-
Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.
If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!
To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
So have you found a scripture yet? Indicating that the spiritual gifts seize?
Merely curious...
Something else I would like to ask you concerning the question you asked me. If I say Yes. it would be merely be a person writing and there would be no proof of me that I actually did hear God's voice. And from what I have learned so far from you, you won't just take someone at their word. Nor do I expect you to. I wouldn't either. But for the sake of friendliness the answer is yes. But on that basis I wish to ask you something...
Why do you think Jesus is called the High Priest of our faith?
Why do you think the curtain in the temple was torn.
What was the purpose of the High Priest?
If God wanted us to talk to Him via someone else, why make Jesus the High Priest?
What would be the purpose of the Holy Spirit if we couldn't listen to Him?
Joh 14:26 But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.
How can He teach us if we do not hear Him? Or listen to Him? How did the disciples of Jesus?
If the Holy Ghost is not in our lives today...how would it even be possible to learn the things that Jesus taught?
What does it mean to be born again, if you cannot enhance spiritually? John 3. How can you enter the Kingdom of God? How can you enhance spiritually if you cannot listen to God. For growth comes through obedience.
Joh 14:21 He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself to him.
Nor shall they enter into His Kingdom...
Mat 7:21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
How do you know the will of the Father for you in this very minute or hour or even day?
How would you know it, if He doesn't say it to you? Of course we need to love one another.
But let's take a practical example.
Say you are about to buy a house or a car? How do you know it is the Father's will without listening?
More so and even more important. Say you are busy counselling someone or talking to that person about Jesus, how do you know that the words coming out of your mouth is the Father's will that you must say those exact words if you didn't listen to hear what He wanted you to say?
How do you know you have given the advice God would have given to that person. In fact how would you know about things in their lives without the revelation of God showing you the things that they are to shy or ashamed to talk about. How would you aid them? And more importantly, how without listening would you be able to be at peace knowing that the advice you gave might not have been what God intended for those people to hear. For if you listened and spoke the words that God told you to speak, there is no fear. There is no doubt. And sometimes even a miracle follows. And that person would immediately sense the fruit of God's spirit. Why because the Holy Spirit worked. And because Jesus said that we should test on the fruit, He would always deposit His fruit. So immediately that person would feel joy, peace or any one of the fruit of the spirit automatically. But if you do not listen, but speak out of your own understanding, you might even give somebody good advice, no doubt. But would it have been the advice God would have given?
And more importantly without it, could you really spiritually grow? Is spiritual growth based on knowledge of the Bible (which is also important) or is it more based on a personal relationship with Jesus Christ. Now think on this. If you cannot have a two-way conversation with any person on earth, we as humans would struggle to keep a relationship with that person. How do you expect to have one with God from a human's side without communication in both directions.
But then again. Maybe you know all this already and I merely wrote it for someone else on this site who does not hear His voice. Just remember, and this I would say to everybody including myself. You cannot fake a relationship. You either have it, or you don't. If I claim I have a girlfriend, but never listen and talk to her. (forgive the comparison) then how can I claim I have a girlfriend.
If I create a fanclub and talk about her all the time, make t-shirts,etc but I never listen to her. How do I even know how she is feeling about something. Or what is her opinion. The same with God. How can you claim to be one of His, go to church all the time. But never listen to Him in your daily life. (don't get me wrong Going to Church to learn more about God is good) But if you don't listen to Him when you are busy in your life. While you are doing things, discussing it with Him. Two-way discussion. How on earth and Heaven for that matter, are you going to know what His opinion is about what you are doing?
Example: Sometimes God tells me to go a certain person and talk to him about a specific thing. Sometimes I have not even met the guy. Then I go talk to him about it, and I can literally see how God touch that person's life. When me and my wife were still in the friends phase, she was deaf. So God said, ok you can go and invite her this afternoon to you house and then you can heal her deafness. I did so. And yes, so did God. He took away her deafness and gave us one of our most precious moments of running outside into the rain so that she could hear the wind in the trees and the birds and the wind and the droplets of water. If I didn't listen to God, she would have remained deaf. I say this so God can get the honour for this and that people can start a relationship with Him and start listening to Him. How else do you think it must be done? Jesus said that He has done nothing if the Father has not shown it to Him. He did that so we could have an example. We should listen to God. For it is not us that can perform miracles. But God.
