(Historicism's) False Teachings Exposed

[Truth7t7]

Historicism falsely teaches that the dating of the book of Revelation is pre 66AD, trying to establish a false foundation for post 66-70AD events, in the Roman destruction of Jerusalem.

The late date of Revelation, with Ireaneus clearly stating below, the (Vison) was seen in the reign of Emperor Domitian 81-96AD, that renders a pre 70AD claim false.

It's a fact Ireaneus was speaking of the (Vision) being seen at the end of Emperor Domitians reign, that was from 81-96AD

(For "That" Was Seen) the (Vision)

You will closely note, no personal pronouns are used (He, Him) to even hint at suggesting it was John seen.

Polycarp was a disciple of John who saw and wrote the Revelation, Ireaneus was a disciple of Polycarp.

(The exact statement below)

Early Christian Writings

Ireaneus: Against Heresies Book 5, Chapter 30.3

"We will not, however, incur the risk of pronouncing positively as to the name of Antichrist; for if it were necessary that his name should be distinctly revealed in this present time, it would have been announced by him who beheld the apocalyptic vision. For that was seen no very long time since, but almost in our day, towards the end of Domitian's reign."

2.) Historicism falsely teaches the (Great Tribulation) took place in the 66-70AD destruction of Jerusalem, as seen in Matthew Chapter 24:21, it's (Impossible) to have a 66-70AD Great Tribulation, with (Historicism) falsely teaching that the (Second Coming) seen in Matthew 24:29-30 has been 1950+ years and waiting in a (Future Event), with the words below destroying this false teaching.

(Immediately After The Tribulation Of Those Days)

Matthew 24:29-30KJV
29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:
30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

3.) Historicism Falsely teaches that Daniel's Abomination Of Desolation as seen in Matthew 24:15 took place in 167BC with Antiochus Epiphanies sacrificing a pig on the temple altar?

This claim is 100% incorrect, as Matthew writes 200+ years (After) in Matthew 24:15 (When Ye Therefore Shall See) a future event from his writing unfulfilled.

Matthew 24:15KJV
15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand

 

[Corban]

Historicism can be defeated with or without the eminent Church fathers. There is ample internal evidence in the Word itself. All I would like to add is that Historicism was invented by people who wanted to claim that the earth is now theirs to rule - the chiefest being the Roman Church. Historicism places us after the Great Tribulation so that the present evil world leaders can claim that they are God's Kingdom on earth. The twist? Our Lord was supposed to be on earth for this Kingdom, but is nowhere to be seen. So the historicists claim that in His absence, they are authorized to rule.

 

[Blackpowderduelist]

I think there is a misunderstanding.
What people believe to be pasted is what Jesus warned his disciples about in Mathew.
Some of what John wrote about was part at the time he wrote it, and some is past now, but some yet to come.

 

[Dino246]

Historicism falsely teaches that the dating of the book of Revelation is pre 66AD, trying to establish a false foundation for post 66-70AD events, in the Roman destruction of Jerusalem.

The late date of Revelation, with Ireaneus clearly stating below, the (Vison) was seen in the reign of Emperor Domitian 81-96AD, that renders a pre 70AD claim false.

It's a fact Ireaneus was speaking of the (Vision) being seen at the end of Emperor Domitians reign, that was from 81-96AD

(For "That" Was Seen) the (Vision)

You will closely note, no personal pronouns are used (He, Him) to even hint at suggesting it was John seen.

Polycarp was a disciple of John who saw and wrote the Revelation, Ireaneus was a disciple of Polycarp.

(The exact statement below)

Early Christian Writings

Ireaneus: Against Heresies Book 5, Chapter 30.3

"We will not, however, incur the risk of pronouncing positively as to the name of Antichrist; for if it were necessary that his name should be distinctly revealed in this present time, it would have been announced by him who beheld the apocalyptic vision. For that was seen no very long time since, but almost in our day, towards the end of Domitian's reign."

2.) Historicism falsely teaches the (Great Tribulation) took place in the 66-70AD destruction of Jerusalem, as seen in Matthew Chapter 24:21, it's (Impossible) to have a 66-70AD Great Tribulation, with (Historicism) falsely teaching that the (Second Coming) seen in Matthew 24:29-30 has been 1950+ years and waiting in a (Future Event), with the words below destroying this false teaching.

(Immediately After The Tribulation Of Those Days)

Matthew 24:29-30KJV
29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:
30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

3.) Historicism Falsely teaches that Daniel's Abomination Of Desolation as seen in Matthew 24:15 took place in 167BC with Antiochus Epiphanies sacrificing a pig on the temple altar?

This claim is 100% incorrect, as Matthew writes 200+ years (After) in Matthew 24:15 (When Ye Therefore Shall See) a future event from his writing unfulfilled.

