Today’s church’s misunderstandings

[notuptome]

My understanding is that Constantine is the one who gave the decree of Sunday Worship. Constantine wanted to unify the Pagan believes with the Church believes so that they would all get along. But that might just be me.

Scripture teaches assembly on the first day of the week.

Ac 20:7 And upon the first day of the week, when the disciples came together to break bread, Paul preached unto them, ready to depart on the morrow; and continued his speech until midnight.
1Co 16:2 Upon the first day of the week let every one of you lay by him in store, as God hath prospered him, that there be no gatherings when I come.

The Pharisees drove the early Jewish Christians out of the temple. They were forced to meet on the first day of the week outside of the temple.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

 

[laymen]

Scripture teaches assembly on the first day of the week.

Ac 20:7 And upon the first day of the week, when the disciples came together to break bread, Paul preached unto them, ready to depart on the morrow; and continued his speech until midnight.
1Co 16:2 Upon the first day of the week let every one of you lay by him in store, as God hath prospered him, that there be no gatherings when I come.

The Pharisees drove the early Jewish Christians out of the temple. They were forced to meet on the first day of the week outside of the temple.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

Fake New!

 

[laymen]

Scripture teaches assembly on the first day of the week.

Ac 20:7 And upon the first day of the week, when the disciples came together to break bread, Paul preached unto them, ready to depart on the morrow; and continued his speech until midnight.
1Co 16:2 Upon the first day of the week let every one of you lay by him in store, as God hath prospered him, that there be no gatherings when I come.

The Pharisees drove the early Jewish Christians out of the temple. They were forced to meet on the first day of the week outside of the temple.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

The only few verse in all the bible that talk about the "first day of the week". You should do a study of the Greek here. Novices who try to make the attempt have been rebuked by their more scholarly sunday keeping brethren who categorically deny the possibility of such a translation. Same word here is used in Mat 28:1.

1598. Sunday, Authority for—Not in Bible
SOURCE: Henry M. Taber, Faith or Fact (New York: Peter Eckler, Publisher, 1897), p. 114. [FRS No. 67.]
Why will not Christian people investigate and find out for themselves (which they easily can), that the keeping of Sunday as a “holy Sabbath day,” is wholly without warrant.
I challenge any priest or minister of the Christian religion, to show me the slightest authority for the religious observance of Sunday. And, if such cannot be shown by them, why is it that they are constantly preaching about Sunday as a holy day? Are they not open to the suspicion of imposing upon the confidence and credulity of their hearers? Surely they are deliberately and knowingly practicing deception upon those who look to them for candor and for truth, unless they can give satisfactory reasons for teaching that Sunday is a sacred day. There never was, and is not now, any such “satisfactory reasons.” No student of the Bible has ever brought to light a single verse, line or word, world, which can, by any possibility, be construed into a warrant for the religious observance of Sunday. Quotations from the writings of the “Church Fathers,” and others familiar with Church history, support this statement, and include the names of Tertul[l]ian, Eusebius, Ireneus, Victorinus, Theodoretus, Origen, Chrysostom, Jerome, Luther, Melanc[h]thon, Zwingle, Knox, Tyndale, Grotius, Neander, Mosheim, Heylyn, Frith, Milton, Priestly, Domville. John Calvin had so little respect for the day that he could be found playing bowls most any Sunday.
The claim that Sunday takes the place of Saturday, and that because of the Jews were supposed to be commanded to keep the seventh day of the week holy, therefore that the first day of the week should be so kept by Christians, is so utterly absurd as to be hardly worth considering.

 

[Benadam]

Not sure where you get that as a historical fact. If you look it was Constantine who issued a civil decree making Sunday a day of rest not the bible. Who gives man the right to Change the Law of God anyways?

Jesus gave the Apostles the right to change ceremonial law. The day of rest is two part. The only commandment that is both a moral law and a ceremonial law. The particular day to rest is a matter of ceremony. The Church was given the authority to change ceremonial law. They did that long before Constantine.

 

[laymen]

Jesus gave the Apostles the right to change ceremonial law. The day of rest is two part. The only commandment that is both a moral law and a ceremonial law. The particular day to rest is a matter of ceremony. The Church was given the authority to change ceremonial law. They did that long before Constantine.