I apologise if I come over a bit strong, Zone. But I really feel some people need to know this, even if not you.
May you have joy today!
Something to consider.
Peace be with you
Merely curious...
Something else I would like to ask you concerning the question you asked me. If I say Yes. it would be merely be a person writing and there would be no proof of me that I actually did hear God's voice. And from what I have learned so far from you, you won't just take someone at their word. Nor do I expect you to. I wouldn't either. But for the sake of friendliness the answer is yes. But on that basis I wish to ask you something...
Why do you think Jesus is called the High Priest of our faith?
Why do you think the curtain in the temple was torn.
What was the purpose of the High Priest?
If God wanted us to talk to Him via someone else, why make Jesus the High Priest?
What would be the purpose of the Holy Spirit if we couldn't listen to Him?
Joh 14:26 But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.
How can He teach us if we do not hear Him? Or listen to Him? How did the disciples of Jesus?
If the Holy Ghost is not in our lives today...how would it even be possible to learn the things that Jesus taught?
What does it mean to be born again, if you cannot enhance spiritually? John 3. How can you enter the Kingdom of God? How can you enhance spiritually if you cannot listen to God. For growth comes through obedience.
Joh 14:21 He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself to him.
Nor shall they enter into His Kingdom...
Mat 7:21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
How do you know the will of the Father for you in this very minute or hour or even day?
How would you know it, if He doesn't say it to you? Of course we need to love one another.
But let's take a practical example.
Say you are about to buy a house or a car? How do you know it is the Father's will without listening?
More so and even more important. Say you are busy counselling someone or talking to that person about Jesus, how do you know that the words coming out of your mouth is the Father's will that you must say those exact words if you didn't listen to hear what He wanted you to say?
How do you know you have given the advice God would have given to that person. In fact how would you know about things in their lives without the revelation of God showing you the things that they are to shy or ashamed to talk about. How would you aid them? And more importantly, how without listening would you be able to be at peace knowing that the advice you gave might not have been what God intended for those people to hear. For if you listened and spoke the words that God told you to speak, there is no fear. There is no doubt. And sometimes even a miracle follows. And that person would immediately sense the fruit of God's spirit. Why because the Holy Spirit worked. And because Jesus said that we should test on the fruit, He would always deposit His fruit. So immediately that person would feel joy, peace or any one of the fruit of the spirit automatically. But if you do not listen, but speak out of your own understanding, you might even give somebody good advice, no doubt. But would it have been the advice God would have given?
And more importantly without it, could you really spiritually grow? Is spiritual growth based on knowledge of the Bible (which is also important) or is it more based on a personal relationship with Jesus Christ. Now think on this. If you cannot have a two-way conversation with any person on earth, we as humans would struggle to keep a relationship with that person. How do you expect to have one with God from a human's side without communication in both directions.
But then again. Maybe you know all this already and I merely wrote it for someone else on this site who does not hear His voice. Just remember, and this I would say to everybody including myself. You cannot fake a relationship. You either have it, or you don't. If I claim I have a girlfriend, but never listen and talk to her. (forgive the comparison) then how can I claim I have a girlfriend.
If I create a fanclub and talk about her all the time, make t-shirts,etc but I never listen to her. How do I even know how she is feeling about something. Or what is her opinion. The same with God. How can you claim to be one of His, go to church all the time. But never listen to Him in your daily life. (don't get me wrong Going to Church to learn more about God is good) But if you don't listen to Him when you are busy in your life. While you are doing things, discussing it with Him. Two-way discussion. How on earth and Heaven for that matter, are you going to know what His opinion is about what you are doing?
Example: Sometimes God tells me to go a certain person and talk to him about a specific thing. Sometimes I have not even met the guy. Then I go talk to him about it, and I can literally see how God touch that person's life. When me and my wife were still in the friends phase, she was deaf. So God said, ok you can go and invite her this afternoon to you house and then you can heal her deafness. I did so. And yes, so did God. He took away her deafness and gave us one of our most precious moments of running outside into the rain so that she could hear the wind in the trees and the birds and the wind and the droplets of water. If I didn't listen to God, she would have remained deaf. I say this so God can get the honour for this and that people can start a relationship with Him and start listening to Him. How else do you think it must be done? Jesus said that He has done nothing if the Father has not shown it to Him. He did that so we could have an example. We should listen to God. For it is not us that can perform miracles. But God.
