Not By Works

[Skovand]

Amen! John 5:24 - Most assuredly, I say to you, he who hears My word and believes in Him who sent Me has everlasting life, and shall not come into judgment, but has passed from death into life. (NKJV)

John 5:24 - I assure you, most solemnly I tell you, the person whose ears are open to My words [who listens to My message] and believes and trusts in and clings to and relies on Him Who sent Me has (possesses now) eternal life. And he does not come into judgment [does not incur sentence of judgment, will not come under condemnation], but he has already passed over out of death into life. (AMPC)

Yet we still die and are later on resurrected to eternal life right?


John 5:29
New American Standard Bible


29 and will come forth; those who did the good deeds to a resurrection of life, those who committed the evil deeds to a resurrection of judgment.

So we do in fact know for sure we will die. You know Christians that have died and I know Christians that have died.

We also have verses about the body being like a seed being planted that sprouts up with eternal life in 1 corinthians 15.

We also know that there is one resurrection of the righteous.

So if we have eternal life now, why do we still die and then get resurrected to eternal life?

One set of verses is very clear and one not. One verse we know is true and that means the other can’t mean something different.

When we know that we will die and then later on hear our names called in the book of life and we are then given eternal life that makes it very easy to understand what those verses mean in John. When held with all scripture, we know that Jesus is saying those who are his, those who become Christians and remain Christians will have eternal life. We know that because we know if anyone in here who believes that are a Christian jumps off a 100 foot building to concrete below head first they will hit the ground and die and remain dead and in the grave until resurrection to eternal life.

All we have to do is continue reading.


John 5:24-30
New American Standard Bible


24 “Truly, truly, I say to you, he who hears My word, and believes Him who sent Me, has eternal life, and does not come into judgment, but has passed out of death into life.
Two Resurrections
25 Truly, truly, I say to you, an hour is coming and now is, when the dead will hear the voice of the Son of God, and those who hear will live. 26 For just as the Father has life in Himself, even so He gave to the Son also to have life in Himself;27 and He gave Him authority to execute judgment, because He is the Son of Man. 28 Do not marvel at this; for an hour is coming, in which all who are in the tombs will hear His voice,29 and will come forth; those who did the good deeds to a resurrection of life, those who committed the evil deeds to a resurrection of judgment.
30 “I can do nothing on My own initiative. As I hear, I judge; and My judgment is just, because I do not seek My own will, but the will of Him who sent Me.


Then these verses.


2 Timothy 4:1-8
New American Standard Bible


“Preach the Word”
4 I solemnly charge you in the presence of God and of Christ Jesus, who is to judge the living and the dead, and by His appearing and His kingdom: 2 preach the word; be ready in season and out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort, with great patience and instruction. 3 For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but wanting to have their ears tickled, they will accumulate for themselves teachers in accordance to their own desires, 4 and will turn away their ears from the truth and will turn aside to myths. 5 But you, be sober in all things, endure hardship, do the work of an evangelist, fulfill your ministry.
6 For I am already being poured out as a drink offering, and the time of my departure has come.7 I have fought the good fight, I have finished the course, I have kept the faith; 8 in the future there is laid up for me the crown of righteousness, which the Lord, the righteous Judge, will award to me on that day; and not only to me, but also to all who have loved His appearing.

In these verses Paul talks about knowing in the future what he will have because he has held the faith until the end. Which is a different fate if someone did not endure but gave up.


Hebrews 3:14
New American Standard Bible


“14 For we have become partakers of Christ, if we hold fast the beginning of our assurance firm until the end,”

( if we ) ( hold firm until the end) ( we have become partakers of Christ ). If we don’t finish the good race and we don’t hold firm but give it up we won’t be saved. The Bible mentions various people who have fallen away.

This is why it’s dangerous to use a single verse outside of its actual meaning as a doctrinal footing that dismisses all of scripture.

 

[mailmandan]

Yet we still die and are later on resurrected to eternal life right?

Believers have eternal life as a present possession (John 5:24) and shall not come into judgment, but have passed from death into life.

John 5:29
New American Standard Bible

29 and will come forth; those who did the good deeds to a resurrection of life, those who committed the evil deeds to a resurrection of judgment.

So we do in fact know for sure we will die. You know Christians that have died and I know Christians that have died.

We also have verses about the body being like a seed being planted that sprouts up with eternal life in 1 corinthians 15.

