take that to it's logical conclusion and you have the reality behind the things you're calling OSAS and Calvinism 
Not By Works
- Thread starter dcontroversal
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OSAS teaches that we may by dead faith obtain that which can only be obtained by living faith, and Calvinism says, well, so many crazy things: like we are so totally depraved that we can't even look in God's direction except that He first cleans us up a little...while the most depraved being in history is fully able to engage the Lord, even make wagers like in the book of Job.
No, you believe the only thing that salvation causes to change is God's opinion of our sin that remains. Because you insist the Christian may continue to commit deliberate, known, habitual sin and still wake up in the first Resurrection - that is NOT Biblical.
The Christian who turns back to a life of habitual, known sin and refuses to repent will be lost because he no longer surrendered to the Lord Jesus, but to another lord.
The Christian who turns back to a life of habitual, known sin and refuses to repent will be lost because he no longer surrendered to the Lord Jesus, but to another lord.
no; that's what people who hate these things, say that those things say. i think that's what EG has been trying to tell you -- that you're really misrepresenting what he believes through these assumptions.
start from God is holy, almighty and just.
take what you confessed, "we can do nothing of our our own selves"
where does that lead?
you can't save yourself. you have nothing not given to you; you add nothing to God and nothing you do or say can measure up to Him.
you can't keep yourself saved. you can't even exist without Him. you can't think, breathe, move or talk unless He grants these things to you. you don't have will unless He allows you to have it. you are nothing, you don't even have being, except for His mercy.
so how are you going to do any of these things having to do with life, faith, righteousness and godliness, without Him being the power and the beginning and the end of all those things?
dude if salvation depended on us there would be no such thing as salvation. and if it depends on God then there is no way He is ever going to lose even one of His own sheep. he's going to carry it back on His shoulder, and if He has to resurrect it from dust to do so, He will. nothing is impossible with Him.
this is the way He designed it to be. He designed it so that men can't look at another man and damn them in truth, and so that men can't reach heaven at all - but that He Himself has to be the one who reaches down and lifts us up. the absolute sovereign origin of it and the irrevocable security of it is kind of why it's called "salvation"
start from God is holy, almighty and just.
take what you confessed, "we can do nothing of our our own selves"
where does that lead?
you can't save yourself. you have nothing not given to you; you add nothing to God and nothing you do or say can measure up to Him.
you can't keep yourself saved. you can't even exist without Him. you can't think, breathe, move or talk unless He grants these things to you. you don't have will unless He allows you to have it. you are nothing, you don't even have being, except for His mercy.
so how are you going to do any of these things having to do with life, faith, righteousness and godliness, without Him being the power and the beginning and the end of all those things?
dude if salvation depended on us there would be no such thing as salvation. and if it depends on God then there is no way He is ever going to lose even one of His own sheep. he's going to carry it back on His shoulder, and if He has to resurrect it from dust to do so, He will. nothing is impossible with Him.
this is the way He designed it to be. He designed it so that men can't look at another man and damn them in truth, and so that men can't reach heaven at all - but that He Himself has to be the one who reaches down and lifts us up. the absolute sovereign origin of it and the irrevocable security of it is kind of why it's called "salvation"
Do you agree that "agape" is only given to saints, not sinners?
If so, Matthew 24:12-13 KJV depicts saints who allowed their agape to grow cold and dead through their practice of iniquity, an erosion of their ability to endure to the end, and ultimately, their failure to be saved.
Some weakly argue this passage is talking about their "physical bodies in the tribulation", as if He's concerned about things He can speak into existence and things we are promised will suffer in this life for His sake
No, it's talking about spiritual death of saints - Jesus just has to blink and bam, new glorified bodies are everyhwere for us.
If so, Matthew 24:12-13 KJV depicts saints who allowed their agape to grow cold and dead through their practice of iniquity, an erosion of their ability to endure to the end, and ultimately, their failure to be saved.
Some weakly argue this passage is talking about their "physical bodies in the tribulation", as if He's concerned about things He can speak into existence and things we are promised will suffer in this life for His sake
No, it's talking about spiritual death of saints - Jesus just has to blink and bam, new glorified bodies are everyhwere for us.