I apologise if I come over a bit strong, Zone. But I really feel some people need to know this, even if not you.
May you have joy today!
Something to consider.
Peace be with you
L
The old testament has 12 tribes from the sons of Israel the NT has 12 apostles and in the last days has 12 x 12000 from spiritual Israel.
Romans 2:28-29
(28) For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh:
(29) But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.
Romans 11:17
(17) And if some of the branches be broken off, and thou, being a wild olive tree, wert graffed in among them, and with them partakest of the root and fatness of the olive tree;
Galatians 3:29
(29) And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.
Romans 2:28-29
(28) For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh:
(29) But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.
Romans 11:17
(17) And if some of the branches be broken off, and thou, being a wild olive tree, wert graffed in among them, and with them partakest of the root and fatness of the olive tree;
Galatians 3:29
(29) And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.
SEE BEFORE ME? that means BEFORE PAUL.
THAT MEANS WITHIN....STILL INSIDE....IN THE TIME OF....WITHIN THE APOSTOLIC AGE.
The Resurrection of Christ
1Now I would remind you, brothers,a of the gospel I preached to you, which you received, in which you stand, 2and by which you are being saved, if you hold fast to the word I preached to you—unless you believed in vain.
3For I delivered to you as of first importance what I also received: that Christ died for our sins in accordance with the Scriptures, 4that he was buried, that he was raised on the third day in accordance with the Scriptures, 5and that he appeared to Cephas, then to the twelve. 6Then he appeared to more than five hundred brothers at one time, most of whom are still alive, though some have fallen asleep. 7Then he appeared to James, then to all the apostles. 8Last of all, as to one untimely born, he appeared also to me. 9 For I am the least of the apostles, unworthy to be called an apostle, because I persecuted the church of God. 10But by the grace of God I am what I am, and his grace toward me was not in vain. On the contrary, I worked harder than any of them, though it was not I, but the grace of God that is with me. 11Whether then it was I or they, so we preach and so you believed.
THAT MEANS WITHIN....STILL INSIDE....IN THE TIME OF....WITHIN THE APOSTOLIC AGE.
The Resurrection of Christ
1Now I would remind you, brothers,a of the gospel I preached to you, which you received, in which you stand, 2and by which you are being saved, if you hold fast to the word I preached to you—unless you believed in vain.
3For I delivered to you as of first importance what I also received: that Christ died for our sins in accordance with the Scriptures, 4that he was buried, that he was raised on the third day in accordance with the Scriptures, 5and that he appeared to Cephas, then to the twelve. 6Then he appeared to more than five hundred brothers at one time, most of whom are still alive, though some have fallen asleep. 7Then he appeared to James, then to all the apostles. 8Last of all, as to one untimely born, he appeared also to me. 9 For I am the least of the apostles, unworthy to be called an apostle, because I persecuted the church of God. 10But by the grace of God I am what I am, and his grace toward me was not in vain. On the contrary, I worked harder than any of them, though it was not I, but the grace of God that is with me. 11Whether then it was I or they, so we preach and so you believed.
not even responding to most of that.
i NEVER said The Holy Ghost is not active in our lives: cheap argument by people who have to defend Charismatic manifestations. not worthy of reply.
NO ONE has looked for this stuff for 1900 years....if you like it carry on. read church history. if anybody through time after the apostolic age claimed to be a prophet he was ejected as a heretic.
example:
Montanism was an early Christian movement of the early 2nd century, later referred to by the name of its founder, Montanus, but originally known by its adherents as the "New Prophecy". It originated at Pepuza in Phrygia, a province of Asia Minor, and flourished throughout the region, leading to the movement being referred to elsewhere as Cataphrygian (meaning it was "from Phrygia"), or simply as "Phrygians". It spread rapidly to other regions in the Roman Empire at a time before Christianity was generally tolerated or legal. Although it came to be labelled a heresy, the movement held similar views about the basic tenets of Christian doctrine to those of the wider Church. It persisted in some isolated places into the 6th century. Some people[who?] have drawn parallels between Montanism and modern Pentecostalism (which some call Neo-Montanism). The most widely known "Montanist" was undoubtedly Tertullian, who would not have recognized the later designation but understood himself simply to be a Christian who recognized the "New Prophecy".
