ANGELS DO NOT HAVE FLESHLY BODIES

[Blik]

I agree pretty much, however you state Angels race back and forth between earth and heaven?

You mention Angels are in another dimension?

You mention Elijah had Angels encamped around him, others couldnt see?

Perhaps Angels are around us, and we are unaware, we need to open our spiritual eyes?

Hebrews 13:2KJV
2 Be not forgetful to entertain strangers: for thereby some have entertained angels unawares.

In Genesis 28:12 it speaks of Jacob having a dream of seeing angels going back and forth to heaven. Genesis 28:12 He had a dream in which he saw a stairway resting on the earth, with its top reaching to heaven, and the angels of God were ascending and descending on it.

I don't think we are meant to see the angels around us except in special cases. I have seen them twice, but it was more in perceiving them than seeing. There was only a form made by a change in light. Both times there were two. One time they were helping with a death, another time they were helping with a birth. I could "hear" them talking to each other and me, but again it was more perceiving what they said than hearing a physical voice.

 

[WithinReason]

I don't believe angels had fleshly bodies.

After a most thorough study of the scriptures upon the subject of Angels, they most certainly do have fleshy (not fleshly) bodies. Would you like to consider the evidence with me?

They are only described as being spirits in the Bible.

Not so. They called "ministering spirits", true, but most have a misunderstanding of the word "spirit" as defined by scripture. Angels, the beings of Heaven, are not aetheral essences. That is a pagan notion.

As such, they have been able to appear invisibly, to people.

There is an oxy-moron in your sentence, when it says, "appear invisibly". To "appear" is to no longer be "invisible" (not appearing to sight). Furthermore, the word 'invisible' is not equal to the word aethereal.

And sometimes looking like what they really look like - angels.

Angels can mask their glory and light, and wear human clothing.

Though sometimes, God has sent angels to mankind in visible form, to look like ordinary humans, too.

Basically true.

 

[Truth7t7]

Great verse concerning cherubs, but....angels are the discussion.

The Spiritual has God, Christ, and Angels?

What are cherubs if you don't believe they are angels?

 

[Blik]

Fallen Angels (Devil's) don't procreate with humans, you suggest the false teachings found in (Greek Mythology)

33 Then went the devils out of the man, and entered into the swine: and the herd ran violently down a steep place into the lake, and were choked.

If you don't believe that devils ever procreated with humans then you must believe that we can not regard scripture as scripture for we are told they did in the sixth chapter of Genesis.

 

[John146]

The Spiritual has God, Christ, and Angels?

What are cherubs if you don't believe they are angels?

Uhhh, cherubs...in Scripture there are angels, cherubims and seraphims. All are sons of God. I have not read where they are all considered angels.

 

[WithinReason]

Uhhh, cherubs...in Scripture there are angels, cherubims and seraphims. All are sons of God. I have not read where they are all considered angels.

Was Lucifer the covering cherub? (Ezekiel 28:14) Lucifer is an angel (see also Revelation 9:11). Cherubim (Exodus 37:8) are a specific class, or office of, angel (see Jude 1:6).

Gabriel is the one that replaced Lucifer (Luke 1:19) as a covering cherub, and Gabriel is an angel (Luke 1:26).

 

[WithinReason]

Most persons, even Christians, are basically ignorant, or have phantastical ideas, about angels in scripture, concerning their nature, their function, their offices, the outward appearance, where they dwell, how they serve God, in regards to prayer, etc.

This may Help -

https://archive.org/download/michael-the-archangel-03-the-word-angel-as-defined-and-used/Michael the archangel [03] - The word angel as defined and used.pdf

https://archive.org/download/michael-the-archangel-04-archangels-in-the-kjb-and-in-the-so-p-to-j/Michael the archangel [04] - Archangels in the KJB and in the SoP-ToJ.pdf

 

[WithinReason]

If you don't believe that devils ever procreated with humans then you must believe that we can not regard scripture as scripture for we are told they did in the sixth chapter of Genesis.

Read the following thread - carefully, and look for the posts by One Baptism - https://www.baptistboard.com/thread...pture-kjb-declares-not-so.93713/#post-2133867

No, the angelic host cannot, and have never procreated. God never gave them the ability to do so.

 

[WithinReason]

Ezekiel 10:7-8KJV
7 And one cherub stretched forth his hand from between the cherubims unto the fire that was between the cherubims, and took thereof, and put it into the hands of him that was clothed with linen: who took it, and went out.
8 And there appeared in the cherubims the form of a man's hand under their wings.

