Is the teaching of Jesus before His crucifixion only for Jews?

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Jackson123

Senior Member
Feb 6, 2014
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He came to His own first.
John 1
11 He came unto his own, and his own received him not.

12 But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:

13 Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.

Read full chapter

He come to Jews but Jews don't want Him than He invite every body

So this gospel is for every body
 
Jan 12, 2019
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John 1
11 He came unto his own, and his own received him not.

12 But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:

13 Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.

Read full chapter

He come to Jews but Jews don't want Him than He invite every body

So this gospel is for every body
But when "this gospel is for every body" happen?
 
Jan 12, 2019
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How do you believe people were saved in the Old Testament?

Remember Paul says Abraham was saved by faith.
What did Abraham had faith in, was it about the cross?

Was he required to have works to accompany his faith?
 

John146

Senior Member
Jan 13, 2016
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How do you believe people were saved in the Old Testament?

Remember Paul says Abraham was saved by faith.
Actually, Abraham was justified by faith.

Do you think people were saved under the law? If so, why the need for Jesus?
 

John146

Senior Member
Jan 13, 2016
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Dont you see the problem that when James sends the letter out, he is actually sending it to NO ONE. But to someone 2000 years later.
People copied the letters by hand back in those days, and were happy to have a piece of what came to be the New Testament

Your view cannot work just because of church history, how it all played out and how people understood it then.

The NT Authors quote the OT extensively, tell us that they are written for our learning and consider them enough to make us wise unto salvation.
Most prophecies books are like this. The book of James was applicable at the time and Christ could have returned given the acceptance of Him by the Jews, but because they rejected Him, the book of james is yet future.
 

Jackson123

Senior Member
Feb 6, 2014
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But when "this gospel is for every body" happen?
When Jesus declare whosoever believe in john 3:16 or may before

John 3:16 doesn't say only Jews are invited, it say whosoever
 
Jan 12, 2019
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When Jesus declare whosoever believe in john 3:16 or may before

John 3:16 doesn't say only Jews are invited, it say whosoever
If you are saying John 3:16 tells you that "the gospel for everybody" began when Jesus was on Earth, then why would Jesus commanded his disciples not to go to the Gentiles in Matthew 10:5? Jesus would also not have stated Matthew 15:24 to the Cannanite lady.

Obviously there was an order to follow right? The nation Israel was to be saved first, before the Gentiles could be reached. Zechariah 8 has that timetable.
 

Jackson123

Senior Member
Feb 6, 2014
11,769
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If you are saying John 3:16 tells you that "the gospel for everybody" began when Jesus was on Earth, then why would Jesus commanded his disciples not to go to the Gentiles in Matthew 10:5? Jesus would also not have stated Matthew 15:24 to the Cannanite lady.

Obviously there was an order to follow right? The nation Israel was to be saved first, before the Gentiles could be reached. Zechariah 8 has that timetable.
Mat 15
28 Then Jesus answered and said unto her, O woman, great is thy faith: be it unto thee even as thou wilt. And her daughter was made whole from that very hour.

But Jesus help that woman.
 
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Mat 15
28 Then Jesus answered and said unto her, O woman, great is thy faith: be it unto thee even as thou wilt. And her daughter was made whole from that very hour.

But Jesus help that woman.
So you are saying Jesus was only joking with her then, by calling her a dog too?
 
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I don't say He is joking or not, but he did help that non Israel woman
There is a reason why he helped her, but its not because "the gospel was for both Jews and gentiles" during his first coming.

It was the same reason why he helped the Roman centurion. These 2 are the only gentiles he blessed during his earthly ministry.

You want to know why he helped her in the end?
 

TMS

Senior Member
Mar 21, 2015
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Australia
Rom 16:26 But now is made manifest, and by the scriptures of the prophets, according to the commandment of the everlasting God, made known to all nations for the obedience of faith:

2 Tim 3:16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:

All scripture, All.... old and new testiment.
 
Jul 6, 2020
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Abraham the father of the faith.

Abraham the father of many nations by that faith.
His children have never been counted by the physical but the spirit according to faith in the promise.

Always faith in the promise of God through Jesus Christ.
Even back then.
No other was to be saved.
 
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Abraham the father of the faith.

Abraham the father of many nations by that faith.
His children have never been counted by the physical but the spirit according to faith in the promise.

Always faith in the promise of God through Jesus Christ.
Even back then.
No other was to be saved.
What good news did Abraham put his faith in, was it about Jesus too?
 

Jackson123

Senior Member
Feb 6, 2014
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There is a reason why he helped her, but its not because "the gospel was for both Jews and gentiles" during his first coming.

