Man, The Cross , and The KJV

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ChosenbyHim

Senior Member
Sep 19, 2011
3,343
114
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#21
I yawn in your general direction.

You can yawn all you want, Dino. I find it really sad that you do not believe that God is capable of finishing a Bible through His preservation.

Interesting how many Christians believe that Christ Jesus is the Author and Finisher of our Faith. And Amen Jesus surely is!

And yet, at the same time, ironically, when it comes to the Bible, they cannot point to any one that they believe is the Finished Bible, and the complete, infallible and inerrant word of God.

If God is capable of finishing our faith, don't you think He also is powerful enough and capable of finishing a perfect Bible???
 

Dino246

Senior Member
Jun 30, 2015
24,555
13,320
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#22
You can yawn all you want, Dino. I find it really sad that you do not believe that God is capable of finishing a Bible through His preservation.

Interesting how many Christians believe that Christ Jesus is the Author and Finisher of our Faith. And Amen Jesus surely is!

And yet, at the same time, ironically, when it comes to the Bible, they cannot point to any one that they believe is the Finished Bible, and the complete, infallible and inerrant word of God.

If God is capable of finishing our faith, don't you think He also is powerful enough and capable of finishing a perfect Bible???
Your baited questions arouse nothing but ennui. Really, you need to find something better to do than make groundless assumptions about other Christians.
 

ChosenbyHim

Senior Member
Sep 19, 2011
3,343
114
63
#23
Dino, I am doing exactly what I need to do. Are the questions, that I am asking, do they bother you that much?

Are you offended because the questions that I ask cause Christians to examine themselves and to see whether or not they really are walking by faith and trusting God when it comes to His word?

The assumptions which I have made are certainly not groundless. You have yet to answer my question, concerning if you believe that there is a perfect and infallible Bible available to us today?

Why do you keep dodging that question, Dino?
 

Dino246

Senior Member
Jun 30, 2015
24,555
13,320
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#24
Dino, I am doing exactly what I need to do. Are the questions, that I am asking, do they bother you that much?

Are you offended because the questions that I ask cause Christians to examine themselves and to see whether or not they really are walking by faith and trusting God when it comes to His word?

The assumptions which I have made are certainly not groundless. You have yet to answer my question, concerning if you believe that there is a perfect and infallible Bible available to us today?

Why do you keep dodging that question, Dino?
Because your advocation of the KJV-only position bores me. I've dealt with your kind before; I have yet to find one who can present a sound argument. Further, you don't know jack about me, so your baiting is pathetic.
 

ChosenbyHim

Senior Member
Sep 19, 2011
3,343
114
63
#27
Because your advocation of the KJV-only position bores me. I've dealt with your kind before; I have yet to find one who can present a sound argument.

If it really bores you, Dino. Then why are you even bothering to respond?

I think it is very sound to believe that our God is able to finish a Bible. Since Christians believe that God is able to author and finish their faith (Hebrews 12:2), and since Christians are trusting in God to finish the good work which He hath begun in them (Phil. 1:6), and likewise since Christians are trusting that God is powerful enough and more than able to complete and finish their translation and provide them a suprerior and glorified body at the rapture, then why would it not also be sound to believe that God also finished His Bible? If God is powerful enough to inspired the original autographs, then He certainly is powerful enough to preserve, translate and finish His perfect word, in the blessed King James Holy Bible.



Further, you don't know jack about me, so your baiting is pathetic.
I know enough to discern that you don't believe that there is a perfect Bible and translation which you can hold in your hand today and actually read. As I mentioned afore, I know that much about you.
 

ChosenbyHim

Senior Member
Sep 19, 2011
3,343
114
63
#28
We hold the Bible in VERY HIGH esteem. Without it, we do not know the gospel. We just just hold your baloney in high esteem. In fact, it’s buffoonery to the nth degree.

Which "The Bible" do you hold in very high esteem??

You are referring to an actual Bible, right???
 

ChosenbyHim

Senior Member
Sep 19, 2011
3,343
114
63
#29
Didn't we just go through this on another thread in this forum? And about 1000 other threads over the years?