Angels have wings that are able to fly (even as Cherub are a class or office of angel):

Rev_8:13 And I beheld, and heard an angel flying through the midst of heaven, saying with a loud voice, Woe, woe, woe, to the inhabiters of the earth by reason of the other voices of the trumpet of the three angels, which are yet to sound!​

​

Rev_14:6 And I saw another angel fly in the midst of heaven, having the everlasting gospel to preach unto them that dwell on the earth, and to every nation, and kindred, and tongue, and people,​

​

Rev_19:17 And I saw an angel standing in the sun; and he cried with a loud voice, saying to all the fowls that fly in the midst of heaven, Come and gather yourselves together unto the supper of the great God;​

Gabriel is a covering cherub angel, who has wings, able to fly:

​

Dan_9:21 Yea, whiles I was speaking in prayer, even the man Gabriel, whom I had seen in the vision at the beginning, being caused to fly swiftly, touched me about the time of the evening oblation.​

​

Luk_1:19 And the angel answering said unto him, I am Gabriel, that stand in the presence of God; and am sent to speak unto thee, and to shew thee these glad tidings.​

Luk_1:26 And in the sixth month the angel Gabriel was sent from God unto a city of Galilee, named Nazareth,​

​

Joh_20:12 And seeth two angels in white sitting, the one at the head, and the other at the feet, where the body of Jesus had lain.​

​

You might also enjoy - The Truth About Angels

 

[tourist]

I have only once seen an angel, so I'm not really certain that they exist

You saw an angel but still doubt that they exist?

 

[tourist]

Read the following thread - carefully, and look for the posts by One Baptism - https://www.baptistboard.com/thread...pture-kjb-declares-not-so.93713/#post-2133867

No, the angelic host cannot, and have never procreated. God never gave them the ability to do so.

I read the post and saw no mention of scripture stating that angels cannot procreate.

 

[Truth7t7]

The men of Sodom did want to have sex with them...

And Genesis 6, the angels who left their first estate?

Man Adding To The Words If God

There are no angels in Genesis 6:1-7 below, as previously stated "The Sons Of God" were human men.

The Sons of God Were Human Men, they married human wives and had human children, simple

John 1:12KJV
12 But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name

Romans 8:14KJV
14 For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.

1 John 3:1KJV
Behold, what manner of love the Father hath bestowed upon us, that we should be called the sons of God: therefore the world knoweth us not, because it knew him not.

God Was Striving With Man (Flesh), Not Angels

Genesis 6:1-7KJV
6 And it came to pass, when men began to multiply on the face of the earth, and daughters were born unto them,
2 That the sons of God saw the daughters of men that they were fair; and they took them wives of all which they chose.
3 And the Lord said, My spirit shall not always strive with man, for that he also is flesh: yet his days shall be an hundred and twenty years.
4 There were giants in the earth in those days; and also after that, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them, the same became mighty men which were of old, men of renown.
5 And God saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually.
6 And it repented the Lord that he had made man on the earth, and it grieved him at his heart.
7 And the Lord said, I will destroy man whom I have created from the face of the earth; both man, and beast, and the creeping thing, and the fowls of the air; for it repenteth me that I have made them.

 

[bluto]

Angels have wings that are able to fly (even as Cherub are a class or office of angel):

Rev_8:13 And I beheld, and heard an angel flying through the midst of heaven, saying with a loud voice, Woe, woe, woe, to the inhabiters of the earth by reason of the other voices of the trumpet of the three angels, which are yet to sound!​

​

Rev_14:6 And I saw another angel fly in the midst of heaven, having the everlasting gospel to preach unto them that dwell on the earth, and to every nation, and kindred, and tongue, and people,​

​

Rev_19:17 And I saw an angel standing in the sun; and he cried with a loud voice, saying to all the fowls that fly in the midst of heaven, Come and gather yourselves together unto the supper of the great God;​

Gabriel is a covering cherub angel, who has wings, able to fly:

​

Dan_9:21 Yea, whiles I was speaking in prayer, even the man Gabriel, whom I had seen in the vision at the beginning, being caused to fly swiftly, touched me about the time of the evening oblation.​

​

Luk_1:19 And the angel answering said unto him, I am Gabriel, that stand in the presence of God; and am sent to speak unto thee, and to shew thee these glad tidings.​

Luk_1:26 And in the sixth month the angel Gabriel was sent from God unto a city of Galilee, named Nazareth,​

​

Joh_20:12 And seeth two angels in white sitting, the one at the head, and the other at the feet, where the body of Jesus had lain.​

​

You might also enjoy - The Truth About Angels

I thought Ellen G. White believed Jesus Christ was Michael the arc angel just like the Jehovah Witnesses believe. Do you know if she "denounced" this teaching?

