How to be Born Again

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Magenta

Magenta

Senior Member
#661
Jul 3, 2015
60,146
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#661
throughfaith said:
Only in the sense of the same things you and every human that comes into the world receives . Saved or unsaved in the end .
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I don't believe that. Many long-time Christians have told me that
I have received things from God that they have not yet wish they had.

I realize you don't want to believe that because you have not received
the same things, and claim as a result that it is not possible.

That is similar to how agnostics view the God question. They have not
experienced Him, nor know Him, and say therefore that nobody can.
 
shittim

shittim

Senior Member
#662
Dec 16, 2016
13,804
7,785
113
#662
Yes Magenta, I agree, for He knows the end from the beginning, remember, "Them that He loves He rebukes and chastises"?
best wishes
 
T

throughfaith

Well-known member
#663
Aug 4, 2020
10,467
1,593
113
#663
Magenta said:
I don't believe that. Many long-time Christians have told me that
I have received things from God that they have not yet wish they had.

I realize you don't want to believe that because you have not received
the same things, and claim as a result that it is not possible.
Click to expand...
Which verse ?
 
shittim

shittim

Senior Member
#665
Dec 16, 2016
13,804
7,785
113
#665
we know He is fair, what are we doing that keeps Him from releasing blessing to us?
 
Magenta

Magenta

Senior Member
#666
Jul 3, 2015
60,146
29,456
113
#666
throughfaith said:
Which verse ?
Click to expand...
Oh, so suddenly now you go from, all things are not meant for/given
to us, to all people should experience God in exactly the same way? LOL

Paul did not have Moses' experience, nor Moses Noah's.

Were they wrong, too?
 
T

throughfaith

Well-known member
#667
Aug 4, 2020
10,467
1,593
113
#667
Magenta said:
I don't believe that. Many long-time Christians have told me that
I have received things from God that they have not yet wish they had.

I realize you don't want to believe that because you have not received
the same things, and claim as a result that it is not possible.

That is similar to how agnostics view the God question. They have not
experienced Him, nor know Him, and say therefore that nobody can.
Click to expand...
I know Armianism ( soft Calvinsm) teaches that because of " foreknowledge 'God knows those who would believe and because of this sends all the ' means ' to them in keeping with that he knew you would believe ect . Its no different to Calvinism. Its just election to salvation, with a twist. The twist just being according to what God foresaw you would do and believe .. Thats why I mentioned ' previenient grace '
 
Magenta

Magenta

Senior Member
#668
Jul 3, 2015
60,146
29,456
113
#668
throughfaith said:
I know Armianism ( soft Calvinsm) teaches that because of " foreknowledge 'God knows those who would believe and because of this sends all the ' means ' to them in keeping with that he knew you would believe ect . Its no different to Calvinism. Its just election to salvation, with a twist. The twist just being according to what God foresaw you would do and believe .. Thats why I mentioned ' previenient grace '
Click to expand...
I am not Arminian, either :p

You seem to dislike the concept of God's grace working in unsaved people.
 
T

throughfaith

Well-known member
#669
Aug 4, 2020
10,467
1,593
113
#669
Magenta said:
Oh, so suddenly now you go from, all things are not meant for/given
to us, to all people should experience God in exactly the same way? LOL
Click to expand...
Just on how God was working in your life prior to you being saved was my point .
 
B

brightfame52

Well-known member
#670
Nov 21, 2020
6,334
557
113
#670
oyster

Thank you Jesus for making it available to all through Your shed blood.
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Sorry thats not the Jesus of the scripture. The Jesus of scripture came to save His People from their sins, not not make it available or possible Matt 1:21

21 And she shall bring forth a son, and thou shalt call his name Jesus: for he shall save his people from their sins.

So you thanking a made up jesus from your imagination friend !
 
T

throughfaith

Well-known member
#671
Aug 4, 2020
10,467
1,593
113
#671
Magenta said:
I am not Arminian, either :p

You seem to dislike the concept of God's grace working through people.
Click to expand...
No I rely on scripture alone . Thats why I asked for the verse . Prior to being saved I would say Gods grace is equal to All , universally. I believe God does respond differently to unsaved people. like hearing thier prayers ( Cornelius) ect . But the ' light ' and conviction is equal to all . That all can come . Its not God was drawing you and not others .
 
B

brightfame52

Well-known member
#672
Nov 21, 2020
6,334
557
113
#672
throughfaith said:
God is pleased to save them that believe. Yes why not believe this ?Do you see what you do when you come across a verse that literally says God is pleased when somenone believes . You don't believe it . Not because there's a verse that says a person cannot believe. Yes this would be a cause to re think 1 cor 1.21 . But no verse says to the contrary . Not infers, not implies , not assumes. BUT SAYS !! You instead believe your system over the scripture . ( Classic Calvinism) You go to verses that don't actually say man cannot believe. Instead your saying " I know the bible SAYS such and such but ...."
This is the opposite of sound bible reading. This is my contention against reformed theology . Its worst theology within christianity because of this terrible approach to scripture . Literally the worst above any other denomination / ism that you could care to name . Certain pentacostal theological ways of interpreting scripture actually put Calvinism to shame .
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Once again:

God is pleased to save them that believe. That just cant be the unregenerate since they cant believe because they cant please God. Also their mind is enmity against God Rom 8:7-8
7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.