We also know that there is one resurrection of the righteous.

So if we have eternal life now, why do we still die and then get resurrected to eternal life?

Just because we have not yet received our glorified bodies at the resurrection does not mean that we do not possess eternal life as a present possession now. There are 3 tenses to salvation that often get mixed up by works-salvationists. 1. We have been saved from the PENALTY of sin (justification) 2. We are being saved from the POWER of sin (ongoing sanctification) 3. We will be saved from the PRESENCE of sin (glorification)

One set of verses is very clear and one not. One verse we know is true and that means the other can’t mean something different.

You don't seem to understand that believers "have been" (past tense with ongoing present results) saved through faith.. (Ephesians 2:8)

When we know that we will die and then later on hear our names called in the book of life and we are then given eternal life that makes it very easy to understand what those verses mean in John. When held with all scripture, we know that Jesus is saying those who are his, those who become Christians and remain Christians will have eternal life. We know that because we know if anyone in here who believes that are a Christian jumps off a 100 foot building to concrete below head first they will hit the ground and die and remain dead and in the grave until resurrection to eternal life.

So you disregard John 5:24 and think that believers do not really have eternal life as a present possession?

All we have to do is continue reading.

You seem to believe that we really do not have eternal life and are not even yet saved until we receive our resurrected bodies. What is salvation to you? Salvation is not probation. Eternal life is not temporary life. Jesus is the door. He is not a revolving door.

John 5:24-30
New American Standard Bible

24 “Truly, truly, I say to you, he who hears My word, and believes Him who sent Me, has eternal life, and does not come into judgment, but has passed out of death into life.
Two Resurrections
25 Truly, truly, I say to you, an hour is coming and now is, when the dead will hear the voice of the Son of God, and those who hear will live. 26 For just as the Father has life in Himself, even so He gave to the Son also to have life in Himself; 27 and He gave Him authority to execute judgment, because He is the Son of Man. 28 Do not marvel at this; for an hour is coming, in which all who are in the tombs will hear His voice,29 and will come forth; those who did the good deeds to a resurrection of life, those who committed the evil deeds to a resurrection of judgment.
30 “I can do nothing on My own initiative. As I hear, I judge; and My judgment is just, because I do not seek My own will, but the will of Him who sent Me.

I often hear works-salvationists cite John 5:28-29 in an effort to try and prove that man is saved by works and end up confusing descriptive passages of scripture with prescriptive passages of scripture. In John 5:28-29, *notice that ALL who come forth unto the resurrection of life (believers - vs. 24) are described as those who have done good and ALL that come forth unto the resurrection of damnation (unbelievers) are described as those who have done evil.

What did Jesus say in John 3:18? - He who believes in Him is not condemned; but he who does not believe is condemned already..

Are believers described as "those who have done good" or those who have done evil?"

Are unbelievers described as those "who have done evil" or "those who have done good?"

Then these verses.

2 Timothy 4:1-8
New American Standard Bible

“Preach the Word”
4 I solemnly charge you in the presence of God and of Christ Jesus, who is to judge the living and the dead, and by His appearing and His kingdom: 2 preach the word; be ready in season and out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort, with great patience and instruction. 3 For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but wanting to have their ears tickled, they will accumulate for themselves teachers in accordance to their own desires, 4 and will turn away their ears from the truth and will turn aside to myths. 5 But you, be sober in all things, endure hardship, do the work of an evangelist, fulfill your ministry.
6 For I am already being poured out as a drink offering, and the time of my departure has come. 7 I have fought the good fight, I have finished the course, I have kept the faith; 8 in the future there is laid up for me the crown of righteousness, which the Lord, the righteous Judge, will award to me on that day; and not only to me, but also to all who have loved His appearing.

In these verses Paul talks about knowing in the future what he will have because he has held the faith until the end. Which is a different fate if someone did not endure but gave up.

Those who hold the faith until the end demonstrate that their faith was firmly rooted and established from the start. Those who do not endure but gave up demonstrate otherwise. There are genuine Christians and there are "nominal" Christians. There are genuine believers and there are make believers.

Hebrews 3:14
New American Standard Bible

“14 For we have become partakers of Christ, if we hold fast the beginning of our assurance firm until the end,”

( if we ) ( hold firm until the end) ( we have become partakers of Christ ). If we don’t finish the good race and we don’t hold firm but give it up we won’t be saved. The Bible mentions various people who have fallen away.

