If God's Word is The Creation and The Truth, that means uncertainty is disturbing both.

[pittsburghjoe]

Hebrews 12:27-28​

And this word, Yet once more, signifieth the removing of those things that are shaken, as of things that are made, that those things which cannot be shaken may remain. Wherefore we receiving a kingdom which cannot be moved, let us have grace, whereby we may serve God acceptably with reverence and godly fear

via @Pilgrimshope​

I wonder if this is saying there won't be an Uncertainty Principle when this is over.

Atoms shake. We can't make absolute zero. There is always movement.

There won't be Uncertainty after because we will know what is right.

Is uncertainty the knowledge of satan's lie from the tree?

Uncertainty of God's Word is at the core of this reality. Physics already has a name for it (Uncertainty Principle), but they didn't realize it was pointing to God.

 

[Dino246]

However, God’s Word is not “the Creation”, which leaves nothing further to discuss.

 

[pittsburghjoe]

However, God’s Word is not “the Creation”, which leaves nothing further to discuss.

What? Christ took the plan from God the Father and made it so with the Word.

 

[Dino246]

Yes, but that means the creation was made at God’s word and by the Word of God. It does not mean that God’s Word is the Creation, which is what the thread title proposes.

 

[pittsburghjoe]

Yes, but that means the creation was made at God’s word and by the Word of God. It does not mean that God’s Word is the Creation, which is what the thread title proposes.

I think you are trying to argue for no reason?

 

[Magenta]

I think you are trying to argue for no reason?

Disagreeing with what another says does not equate to lack of reason/s on the other's part

 

[Dino246]

I think you are trying to argue for no reason?

I am telling you that your premise is fatally flawed, and therefore not worth discussing.

 

[pittsburghjoe]

I am telling you that your premise is fatally flawed, and therefore not worth discussing.

Comical

I just told you the very core of our reality is based on Tree of Knowledge. Maybe consider it again?

 

[Dino246]

Comical

I just told you the very core of our reality is based on Tree of Knowledge. Maybe consider it again?

Maybe rewrite your starting premise.

 

[Diakonos]

Maybe rewrite your starting premise.

God created other things before the tree of knowledge, so it is not the core of our reality

 

[pittsburghjoe]

God created other things before the tree of knowledge, so it is not the core of our reality

The core of our fallen reality.

 

[Magenta]

I just told you the very core of our reality is based on Tree of Knowledge.

The core of our reality and existence is God.

Also, Adam had knowledge before he ate from what is properly called the tree of the knowledge of good and evil.

 

[pittsburghjoe]

Adam had knowledge before he ate from what is properly called the tree of the knowledge of good and evil.

Correct, He wasn't dumb. This thread is about what happened after taking on satan's perception. Believing him instead of God. Everything became uncertain, including physics.

 

[Magenta]

Correct, He wasn't dumb. This thread is about what happened after taking on satan's perception. Believing him instead of God. Everything became uncertain including physics.

Adam was not deceived, so did he believe and take on Satan's perception, or eat for some other unspecified reason?

Many say he ate out of love for his wife. We are simply not told.

Whatever the reason, what we know is that he put his will above the will of God hereby corrupting the whole of creation.

 

[pittsburghjoe]

Adam was not deceived, so did he believe and take on Satan's perception, or eat for some other unspecified reason?

Many say he ate out of love for his wife. We are simply not told.

Whatever the reason, what we know is that he put his will above the will of God hereby corrupting the whole of creation.

I think the fruit and tree is symbolic. I imagine it similar to Eve going to a rave party and taking drugs, she then got Adam to take the same drug. I suspect DMT.

 

[Magenta]

I think the fruit and tree is symbolic. I imagine it similar to Eve going to a rave party and taking drugs, she then got Adam to take the same drug. I suspect DMT.

I can certainly see value in viewing both trees symbolically, with the tree of life representing Jesus, and He is called the True vine. Fruit is also used metaphorically many times throughout Scripture. Adam and Eve ate the fruit of their disobedience, which is to say, they bore the consequences of placing their will above the will of God. I have copied the following from a post I made here shortly after joining

As Christians, we are exhorted to bear fruit.

We know we are not trees, but only {metaphorical} branches, offshoots of the true vine, Jesus Christ. I believe He was the {metaphorical} tree of Life placed in the garden of Eden; He holds the keys to life and death; all life is in Him; He is author and giver of life etc, and eternal life is promised to those who surrender to and abide in Him (John 15:4-5).

The fruit we are to bear has different aspects to it. One is character building: the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, and self-control. Against such things there is no law.

Peter adds to this: make every effort to add to your faith excellence, to excellence, knowledge; to knowledge, self-control; to self-control, perseverance; to perseverance, godliness; to godliness, brotherly affection; to brotherly affection, unselfish love. For if these things are really yours and are continually increasing, they will keep you from becoming ineffective and unproductive in your pursuit of knowing our Lord Jesus Christ more intimately.