Differences between Montanism and Orthodox Christianity
The beliefs of Montanism are presented by an orthodox historian as follows:
do 10 minutes research on Montanism/Neo-Montanism
i NEVER said The Holy Ghost is not active in our lives: cheap argument by people who have to defend Charismatic manifestations. not worthy of reply.
NO ONE has looked for this stuff for 1900 years....if you like it carry on. read church history. if anybody through time after the apostolic age claimed to be a prophet he was ejected as a heretic.
example:
Montanism was an early Christian movement of the early 2nd century, later referred to by the name of its founder, Montanus, but originally known by its adherents as the "New Prophecy". It originated at Pepuza in Phrygia, a province of Asia Minor, and flourished throughout the region, leading to the movement being referred to elsewhere as Cataphrygian (meaning it was "from Phrygia"), or simply as "Phrygians". It spread rapidly to other regions in the Roman Empire at a time before Christianity was generally tolerated or legal. Although it came to be labelled a heresy, the movement held similar views about the basic tenets of Christian doctrine to those of the wider Church. It persisted in some isolated places into the 6th century. Some people[who?] have drawn parallels between Montanism and modern Pentecostalism (which some call Neo-Montanism). The most widely known "Montanist" was undoubtedly Tertullian, who would not have recognized the later designation but understood himself simply to be a Christian who recognized the "New Prophecy".
Differences between Montanism and Orthodox Christianity
The beliefs of Montanism are presented by an orthodox historian as follows:
- The belief that the prophecies of the Montanists superseded and fulfilled the doctrines proclaimed by the Apostles.
- The encouragement of ecstatic prophesying,[7] contrasting with the more sober and disciplined approach to theology dominant in orthodox Christianity at the time and since.
- The view that Christians who fell from grace could not be redeemed, also in contrast to the orthodox Christian view that contrition and confession could lead to a sinner's restoration to the Church.
- Their prophetesses abandoned their husbands.[8] In contrast to the Montanists, the Church emphasized chastity and forbade divorce and remarriage (unless the first marriage was not valid).
do 10 minutes research on Montanism/Neo-Montanism
Last edited:
L
Paul was an apostle but he was not one of the 12 cause he was not with Christ from the start as was Matthias who replaced Judas Acts 1:21. 22 there were also people who claimed to be apostles but were not Revelation 2:2 There is many numbers in the book of Revelation, 7 is mentioned more times than anything but 12 is also mentioned a few times maybe God is trying to tell us something. the new Jerusalem has 4 sides and 3 gates on each side 4 x 3 =12; 4 + 3=7
A
Why would you not believe in the 9 spiritual gifts? It is bible and Jesus told his disciples, greater things what this will you do once i have gone away. My husbands step father was diagnosed with bone cancer about 2 years ago. he went through terrible agony with so much pain, but he refused to go back to the doctors, he refused any kind of treatment. The PET scan said it was in every bone in his body even his skull. He got very ill at one point almost to death, but all this time he kept trusting in the Lord and his healing, and if it didn't come he knew the alternative...instantaneous healing in heaven!!
As time went by he went back to his family doctor about 11 months ago, he was amazed to even see him alive. he sent him to a oncologist. he did test for cancer on him. When he got the results back he told him he could see lesions on his bones but could not find cancer for sure. He wanted to see his PET scan and look at both and compare them. All this time he ate the foods that God made asparagus, ginger, and other natural God made things. He was up and down, still having lots of pain. He went back to the oncologist last week and they gave him a great bill of health as far as the cancer. he still hurts but only the scars of cancer are on his bones...he has totally dumbfounded the doctors. All he did was pray and trust God . God honored his faith and left the proof for others to see. It takes a lot of faith and courage to not take any kind of cancer treatments and say...I am just going to let God take care of me. He is 77 years old and for the past 4 years he has been terribly sick, but he is getting better, and he is healed.
I think God was testing him with the cancer , and even the pain, but he held true to what he really believed.
The bible tells us there are 9 spiritual gifts, but we have to have the faith to operate in those gifts. Without true faith we cannot ever see them come to fruition. You must believe and expect, God demands it. Without faith you cannot please God.
