The Purpose of Speaking in Tongues

[CS1]

These are the very same scriptures that I have quoted to you to demonstrate that tongues are not for today. You simply interpret them from a heart that does not seek to know but a heart that has what it wants.

If you understood the scriptures you quoted you would see why you need to repent. Turn now before it's too late.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

where? are they hid in the white backdrop of this Thread? You keep telling me I need to repent for what? Disagreeing with your unbiblical position on the Gifts of the Holy Spirit?

Take that fear-mongering to someone else. It will not work with me. I thank God for the understanding i have in His word and I would love for you to show me where I am wrong but you only have your opinion.

Each time you made a foolish comment I have provided scripture in context to the Gifts of the Holy Spirit and how they are for today.

You have provided only 1cor 13:8-10 and out of context too. Nothing says that once the English Bible came into existence the gifts of the Holy Spirit are no longer needed. You have been shown this repeatedly.

Your issue is with those who are ignorant, and immature using the gifts. As you know that was and has been agreed on fully.

But you are angry and now have only threats of judgment on me and others who disagree with you. it is sad, that the very thing you accuse me and others of you are doing.

 

[wolfwint]

Likewise thank you for yours, as I believe it to be honest, not argumentative. I will continue to reply openly.

I didn't post that because you hurt my feelings. You had been using a false argument called "Guilt by Association". We cannot redeem ourselves from the errors of strangers, because those errors don't belong to us. That's why it is a false argument. If we are going to suggest guilt and error in a person, let's at least talk about guilt that they actually own, not someone's guilt that may have nothing to do with them.
This part is something I would like to ask you more about (privately, if needed) because some people who receive speaking in tongues only receive a small bit at first and don't know how to do more. Then they feel like what they received wasn't speaking in tongues because they think they made it up with their own mind. I was one of those. Fortunately, someone wise told me to keep using the piece that I had until God gave me more. I did this somewhat fearfully for about 2 months until God gave me fluent tongues one day in my dorm at college.

People who did not have someone there to guide them past that obstacle will often give up (because they tried their best and THINK they failed...but they didn't) and then won't try again. They KNOW they tried honestly and didn't seem to obtain the expected result...and that's NOT how God works... so they conclude that what they were told was false. It is reasonable thinking all except for that one little bit that God DID give them. <-- that is very important to remember

I can't tell by your post whether or not you spoke something out loud or just thought or saw something in your mind. In my case, I could feel it in my throat wanting to be spoken but I didn't know what it was. I've heard of others who actually saw the words and just spoke what they saw. God deals with each person according to their own needs.

I will say that people who have tried to receive "speaking in tongues" and feel like they couldn't or didn't get it are the most difficult arguers against speaking in tongues. "A brother offended is harder to be won than a strong city: and their contentions are like the bars of a castle." - Proverbs 18:19 KJV

There are many questions I did not answer in this post like "What makes it hard to receive for some, but easy for others?" "How did God give you more in your college dorm?" "How did you know it was really God and not some other thing that allows you to speak this garble-dee-guk?" "What benefit do you get from speaking "gibberish"?

Those are all reasonable questions. I just need to prepare for work. Feel free to ask any that seem reasonable to you, and I'll answer as I have time.

Love in Jesus,
Kelby

Well, i am shure this what I spoke was not speaking in tongues. Then I cant find in scripture that someone has to learn speaking in tongues ore First little and then more.
If someone given a gift, he know that and he must not learn to envelope it.
Second, all pentecostal / charismatic groups, sov far I know teach that speaking in tongues as proof for to be baptised with the Holy Spirit. But all other gifts are not.
I got my gift, when I received the Holy Spirit by turning to God. And is was not the Kind of receiving the Holy Spirit which is taught by pentecostal/ charismatic groups.

 

[CS1]

Well, i am shure this what I spoke was not speaking in tongues. Then I cant find in scripture that someone has to learn speaking in tongues ore First little and then more.
If someone given a gift, he know that and he must not learn to envelope it.
Second, all pentecostal / charismatic groups, sov far I know teach that speaking in tongues as proof for to be baptised with the Holy Spirit. But all other gifts are not.
I got my gift, when I received the Holy Spirit by turning to God. And is was not the Kind of receiving the Holy Spirit which is taught by pentecostal/ charismatic groups.