Where is your proof seems to me you are just speculating. I have done much study of the history of the Sabbath because it was very important that I understood the subject. Have meany book on Logos.com that come from meany different sects and denominations and most but not all agree That Sunday is a none biblical teaching past down from the Church fathers of the Catholic church.

 

[Nehemiah6]

The only few verse in all the bible that talk about the "first day of the week".

There are also significant verses which speak about "the morrow after the sabbath". The first day of the week is called "the Lord's Day" (Rev 1:10).

The day and time in which he had this vision: it was the Lord’s day, the day which Christ had separated and set apart for himself, as the Eucharist is called the Lord’s supper. Surely this can be no other than the Christian sabbath, the first day of the week, to be observed in remembrance of the resurrection of Christ. Let us who call him our Lord honour him on his own day, the day which the Lord hath made and in which we ought to rejoice. -- Matthew Henry

 

[Ogom]

You still have the issue here f both believing they are doing what you said yet appose each other in views

 

[eternally-gratefull]

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Still no answer

THEY CANT BOTH BE RIGHT

yet both claim to be Jesus disciple, both claim to be listening to God both claim to be like his teacher, both claim to abide in the word, to abide in Jesus to continue in the word, and to know truth

it appears you are new here? So many people come back under different names can not even trust that truely)

this is what many in here claim to be doing, everything you just posted, so who is right and how do welisten to both??

 

[Blik]

My understanding is that Constantine is the one who gave the decree of Sunday Worship. Constantine wanted to unify the Pagan believes with the Church believes so that they would all get along. But that might just be me.

From my studies of the church as it was before Constantine changed it agrees with you. There was also a big change in the early church when the final destruction came in 132 of most of the Jews in Jerusalem. Most Christians were Jews before then, understanding the connection between the Father and the Son.

 

[Blik]

Still no answer

THEY CANT BOTH BE RIGHT

yet both claim to be Jesus disciple, both claim to be listening to God both claim to be like his teacher, both claim to abide in the word, to abide in Jesus to continue in the word, and to know truth

it appears you are new here? So many people come back under different names can not even trust that truely)

this is what many in here claim to be doing, everything you just posted, so who is right and how do welisten to both??

Christianity isn't about theological and intellectual questions of right and wrong, it is about a loving, close relationship with the Lord.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Christianity isn't about theological and intellectual questions of right and wrong, it is about a loving, close relationship with the Lord.

True

but there are some things that if you get wrong, There are eternal consequences

 

[laymen]

Christianity isn't about theological and intellectual questions of right and wrong, it is about a loving, close relationship with the Lord.

Seems to me that Jesus was always asking thing even as child.
Luke 2:46–47 (AV): And it came to pass, that after three days they found him in the temple, sitting in the midst of the doctors, both hearing them, and asking them questions.
47 And all that heard him were astonished at his understanding and answers.

 

[gb9]

Seems to me that Jesus was always asking thing even as child.
Luke 2:46–47 (AV): And it came to pass, that after three days they found him in the temple, sitting in the midst of the doctors, both hearing them, and asking them questions.
47 And all that heard him were astonished at his understanding and answers.

question-

is Sabbath keeping required for salvation? yes or no?

 

[Benadam]

Where is your proof seems to me you are just speculating. I have done much study of the history of the Sabbath because it was very important that I understood the subject. Have meany book on Logos.com that come from meany different sects and denominations and most but not all agree That Sunday is a none biblical teaching past down from the Church fathers of the Catholic church.

Funny that it took over a thousand years for Christians to realize that.

Catholic doctrine isn't dogmatized unless it is threatened or required for some good. None of what Catholics believe is new it's just that some needed to be clarified for some reason or another. People mistake the clarification as a doctrines beginning. Constantine didn't have the spiritual authority to introduce doctrine. He just made Christianity legal.

 

[laymen]

question-

is Sabbath keeping required for salvation? yes or no?

Do you mean, Does love cover sin?
Pr 10:12Hatred stirreth up strifes: but love covereth all sins.
The Holy Bible: King James Version. (1995). (electronic ed. of the 1769 edition of the 1611 Authorized Version., Pr 10:12). Bellingham WA: Logos Research Systems, Inc.

 

[laymen]

Funny that it took over a thousand years for Christians to realize that.