Well then if you have, why are you still in unbelief when it comes to the absolute authority, power and perfection of God’s holy word, the blessed King James Holy Bible?


I cannot read the KJV because I do not understand the grammar and vocabulary.


Well Angela, then why don’t you take the time to learn the grammar and vocabulary of the King James Bible?




There are so many good translations.


Could you name a few, Angela?


I just can't fathom why this KJV ONLY even exists.


It exists Angela, because there are a remnant of Christians who actually do believe that God kept His faithful promise to preserve His pure words (Psalm 12:6-7).

That is why it exists.

I have no problem with anyone using the KJV as their Bible. People should read the version where God speaks through the words and helps them grow and live and serve God!


Angela, if people want to continue to use the modern versions, they can go on right ahead and do that. After all, we all have a free will, right? I don’t look down on other Christians just because they use or read out of the modern versions. But I do have a responsibility to at least give them the truth that there is only one true Holy and Finished Bible for us today and that it is indeed, the King James Holy Bible.


What you and other Christians do with the information which I hath provided unto you, that is simply up to you all.


KJV Onlyists are a desperate cult.


How are we a cult, Angela?


And OP, don't make any assumptions about me. I'm sure I have been a Christian longer than you,


I am fairly sure Angela that you have been a Christian and saved much longer than I have. But that does not give you the right to reject the supreme authority of the King James Bible.

[
QUOTE="Angela53510, post: 4235865, member: 76369"]read the Bible from cover to cover more times than you.[/QUOTE]


Which Bible have you read from cover to cover, Angela?


And I am more educated theologically than you.


Angela, your education does not amount to much, ma’am, if your education has not led you to have full faith in God’s perfect word, the blessed King James Holy Bible.


And I say this with charity and care.


Don't tell me I can't see the truth. I see it all too well.


Angela, on this Bible Version Issue, you are missing the mark. Why can’t you receive the truth that God has finished a perfect Bible for us today?



And that you are totally ignorant with regards to understanding manuscript evidence, because your cult leaders have led you astray!

No Angela, you are wrong again, Ma’am. I have understanding of which Bible has the right and pure line of manuscripts! Whereas, you and others fail to see the utter corruption that the Siniaticus and Vaticanus manuscripts are filled with. And sadly, the modern versions based upon these very corrupt manuscripts (Siniaticus and Vaticanus).
 

Blik

Senior Member
Dec 6, 2016
7,312
2,424
113
#30
If it really bores you, Dino. Then why are you even bothering to respond?

I think it is very sound to believe that our God is able to finish a Bible. Since Christians believe that God is able to author and finish their faith (Hebrews 12:2), and since Christians are trusting in God to finish the good work which He hath begun in them (Phil. 1:6), and likewise since Christians are trusting that God is powerful enough and more than able to complete and finish their translation and provide them a suprerior and glorified body at the rapture, then why would it not also be sound to believe that God also finished His Bible? If God is powerful enough to inspired the original autographs, then He certainly is powerful enough to preserve, translate and finish His perfect word, in the blessed King James Holy Bible.




I know enough to discern that you don't believe that there is a perfect Bible and translation which you can hold in your hand today and actually read. As I mentioned afore, I know that much about you.
When people say things that are not true about the things of God, the people who listen to the Lord need to speak up. The wonderful translation those men who translated scripture into English in 1613 need to be thought o with accuracy. It is a translation made by men of that time. They tried their best to only report God and did a wonderful job, but we need to understand the times they wrote in and how they influenced them in order to use the translation correctly.

If we say they perfectly translated from God alone and were not influenced by ideas accepted at the time we cannot learn truth from this translation. For example, Isabella queen of Spain, had forced Jews to be Catholics or be exiled. If we compare it with other translations and understand how their times influenced them we can be blessed by this translation.
 

Angela53510

Senior Member
Jan 24, 2011
11,780
2,938
113
#32
Well then if you have, why are you still in unbelief when it comes to the absolute authority, power and perfection of God’s holy word, the blessed King James Holy Bible?