The understanding is as it is seen in the word of God the Book of Acts those who were initially Baptized in the Holy Spirit all spoke in tongues or Prophesied which is tongues and interpretation also.

teach one to learn how to speak in tongues is unBiblical As a Pentecostal person for more than 38 years. WE did not teach doing that. So your experience is not the norm. I have seen those come and receive salvation and immediately after were baptized with the Holy Spirit and spoke in tongues. And it is that kind of teaching you are referring to that is taught BY some but not all Pentecostals. Your bias is telling.

 

[notuptome]

where? are they hid in the white backdrop of this Thread? You keep telling me I need to repent for what? Disagreeing with your unbiblical position on the Gifts of the Holy Spirit?

Take that fear-mongering to someone else. It will not work with me. I thank God for the understanding i have in His word and I would love for you to show me where I am wrong but you only have your opinion.

Each time you made a foolish comment I have provided scripture in context to the Gifts of the Holy Spirit and how they are for today.

You have provided only 1cor 13:8-10 and out of context too. Nothing says that once the English Bible came into existence the gifts of the Holy Spirit are no longer needed. You have been shown this repeatedly.

Your issue is with those who are ignorant, and immature using the gifts. As you know that was and has been agreed on fully.

But you are angry and now have only threats of judgment on me and others who disagree with you. it is sad, that the very thing you accuse me and others of you are doing.

I have never said that the English version of the bible is the perfect that triggered the ending of tongues. That is one of the many things you errantly read into my posts.

You are the one who claims that one can use gifts without knowledge or understanding. You may choose to pray with an empty mind but when I contrast that with entering into the presence of the Father boldly I find a disconnect with your practice and scripture.

It is Gods word that brings conviction not my words. I seek mercy not judgment for you.

You still only offer your opinion of how to interpret the scriptures surrounding tongues. Since your opinion conflicts with scripture you discount scripture in favor of your opinion. Nothing new here.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

 

[CS1]

Acts /1cor 12, 13, 14 baptism in the HG and gifts of the Spirit
This is a thread I posted some time ago . some of the same charters here were addressed of the very things that are saying and asking now. You be the judge. You will see my comment and when it turned to mock and scoffing by some of those here in this thread. They are here still because I think they need to be here so those of you can see the lack of biblical support to their outlandish claims and attacks.

Those who are pentecostal have agreed with them over the following and said so many times:

1. it wrong to teach one to speak in tongues
2. barking and foolish actions are not of God
3. it is wrong you have to speak in tongues to be saved
4. prophesying that does not confirm the word of God is an error.

You all be the judge

I think you will be surprised. You will see how I too have moved from cutting them slack in attacking and mocking and scoffing.

 

[notuptome]

Acts /1cor 12, 13, 14 baptism in the HG and gifts of the Spirit
This is a thread I posted some time ago . some of the same charters here were addressed of the very things that are saying and asking now. You be the judge. You will see my comment and when it turned to mock and scoffing by some of those here in this thread. They are here still because I think they need to be here so those of you can see the lack of biblical support to their outlandish claims and attacks.

Those who are pentecostal have agreed with them over the following and said so many times:

1. it wrong to teach one to speak in tongues
2. barking and foolish actions are not of God
3. it is wrong you have to speak in tongues to be saved
4. prophesying that does not confirm the word of God is an error.

You all be the judge

I think you will be surprised. You will see how I too have moved from cutting them slack in attacking and mocking and scoffing.

This is better addressed to the Pentecostals who hold to these behaviors.

One mans attacking, mocking and scoffing is another mans rebuking, extolling and exhorting.

Behaviors speak louder than words. Gods word never promotes capricious behaviors.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

 

[CS1]

I have never said that the English version of the bible is the perfect that triggered the ending of tongues. That is one of the many things you errantly read into my posts.

You are the one who claims that one can use gifts without knowledge or understanding. You may choose to pray with an empty mind but when I contrast that with entering into the presence of the Father boldly I find a disconnect with your practice and scripture.

It is Gods word that brings conviction not my words. I seek mercy not judgment for you.