Catholic doctrine isn't dogmatized unless it is threatened or required for some good. None of what Catholics believe is new it's just that some needed to be clarified for some reason or another. People mistake the clarification as a doctrines beginning. Constantine didn't have the spiritual authority to introduce doctrine. He just made Christianity legal.

Are you Catholic?
Half my family is Catholic.

 

[Blik]

True

but there are some things that if you get wrong, There are eternal consequences

We need to keep to those things that have eternal consequences. They center on Christ as the Son of the Father.

I have had a strong personal conviction that it is dishonoring God if we will not acknowledge that God created Saturday as the Sabbath. Paul disagrees with me about its importance. Paul was chosen by the Lord, I am not. Paul states that what is important is living for the Lord, and not putting a stumbling block to others who have personal convictions about how to do that. I must listen.

 

[laymen]

Funny that it took over a thousand years for Christians to realize that.

Catholic doctrine isn't dogmatized unless it is threatened or required for some good. None of what Catholics believe is new it's just that some needed to be clarified for some reason or another. People mistake the clarification as a doctrines beginning. Constantine didn't have the spiritual authority to introduce doctrine. He just made Christianity legal.

Their are reports that NT Sabbath keepers have been around even through the Dark ages up to now. But most have forgot the one Commandment that tells us to Remember. IF Jesus and Paul made it a custom to keep the Sabbath then I will always follow Paul as he follows Christ.

 

[Blik]

Scripture teaches assembly on the first day of the week.

Ac 20:7 And upon the first day of the week, when the disciples came together to break bread, Paul preached unto them, ready to depart on the morrow; and continued his speech until midnight.
1Co 16:2 Upon the first day of the week let every one of you lay by him in store, as God hath prospered him, that there be no gatherings when I come.

The Pharisees drove the early Jewish Christians out of the temple. They were forced to meet on the first day of the week outside of the temple.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

Roger, please read these scriptures. None of them say they met to honor the Sabbath. One is to eat together, another "lay by him in store". For the first 100 years after Christ, most Christians were Jews who knew God established the Sabbath at creation.

Paul tells us it is fine if you think of every day the same, it is for Christ. But please read scripture as written.

 

[laymen]

Roger, please read these scriptures. None of them say they met to honor the Sabbath. One is to eat together, another "lay by him in store". For the first 100 years after Christ, most Christians were Jews who knew God established the Sabbath at creation.

Paul tells us it is fine if you think of every day the same, it is for Christ. But please read scripture as written.

If you are quoting Rom 25:5 One man esteemeth one day above another: another esteemeth every day alike. Let every man be fully persuaded in his own mind. The Holy Bible: King James Version. (1995). (electronic ed. of the 1769 edition of the 1611 Authorized Version., Ro 14:5). Bellingham WA: Logos Research Systems, Inc.

This we must also be look at in the right context. Paul discusses the obervance of special days, it was the cause of dissenion and confusion among believers similar to Gal4:10,11 and in the Colossian church Col 2:16,17

Those believers whose faith let them leave behind all ceremonial holidays should not depise others whose faith is not as strong. Nor in turn, those who are lax. Each of us are responsible to God Rom 14:10-12. We should never follow Christ out of force or compulsion.

We can not lump the 4th commandment in with these special days seeing how they were added by Moses and the 4th commandment was by God him self from Creation. Note Before sin. The 4th is part of the character of God, how he Rested from Creation and made the Sabbath to set us apart from any other religion because even the Dalai Lama can say do not kill do not still. But the Dalai lama can not clam the Sabbath Because he did not Create the world as did our God. So to throw out the 4th commandment or lessen how important it is, is the same as saying the Christian religion is the same as Dalai Lama. Lev 23:38 Says the ceremonial laws were added. To make sure the Sabbath should not be considered a Jewish institution and hence cease with the Jewish nation Christ declared "The sabbath was made for man" Mark 2:27. and vs 28 the "son of man is Lord also of the sabbath."

"Made for Man" so that he would remember who the Creator was. " Made for Man to Remember He is Lord of Creation. So to take away the 7th day Sabbath as if it was a ceremonial law would make the 10 Commandments the 9 Commandments and no better than Dalai Lama teachings. And cast a shadow on the creator as a whole. No other religion can clam this none other than Christians. It sets us apart from other religions as following a "Creator" not just a moral guide.