How many sins does it take for a christian to become aa sinner? John 9:31 Now we know that God hearth not sinners.

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Lafftur said:
I’m sorry, @Lightskin did “egg you on” disrespectfully and @Eleventhour is highly intelligent, but comes across condescending in her posts.

They are deep in theology and what I’ve presented to them goes against what they believe to be true.

@Brandnewday - you are loved, as well as Lightskin and EleventhHour.

Let’s all forgive each other - we stumbled. Let’s help each other back up and praise God.........

WE ARE NOT SINNERS ANYMORE!!

HALLELUJAH!!! We are Beloved Children - sisters and brothers!! :love:(y)
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Sorry if my posts seem condescending they are not meant to be.

I think you are confusing the lens of God on us, as well having this idea we can have complete victory over sin, that is not possible.

While walking in the Spirit gives victory, it does not make us sinless...sin lives in us and it will not be gone until we are glorified.
 
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Deade said:
Are we really saved before we are resurrected and immortalized?
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Yes we are.

We are already seated in heavenly places

“But God, being rich in mercy, because of the great love with which he loved us, even when we were dead in our trespasses, made us alive together with Christ-by grace you have been saved- and raised us up with him and seated us with him in the heavenly places in Christ Jesus, so that in the coming ages he might show the immeasurable riches of his grace in kindness toward us in Christ Jesus”
(Eph 2:4-7).
 
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EleventhHour said:
It is only His righteousness not ours and that is why we are acceptable.

You are confusing the two different things

We have a positional righteous, and positional sanctification.
Our behaviour is not what makes us sinless ... it Christ within that makes us sinless

We are called to conform our lives to what is a reality...... why.......to live the life of liberty, live a profitable life and bear witness to the faith.



It is sin and we still sin and no one will walk perfectly in this temporal life.
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EleventhHour said:
Sorry if my posts seem condescending they are not meant to be.

I think you are confusing the lens of God on us, as well having this idea we can have complete victory over sin, that is not possible.

While walking in the Spirit gives victory, it does not make us sinless...sin lives in us and it will not be gone until we are glorified.
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Your posts are very important to me and I want to reply when I am not so busy - it’s my daughter’s birthday today and I have a lot to do, but I will reply to you and everyone as soon as I can.

Much love to all of you! :love:(y)
 
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Can it be both... we are saved by His Grace, which is sufficient amongst the thorns, but still we are, because of Him, to be mindful of our thoughts, words and actions, that we may grow and mature.

Let's say we die or He comes back in a moment of stumble, He knows our hearts, He knows our sincerity or lack thereof. I take comfort knowing His promises are true. He will present us blameless if we sincerely seek to follow Him. He remains faithful to the heart that truly believes, receives and loves Him in action, thought, and deed. Salvation will always belong to Him and though love covers a multitude of sin, we should never ever take Him or His love for granted, that should break our hearts doing so. Repentance is so good for the sanctification process.

I do NOT claim to think sinless perfection is achievable in these fleshly bodies. Sinless perfection is not something I can fathom but I know the One inside is working to help me line up with the will of God. If we do not believe we can ever overcone the stumble, will we give ourselves to hyper grace, will we chk ourselves and grow?

Hmmmmm... so no matter what, I am so thankful for His mercy and correction.

May we always respond to the Holy Spirit, and when we grieve Him, may we respond to the pricking of our conscience.

I am so thankful, that all we need to do is choose Him on some of these threads.
 
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Lafftur said:
Your posts are very important to me and I want to reply when I am not so busy - it’s my daughter’s birthday today and I have a lot to do, but I will reply to you and everyone as soon as I can.

Much love to all of you! :love:(y)
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Happy Birthday to your beautiful daughter...

Love to you as well.
 
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Absolutely said:
So heaven looks through the blood and sees all saints as sinners?
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Maybe our problem is we’re arguing apples and oranges. If or when you sin today, are you a sinner? Yes. How can you say otherwise? Does God see your sin? No, because you’re washed in the blood of Jesus Christ.

However, if your sin is blatantly against the law, you will be arrested. What are you going to say to the arresting officer, prosecutor and judge, that you did not break the law because God sees you as a saint? That’s ridiculous. Apples and oranges.
 
CharliRenee said:
Is it too simple to say, it is a heart matter? He knows what is false in us, and when we sincerely yearn for Him, even when we go left. Willful sinning is very different from human error. We will always need Him!!! I have a glitch or two in my character that He is working on right now. I guarantee the same is true for us all. He knows that, this is why we are to forgive one another.

The thing we need to examine is...

Are we growing in Him.
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Yep Roman's 8 says there is no condemnation for those that are in Christ Jesus.


Oh...but wait... that is no gimme. IT REQUIRES a Holy walk.
No less than 7 or 8 times that freedom from condemnation is authenticated and restricted to those brethren that are overcomers.