As time went by he went back to his family doctor about 11 months ago, he was amazed to even see him alive. he sent him to a oncologist. he did test for cancer on him. When he got the results back he told him he could see lesions on his bones but could not find cancer for sure. He wanted to see his PET scan and look at both and compare them. All this time he ate the foods that God made asparagus, ginger, and other natural God made things. He was up and down, still having lots of pain. He went back to the oncologist last week and they gave him a great bill of health as far as the cancer. he still hurts but only the scars of cancer are on his bones...he has totally dumbfounded the doctors. All he did was pray and trust God . God honored his faith and left the proof for others to see. It takes a lot of faith and courage to not take any kind of cancer treatments and say...I am just going to let God take care of me. He is 77 years old and for the past 4 years he has been terribly sick, but he is getting better, and he is healed.
I think God was testing him with the cancer , and even the pain, but he held true to what he really believed.
The bible tells us there are 9 spiritual gifts, but we have to have the faith to operate in those gifts. Without true faith we cannot ever see them come to fruition. You must believe and expect, God demands it. Without faith you cannot please God.
No one is denying that they lived at the same time. A child that can read can tell you that, cause how else would he talk of them...
You still have not shown WHERE in the Bible it says there is such a thing as an APOSTOLIC AGE. And then WHERE in the Bible it says when it began or where it ends. Neither have you proven with scripture that any of the gifts Paul mentioned CEASE to exist. These gifts includes Healings, Prophecies, Apostels, Prophets, etc.
You have not given any scripture proving it. All that you prooved is that Paul was in fact an apostle. Which everybody by now believes. And that Jesus appeared to Paul. If you wish me to be convinced show me a scripture where it says the gifts that Paul mentions cease to exist. Because that is your statement. Secondly, show me where it says the apostolic age begins and where it ends... And that apostles are regardes so high that they actually have their own age... BTW how does that glorify God?? Apostles having their own age? It sounds more like you try to glorify the apostles. Thirdly if it was an age that took place and God did want to show the beginning to the end, wouldn't He indicate it like He has done before in the Bible? A clear beginning and a clear end. It isn't there because it doesn't exist. Apostles do exist. But there is no APOSTOLIC AGE. Unless your Bible looks different from the eight I have on my computer. I don't think you are going to find scripture. But please feel free to try.
ACTS 5:12
The apostles performed many miraculous signs and wonders among the people. And all the believers used to meet together in Solomon's Colonnade.
~
GO AHEAD.
believe and put your trust and faith in Modern Apostles, Modern prophets, people who claim to WORK MIRACLES, AND HAVE THE POWER TO DO SIGNS AND WONDERS.
GO FOR IT.
run around looking for them! there's no shortage.
seek signs continually! FAITH IS NOT WHAT'S NEEDED....SIGNS ARE.
if that's what you want, that is INDEED what you will get: FIND OUT WHERE THE BENTLEY-ITES ARE TODAY.
1 Corinthians 1
20 Where is the one who is wise? Where is the scribe? Where is the debater of this age? Has not God made foolish the wisdom of the world? 21 For since, in the wisdom of God, the world did not know God through wisdom, it pleased God through the folly of what we preach to save those who believe. 22For Jews demand signs and Greeks seek wisdom, 23 but we preach Christ crucified, a stumbling block to Jews and folly to Gentiles, 24 but to those who are called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God and the wisdom of God. 25 For the foolishness of God is wiser than men, and the weakness of God is stronger than men.
Mark 8:12
He sighed deeply and said, "Why does this generation ask for a miraculous sign? I tell you the truth, no sign will be given to it."
Mark 13:22
For false christs and false prophets will arise and perform signs and wonders, to lead astray, if possible, the elect.
Matthew 16:4
A wicked and adulterous generation looks for a miraculous sign, but none will be given it except the sign of Jonah." Jesus then left them and went away.
2 Thessalonians2
9 Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders, 10 And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved. 11 And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie: 12 That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.
John 4:48
"Unless you people see miraculous signs and wonders," Jesus told him, "you will never believe."
The apostles performed many miraculous signs and wonders among the people. And all the believers used to meet together in Solomon's Colonnade.
~
GO AHEAD.
believe and put your trust and faith in Modern Apostles, Modern prophets, people who claim to WORK MIRACLES, AND HAVE THE POWER TO DO SIGNS AND WONDERS.