Hebrews 3:14 - For we have become [past tense Gk. verb, gegonamen, meaning we have become already] partakers of Christ, (demonstrative evidence) if we hold fast the beginning of our confidence steadfast to the end. Notice that this is essentially a repeat of verse 6, in which we read: but Christ was faithful as a Son over His house - whose house we are, (demonstrative evidence) if we hold fast our confidence and the boast of our hope firm until the end.

The wording is not - "and you will become partakers of Christ (future indicative) if you (future indicative) hold fast." It is rather - "you have been, and now are partakers of Christ" (demonstrative evidence) if in the future you hold fast the beginning of your confidence steadfast to the end." *Holding fast confirms "have become" partakers of Christ.

The point is that not all of these Hebrews have become partakers in Christ and the only ones in the end who will be identified as having become partakers of Christ (demonstrative evidence) will be those who have held fast the beginning of their confidence steadfast to the end. Now what about those faltering Hebrews who depart from God, yet begin with loud confidence and profession of loyalty? But then later? *Once again, holding fast confirms "have become" partakers of Christ.

In Hebrews 4:1-2, we read - "For indeed the gospel was preached to US as well as to THEM; but the word which THEY heard did not profit THEM, not being mixed with faith in those who heard it. For WE who have believed do enter that rest, as He has said: "So I swore in My wrath, 'They shall not enter My rest," although the works were finished from the foundation of the world. Obviously, not all of these Hebrews were genuine believers. *Notice that verses 2-3 make a distinction between US who have BELIEVED and do enter that rest and THEM who heard the word but did not mix faith with what they heard and will not enter that rest because of UNBELIEF.

Jude 1:5 - ..the Lord at one time delivered his people out of Egypt, but later destroyed those who did not believe.

This is why it’s dangerous to use a single verse outside of its actual meaning as a doctrinal footing that dismisses all of scripture.

Your misinterpretation of these other verses results in dismissing the intended meaning of John 5:24. Elsewhere, we read - 1 John 5:11 And this is the testimony: that God has given us eternal life, and this life is in His Son. 12 He who has the Son has life; he who does not have the Son of God does not have life. 13 These things I have written to you who believe in the name of the Son of God, that you may know that you have eternal life, and that you may continue to believe in the name of the Son of God.

Will you dismiss 1 John 5:11-13 as well?

 

[Duskey]

He choose to believe in the gospels he heard preached. That’s an action.

You’re saying having faith is an action?

 

[Skovand]

You’re saying having faith is an action?

If you are choosing to do something or believe something it requires work. Even when you get verses about god working in ur for faith, when you place those verses in context of everything else there is a clear understanding.

Faith is never free will be stripped away and forced to believe in something. You don’t see that in the Bible anywhere.

 

[Skovand]

Believers have eternal life as a present possession (John 5:24) and shall not come into judgment, but have passed from death into life.

Just because we have not yet received our glorified bodies at the resurrection does not mean that we do not possess eternal life as a present possession now. There are 3 tenses to salvation that often get mixed up by works-salvationists. 1. We have been saved from the PENALTY of sin (justification) 2. We are being saved from the POWER of sin (ongoing sanctification) 3. We will be saved from the PRESENCE of sin (glorification)

You don't seem to understand that believers "have been" (past tense with ongoing present results) saved through faith.. (Ephesians 2:8)

So you disregard John 5:24 and think that believers do not really have eternal life as a present possession?

You seem to believe that we really do not have eternal life and are not even yet saved until we receive our resurrected bodies. What is salvation to you? Salvation is not probation. Eternal life is not temporary life. Jesus is the door. He is not a revolving door.

I often hear works-salvationists cite John 5:28-29 in an effort to try and prove that man is saved by works and end up confusing descriptive passages of scripture with prescriptive passages of scripture. In John 5:28-29, *notice that ALL who come forth unto the resurrection of life (believers - vs. 24) are described as those who have done good and ALL that come forth unto the resurrection of damnation (unbelievers) are described as those who have done evil.

What did Jesus say in John 3:18? - He who believes in Him is not condemned; but he who does not believe is condemned already..

Are believers described as "those who have done good" or those who have done evil?"

Are unbelievers described as those "who have done evil" or "those who have done good?"

Those who hold the faith until the end demonstrate that their faith was firmly rooted and established from the start. Those who do not endure but gave up demonstrate otherwise. There are genuine Christians and there are "nominal" Christians. There are genuine believers and there are make believers.