12 Therefore, brethren, we are debtors, not to the flesh, to live after the flesh.

13 For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.

14 For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.

Being compromised by a life of a carnal walk is a so so relationship with God.

Crucify the flesh. Live a Holy life.
Be free
Be happy
Enjoy the ride
Even the trials are an adventure to the sold out ones.

See,those items do not mix with "well,we are all sinners saved by grace"
Play it backwards
If I am a compromising believer,and my carnal life does not convict me them when even the leadership gives me a pass (we are all siiners... label) I can leave the church in "peace" shrug my shoulders and say "hey even pastor lives a carnal sinful life"
Oh well,let's just keep spinning since we place sin ahead of salvation.
And then add "it is futile fighting against sin"

See that? The bar is set low for a reason.
 
Lightskin said:
Maybe our problem is we’re arguing apples and oranges. If or when you sin today, are you a sinner? Yes. How can you say otherwise? Does God see your sin? No, because you’re washed in the blood of Jesus Christ.

However, if your sin is blatantly against the law, you will be arrested. What are you going to say to the arresting officer, prosecutor and judge, that you did not break the law because God sees you as a saint? That’s ridiculous. Apples and oranges.
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A sin practicer is a sinner. That is why we call them sinners.

There is a saying
"You can't stop birds from flying over your head,but you can stop them from building a nest in your hair."

So if someone says they are saved and still a sinner, it is like they give themselves a pathway into not checking sin.

That is why the flesh has to be crucified.

Dead men do not sin.
 
Absolutely said:
So if someone says they are saved and still a sinner, it is like they give themselves a pathway into not checking sin.
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Where sin abounds, grace abounds all the more. All our sins have been nailed to the cross. Now don’t get those words twisted thinking I promote sin and encourage people to live in a disrespectful manner to God.
 
Adstar said:
What verse :oops: ???

I have never in my life met a sinless human being.. Are you claiming to be perfectly sinless in the flesh?? If so you are deluded and the truth is not in you..
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That is not the dynamic I am challenging.
I totally agree all men sin.
But you are saying if I take a drink I am a drunk.
That is how the "saints are sinners" concept reads.
Yes drunks drink.
No ... a drink does not make one exactly like an alcoholic.

It is too broad. It gives the nominal ,carnal, flesh centered, believer a pass, big time.

But yes all humanoids sin.

If I am an overcomer,I have overcome sin.
Iow it is not that I never will sin again,but if I do,it breaks my heart for my sights are set on walking Holy.
The "saints are sinners" by his own confession has no problem with "unavoidable sin" he sees his walk as carnal from the get go.

Paul said "you have not yet resisted sin to the degree of shedding blood" (my paraphrase)

The flesh has to be crucified.
 
You know....
Roman's chapter 8 SPECIFICALLY ADDRESSES the walking in Holiness vs sin issue.
 
EleventhHour said:
Yes we are.

We are already seated in heavenly places

“But God, being rich in mercy, because of the great love with which he loved us, even when we were dead in our trespasses, made us alive together with Christ-by grace you have been saved- and raised us up with him and seated us with him in the heavenly places in Christ Jesus, so that in the coming ages he might show the immeasurable riches of his grace in kindness toward us in Christ Jesus”
(Eph 2:4-7).
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So, where are you right now walking around on earth or sitting in heaven. Your scripture is again telling us how God views us and how we should view ourselves. We are speaking our future.

Salvation is very simple, a child can understand it. It does not require us to study Calvinism or his TULIP doctrine or anything else. Some make it so hard, to gain salvation, you would need to be a Philadelphia lawyer. :geek:
 
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Absolutely said:
a drink does not make one exactly like an alcoholic.
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So how many sins does it take for someone to be deemed a sinner? Remember, it only takes one sin to separate us from God forever, hence the magnitude of Jesus’ saving grace.
 
Deade said:
So, where are you right now walking around on earth or sitting in heaven. Your scripture is again telling us how God views us and how we should view ourselves. We are speaking our future.

Salvation is very simple, a child can understand it. It does not require us to study Calvinism or his TULIP doctrine or anything else. Some make it so hard, to gain salvation, you would need to be a Philadelphia lawyer. :geek:
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We are partakers of God's nature, His very essence, that is part of the meaning of the words "eternal life"

The eternal lives in the temporal....Us

So I have both at the same time.
 
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Lightskin said:
Where sin abounds, grace abounds all the more. All our sins have been nailed to the cross. Now don’t get those words twisted thinking I promote sin and encourage people to live in a disrespectful manner to God.
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I will be waiting for how long it takes... maybe I will be pleasantly surprised. :)
 
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Lafftur said:
Your posts are very important to me and I want to reply when I am not so busy - it’s my daughter’s birthday today and I have a lot to do, but I will reply to you and everyone as soon as I can.

Much love to all of you! :love:(y)
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That girl hit the jackpot when she got you
 
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