It was the same reason why he helped the Roman centurion. These 2 are the only gentiles he blessed during his earthly ministry.

You want to know why he helped her in the end?
Yes
 
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When God made Abraham and his descendants the focus of his blessings, here is what was said in Genesis 22

17 That in blessing I will bless thee, and in multiplying I will multiply thy seed as the stars of the heaven, and as the sand which is upon the sea shore; and thy seed shall possess the gate of his enemies;

18 And in thy seed shall all the nations of the earth be blessed; because thou hast obeyed my voice.

Verse 18 is the key verse in understand how God related to Gentiles in the Old Testament, as well as the 4 Gospels.

Luke 7

2 And a certain centurion's servant, who was dear unto him, was sick, and ready to die.

3 And when he heard of Jesus, he sent unto him the elders of the Jews, beseeching him that he would come and heal his servant.

4 And when they came to Jesus, they besought him instantly, saying, That he was worthy for whom he should do this:

5 For he loveth our nation, and he hath built us a synagogue.

6 Then Jesus went with them. And when he was now not far from the house, the centurion sent friends to him, saying unto him, Lord, trouble not thyself: for I am not worthy that thou shouldest enter under my roof:

7 Wherefore neither thought I myself worthy to come unto thee: but say in a word, and my servant shall be healed.

8 For I also am a man set under authority, having under me soldiers, and I say unto one, Go, and he goeth; and to another, Come, and he cometh; and to my servant, Do this, and he doeth it.

9 When Jesus heard these things, he marvelled at him, and turned him about, and said unto the people that followed him, I say unto you, I have not found so great faith, no, not in Israel.

10 And they that were sent, returning to the house, found the servant whole that had been sick.

For the Roman Centurion case, the key verse was

3 And when he heard of Jesus, he sent unto him the elders of the Jews, beseeching him that he would come and heal his servant.

4 And when they came to Jesus, they besought him instantly, saying, That he was worthy for whom he should do this:

5 For he loveth our nation, and he hath built us a synagogue.

The Lord Jesus, without hesitation, immediately agreed to his request because he has blessed the Jews, and the Abrahamic covenant allows the blessing to then go to him.

As for the Canaanite woman, she did not deeds for the Jews but she wisely said in Mark

28 "Yes, Lord," she replied, "but even the dogs under the table eat the children's crumbs." 29 Then he told her, "For such a reply, you may go; the demon has left your daughter."

Mark has this important detail which I highlighted in bold. That lady made the correct analogy that even the dogs, a term used by the Jews to describe Gentiles, could be blessed with the crumbs falling from the Jewish children's bread.

Thus Jesus healed her because her faith allowed her to be blessed, thru the Jews, as promised to Abraham.
 

Derek1955

Active member
Jul 2, 2020
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When Jesus speaks He speaks for all, both Jew and Gentile for we are all one flock. Never believe otherwise.

John 10:11-16 I am the good shepherd. The good shepherd lays down his life for the sheep. The hired hand is not the shepherd and does not own the sheep. So when he sees the wolf coming, he abandons the sheep and runs away. Then the wolf attacks the flock and scatters it. The man runs away because he is a hired hand and cares nothing for the sheep. I am the good shepherd; I know my sheep and my sheep know me- just as the Father knows me and I know the Father-and I lay down my life for the sheep. I have other sheep that are not of this sheep pen. I must bring them also. They too will listen to my voice, and there shall be one flock and one shepherd.
 
Jan 12, 2019
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When Jesus speaks He speaks for all, both Jew and Gentile for we are all one flock. Never believe otherwise.

John 10:11-16 I am the good shepherd. The good shepherd lays down his life for the sheep. The hired hand is not the shepherd and does not own the sheep. So when he sees the wolf coming, he abandons the sheep and runs away. Then the wolf attacks the flock and scatters it. The man runs away because he is a hired hand and cares nothing for the sheep. I am the good shepherd; I know my sheep and my sheep know me- just as the Father knows me and I know the Father-and I lay down my life for the sheep. I have other sheep that are not of this sheep pen. I must bring them also. They too will listen to my voice, and there shall be one flock and one shepherd.
Can you find the terms sheep and Jesus as our shepherd in romans to philemon?

How come paul never use those terms for us in the body of Christ?
 

Derek1955

Active member
Jul 2, 2020
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Can you find the terms sheep and Jesus as our shepherd in romans to philemon?

How come paul never use those terms for us in the body of Christ?
The words of Christ, God Incarnate are more than enough for me.
 
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The words of Christ, God Incarnate are more than enough for me.
But Jesus himself announced his first coming was only for the lost sheep of the house of Israel (Matthew 15:24)