Well Angela, then why don’t you take the time to learn the grammar and vocabulary of the King James Bible?






Could you name a few, Angela?





It exists Angela, because there are a remnant of Christians who actually do believe that God kept His faithful promise to preserve His pure words (Psalm 12:6-7).

That is why it exists.




Angela, if people want to continue to use the modern versions, they can go on right ahead and do that. After all, we all have a free will, right? I don’t look down on other Christians just because they use or read out of the modern versions. But I do have a responsibility to at least give them the truth that there is only one true Holy and Finished Bible for us today and that it is indeed, the King James Holy Bible.


What you and other Christians do with the information which I hath provided unto you, that is simply up to you all.





How are we a cult, Angela?





I am fairly sure Angela that you have been a Christian and saved much longer than I have. But that does not give you the right to reject the supreme authority of the King James Bible.

[QUOTE="Angela53510, post: 4235865, member: 76369"]read the Bible from cover to cover more times than you.

Which Bible have you read from cover to cover, Angela?





Angela, your education does not amount to much, ma’am, if your education has not led you to have full faith in God’s perfect word, the blessed King James Holy Bible.


And I say this with charity and care.





Angela, on this Bible Version Issue, you are missing the mark. Why can’t you receive the truth that God has finished a perfect Bible for us today?





No Angela, you are wrong again, Ma’am. I have understanding of which Bible has the right and pure line of manuscripts! Whereas, you and others fail to see the utter corruption that the Siniaticus and Vaticanus manuscripts are filled with. And sadly, the modern versions based upon these very corrupt manuscripts (Siniaticus and Vaticanus).[/QUOTE]

Sorry it is the Textus Receptus that is corrupt. It just sprang to life in the 9th or 10th centuries AD. There is no progression back to the earliest extant manuscripts. One day, very late in Christian history, someone copied it, and because it was in Byzantium, where Greek was still spoken, they just kept copying the mistakes, adding text to explain in the margin, which were incorporated into the text by the next generation of copyists, or scribes.

I'll just say, I have read from cover to cover almost every modern translation that exist. Except the KJV, which I don't understand. And no, I won't be taking courses in KJV English because I have no need or desire to speak or read it. I speak French fluently, I understand and read German. I have a good background in Spanish. If there was a language I was going to learn, it would be Russian and/or Ukrainian, which is part of my heritage, along with 3 other countries.

I've been fortunate in getting training to read Biblical Hebrew and Koine Greek. I can compare all the mistakes in any translation to the original languages. The OT of the KJV is pretty close to the Hebrew. I translated and compared Hebrew to the KJV for a few months in Hebrew class, and the syntax and grammar of Hebrew is close to English.

But Koine Greek has totally different word order, and it uses cases for nouns and aspect is more important than time in Greek (and German) than in English. The KJV makes a terrible mess of most of the NT, except for John, who wrote in Greek, but used Hebrew word order. It becomes a hash when the KJV tries to follow Greek word order. In places it makes no sense in English, and in other places, rather than starting with the nominative case, as we do in English, it might start when the accusative or dative case, which will actually change the meaning of the sentence.

Of course, the fact is that Erasmus, a Roman Catholic priest, translated the copy the KJV used. In some cases, he couldn't find a Greek manuscript for certain books, so he used the Latin Vulgate to back translate it into Greek. He only had access to 7 very late, corrupted manuscripts! To think there are over 6000 manuscripts now available.

I just finished rereading the Greek NT, and I always get so much out of it. I'm reading 3 OT chapters and 1 Psalm & 1 NT chapter in the NET plus reading the NT in German.

When I say KJV Onlyists are in a cult, and you don't get it, just reread your post to me. You utterly worship the KJ Bible as perfect. It is not! Nor should it be idolized.