I didn't read the whole thing tbh. I just want a simple answer: If Satan, the most depraved being in history, can communicate with God, why can't humans - who are far less depraved - even hope to just look in God's direction without Him first lifting us above our fellow slime dwellers?
No, get gets down in the slime, taps us on the shoulder individually, and says, "This is right, this is wrong, and there's a coming judgment, so choose ye this day." (John 16:7-11 KJV)
No, get gets down in the slime, taps us on the shoulder individually, and says, "This is right, this is wrong, and there's a coming judgment, so choose ye this day." (John 16:7-11 KJV)
yeah thanks for telling me it's a waste of effort to talk to you, since you can't be bothered reading a single paragraph.
as for your question it's based on false premises which have already been carefully explained to you, probably in posts you decided not to read but reply to anyway. i saw no reason to acknowledge it.
so you've still got a question left unanswered: do you believe Satan has 'joint custody over you' ? and you get some weird 'tie-breaking vote' ??
or do you just have some crazy idea that other people believe that?
as for your question it's based on false premises which have already been carefully explained to you, probably in posts you decided not to read but reply to anyway. i saw no reason to acknowledge it.
so you've still got a question left unanswered: do you believe Satan has 'joint custody over you' ? and you get some weird 'tie-breaking vote' ??
or do you just have some crazy idea that other people believe that?
You OSAS folks are always so preoccupied with others. Why don't you heed Paul's words to "examine yourselves" and use the mirror of the law James spoke of?
It's not hard. Just start at the top:
1. What recieves my first attention and affection is my god, so is that Jesus or something else?
2. Do I partake in idolatry, be it carved stones, statues, movie stars, sports stars, false theological ideas, etc.?
3. Do I take God's name in vain, by calling Him "Lord Lord, but do not the things which I say?"
4. Do I observe the seventh day Sabbath as a memorial to Creation Week and as a memorial to His power to recreate in me a new heart...or do I follow the change in God's law by the Papacy?
(Just go down the list and stop worrying about what others do)
It's not hard. Just start at the top:
1. What recieves my first attention and affection is my god, so is that Jesus or something else?
2. Do I partake in idolatry, be it carved stones, statues, movie stars, sports stars, false theological ideas, etc.?
3. Do I take God's name in vain, by calling Him "Lord Lord, but do not the things which I say?"
4. Do I observe the seventh day Sabbath as a memorial to Creation Week and as a memorial to His power to recreate in me a new heart...or do I follow the change in God's law by the Papacy?
(Just go down the list and stop worrying about what others do)
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i believe i will never be "unsaved" i think that very idea is nonsense.
and i do not believe Satan has any authority or custody over me whatsoever.
and i have no intention of spending my life pursuing sin even if my flesh wants to and even if it wouldn't mean God would forsake me & reneg on His gifts and promises.
i do not believe Satan owns any holly trees. you probably should have said figs if you knew your Bible, but those don't belong to Satan either.
so, dude, you don't really have any idea what i believe. you probably shouldn't go around telling people what others believe when what you're saying is not at all what they believe -- that's pretty much definition of slander, OK? and the Bible happens to say something about whether a Christian should slander or not.
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yeah thanks for telling me it's a waste of effort to talk to you, since you can't be bothered reading a single paragraph.
as for your question it's based on false premises which have already been carefully explained to you, probably in posts you decided not to read but reply to anyway. i saw no reason to acknowledge it.
so you've still got a question left unanswered: do you believe Satan has 'joint custody over you' ? and you get some weird 'tie-breaking vote' ??
or do you just have some crazy idea that other people believe that?
as for your question it's based on false premises which have already been carefully explained to you, probably in posts you decided not to read but reply to anyway. i saw no reason to acknowledge it.
so you've still got a question left unanswered: do you believe Satan has 'joint custody over you' ? and you get some weird 'tie-breaking vote' ??
or do you just have some crazy idea that other people believe that?
i think i would rather creep our someone who is supposedly a believer in a religion absolutely soaked with blood and death, with a scripture containing Ezekiel 37, than i would go look for a different avatar to please such a person.
maybe i ought to love deeper.
do you think i've lost my salvation if i refuse to serve you in this matter?
maybe i ought to love deeper.
do you think i've lost my salvation if i refuse to serve you in this matter?