Hebrews 3:14 - For we have become [past tense Gk. verb, gegonamen, meaning we have become already] partakers of Christ, (demonstrative evidence) if we hold fast the beginning of our confidence steadfast to the end. Notice that this is essentially a repeat of verse 6, in which we read: but Christ was faithful as a Son over His house - whose house we are, (demonstrative evidence) if we hold fast our confidence and the boast of our hope firm until the end.

The wording is not - "and you will become partakers of Christ (future indicative) if you (future indicative) hold fast." It is rather - "you have been, and now are partakers of Christ" (demonstrative evidence) if in the future you hold fast the beginning of your confidence steadfast to the end." *Holding fast confirms "have become" partakers of Christ.

The point is that not all of these Hebrews have become partakers in Christ and the only ones in the end who will be identified as having become partakers of Christ (demonstrative evidence) will be those who have held fast the beginning of their confidence steadfast to the end. Now what about those faltering Hebrews who depart from God, yet begin with loud confidence and profession of loyalty? But then later? *Once again, holding fast confirms "have become" partakers of Christ.

In Hebrews 4:1-2, we read - "For indeed the gospel was preached to US as well as to THEM; but the word which THEY heard did not profit THEM, not being mixed with faith in those who heard it. For WE who have believed do enter that rest, as He has said: "So I swore in My wrath, 'They shall not enter My rest," although the works were finished from the foundation of the world. Obviously, not all of these Hebrews were genuine believers. *Notice that verses 2-3 make a distinction between US who have BELIEVED and do enter that rest and THEM who heard the word but did not mix faith with what they heard and will not enter that rest because of UNBELIEF.

Jude 1:5 - ..the Lord at one time delivered his people out of Egypt, but later destroyed those who did not believe.

Your misinterpretation of these other verses results in dismissing the intended meaning of John 5:24. Elsewhere, we read - 1 John 5:11 And this is the testimony: that God has given us eternal life, and this life is in His Son. 12 He who has the Son has life; he who does not have the Son of God does not have life. 13 These things I have written to you who believe in the name of the Son of God, that you may know that you have eternal life, and that you may continue to believe in the name of the Son of God.

Will you dismiss 1 John 5:11-13 as well?

When I’m off work and sometimes over the next few weeks I’ll have time to answer all the questions again.

 

[mailmandan]

If you are choosing to do something or believe something it requires work.

Yet faith is not just another work in a series of works in a quest to receive salvation by works. Faith is faith and actions which “follow” and are produced “out of” faith are works.

 

[EleventhHour]

Some people turn from their faith though after believing and being baptized into Christ. They turn their back on Christ and when they die they go to hades and when resurrected they don’t receive eternal life but are destroyed in hell.

This would be incorrect.

Salvation is a gift and that gift is irrevocable.

For the gifts and the calling of God are irrevocable.
Romans 11:29

I can guarantee no scripture states otherwise.

 

[EleventhHour]

Back it up with scripture then.
because if you think we are saved twice you have a lot to learn. We don’t get saved now and then get saved when our name is called in the book of life. Just like the lost don’t get condemned at death and the. Resurrected and not found in the book of life and judged a second time and cast into hell. One salvation and one judgement.

Jesus makes it clear one physical birth and one spiritual birth that brings eternal life.

5 Jesus answered, “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God. 6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
John 3:5-6

 

[EleventhHour]

If you are choosing to do something or believe something it requires work. Even when you get verses about god working in ur for faith, when you place those verses in context of everything else there is a clear understanding.

Faith is never free will be stripped away and forced to believe in something. You don’t see that in the Bible anywhere.

No one is forced to believe, yet belief has an enduring result.

One believes IN Jesus Christ for salvation and that salvation is secure because Jesus is the Author and the Finisher of faith.

 

[Skovand]

This would be incorrect.

Salvation is a gift and that gift is irrevocable.

For the gifts and the calling of God are irrevocable.
Romans 11:29

I can guarantee no scripture states otherwise.

I would suggest reading all of chapter 11 to understand that statement. Such as verse 20.....

 

[EleventhHour]

I would suggest reading all of chapter 11 to understand that statement. Such as verse 20.....

Romans 11:20

20 Well said. Because of unbelief they were broken off, and you stand by faith. Do not be haughty, but fear.

Perhaps you should consider the context and what is in view in this "unbelief" ... it is not an unbelief causing loss of salvation that is Paul is addressing.