GO FOR IT.
run around looking for them! there's no shortage.
seek signs continually! FAITH IS NOT WHAT'S NEEDED....SIGNS ARE.
if that's what you want, that is INDEED what you will get: FIND OUT WHERE THE BENTLEY-ITES ARE TODAY.
1 Corinthians 1
20 Where is the one who is wise? Where is the scribe? Where is the debater of this age? Has not God made foolish the wisdom of the world? 21 For since, in the wisdom of God, the world did not know God through wisdom, it pleased God through the folly of what we preach to save those who believe. 22For Jews demand signs and Greeks seek wisdom, 23 but we preach Christ crucified, a stumbling block to Jews and folly to Gentiles, 24 but to those who are called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God and the wisdom of God. 25 For the foolishness of God is wiser than men, and the weakness of God is stronger than men.
Mark 8:12
He sighed deeply and said, "Why does this generation ask for a miraculous sign? I tell you the truth, no sign will be given to it."
Mark 13:22
For false christs and false prophets will arise and perform signs and wonders, to lead astray, if possible, the elect.
Matthew 16:4
A wicked and adulterous generation looks for a miraculous sign, but none will be given it except the sign of Jonah." Jesus then left them and went away.
2 Thessalonians2
9 Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders, 10 And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved. 11 And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie: 12 That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.
John 4:48
"Unless you people see miraculous signs and wonders," Jesus told him, "you will never believe."
Again, NOT giving ANY scripture that specifically state that the gifts cease to exist.
Again I remind you of these two:
1Co 13:8 Charity never faileth: but whether there be prophecies, they shall fail; whether there be tongues, they shall cease; whether there be knowledge, it shall vanish away.
1Co 13:9 For we know in part, and we prophesy in part.
1Co 13:10 But when that which is perfect is come, then that which is in part shall be done away. 1Co 13:11 When I was a child, I spake as a child, I understood as a child, I thought as a child: but when I became a man, I put away childish things.
1Co 13:12 For now we see through a glass, darkly; but then face to face: now I know in part; but then shall I know even as also I am known.
Eph 4:11 And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers;
Eph 4:12 For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ: Eph 4:13 Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:
Your verses merely state I should not always just look for a sign or for miracles. I'm not. I am looking for SCRIPTURE. Why? Because I gave you scripture. You come with opinions. And versus that does not state what your statement was.
So, scripture please...
Relevant to the statement that you made that apostles, prophets and the other gifts like healing, etc does not exist today.
Again I remind you of these two:
1Co 13:8 Charity never faileth: but whether there be prophecies, they shall fail; whether there be tongues, they shall cease; whether there be knowledge, it shall vanish away.
1Co 13:9 For we know in part, and we prophesy in part.
1Co 13:10 But when that which is perfect is come, then that which is in part shall be done away. 1Co 13:11 When I was a child, I spake as a child, I understood as a child, I thought as a child: but when I became a man, I put away childish things.
1Co 13:12 For now we see through a glass, darkly; but then face to face: now I know in part; but then shall I know even as also I am known.
Eph 4:11 And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers;
Eph 4:12 For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ: Eph 4:13 Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:
Your verses merely state I should not always just look for a sign or for miracles. I'm not. I am looking for SCRIPTURE. Why? Because I gave you scripture. You come with opinions. And versus that does not state what your statement was.
So, scripture please...
Relevant to the statement that you made that apostles, prophets and the other gifts like healing, etc does not exist today.
telling how you leave out the verses that SAY about cessation.
last post to you on this matter.
1 Corinthians 13
Love Is the Greatest
1 If I could speak all the languages of earth and of angels, but didn’t love others, I would only be a noisy gong or a clanging cymbal. 2 If I had the gift of prophecy, and if I understood all of God’s secret plans and possessed all knowledge, and if I had such faith that I could move mountains, but didn’t love others, I would be nothing. 3 If I gave everything I have to the poor and even sacrificed my body, I could boast about it;a but if I didn’t love others, I would have gained nothing.
4 Love is patient and kind. Love is not jealous or boastful or proud 5 or rude. It does not demand its own way. It is not irritable, and it keeps no record of being wronged. 6 It does not rejoice about injustice but rejoices whenever the truth wins out. 7 Love never gives up, never loses faith, is always hopeful, and endures through every circumstance.
