P
pottersclay
Guest
It is said that absolute knowledge requires no faith.
So my question for you is did jesus walk by faith or knowledge?
So my question for you is did jesus walk by faith or knowledge?
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Not sure that question can be answered.
When here on earth, Jesus was fully man AND fully God. Can we say Jesus has "faith" in Himself? Jesus IS who man has or does not have "faith." Jesus is "all knowing," but does He walk by knowledge? Again, the concepts you are speaking of are correctly identified with man and not Jesus/God IMO.
Regarding the statement: absolute knowledge requires no faith
Here are some Articles one can consider:
Faith vs. Knowledge – Gluteus Maximus
Faith Is Based on Knowledge - Andrew Wommack Ministries
What Faith Is and Is Not by Guy Richard - Ligonier Ministries
When here on earth, Jesus was fully man AND fully God. Can we say Jesus has "faith" in Himself? Jesus IS who man has or does not have "faith." Jesus is "all knowing," but does He walk by knowledge? Again, the concepts you are speaking of are correctly identified with man and not Jesus/God IMO.
Regarding the statement: absolute knowledge requires no faith
Here are some Articles one can consider:
Faith vs. Knowledge – Gluteus Maximus
Faith Is Based on Knowledge - Andrew Wommack Ministries
What Faith Is and Is Not by Guy Richard - Ligonier Ministries
L
Live4Him
Guest
Apparently, during his incarnation, Jesus did not walk in absolute knowledge.
For example, in relation to a yet future day, Jesus said:
"But of that day and that hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels which are in heaven, neither the Son, but the Father." (Mark 13:32)
Even after His resurrection from the dead and ascension back to the Father in heaven, Jesus needed to have certain end-times events revealed to him by the Father:
Revelation chapter 1
[1] The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to shew unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John:
[2] Who bare record of the word of God, and of the testimony of Jesus Christ, and of all things that he saw.
As far as "faith" is concerned, we read:
"Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen." (Hebrews 11:1)
Seeing how "faith is the substance of things hoped for", it seems to me that Jesus required "faith" because we know that he "hoped for" certain things, like his resurrection from the dead, during his incarnation.
We read:
Acts chapter 2
[22] Ye men of Israel, hear these words; Jesus of Nazareth, a man approved of God among you by miracles and wonders and signs, which God did by him in the midst of you, as ye yourselves also know:
[23] Him, being delivered by the determinate counsel and foreknowledge of God, ye have taken, and by wicked hands have crucified and slain:
[24] Whom God hath raised up, having loosed the pains of death: because it was not possible that he should be holden of it.
[25] For David speaketh concerning him, I foresaw the Lord always before my face, for he is on my right hand, that I should not be moved:
[26] Therefore did my heart rejoice, and my tongue was glad; moreover also my flesh shall rest in hope:
[27] Because thou wilt not leave my soul in hell, neither wilt thou suffer thine Holy One to see corruption.
[28] Thou hast made known to me the ways of life; thou shalt make me full of joy with thy countenance.
Peter preached these words in relation to Jesus Christ, and Jesus needed to have "hope" (vs. 26) that the Father would raise him from the dead, and this "hope" was based upon his "faith" in what had been written in the 16th psalm concerning him (Luke 24:44).
There, we read:
Psalm 16
[8] I have set the LORD always before me: because he is at my right hand, I shall not be moved.
[9] Therefore my heart is glad, and my glory rejoiceth: my flesh also shall rest in hope.
[10] For thou wilt not leave my soul in hell; neither wilt thou suffer thine Holy One to see corruption.
[11] Thou wilt shew me the path of life: in thy presence is fulness of joy; at thy right hand there are pleasures for evermore.
Hopefully, this helps to answer your question.
I would say Knowledge.. Faith requires trusting someone or something you are not certain of.. Jesus being LORD knew all things..
We as humans with limited knowledge and limited wisdom must to a certain extent walk by a mixture of Knowledge and Faith..
Faith and knowledge come hand in hand. To separate the two, separates the mind. Jesus had knowledge of the Father and that knowledge gave Him the confidence and assurance in the things unseen.