IN GOD THE SON,
bluto

 

[John146]

Was Lucifer the covering cherub? (Ezekiel 28:14) Lucifer is an angel (see also Revelation 9:11). Cherubim (Exodus 37:8) are a specific class, or office of, angel (see Jude 1:6).

Gabriel is the one that replaced Lucifer (Luke 1:19) as a covering cherub, and Gabriel is an angel (Luke 1:26).

Thanks for this. I’ll check into it.

 

[John146]

Man Adding To The Words If God

There are no angels in Genesis 6:1-7 below, as previously stated "The Sons Of God" were human men.

The Sons of God Were Human Men, they married human wives and had human children, simple

John 1:12KJV
12 But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name

Romans 8:14KJV
14 For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.

1 John 3:1KJV
Behold, what manner of love the Father hath bestowed upon us, that we should be called the sons of God: therefore the world knoweth us not, because it knew him not.

God Was Striving With Man (Flesh), Not Angels

Genesis 6:1-7KJV
6 And it came to pass, when men began to multiply on the face of the earth, and daughters were born unto them,
2 That the sons of God saw the daughters of men that they were fair; and they took them wives of all which they chose.
3 And the Lord said, My spirit shall not always strive with man, for that he also is flesh: yet his days shall be an hundred and twenty years.
4 There were giants in the earth in those days; and also after that, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them, the same became mighty men which were of old, men of renown.
5 And God saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually.
6 And it repented the Lord that he had made man on the earth, and it grieved him at his heart.
7 And the Lord said, I will destroy man whom I have created from the face of the earth; both man, and beast, and the creeping thing, and the fowls of the air; for it repenteth me that I have made them.

Man becomes a son of God by believing on Jesus Christ. No one believed on Jesus Christ in Genesis 6. Furthermore, two humans procreating never brings forth giants. These giants show up all throughout scripture. Angels are sons of God.

 

[Blik]

Angels have wings that are able to fly (even as Cherub are a class or office of angel):

Rev_8:13 And I beheld, and heard an angel flying through the midst of heaven, saying with a loud voice, Woe, woe, woe, to the inhabiters of the earth by reason of the other voices of the trumpet of the three angels, which are yet to sound!​

​

Rev_14:6 And I saw another angel fly in the midst of heaven, having the everlasting gospel to preach unto them that dwell on the earth, and to every nation, and kindred, and tongue, and people,​

​

Rev_19:17 And I saw an angel standing in the sun; and he cried with a loud voice, saying to all the fowls that fly in the midst of heaven, Come and gather yourselves together unto the supper of the great God;​

Gabriel is a covering cherub angel, who has wings, able to fly:

​

Dan_9:21 Yea, whiles I was speaking in prayer, even the man Gabriel, whom I had seen in the vision at the beginning, being caused to fly swiftly, touched me about the time of the evening oblation.​

​

Luk_1:19 And the angel answering said unto him, I am Gabriel, that stand in the presence of God; and am sent to speak unto thee, and to shew thee these glad tidings.​

Luk_1:26 And in the sixth month the angel Gabriel was sent from God unto a city of Galilee, named Nazareth,​

​

Joh_20:12 And seeth two angels in white sitting, the one at the head, and the other at the feet, where the body of Jesus had lain.​

​

You might also enjoy - The Truth About Angels

Cherubs have six wings and a man's, a lion's, a bull's, and an eagle's face. Rev, 4:7, Eze 1.10. There were six, but two fell away and became Lucifer. and the angel of death. See Isaiah 14:12 KJV. Those remaining are Michael, Gabriel, Raphael, and Uriel. They are the most powerful angels of the highest order.














v

 

[Benadam]

Good day, Benadam!

There is indeed is an account of those fallen spirits who defiled themselves and corrupted mankind, found in the prophecies of Enoch and which was the major reason for the flood.

"Now Enoch, the seventh from Adam, prophesied about these men also, saying, “Behold, the Lord comes with ten thousands of His saints, to execute judgment on all, to convict all who are ungodly among them of all their ungodly deeds which they have committed in an ungodly way, and of all the harsh things which ungodly sinners have spoken against Him.”

The angels who sinned by taking wives from the progeny of men: (An excerpt from Enoch)

It happened after the sons of men had multiplied in those days that daughters were born to them, elegant and beautiful. (see Genesis 6:1-2)

And when the angels, the sons of heaven, beheld them, they became enarmored of them, saying to each other: Come, let us select for ourselves wives from the progeny of men and let us beget children.