You still only offer your opinion of how to interpret the scriptures surrounding tongues. Since your opinion conflicts with scripture you discount scripture in favor of your opinion. Nothing new here.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

I have posted an in-depth thread where you too participated.
Acts /1cor 12, 13, 14 baptism in the HG and gifts of the Spirit

many will see your lies.

 

[CS1]

This is better addressed to the Pentecostals who hold to these behaviors.

One mans attacking, mocking and scoffing is another mans rebuking, extolling and exhorting.

Behaviors speak louder than words. Gods word never promotes capricious behaviors.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

Just go back and reread your comment IN this thread I posted I hope others will do so. it is the same old song and dance you have been doing each time this topic comes up. One thing you need to remember you are not in authority to rebuke LOL. Those who rebuke are respectful to those who are in authority. You are not.

 

[Scribe]

The examples you gave are all modern translations based on one original English version (likely the KJB).

The traditional view is that 'akarpos' must be taken in the passive sense" "my mind/understanding is unfruitful (to/for me).

Indeed, that's the only way it can be taken if you don't want the speaker to understand what he's saying.

What I'm pointing out is that the word can also be taken in the active sense of "my mind/understanding is unfruitful (for others).

This is not a new concept; it's at least 500 years old as evidenced in Luther's Bible. Indeed, an active meaning seems to fit more in line with Paul's calling for clarity and understanding.

Yes, Paul was the apostle to the Gentiles. I imagine he used his knowledge of languages (though he really only needed two, maybe three) considerably more than his congregation when he went on his missions to preach to the Gentiles - no modern tongues-speech here; just real, rational languages.

If you think that the NIV, NASB, ESV are not translations from original languages using all manuscripts in extant and that they rely on some English translation it would reveal that you are just making things up as you speak. This willingness to just make things up about how the ESV, NASB, or NIV were produced is strong evidence that your interpretation of 1 Cor 14:14 is a belligerent interpretation based on your own desire for it to say what you want it to say rather than a sincere desire to yield to the actual meaning. I might call this a clear case of eisegesis if it were sincere but after the comment on the translations I am suspecting just plain belligerence.

And for that reason I am out.

 

[notuptome]

Just go back and reread your comment IN this thread I posted I hope others will do so. it is the same old song and dance you have been doing each time this topic comes up. One thing you need to remember you are not in authority to rebuke LOL. Those who rebuke are respectful to those who are in authority. You are not.

To you it's song and dance. Scripture is the authority through the Holy Spirit. The perfect is the completed revelation from God. The language is the language of the time. Hebrew or Greek were the languages of the time. Some Latin from the Romans but that was not included as part of the NT disposition.

I already know the way you read things especially things you don't like. You have chosen your path I can only endeavor to warn others of the perils ahead.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

 

[notuptome]

I have posted an in-depth thread where you too participated.
Acts /1cor 12, 13, 14 baptism in the HG and gifts of the Spirit

many will see your lies.

That was a mess. You have not improved but then you see no need. You have a cavalier attitude toward scripture. You do not have a solemn respect for Gods word or the need to worship Christ with a repentant heart.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

 

[CS1]

To you it's song and dance. Scripture is the authority through the Holy Spirit. The perfect is the completed revelation from God. The language is the language of the time. Hebrew or Greek were the languages of the time. Some Latin from the Romans but that was not included as part of the NT disposition.

I already know the way you read things especially things you don't like. You have chosen your path I can only endeavor to warn others of the perils ahead.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

Ok ole great one, have at it. You do not know me or the way I read anything. You are prideful and hypocritical.

 

[CS1]

That was a mess. You have not improved but then you see no need. You have a cavalier attitude toward scripture. You do not have a solemn respect for Gods word or the need to worship Christ with a repentant heart.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

again your words are there to see

 

[CS1]

That was a mess. You have not improved but then you see no need. You have a cavalier attitude toward scripture. You do not have a solemn respect for Gods word or the need to worship Christ with a repentant heart.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

thank you I will take that as a compliment

 

[Kavik]

If you think that the NIV, NASB, ESV are not translations from original languages using all manuscripts in extant and that they rely on some English translation it would reveal that you are just making things up as you speak. This willingness to just make things up about how the ESV, NASB, or NIV were produced is strong evidence that your interpretation of 1 Cor 14:14 is a belligerent interpretation based on your own desire for it to say what you want it to say rather than a sincere desire to yield to the actual meaning.

