The Judging Thread

[Benadam]

QUOTE="Scribe, post: 4351474, member: 14352"]With what measure you use it shall be used on you is a sobering thought to guide us on what we should think about people, and how we speak to them and treat them.[/QUOTE]
Very sobering.
Judgement in the measure

and

forgive us our sins AS we forgive those who .......

In as much as we are just we will be treated justly.
In As much as we are merciful we will receive mercy.

Yeah, those teach ings have stopped me in my tracks many times

 

[Jackson123]

Is These verse teach how to judge?

Matt 7

16 Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles?

17 Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit.

18 A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit.

19 Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire.

20 Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.

 

[MattforJesus]

Have you ever been judged by someone and when you pointed it out they said "I'm not judging you"?

This it a thread about how we Judge and examples of judging and bible verses about judging.

But if we judged ourselves rightly, we would not be judged -1 Cor 11:13

Joh 5:22 For the Father judgeth no man, but hath committed all judgment unto the Son.

Act 17:31 Because he hath appointed a day, in the which he will judge the world in righteousness by that man whom he hath ordained; whereof he hath given assurance unto all men, in that he hath raised him from the dead.

1Ti 2:5 For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus.

God shall judge the world by the Son, the man Christ Jesus, for He did the will of God and obtained eternal life, so no person has an excuse why they cannot make it to heaven.

1Co 6:1 Dare any of you, having a matter against another, go to law before the unjust, and not before the saints?
1Co 6:2 Do ye not know that the saints shall judge the world? and if the world shall be judged by you, are ye unworthy to judge the smallest matters?
1Co 6:3 Know ye not that we shall judge angels? how much more things that pertain to this life?
1Co 6:4 If then ye have judgments of things pertaining to this life, set them to judge who are least esteemed in the church.

1Co 5:12 For what have I to do to judge them also that are without? do not ye judge them that are within?
1Co 5:13 But them that are without God judgeth. Therefore put away from among yourselves that wicked person.

The saints shall judge the world for they made it to heaven, and the world will not have an excuse for why they could not make it.

The saints can judge those in the Church if they do not act like Christ, but they must be acting like Christ first or they will be a hypocrite.

Mat 7:1 Judge not, that ye be not judged.
Mat 7:2 For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged: and with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again.
Mat 7:3 And why beholdest thou the mote that is in thy brother's eye, but considerest not the beam that is in thine own eye?
Mat 7:4 Or how wilt thou say to thy brother, Let me pull out the mote out of thine eye; and, behold, a beam is in thine own eye?
Mat 7:5 Thou hypocrite, first cast out the beam out of thine own eye; and then shalt thou see clearly to cast out the mote out of thy brother's eye.

Do not judge in a condemning manner like saying you no good sinner, for you were a sinner yourself, and it was God that saved you and not of yourself.

And when we judge we have to be Christlike or we will be hypocritical, and if we say you no good sinner, or judge not acting Christlike then that judgment will come on us and we will not be forgiven.

 

[Blik]

Matt gave this scripture that I think is the essence to the answer to this problem: Joh 5:22 For the Father judgeth no man, but hath committed all judgment unto the Son. When we take on the job of judging people we are taking on what belongs to Christ alone.

There is a lot of judging of people on this site, but also, if we disagree about an interpretation of scripture someone has made it is perceived as judging the person they disagree with. Then the answer comes back as a personal fight, forgetting it is about scripture, not people.

I think there is a need for people to discipline themselves enough to keep discussions to scripture so we can each see different ways to look at the word with each allowing each other to understand something differently.

God lets us choose our way, even if we choose to be sinful and still loves us. I think God asks us to do the same for each other. It is God's place to judge people, we are not Gods. But we are to judge what is sin.

 

[Nehemiah6]

Do not judge in a condemning manner like saying you no good sinner...

This goes to the heart of Christian judging. Only God can condemn or forgive those who sin. But Christians are required to make moral and spiritual judgments, as long as there is good and evil in the world.

 

[Jackson123]

This goes to the heart of Christian judging. Only God can condemn or forgive those who sin. But Christians are required to make moral and spiritual judgments, as long as there is good and evil in the world.

Let say you know your Christian friend start interested in Mormon teaching. As a friend you tell him, you go to the wrong direction brother

It that cosider judging To say he went to wrong for the sake of love?

Like what op did, to say It is wrong to criticized with hate

,
That is also criticized, but as long as we do It for love, It is biblical

 

[p_rehbein]

Mayhaps, some here, eventually, will get around to realizing that the Author of the OP is doing exactly what he is speaking against. For he is judging those who judge others, right? Else, what is the point of the Thread?

Judging v. evaluating may be synonyms............try discerning...........you know, like how we are to discern the spirits to see if they are "of God," or just another troll here on CC..........

OH NO!

Have I judged?

or

Have I discerned?

 

[MattforJesus]

This goes to the heart of Christian judging. Only God can condemn or forgive those who sin. But Christians are required to make moral and spiritual judgments, as long as there is good and evil in the world.