So our life surrendered to God, and our works through faith are fruit, and so are people who come to Christ through our efforts on their behalf (Rom 1:3; Phil 4:17), and there is also the fruit of our lips as we praise God and witness to others (Hebrews 13:15).

These are good fruits, partaken of when aligned with the will of God.

Evil fruits would be the result of disobeying God, defying God, following self will in opposition to God's will, severing ourselves from fellowship with Him, etc. That is the fruit Adam and Eve bore and ate (lived). They followed the desires of the flesh and the desires of the eyes and pride of life, in turning away from God after being in fellowship with Him. It is what we all do before being regenerated by the Holy Spirit of God.

 

[Blain]

You know uncertainty is not always a bad thing, I mean yes God did create us to be perfect with him but it isn't as if he was blind to what was going to happen.
I find it interesting that humans are a unique creation with God, with angels if they fall from grace there is no redemption with them because they were already made perfect they already knew God,an angel is either of the light or the dark never both. We humans however are beings made of both light and darkness in us we are by no means perfect and do not know God like they did when they chose to follow satan . Look at the way the human eyes work if we are in total darkness we cannot see anything if we are in to much brightness we go blind the human eyes require both light and dark to work.

And uncertainty leads to searching and learning, lack of knowledge and understanding leads to discovery and since we do not know God like they do we have to search him out but Father treasures a hungry heart that seeks after his own after all his favorite game is hide and seek. Maybe the lesson isn't the core of our fallacy but the lesson to be learned in our fallacy and uncertainty itself

 

[pittsburghjoe]

I can certainly see value in viewing both trees symbolically, with the tree of life representing Jesus, and He is called the True vine. Fruit is also used metaphorically many times throughout Scripture. Adam and Eve ate the fruit of their disobedience, which is to say, they bore the consequences of placing their will above the will of God. I have copied the following from a post I made here shortly after joining

As Christians, we are exhorted to bear fruit.

We know we are not trees, but only {metaphorical} branches, offshoots of the true vine, Jesus Christ. I believe He was the {metaphorical} tree of Life placed in the garden of Eden; He holds the keys to life and death; all life is in Him; He is author and giver of life etc, and eternal life is promised to those who surrender to and abide in Him (John 15:4-5).

The fruit we are to bear has different aspects to it. One is character building: the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, and self-control. Against such things there is no law.

Peter adds to this: make every effort to add to your faith excellence, to excellence, knowledge; to knowledge, self-control; to self-control, perseverance; to perseverance, godliness; to godliness, brotherly affection; to brotherly affection, unselfish love. For if these things are really yours and are continually increasing, they will keep you from becoming ineffective and unproductive in your pursuit of knowing our Lord Jesus Christ more intimately.

So our life surrendered to God, and our works through faith are fruit, and so are people who come to Christ through our efforts on their behalf (Rom 1:3; Phil 4:17), and there is also the fruit of our lips as we praise God and witness to others (Hebrews 13:15).

These are good fruits, partaken of when aligned with the will of God.

Evil fruits would be the result of disobeying God, defying God, following self will in opposition to God's will, severing ourselves from fellowship with Him, etc. That is the fruit Adam and Eve bore and ate (lived). They followed the desires of the flesh and the desires of the eyes and pride of life, in turning away from God after being in fellowship with Him. It is what we all do before being regenerated by the Holy Spirit of God.

It means we are in the same test as Adam and Eve. We don't get to complain about not taking the fruit ..because the same fruit is right in front of us.

 

[Magenta]

It means we are in the same test as Adam and Eve. We don't get to complain
about not taking the fruit ..because the same fruit is right in front of us.

Colossians 1:21-22

Yes, we are said to be born in Adam. The natural man is
an enemy to God. We need to be born again, "from above."

Satan has asked to sift each of you like wheat.

 

[pittsburghjoe]

You know uncertainty is not always a bad thing, I mean yes God did create us to be perfect with him but it isn't as if he was blind to what was going to happen.
I find it interesting that humans are a unique creation with God, with angels if they fall from grace there is no redemption with them because they were already made perfect they already knew God,an angel is either of the light or the dark never both. We humans however are beings made of both light and darkness in us we are by no means perfect and do not know God like they did when they chose to follow satan . Look at the way the human eyes work if we are in total darkness we cannot see anything if we are in to much brightness we go blind the human eyes require both light and dark to work.

And uncertainty leads to searching and learning, lack of knowledge and understanding leads to discovery and since we do not know God like they do we have to search him out but Father treasures a hungry heart that seeks after his own after all his favorite game is hide and seek. Maybe the lesson isn't the core of our fallacy but the lesson to be learned in our fallacy and uncertainty itself

Your stance is that you would prefer we didn't have scientific evidence of the Garden? Are you saying there is going to be uncertainty in Heaven?