Matthew 24:15KJV
15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand

You have historicism confused with preterism. They are relatively distinct belief systems.

 

[Blackpowderduelist]

You have historicism confused with preterism. They are relatively distinct belief systems.

Too many isms, who can keep up?

 

[Truth7t7]

You have historicism confused with preterism. They are relatively distinct belief systems.

You wrong, do your research, appears your circular reasoning has you bound.

 

[Dino246]

You wrong, do your research, appears your circular reasoning has you bound.

Your command of English grammar is sadly lacking, and I haven't made any claims that could rightly be called "circular reasoning". If you think otherwise, you're welcome to articulate the evidence.

 

[SoulWeaver]

Your command of English grammar is sadly lacking, and I haven't made any claims that could rightly be called "circular reasoning". If you think otherwise, you're welcome to articulate the evidence.

Just saying, but maybe it's not his native language, Dino... native English speakers often assume that everyone else online is a native speaker... I am sure that my command of English grammar is lacking as well, but English is my second language...

 

[SoulWeaver]

Too many isms, who can keep up?

I share your sentiment. I am not even trying to keep up any more, I'm actively boycotting the mess... if a "term" isn't in the Bible, I simply don't use it...

 

[Keras]

I view people who place all, or most Bible prophecies into the past; as those who cannot face the prospect of having to experience the dramatic events of the forthcoming end times.
The 'rapture' theory is another means of thinking you can avoid this prospect.

It is quite clear from all the Prophecies, that all the world will be present when the Lord destroys His enemies, as described in Psalms 83 and Micah 4:11-12.
This event; the Sixth Seal punishment, will affect all the world, but will mainly devastate the Middle East region.

 

[Corban]

You have historicism confused with preterism. They are relatively distinct belief systems.

You have a point. Here is Wikipedia on the matter. I quote;

Wikipedia:
In Christian eschatology, Historicism is a method of interpretation of biblical prophecies which associates symbols with historical persons, nations or events. The main primary texts of interest to Christian historicists include apocalyptic literature, such as the Book of Daniel and the Book of Revelation. It sees the prophecies of Daniel as being fulfilled throughout history, extending from the past through the present to the future. It is sometimes called the continuous historical view.[1] Commentators have also applied historicist methods to ancient Jewish history, to the Roman Empire, to Islam, to the Papacy, to the Modern era, and to the end time.

The historicist method starts with Daniel 2 and works progressively through consecutive prophecies of the book–chapters 7, 8 and 11–resulting in a view of Daniel's prophecies very different from preterism and futurism. According to William Shea, Antiochus is thus scaled down to a very modest subheading under the Greek kingdom. "This is the most ancient system of interpretation in both Jewish and Christian traditions. So far it is the only one which respects the historical intention of the biblical author as such. The preterist approach makes the Bible lie, the futurist approach makes the Bible a work of science fiction; neither one seriously takes the historical data into account."[2]

Almost all Protestant Reformers from the Reformation into the 19th century held historicist views.[3][need quotation to verify]

I think the OP fulfilled the idea, but his scriptures could be taken for the preterist position too - or its downfall. The last comment underscores my first posting. The Reformation happened for a number of reasons. One of them was simply to get the people to change their allegiance to the Pope. So the doctrines of the events at the end of this age were not re-examined closely by Reform Protestantism. They simply accepted what the Roman Church had maintained for 1,000 years. The battle in the Reformation was in other areas of scripture until the Brethren started studying the Bible from scratch and irrespective of commonly held doctrines. At the first they were castigated by Reform Christianity at large, but by the late 1800's scholars everywhere started to take them seriously. I think it boils down to whether one takes the Bible as an allegory or as literal (not that there is not allegory in the Bible).

It has dawned on many scholars that all the prophecies that have been fulfilled up to now might have had allegory in the prophecy, but their fulfillment was always literal. It became then safe to assume that the multitude of prophecies still to be fulfilled would be fulfilled in the same literal way. Since the battle is for dominion of the earth (Gen.1:26-28), we are always going to have men taking the historicist/preterist position because they can claim to be God's emissary in the place of a missing Christ - like the Pope does.

I guess that the events of the last years of this age will provide me with other problems, but I would love to see the faces of the historicists when our Lord bursts out of the clouds over Mount Olives (Zech.14:4).

 

[Dino246]

Just saying, but maybe it's not his native language, Dino... native English speakers often assume that everyone else online is a native speaker... I am sure that my command of English grammar is lacking as well, but English is my second language...

If the issue were simply that English is not his native language, I would not make the comment. There is more going on here.

 

[SoulWeaver]

If the issue were simply that English is not his native language, I would not make the comment. There is more going on here.

Okay. I apologize for assuming, brother. (it did surprise me from you, you're normally always kind to non native speakers)