Then their leader Samyaza said to them; I fear that you may perhaps be indisposed to the performance of this enterprise;
and that I alone shall suffer for so grievous a crime.

But they answered him and said: We all swear; and bind ourselves by mutual execrations, that we will not change our intension, but execute our projected undertaking.

They all swore together, and all bound themselves by mutual excrations. There whole number was two hundred, who descended upon Ardis, which is the tope of Mount Armon.

That mountain, therefore, they called Armon, because they had sworn upon it and bound themselves by mutual execrations.

These are the names of their chiefs: Samyaza, who was their leader, Urakabarameel, Akibeel, Tamiel, Ramuel, Danel, Azkeel, sarakuyal, Asael, Batraal, Anane, Zavebe, Samsaveel, Ertael, Turel, Yomyael, Arazyal. These were the prefects of the two hunder angesl, and the remainder were all with them.

Then they took wives, each choosing for himself; whom they began to approach and with whom they cohabited; teaching them sorcery, incantation and the dividing of roots and trees.

And they conceiving brought forth giants (Gen.6:4-6) whose stature was each three hundred cubits. These devoured all which the labor of men produced; until it became impossible to feed them;

When they turned themselves agains men, in order to devour them; and began to injure birds, beasts, reptiles and fishes, to eat their flesh one after another and to drink their blood.

Then the earth reproved the unrighteousness.

Hi Awhatukee!
That the sons of God in Gen 6 are angels is disputed. There is no dispute for the passages that describe holy angels.

 

[WithinReason]

I thought Ellen G. White believed Jesus Christ was Michael the arc angel just like the Jehovah Witnesses believe. Do you know if she "denounced" this teaching?

IN GOD THE SON,
bluto

Why would she reject that which the entire reformation taught, and all the way back unto Meltio of Sardis, and the others before him in the scripture? -

Long list with citations:
https://ia801409.us.archive.org/29/items/michael-the-archangel-11-messengers-of-the-lord-the-reformation-etc/Michael the archangel [11] - Messengers of the LORD & the Reformation & etc.pdf

List of names, no citations:
https://ia601404.us.archive.org/15/items/michael-the-archangel-x-2-appendix-2-the-short-historical-list-of-those-who-taught-jesus-is-michael/Michael the archangel [X2] - Appendix 2 The Short Historical List of those who taught Jesus is Michael.pdf

Just because the WTS/JW cling in part to the Roman Catholic doctrine, that Michael is created, is their business, for having rejected the light in the Reformation and Great Awakening movements.

Others have long pointed out the same:

https://ia803207.us.archive.org/0/items/awhn-bible-michael-wikipedia/AWHN - Bible - Michael Wikipedia.jpg

Not perfect but useful:

https://ia802906.us.archive.org/11/items/amazing-facts-pocket-book-doug-batchelor-who-is-michael-the-archangel/Amazing Facts - Pocket Book - Doug Batchelor - Who Is Michael The Archangel.pdf

https://ia802908.us.archive.org/4/items/doctrine-michael-archangel-archangels-another-study-not-all-correct-but-good/Doctrine - Michael Archangel - Archangels - Another Study, Not All Correct But Good.pdf

https://ia801901.us.archive.org/10/items/doctrine-michael-archangel-francis-n-lee-jesus-is-michael/Doctrine - Michael Archangel - Francis N Lee - Jesus Is Michael.pdf

https://ia903208.us.archive.org/32/items/doctrine-michael-archangel-francis-n-lee-michael-archangel-short-notes/Doctrine - Michael Archangel - Francis N Lee - Michael Archangel Short Notes.pdf

I would simply ask that you do not confuse the WTS./JW errors (or the Roman Catholic ones for that matter) with the truth of scripture, history.

 

[garee]

Hi Diakonos!

Just fyi, their 'natural abode' is in reference to heaven, not their spiritual form. The Nephilim were the result of those angels being intimate with human women and they giving birth to those would who would become giants. These Nephilim were killed in the flood along with the rest of mankind who had been corrupted by all that the angels had taught them. The angels themselves were cast down into a place under the earth called Tartaroo/Tartartus where they will be released to stand at the great white throne judgment.

"For if God did not spare the angels when they sinned, but cast them deep into hell (tartartus), placing them in chains of darkness to be held for judgment."

The Nephilim are hero's of faith the faith of Christ working in the heart and soul of mankind. The word is used 9 times It also supports men of faith called sons of God (Christians )

Turning them into Giants of the evil one as lying spirits without form . Hollywood stuff.

 

[soberxp]

They are translucent light, not the presence of matter if it comes into this world to show themself,trust me.