended. This is the first resurrection." (Rev20:5)

386 anástasis (from 303 /aná, "up, again" and 2476 /hístēmi, "to stand") – literally, "stand up" (or "stand again"), referring to physical resurrection (of the body).

Christ's physical resurrection is the foundation of Christianity, which also guarantees the future resurrection of all believers (see Jn 6:39,40,44).

[386 /anástasis ("resurrection") refers to the physical, bodily resurrection of Christ – and people (both of the redeemed and the unredeemed).]

You know the angels...they are going to gather all of resurrected wicked and bring them into judgement to be cast into lake of fire
.while the righteous will be gathered in the kingdom of God...
This is the harvest...
Do not mistake it for the rapture. This is when christ will reign on earth

 

[Absolutely]

Eph 5:23-27 KJV 23 For the husband is the head of the wife, even as Christ is the head of the church: and he is the saviour of the body. 24 Therefore as the church is subject unto Christ, so let the wives be to their own husbands in every thing. 25 Husbands, love your wives, even as Christ also loved the church, and gave himself for it; 26 That he might sanctify and cleanse it with the washing of water by the word, 27 That he might present it to himself a glorious church, not having spot, or wrinkle, or any such thing; but that it should be holy and without blemish.

Christ is the Head..in theory male
Body...male...

The bride
Rev 21:10-12 KJV 10 And he carried me away in the spirit to a great and high mountain, and shewed me that great city, the holy Jerusalem, descending out of heaven from God, 11 Having the glory of God: and her light was like unto a stone most precious, even like a jasper stone, clear as crystal; 12 And had a wall great and high, and had twelve gates, and at the gates twelve angels, and names written thereon, which are the names of the twelve tribes of the children of Israel:

See the names of the twelve tribes of the children of Israel..

Christ does not marry a building.

 

[Absolutely]

You know the angels...they are going to gather all of resurrected wicked and bring them into judgement to be cast into lake of fire
.while the righteous will be gathered in the kingdom of God...
This is the harvest...
Do not mistake it for the rapture. This is when christ will reign on earth

Just leave out the first resurrection.
That is what you did.

 

[watcher2013]

Just leave out the first resurrection.
That is what you did.

I said..do not mistake the rapture to the harvest..
Rapture is the first resurrection.

 

[watcher2013]

Christ does not marry a building.

No...definitely right...
Same as God did not marry a country nor a man called Israel.

 

[JohnR7]

cast into lake of fire

I actually saw the bottomless pit when I was under anesthesia when I was around 8 years old. Now I am finding out the bottomless pit in the Bible is a volcano. "Immediately after the tribulation of those days: 'The sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light; the stars will fall from the sky, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken.'" (Matthew 24:29) This is a description of a volcanic eruption. They still talk about Pompeii and the devastation from that eruption.

 

[JohnR7]

Rapture is the first resurrection.

I was taught that the rapture is not a resurrection. When a believer dies they are raptured out of here but they leave their body behind. So they tell us we have a spiritual body in Heaven but we do not have a physical body. For me what good is a resurrected body if we do not have a new earth. The new heaven and the new earth is after the 1,000 reign of Christ.

There does seem to have been a resurrection of the 500 after Jesus made his sacrifice at calvary. "The tombs broke open, and the bodies of many saints who had fallen asleep were raised. After Jesus’ resurrection, when they had come out of the tombs, they entered the holy city and appeared to many people". (Matthew 27:52,53) What happened to these 500?