You are once again contradicting yourself since you do not believe we are saved in this life.

 

[Skovand]

Romans 11:20

20 Well said. Because of unbelief they were broken off, and you stand by faith. Do not be haughty, but fear.

Perhaps you should consider the context and what is in view in this "unbelief" ... it is not an unbelief causing loss of salvation that is Paul is addressing.

You are once again contradicting yourself since you do not believe we are saved in this life.

I’m not contradicting myself. I already explained it in other parts. The salvation being lost, and the salvation being gained, is salvation when they are saved from sin and judgement at the white throne judgement. We are all saved at once, not multiple times. In scripture when talking about gaining and losing salvation they are talking about how people’s choices and faith will affect them. The choices we make in this life changes our fate at judgement.

Consider when paul says to die is to be with Christ. If isolated it sounds like when we die are as Christians are united with Christ immediately. But that’s not true. We don’t get united with Christ, then resurrected and saved from hell. We die, go to the grave which is metaphorically broken up into a good place and bad place which is all depending on what happens at the resurrection.

 

[EleventhHour]

I’m not contradicting myself. I already explained it in other parts. The salvation being lost, and the salvation being gained, is salvation when they are saved from sin and judgement at the white throne judgement. We are all saved at once, not multiple times. In scripture when talking about gaining and losing salvation they are talking about how people’s choices and faith will affect them. The choices we make in this life changes our fate at judgement.

Consider when paul says to die is to be with Christ. If isolated it sounds like when we die are as Christians are united with Christ immediately. But that’s not true. We don’t get united with Christ, then resurrected and saved from hell. We die, go to the grave which is metaphorically broken up into a good place and bad place which is all depending on what happens at the resurrection.

And what do you make of the conversation Jesus had with Nicodemus?

5 Jesus answered, “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God. 6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
John 3:5-6

 

[Duskey]

If you are choosing to ... believe something it requires work.

How so?

 

[Skovand]

And what do you make of the conversation Jesus had with Nicodemus?

5 Jesus answered, “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God. 6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
John 3:5-6

The kingdom of God is the body of believers. We are the church. What he was told is true. You must be born of water and spirit, ( being baptized into Christ and receiving the Holy Spirit) just like acts 2:38 says. You do that to be forgiven of your sins, receive the Holy Spirit and be added to the church. Then if you remain firm and endure until the end after you die and go to the grave you’ll eventually be resurrected to eternal life and saved from hell and enjoy life on a restored earth where the holy Jerusalem of Heaven overlaps with earth.

 

[mailmandan]

The kingdom of God is the body of believers. We are the church. What he was told is true. You must be born of water and spirit, (being baptized into Christ and receiving the Holy Spirit) just like acts 2:38 says.

I already explained Acts 2:38 to you in post #148,379 and properly harmonized scripture with scripture before reaching my conclusion on doctrine. You previously mentioned that's not the scholarly interpretation.

Greek scholar A. T. Robertson comments on Acts 2:38 - he shows how the grammar of this verse can be used to support more than one interpretation of this text. He then reaches this conclusion: "One will decide the use here according as he believes that baptism is essential to the remission of sins or not. My view is decidedly against the idea that Peter, Paul, or any one in the New Testament taught baptism as essential to the remission of sins or the means of securing such remission. So I understand Peter to be urging baptism on each of them who had already turned (repented) and for it to be done in the name of Jesus Christ on the basis of the forgiveness of sins which they had already received."

Elsewhere, AT Robertson said - Change of number from plural to singular and of person from second to third. This change marks a break in the thought here that the English translation does not preserve.

https://www.biblestudytools.com/commentaries/robertsons-word-pictures/acts/acts-2-38.html

Greek scholar E Calvin Beisner said something similar - In short, the most precise English translation of the relevant clauses, arranging them to reflect the switches in person and number of the verbs, would be, “You (plural) repent for the forgiveness of your (plural) sins, and let each one (singular) of you be baptized (singular)….” Or, to adopt our Southern dialect again, “Y’all repent for the forgiveness of y’all’s sins, and let each one of you be baptized….”