8 So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.
 
T

throughfaith

Well-known member
#673
Aug 4, 2020
10,467
1,593
113
#673
brightfame52 said:
oyster



Sorry thats not the Jesus of the scripture. The Jesus of scripture came to save His People from their sins, not not make it available or possible Matt 1:21

21 And she shall bring forth a son, and thou shalt call his name Jesus: for he shall save his people from their sins.

So you thanking a made up jesus from your imagination friend !
Click to expand...
Matt 1 is before the cross . Which is a handy verse for a calvinist . But the focus is Israel ( He came to his own ) Now read
1 John 2:2

“And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.”
 
T

throughfaith

Well-known member
#674
Aug 4, 2020
10,467
1,593
113
#674
brightfame52 said:
Once again:

God is pleased to save them that believe. That just cant be the unregenerate since they cant believe because they cant please God. Also their mind is enmity against God Rom 8:7-8
7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.

8 So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.
Click to expand...
Why do you say they can't believe, because they can't please God ? Which verse SAYS this?
 
T

throughfaith

Well-known member
#675
Aug 4, 2020
10,467
1,593
113
#675
Magenta said:
Oh, so suddenly now you go from, all things are not meant for/given
to us, to all people should experience God in exactly the same way? LOL

Paul did not have Moses' experience, nor Moses Noah's.

Were they wrong, too?
Click to expand...
I don't believe I have a verse that says that's how God is dealing with people today. like how it says in hebrews how he spoke in times past through prophets ect .
 
Magenta

Magenta

Senior Member
#676
Jul 3, 2015
60,146
29,456
113
#676
throughfaith said:
No I rely on scripture alone . Thats why I asked for the verse . Prior to being saved I would say Gods grace is equal to All , universally. I believe God does respond differently to unsaved people. like hearing thier prayers ( Cornelius) ect . But the ' light ' and conviction is equal to all . That all can come . Its not God was drawing you and not others .
Click to expand...
I never said He drew me and not others. Multiple times I have affirmed that
Jesus is drawing all to Himself. I am sorry I cannot provide a Scripture verse
to show that God revealed Himself to me personally. However, it is a promise,
and one He fulfilled in my life. I came to know God personally through such
experiences, to know He knew me, and cared for me, that He loved me, and
that I was forgiven. Why you have a problem with that, I may never understand.

 
T

throughfaith

Well-known member
#677
Aug 4, 2020
10,467
1,593
113
#677
Magenta said:
I am not Arminian, either :p

You seem to dislike the concept of God's grace working in unsaved people.
Click to expand...
Conviction of the Holy Spirit is necessary for salvation, but occurs to sinners alike, regardless of consequent faith or unbelief. It is not irresistible or unconditionally selective. (Jn. 16:7-11)

Grace is a ubiquitous reality, not a selective force. (Tit. 2:11-13)

Grace is just fine on it’s own as it’s found in scripture. Any modifier other than “free,” such as “sovereign,” “irresistible,” or “prevenient” indicate someone is either confused or attempting to confuse. (Rom. 3:24; 5:15; Jn. 1:16; Tit. 2:11-13)
 
T

throughfaith

Well-known member
#678
Aug 4, 2020
10,467
1,593
113
#678
brightfame52 said:
Once again:

God is pleased to save them that believe. That just cant be the unregenerate since they cant believe because they cant please God. Also their mind is enmity against God Rom 8:7-8
7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.

8 So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.
Click to expand...
The first line ( which is scripture) in your statement above literally refutes the rest of what you say ' God is pleased to save them that believe. ' This shuts down everything you say after it .
 
Magenta

Magenta

Senior Member
#679
Jul 3, 2015
60,146
29,456
113
#679
throughfaith said:
Conviction of the Holy Spirit is necessary for salvation, but occurs to sinners alike, regardless of consequent faith or unbelief. It is not irresistible or unconditionally selective. (Jn. 16:7-11)

Grace is a ubiquitous reality, not a selective force. (Tit. 2:11-13)

Grace is just fine on it’s own as it’s found in scripture. Any modifier other than “free,” such as “sovereign,” “irresistible,” or “prevenient” indicate someone is either confused or attempting to confuse. (Rom. 3:24; 5:15; Jn. 1:16; Tit. 2:11-13)
Click to expand...
Why in the world do you think you have to keep repeating things to me which I have never contested or even hinted at and told you so previously??? You sound like a broken record that refuses to really hear and comprehend what I am saying.
 
T

throughfaith

Well-known member
#680
Aug 4, 2020
10,467
1,593
113
#680
Magenta said:
I never said He drew me and not others. Multiple times I have affirmed that
Jesus is drawing all to Himself. I am sorry I cannot provide a Scripture verse
to show that God revealed Himself to me personally. However, it is a promise,
and one He fulfilled in my life. I came to know God personally through such
experiences, to know He knew me, and cared for me, that He loved me, and
that I was forgiven. Why you have a problem with that, I may never understand.

Click to expand...
He loved ' us ' by dying for ' us ' Whilst we ( everyone without exception) were yet sinners . Amen .
 
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