Right, for we tell the world what God requires of them which is not judging for it is of God and His ways like telling the world God is against homosexuality, against pornography that are not considered an offence to people so the world thinks it is alright, but it is not, as well as tell them do not steal, do not harm anyone, which they know is an offence to people.

 

[Benadam]

In the end I think this is how Christians will sit on thrones and judge.




Matthew 12;42

The queen of the south shall rise up in the judgment with this generation, and shall condemn it: for she came from the uttermost parts of the earth to hear the wisdom of Solomon; and, behold, a greater than Solomon is here.

 

[Blik]

Mayhaps, some here, eventually, will get around to realizing that the Author of the OP is doing exactly what he is speaking against. For he is judging those who judge others, right? Else, what is the point of the Thread?

Judging v. evaluating may be synonyms............try discerning...........you know, like how we are to discern the spirits to see if they are "of God," or just another troll here on CC..........

OH NO!

Have I judged?

or

Have I discerned?

I don't think the point of this post is judging people, it is judging what scripture tells us about judging. We are allowed to judge what actions follow the Lord and what actions do not. We are not to judge the people exhibiting those actions.

 

[Lion222]

A few of my thoughts on judging wrongfully that Jesus was talking about:

If you saw a man come out of a sisters house in the morning and drive away and then you thought, or said "That sister should not be sinning like that! She needs to repent of fornication." or "She should not let men stay at her house overnight like that people are going to think she is sleeping with them" And then you found out it was her brother, you would feel foolish because you were guilty of judging wrongfully. Judging by outward appearance.

If you saw a tall man who had a very strong low baritone voice and was articulate. You might say, "that man would be a good leader for the xyz ministry" and he might turn out to be a total buffoon. You were judging by outward appearance instead of looking at the heart like God does. How do you look at the heart? You have to get to know them and find out what they are like and what their character is like.

Any false accusation against someone without evidence would also be a form of the unrighteous judging Jesus condemned.

Condemning someone harshly, such as saying "that person is so wicked they are probably past saving. Their heart is too hard." That also could be a form of judging unrighteously.

With what measure you use it shall be used on you is a sobering thought to guide us on what we should think about people, and how we speak to them and treat them.

Telling a homosexual that asks you about it that homosexuals must repent and turn from that sin to be saved is not judging them wrongfully it is simply preaching repentance toward God and faith in the Lord Jesus Christ.

When I eat a whole large pizza for lunch and you tell me "you're disgusting" that is really not judging either. But I will probably tell you "Don't Judge Me!" and then I'll cry.

So the issue is thinking you know and then judging vs Actually knowing and then judging?

But about intent?

 

[Lion222]

I am at a loss. My five points were especially written simply and plainly - the best way to transmit an idea. Why would I use "nuance" and "subtlety of language". That's what politicians do to confuse an issue. But maybe you are correct. Can give an example.

Understanding those thing is where accuracy comes from.
Accurately handling the word of truth...
If you ignore them you end up with a truth of our own design.

John 7:24 does concern judging, but does not concern us. It was a matter between Jews and their Law.

John 8:15 shows how NOT to judge. If Jesus has released a person, who then is left to judge. Those who judged the woman had fled. Why? Our Lord Jesus wrote in the earth twice. The Law of Moses was written on earthy tables of stone and it had no effect. Israel have broken the Law to the uttermost and within just days of it being given (the golden calf). So the first time our Lord writes in the earth nothing happens. But then our Lord writes in the earth again. This speaks of the New Covenant that is to come when Israel are restored again (Jer.31:31). It is written IN the Israelite, a man of earth and these Laws will be effective (Jer.31:33). So the full weight of the Law was suddenly impressed upon the accusers. What had they done? The Law that condemned the woman ALSO condemns THE MAN (Deut.22:22-24)! Where was the MALE? The accusers had (i) NOT brought both partners, and (ii) now brought false witness in a matter of the death penalty. And what does Deuteronomy 19:16-19 say?

It says that if a man bring falsehood into a matter of Law, the punishment for that man will be the same as he thought to place on the accused. In John 8 the Pharisees had not brought the man in matter of the DEATH SENTENCE. Each Pharisee, old to young, was guilty of the Law that required their DEATHS! Beautiful as it may be, this is NOT the way to judge and the lesson almost lands a crowd of Pharisees in a stoning to death. But it should not end here. There is more. How can Jesus, a Man under Law, let the woman, the man AND the Pharisees go free. Is not the Law the Law? YES! But the woman, the man AND the Pharisees MY GO FREE only if a suitable SUBSTITUTE is found. The blood of bulls and goats cannot stop a stoning. Only the blood of JESUS was good enough. Whe Jesus wrote the second time, did He not sign His OWN DEATH WARRANT? He signed away His life blood to dribble into the earth!

There is neither "nuance" or "subtlety". This is the harsh brazen truth of the price of sinners like the woman, the man, the Pharisees AND YOU AND I going free BECAUSE Another took our place.

1st Corinthians 6:1-3 should be covered by my point # 3.