When I showed this translation to the late Julius Mantey, one of the foremost Greek grammarians of the twentieth century and co-author of A Manual Grammar of the Greek New Testament (originally published in 1927), he approved and even signed his name next to it in the margin of my Greek New Testament. *These arguments, lexical and grammatical, stand independently. Even if one rejects both lexical meanings of for, he still must face the grammatical argument, and even if he rejects the grammatical conclusion, he still must face the lexical argument. Does Acts 2:38 prove baptismal remission? No, it doesn’t even support it as part of a cumulative case. — E. Calvin Beisner

http://www.equip.org/PDF/JAA238.pdf

Greek scholar Daniel Wallace explains in Greek Grammar Beyond the Basics: It is possible that to a first-century Jewish audience (as well as to Peter), the idea of baptism might incorporate both the spiritual reality and the physical symbol (although only the reality remits sins). In other words, when one spoke of baptism, he usually meant both ideas—the reality and the ritual. Peter is shown to make the strong connection between these two in chapters 10 and 11. In 11:15-16 he recounts the conversion of Cornelius and friends, pointing out that at the point of their conversion they were baptized by the Holy Spirit. After he had seen this, he declared, “Surely no one can refuse the water for these to be baptized who have received the Holy Spirit…” (10:47). The point seems to be that if they have had the internal testimony of the Holy Spirit via spiritual baptism, there ought to be a public testimony/acknowledgment via water baptism as well. This may not only explain Acts 2:38 (that Peter spoke of both reality and picture, though only the reality removes sins), but also why the NT speaks of only baptized believers (as far as we can tell): Water baptism is not a cause of salvation, but a picture; and as such it serves both as a public acknowledgment (by those present) and a public confession (by the convert) that one has been Spirit baptized.

https://christiandefense.org/general/3871/

In regards to the word "water" in John 3:5, there are those who would argue that the natural sense of the passage parallels "water" with being born out of a mother’s womb (verse 4) and with "flesh" (verse 6). Simply stated in that case, Jesus told Nicodemus that in order to see the kingdom of God two births are necessary. The first is a physical birth (which is accompanied by amniotic water) and the second is Spirit.

There are also those who would argue that Jesus mentions "living water" in John 4:10, 14; 7:37-39 and in John 7:38-39, we read - "He who believes in Me, as the Scripture has said, out of his heart will flow rivers of living water. But this He spoke concerning the Spirit. The Holy Spirit is the source of living water and spiritual cleansing. If "water" is arbitrarily defined as baptism, then we could just as justifiably say, "Out of his heart will flow rivers of living baptism" in John 7:38. *If this sounds ridiculous, it is no more so than the idea that water baptism is the source or the means of becoming born again.

Yet there are still others who would argue that "water" is used in the Bible as an emblem of the Word of God, and in such uses it is associated with cleansing or washing. (John 15:3; Ephesians 5:26) When we are born again, the Holy Spirit begets new life, divine life, so that we are said to become "partakers of the divine nature" (2 Peter 1:4). The new birth is brought to pass through "incorruptible seed, by the Word of God, which lives and abides forever" (I Peter 1:23), but the Holy Spirit is the Agent who accomplishes the miracle of regeneration. *So to automatically read "baptism" into John 3:5 simply because it mentions "water" is unwarranted.*

You do that to be forgiven of your sins, receive the Holy Spirit and be added to the church.

Again, in Acts 2:38, "for the remission of sins" does not refer back to both clauses, "you all repent" and "each one of you be baptized," but refers only to the first. Peter is saying "repent unto the remission of your sins," the same as in Acts 3:19. The clause "each one of you be baptized" is parenthetical. This is exactly what Acts 3:19 teaches except that Peter omits the parenthesis.

Acts 2:41 - Then those who gladly received his word (repent/believe) were "afterwards" baptized; and that day about three thousand souls were added to them.

Acts 4:4 - However, many of those who heard the word believed; and the number of the men came to be about five thousand.

Acts 5:14 - And believers were increasingly added to the Lord, multitudes of both men and women.

Then if you remain firm and endure until the end after you die and go to the grave you’ll eventually be resurrected to eternal life and saved from hell and enjoy life on a restored earth where the holy Jerusalem of Heaven overlaps with earth.

Those who remain firm and endure until the end demonstrate that they "have become" partakers of Christ as I previously explained in post #148,442. Those who fail to remain firm and endure until the end demonstrate that their spurious faith was never firmly rooted and established from the start.