I don’t believe that’s what I said. Obviously if they’re based on an earlier English version (KVB), the earlier version is based on original manuscripts. I’m not suggesting the examples given are anything new.

The point I’m making is that the traditional view is for a passive meaning of ‘akarpos’. It can, however, also be taken in an active meaning which I think makes more sense in light of “tongues” as real, rational language and Paul’s call for clarity and understanding such that all may benefit. It also ties back to 1 Cor. 14:2 with respect to the speaker understanding what he's saying, but the audience does not as they don't speak his language.

Further, I am also pointing out that this idea (taking ‘akarpos’ with an active meaning) is not some newfangled concept/idea – it’s been around at least 500 years, if not more.

I do not hold that Biblical “tongues” are anything but real, rational langue(s). Modern tongues-speech (non-cognitive non-language utterance) is a completely different animal altogether.

 

[wolfwint]

The understanding is as it is seen in the word of God the Book of Acts those who were initially Baptized in the Holy Spirit all spoke in tongues or Prophesied which is tongues and interpretation also.

teach one to learn how to speak in tongues is unBiblical As a Pentecostal person for more than 38 years. WE did not teach doing that. So your experience is not the norm. I have seen those come and receive salvation and immediately after were baptized with the Holy Spirit and spoke in tongues. And it is that kind of teaching you are referring to that is taught BY some but not all Pentecostals. Your bias is telling.

If I am not wrong, you then should discuss this with Kelby. I was answering to his Post.

I know that among pentecostals are different teachings running.

Concerning the pentecostal/charismatic teachings I already told why I dont believe it.
To take a 2 years old thread changes nothing.

 

[garee]

This is better addressed to the Pentecostals who hold to these behaviors.

One mans attacking, mocking and scoffing is another mans rebuking, extolling and exhorting.

Behaviors speak louder than words. Gods word never promotes capricious behaviors.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

Yes that defines the law of tongues. "God declaring his prophecy to all the nations". A picture of God mocking those who mock him. Having another authority as a oral tradition of men And yet for all the warnings they continue to mock him as a sign against themselves falling back slain in the spirit of Judgement

God Wants to Help His People

Isiah 28;9-13 The people say, “Who does he think he is trying to teach and explain his message to? Does he think we are babies who were at their mother’s breast only a very short time ago? He speaks to us as though we were babies “Saw lasaw saw lasaw Qaw laqaw qaw laqaw Ze’er sham ze’er sham.” So God will use this strange way of talking, and he will use other languages to speak to these people. In the past he spoke to them and said, “Here is a resting place. Let those who are tired come and rest. This is the place of peace.”But they would not listen to him. So the Lord’s words will be senseless sounds to them:“Saw lasaw saw lasawQaw laqaw qaw laqaw.Ze’er sham ze’er sham.”When the people try to walk, they will fall backwards. They will be defeated, trapped, and captured.

 

[DWR]

I have a question for those who speak in tongues.
I was saved 60 years ago.
I have never been lead to speak in tongues nor have I ever felt the need to.
What is your thoughts on a believer like me?

 

[breno785au]

I have a question for those who speak in tongues.
I was saved 60 years ago.
I have never been lead to speak in tongues nor have I ever felt the need to.
What is your thoughts on a believer like me?

My thoughts are, I look forward to seeing His face with you in the age to come.

 

[biker]

I have a question for those who speak in tongues.
I was saved 60 years ago.
I have never been lead to speak in tongues nor have I ever felt the need to.
What is your thoughts on a believer like me?

I am willing to bet that you were given Gifts that I have never been able to find from the Holy Spirit. And because I have never been able to do the Gifts you were given doesn't make me feel like I am less than. What I have learned about my Gifts. One day they will cost me. I know I have been given the Gifts of Tongues and Discernment. Generally, that places me on the front line of Spiritual Warfare because I really have a Faith in God that seems more extreme than normal. I know how this world is becoming, and that combination is going to lead me to face what God has been preparing me for my entire life. Chances are, I will die ugly. But the upside of it all, I ain't going down in a blaze of Glory. I am going to be with my Lord and Maker immediately!