I save my worship for God, although I love the Bible and it is an essential part of my life! I would be lost without it. I memorize parts a lot. But, there is no perfect translation. I could go on forever about your errors, but you are obsessed and blind so I won't waste my time. I sure feel sorry reading your attempts to hold up a translation as perfect. It's just sad that you have missed Jesus in a failed attempt to make your translation more important than the Father, Son and Holy Spirit. Besides, there is not one doctrinal difference between the KJV and modern translations, except for the JW or other cult Bibles.

Don't bother answering me, I won't be reading it.
 

JaumeJ

Senior Member
Jul 2, 2011
21,195
6,508
113
#33
There is no "perfect" translation of the Bible, however all a perfect when the reader is led by the Holy Spirit...…...even a Betty Crocker Cookbook, if our Father wants to use it.. I doubt He ever will, but He does take what is not to bring down what is...……….I believe Him, and all here who believe do too.
 
Dec 28, 2016
9,171
2,718
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#34
Didn't we just go through this on another thread in this forum? And about 1000 other threads over the years?

I cannot read the KJV because I do not understand the grammar and vocabulary. There are so many good translations. I just can't fathom why this KJV ONLY even exists. I have no problem with anyone using the KJV as their Bible. People should read the version where God speaks through the words and helps them grow and live and serve God!

KJV Onlyists are a desperate cult. And OP, don't make any assumptions about me. I'm sure I have been a Christian longer than you, read the Bible from cover to cover more times than you. And I am more educated theologically than you. Don't tell me I can't see the truth. I see it all too well. And that you are totally ignorant with regards to understanding manuscript evidence, because your cult leaders have led you astray!
KJVO is a hobby of ignorance.
 
Dec 28, 2016
9,171
2,718
113
#35
How are we a cult, Angela...the supreme authority of the King James Bible.
Here's how:

A cursory look at the above post along with your signature “Home Improvement begins with a King James Bible” shows this plainly.

It’s all about a version, not about Christ.

Yet now you can use your go to verse, poorly translated by the KJV translators, Psalm 138:2 which further shows the cultic mindset; all cults have their go to verse, misused, misapplied.

The verse is misused as a proof text and pretext for KJVOnlyism which is not its purpose or intent. This verse was not written to support KJVO'ers. Shocking, right?

You all use, rather misuse, many texts and twist them to exalt a version, not Christ, then you conflate Christ as if he’s a KJV Bible. It’s nothing short of sacrilege if not outright blasphemy.
 

Dino246

Senior Member
Jun 30, 2015
24,555
13,320
113
#36
I think it is very sound to believe that our God is able to finish a Bible. Since Christians believe that God is able to author and finish their faith (Hebrews 12:2), and since Christians are trusting in God to finish the good work which He hath begun in them (Phil. 1:6), and likewise since Christians are trusting that God is powerful enough and more than able to complete and finish their translation and provide them a suprerior and glorified body at the rapture, then why would it not also be sound to believe that God also finished His Bible? If God is powerful enough to inspired the original autographs, then He certainly is powerful enough to preserve, translate and finish His perfect word
God's capability is not in question.

I know enough to discern that you don't believe that there is a perfect Bible and translation which you can hold in your hand today and actually read. As I mentioned afore, I know that much about you.
You don't know jack about me. Keep your ignorant assumptions to yourself.
 

JaumeJ

Senior Member
Jul 2, 2011
21,195
6,508
113
#38
God's capability is not in question.


You don't know jack about me. Keep your ignorant assumptions to yourself.
Watch how you throw around that name...………….God bless you always.....jack
 

Dino246

Senior Member
Jun 30, 2015
24,555
13,320
113
#39
Watch how you throw around that name...………….God bless you always.....jack
Fair point! I missed the interactions with 'Jack'. Or perhaps I should say that I was not around for those; from what I've heard, I didn't miss anything good. :)
 

tantalon

Active member
Oct 11, 2019
286
105
43
#40
The KJV Bible has a track record of the GREAT REVIVALS of the past. The modern versions are copywrite and have doctrinal errors that water down, leave out, and change meanings. The NIV being one of the most popular, and worst. The modern versions are part and parcel of the great falling away now taking place.