 

[EleventhHour]

The kingdom of God is the body of believers. We are the church. What he was told is true. You must be born of water and spirit, ( being baptized into Christ and receiving the Holy Spirit) just like acts 2:38 says. You do that to be forgiven of your sins, receive the Holy Spirit and be added to the church. Then if you remain firm and endure until the end after you die and go to the grave you’ll eventually be resurrected to eternal life and saved from hell and enjoy life on a restored earth where the holy Jerusalem of Heaven overlaps with earth.

You must be born of water and spirit, ( being baptized into Christ and receiving the Holy Spirit)

When Jesus is talking to Nicodemus He is making an analogy between physical birth and spiritual birth.

"Being born of water" is not baptism but physical birth.

That which is "born of flesh is flesh" tells us he speaking of the physical birth.

Baptism does not save.
One is saved and has eternal life when one is born again in this life.

 

[Magenta]

Did we worship God before we were born? How can we worship what we have not accepted? IMO we worshiped Him after we became an accepting child. I believe we were made for the purpose of worshiping and fellowship with our God the Creator.

Hello Star I see this is your last post for the past couple of weeks, at least... and I have not been all that active either, as I had surgery mid August and am still recovering from that I did not realize how much energy it takes to be here on a more regular basis, until I found myself too low on energy to participate Anyways, it has been a while, and I cannot remember if it was you or @Duskey who requested these verses from Matthew for a panel when I asked, but I have finally found the energy to compete it also (I started it toward the end of August) The figure in this panel? I originally thought was from a Picasso painting, but could not find it listed on a page where I viewed over a thousand of his works Perhaps it is Joe Average?

 

[Magenta]

I have a Bible prayer app on my newish smart phone,
and just read today's verse, which was Matthew 11:28

 

[EleventhHour]

You need to properly harmonize scripture with scripture before reaching your conclusion on doctrine. In Acts 2:38, "for the remission of sins" does not refer back to both clauses, "you all repent" and "each one of you be baptized," but refers only to the first. Peter is saying "repent unto the remission of your sins," the same as in Acts 3:19. The clause "each one of you be baptized" is parenthetical. This is exactly what Acts 3:19 teaches except that Peter omits the parenthesis.

*Also compare the fact that these Gentiles in Acts 10:45 received the gift of the Holy Spirit (compare with Acts 2:38 - the gift of the Holy Spirit) and this was BEFORE water baptism (Acts 10:47).

In Acts 10:43 we read ..whoever believes in Him receives remission of sins. Again, these Gentiles received the gift of the Holy Spirit - Acts 10:45 - when they believed on the Lord Jesus Christ - Acts 11:17 - (compare with Acts 16:31 - Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and you will be saved) BEFORE water baptism - Acts 10:47. This is referred to as repentance unto life - Acts 11:18.

*So the only logical conclusion when properly harmonizing scripture with scripture is that faith in Jesus Christ "implied in genuine repentance" (rather than water baptism) brings the remission of sins and the gift of the Holy Spirit (Luke 24:47; Acts 2:38; 3:19; 5:31; 10:43-47; 11:17,18; 15:8,9; 16:31; 26:18). *Perfect Harmony*

Simply believing "mental assent" in the existence of God no more saved the Jews than "mental assent" belief in God of demons. (James 2:19) Living unrighteously in continued disobedience is a manifestation of unbelief. (Hebrews 3:16-19) Though you already know all this, I want to remind you that the Lord at one time delivered his people out of Egypt, but later destroyed those who did not believe. (Jude 1:5)

Those who believe in/have faith in/trust in/reliance Jesus Christ for salvation receive eternal life. Works are the fruit, by product and demonstrative evidence of saving belief in Christ, but not the essence of belief and also not the means of obtaining salvation. All genuine believers are fruitful, yet not all are equally fruitful.

It sounds to me like you are trusting in works for salvation and NOT IN CHRIST ALONE.

You need to properly harmonize scripture with scripture before reaching your conclusion on doctrine. In Acts 2:38, "for the remission of sins" does not refer back to both clauses, "you all repent" and "each one of you be baptized," but refers only to the first. Peter is saying "repent unto the remission of your sins," the same as in Acts 3:19. The clause "each one of you be baptized" is parenthetical. This is exactly what Acts 3:19 teaches except that Peter omits the parenthesis.

This is a very good outline with regards to baptism not being a ritual that provides forgiveness of sins.

It is really something how churches have built an entire system of false salvation around baptism substituting baptism in the place of this...... Those who believe in/have faith in/trust in/reliance Jesus Christ for salvation receive eternal life.