Conjecture. He could have just doodled while the spirit convicted them, or written out the law or their sins or names of people they sinned against. We do not know! its all just assumption and conjecture. Where if the subtly of a specific word had communicated something more nuanced about what he wrote we would have just reason to think a way on the matter.

 

[Scribe]

So the issue is thinking you know and then judging vs Actually knowing and then judging?

But about intent?

The emphasis in scripture was about judging by outward appearance. We can reference the choosing of King David. And of course false accusations without evidence. Saying homosexual sin is wrong or telling a homosexual there is an eternal hell if there is no repentance is not judging wrong.
However saying someone is gay because of the sound of their voice or because they like fashion design and then you find out they are married with children and were never gay. You should feel ashamed. But most don't. They don't learn from those moments when they were proven wrong and they just keep sinning spitting out false accusations a mile a minute heaping up for themselves judgment.

 

[Lion222]

I think that the subject has multiple facets.

1. We are NOT to judge another's motives (Matt.7:1)
2. We are NOT to judge the actions of those outside the Church (1st Cor.5:12a)
3. We ARE to judge the actions of those IN the Church (1st Cor.5:12b)
4. We ARE to judge ourselves, especially when taking the Lord's Table (1st Cor.11:13, 31)
5. We are to approach a brother who is sinning. This presumes some sort of Judgment (Gal.6:1)

Nice list by the way.

So we are NOT to judge other people motives, but we ARE to judge our own motives behind our actions?
We are TO judge the actions of those in the Church, but NOT the actions of those outside of the Church?

If you pay attention on the man in fine clothes and say, “Here is a seat of honor,” but say to the poor man, “You must stand,” or, “Sit at my feet,” have you not discriminated among yourselves and become judges with evil thoughts/motives? - James 2:3-4

Yet James just judged the peoples motives by their actions or did he invite them to judge themselves based on their actions?

 

[Scribe]

Nice list by the way.

So we are NOT to judge other people motives, but we ARE to judge our own motives behind our actions?
We are TO judge the actions of those in the Church, but NOT the actions of those outside of the Church?

If you pay attention on the man in fine clothes and say, “Here is a seat of honor,” but say to the poor man, “You must stand,” or, “Sit at my feet,” have you not discriminated among yourselves and become judges with evil thoughts/motives? - James 2:3-4

Yet James just judged the peoples motives by their actions or did he invite them to judge themselves based on their actions?

James is saying dont judge by outward appearance or you are violating known scriptures and are a transgressor.

 

[Scribe]

James is saying dont judge by outward appearance or you are violating known scriptures and are a transgressor.

If they judged by outward appearance they would be the judge with evil thoughts (wrong kind of judgment, outward appearance)

 

[Lion222]

James is saying dont judge by outward appearance or you are violating known scriptures and are a transgressor.

That is not what I see.
James is using the example or outward appearances (nice clothes) to address how people are judging.

James then judges by example by the outward appearances of their actions so as to question them to judge themselves in regards to their motives of heart.
James never asserts that they are wrong with evil motives.

The focus is all about discriminating among yourselves.
That tendency to look and think and make distinctions in ignorance or conjecture.
That operating in the nature of the fall into reason and ignorance with our thinking playing god instead of faith in the true God and Judge.

Us getting the operation of judgement wrong is what divides us, living out of the evil motives of the heart and dependence on our reason as Judge playing God.

I also suspect this is the space where the fear of God is lacking due to, for the most part our ignorance of what we are actually doing.

 

[Scribe]

That is not what I see.
James is using the example or outward appearances (nice clothes) to address how people are judging.

Right. If they are giving preference to someone that looks wealthy they are judging the poor person as less worthy, this judgment is wrong, it is an opinion of a persons worth or maybe even character based on their outward appearance of being wealthy or poor. It may also suggest that they expect to gain something from the wealthy person and that is why they are giving them preference. Whether they are thinking that the wealthy person is of a more noble character (which could be wrong), or that the wealthy person is able to support the church and the poor is not, both are evil thoughts that should not motivate a person to be a respector of persons.

 

[Scribe]

Nice list by the way.

So we are NOT to judge other people motives, but we ARE to judge our own motives behind our actions?
We are TO judge the actions of those in the Church, but NOT the actions of those outside of the Church?

If you pay attention on the man in fine clothes and say, “Here is a seat of honor,” but say to the poor man, “You must stand,” or, “Sit at my feet,” have you not discriminated among yourselves and become judges with evil thoughts/motives? - James 2:3-4

Yet James just judged the peoples motives by their actions or did he invite them to judge themselves based on their actions?

4have you not then made distinctions among yourselves and become judges with evil thoughts? 5Listen, my beloved brothers, has not God chosen those who are poor in the world to be rich in faith and heirs of the kingdom, which he has promised to those who love him?

I think that the one doing the judging is the one with the evil thoughts. Compare KJV with ESV

 

[JaumeJ]

We are taught to judge for ourselves what is right. Note it points out "for ourselves." Our judgment is only final for ourselves, but not necessarily eternally.
We are never to judge to condemnation.............