8Prophecy and speaking in unknown languagesb and special knowledge will become useless. But love will last forever! 9Now our knowledge is partial and incomplete, and even the gift of prophecy reveals only part of the whole picture! 10But when the time of perfection comes, these partial things will become useless.
11When I was a child, I spoke and thought and reasoned as a child. But when I grew up, I put away childish things. 12Now we see things imperfectly, like puzzling reflections in a mirror, but then we will see everything with perfect clarity.c All that I know now is partial and incomplete, but then I will know everything completely, just as God now knows me completely.
13 Three things will last forever (until the end of th age)—faith, hope, and love—and the greatest of these is love.
~
we know it means until the end of the age because:
do you need faith and hope after Jesus comes if 'that which is perfect (complete)' means The Second Advent?
L
Eph 4:10 He that descended is the same also that ascended up far above all heavens, that he might fill all things.)
Eph 4:11 And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers;
Eph 4:12 For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ:
Eph 4:13 Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:
This is what we need to know. One verse can mean one thing, but when you take the full verse an read it out in full, not just one piece, another meaning is formed.
Here God said that AFTER He ascended to the the right hand of our God to plea for our souls, He gave Apostels, Prophets, evangelists, pasters and teachers for the purpose of showing people that God does exist.
Along the way people moved away from those peachings for Jesus was no longer on earth and dus after a few generations, they started to forget. We need to remember, work and learn not only for our God, but also from one another. Each person has got their own Gift God gave to them. Our work now is to identify our own gifts and work to get them stronger. By helping one another, identifying might come faster, training our gifts might be faster and reaching the full potential that God intended us to reach will be reached.
Mirricals can happen through us, done by God. Never take credit for something you were used for by Jesus, give ALL the credit to Him. He did it through us. Think of what we as followers of Christ could do if we realy started to take some time, and listern to God in the wisper of a breeze, the soothing waves, the sound of nature around us, God is there, why keep Him at a distance.
Glory onto God in the Heavens, for all we have is His, all we do is maintain it for Him. Why? If He made everything, can what ever we posess not be His aswell?
YES......I believe that the spiritual gifts still prevail on earth, for our God still walks the earth, even tough we can not see him. A thousand times over....YES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Eph 4:11 And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers;
Eph 4:12 For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ:
Eph 4:13 Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:
This is what we need to know. One verse can mean one thing, but when you take the full verse an read it out in full, not just one piece, another meaning is formed.
Here God said that AFTER He ascended to the the right hand of our God to plea for our souls, He gave Apostels, Prophets, evangelists, pasters and teachers for the purpose of showing people that God does exist.
Along the way people moved away from those peachings for Jesus was no longer on earth and dus after a few generations, they started to forget. We need to remember, work and learn not only for our God, but also from one another. Each person has got their own Gift God gave to them. Our work now is to identify our own gifts and work to get them stronger. By helping one another, identifying might come faster, training our gifts might be faster and reaching the full potential that God intended us to reach will be reached.
Mirricals can happen through us, done by God. Never take credit for something you were used for by Jesus, give ALL the credit to Him. He did it through us. Think of what we as followers of Christ could do if we realy started to take some time, and listern to God in the wisper of a breeze, the soothing waves, the sound of nature around us, God is there, why keep Him at a distance.
Glory onto God in the Heavens, for all we have is His, all we do is maintain it for Him. Why? If He made everything, can what ever we posess not be His aswell?
YES......I believe that the spiritual gifts still prevail on earth, for our God still walks the earth, even tough we can not see him. A thousand times over....YES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
They are NOT known languages, with the exception of what happened at pentecost.
I Cor 14:2) For he that speaketh in an unknown tongue speaketh not unto men, but unto God: for no man understandeth him; howbeit in the spirit he speaketh mysteries.
I Cor 13: 1) Though I speak with the tongues of men and of angels,
Tongues can be of men or angels.
Guess what. If it's the tongue of an angel, you ain't gonna understand it.
I Cor 14:2) For he that speaketh in an unknown tongue speaketh not unto men, but unto God: for no man understandeth him; howbeit in the spirit he speaketh mysteries.
I Cor 13: 1) Though I speak with the tongues of men and of angels,
Tongues can be of men or angels.
Guess what. If it's the tongue of an angel, you ain't gonna understand it.