P
pottersclay
Guest
Jesus is never not God.
He knows all things at all times.
Saying 'only the Father knows the day and the hour' is Hebrew betrothal ceremony language with a specific meaning relating to the mystery of Christ and the Church. It is not indicating that God is ignorant of anything.
He knows all things at all times.
Saying 'only the Father knows the day and the hour' is Hebrew betrothal ceremony language with a specific meaning relating to the mystery of Christ and the Church. It is not indicating that God is ignorant of anything.
P
pottersclay
Guest
Faith can never be based on faith. Faith is based on truth.
Jesus said "I am the way the truth and the life".
Many of us struggle with this teaching. This world would have you deny this very truth. Others have changed it into a name it and claim it theology along with " what so ever you ask I will do.
As the story goes........Jesus came from heaven to earth to show the way.
From the earth to the cross ( our debts to pay)
From the cross to the grave
From the grave to the sky
That's why we lift his name on high
Do you where there once was faith now have come to the truth in things that the Lord has shown you?
Jesus said "I am the way the truth and the life".
Many of us struggle with this teaching. This world would have you deny this very truth. Others have changed it into a name it and claim it theology along with " what so ever you ask I will do.
As the story goes........Jesus came from heaven to earth to show the way.
From the earth to the cross ( our debts to pay)
From the cross to the grave
From the grave to the sky
That's why we lift his name on high
Do you where there once was faith now have come to the truth in things that the Lord has shown you?
B
Blackpowderduelist
Guest
It is an error to attempt to separate the two. It like trying to separate "head knowledge" from " heart knowledge". This is babel designed to obfuscate the truth and disparaging scholastic study. Satan does this so that people are ignorant and therefore easily deceived. Study and passion are hand in hand and complementary to each other. One without the other is not actually possible.
"Faith comes by hearing and hearing by the word."
I think it's a legitimate question, but what the question is really asking is whether Christ is omniscient or not. It's asking if God ceased to be God, or whether Christ even really is God. It's equivalent to asking whether Peter is in error to say "Lord, You know all things"
The way we answer that radically changes how we understand the record of Him in the gospel.
P
pottersclay
Guest
Faith leads to truth. We see this in the apostles lives as well as the other lives jesus touched.
My thoughts are that every faithful christian should have arrived to undeniable truths in there life.
This is to be a encouraging thread based on the good work jesus started in us all that he shall bring to a finish.
For example thomas when told to examine jesus wounds proclaimed "my Lord my God" taking him from faith to truth.
The apostles in general, hiding because of the death of our Lord now boldly proclaiming the gospel after see first hand the resurrection .
To hear and read what is written and believe is faith. To experience first hand what you have read and heard is truth.
Over time our faith should develop in to truth which is undeniable.
Faith of a mustard seed the smallest of seed grows into one of the largest garden plants.
By the way thanks for your evaluation of my babel.
Jesus laid aside being "all knowing" (omniscient) when He took on human flesh. There are many scriptures showing this. Your question is based on a false premise.
B
Blackpowderduelist
Guest
It's not "your" babel. It time and memorial. Also understand what I mean by babel. Not like babies who can't speak, so they make sounds to learn to speak. I mean language for the purpose of causing division not among the group but with in the person. The idea that a person we who studies and examines the word of God in so much as to know his word; can do so without faith or passion is theoretic and not a reality. It's like in theory a person could scientifically figure out how to pass two solid objects through each other with out damaging with of them, but in reality it can't happen.
Should this be termed "idle speculation"? The Gospels show that Jesus of Nazareth had divine foreknowledge of all things. As to the time of His return, He now has absolute knowledge of that also.
Once more, if one believes the Word, in reading Isaiah 9:6, it will be obvious exactly what our Savior, Yeshua, knew. All it will take is faith in the Word, and the Word is God...amen
Jesus shared in all our struggles and weaknesses but over came them all. In what way did He face the issue of gaining and keeping
the faith, I do not know. But face it He did.
On the issue of knowledge, I suspect the same thing. There may have been things that came to Him as He grew but until then He was in the same boat as us. Unsure.
