Jesus Came To Fulfill Not To Destroy

[Charlie24]

John5:46 For had ye believed Moses, ye would have believed me: for he wrote of me.
vs. 47 But if ye believe not his writing, shall ye believe my words?
Christ is literally telling you there is no difference in OT teaching from the New, they are teaching the same thing! there was no new testament when Christ walked the earth, so what was he teaching from? the OT the law of Moses!

Concerning circumcision: the Scribes and Saddaces were circumcised ,

thats why Christ said this: Matt. 23:3 All therefore whatsoever they bid you observe, that observe and do; but do not ye after their work: for they say and do not.
meaning: Christ said what ever they say concerning the law follow but not after their ways they were quoting the law but not keeping it!
like you said being circumcised means nothing if you are not keeping the Commandments

Jesus was the last prophet under Law. He taught the Law and brought to knowledge the deeper meanings of the Law.

Just as the torch in handed to others in the scripture, the Law/Grace issue was handed to Paul. Christ personally chose Paul to give us this information, this is the issue that took Paul's life when he had finished what the Lord gave him to do.

Paul told us that man of his own doing cannot keep the Law, "weak through the flesh" meaning we are fallen man and we of our own ability will fail. But by the fact that Christ kept that Law, dotting every "i" and crossing every "t" with our faith in His ability rather than ours, He will accomplish through us what we can't do for ourselves.

Just as faith in Christ saves the soul of man, so faith in Christ will give the Holy Spirit the legal authority to accomplish in us the keeping of the Law, and even when we fail, He will pick us up and take us across the finish line, all to honor the faith we have placed in Him.

It's called Grace, something we in no way deserve, but by surrendering to Him, trusting in Him, that faith in Him will see us through. If we try to do it the way man is inclined, it will be of our own doing and certain failure. God will simply not accept anything of mans doing, but only what we allow the Holy Spirit to perform through us.

We must do as the great apostle Paul did on the road to Damascus when he surrendered totally to Christ and said, "Lord, what will you have me do." He has told us through Paul exactly what to do!

 

[Knowledged]

Not me, I'm only working on increasing my faith in Christ which will give the Holy Spirit more room to work out the commandments through me. It's about me surrendering to Christ and depending on Him to keep the commandments through me.

Rom. 8:3-4

"For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:

That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit."

The walking after the flesh is trying to keep the Law of my own ability, Paul said NO!

The walking after the Spirit is my yielding to Him by faith and letting Him keep the Law through me.

I do the same as the apostle Paul, he knew much more about it than I could ever hope to know!

Gal. 2:19-21

"For I through the law am dead to the law, that I might live unto God.

I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me.

I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain."


Paul let Christ live through him by faith. It's the only way the Law will be fulfilled in your life!

Paul also said this: Romans 3:31 Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid (that means no)
ye we establish the law.
Romans 7:7 what shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid. Nay, I had not known sin, but for the law: for I had known lust, except the law had said, Thou shall not covet

Psalms 19:7 The law of the LORD is perfect, converting the soul: the testimony of the LORD is sure, making wise the simple. (Who gets rid of something perfect!)

Hebrews 8:8 For finding fault in them in them Sir not Gods perfect laws

 

[Knowledged]

John 15:10 If ye keep my commandments ye shall abide in my love; even I have kept my Fathers commandments and abide in his love. John 14: 15 if ye love me, keep my commandments.
what do these Scriptures mean?[/QUOTE

Righteousness: Deu.6:25 And it shall be our righteousness, if we observe to do all these Commandments before the LORD our God, as he has commanded us.

 

[Charlie24]

Paul also said this: Romans 3:31 Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid (that means no)
ye we establish the law.
Romans 7:7 what shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid. Nay, I had not known sin, but for the law: for I had known lust, except the law had said, Thou shall not covet

Psalms 19:7 The law of the LORD is perfect, converting the soul: the testimony of the LORD is sure, making wise the simple. (Who gets rid of something perfect!)

Hebrews 8:8 For finding fault in them in them Sir not Gods perfect laws

Paul also said the Law is holy and good. The Law is perfect and is the standard of God's righteousness.

There is no problem with the Law whatsoever, it is flawless, the problem is with fallen man who can't keep it!

There are 3 reasons the Law was given, one of them is to show fallen man he can't keep that standard of righteousness that God set before us. This is why God ordained the sacrificial system, man would see he can't keep that perfect Law and he was to turn to the sacrifice of an innocent animal which represented the coming Messiah who would be the sacrifice for man to pay his sin debt.

If it were possible for fallen man to keep the Law without the Grace of God to do it for him, there would have been no need for Christ to offer Himself at Calvary! Man could have had his own righteousness by his own doings.

 

[Knowledged]

Jesus was the last prophet under Law. He taught the Law and brought to knowledge the deeper meanings of the Law.

Just as the torch in handed to others in the scripture, the Law/Grace issue was handed to Paul. Christ personally chose Paul to give us this information, this is the issue that took Paul's life when he had finished what the Lord gave him to do.

Paul told us that man of his own doing cannot keep the Law, "weak through the flesh" meaning we are fallen man and we of our own ability will fail. But by the fact that Christ kept that Law, dotting every "i" and crossing every "t" with our faith in His ability rather than ours, He will accomplish through us what we can't do for ourselves.

Just as faith in Christ saves the soul of man, so faith in Christ will give the Holy Spirit the legal authority to accomplish in us the keeping of the Law, and even when we fail, He will pick us up and take us across the finish line, all to honor the faith we have placed in Him.

It's called Grace, something we in no way deserve, but by surrendering to Him, trusting in Him, that faith in Him will see us through. If we try to do it the way man is inclined, it will be of our own doing and certain failure. God will simply not accept anything of mans doing, but only what we allow the Holy Spirit to perform through us.

We must do as the great apostle Paul did on the road to Damascus when he surrendered totally to Christ and said, "Lord, what will you have me do." He has told us through Paul exactly what to do!

This is the problem: (Peter warned them) As also in all his epistles, speaking in them of things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they are unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the others scriptures, unto their own destruction.
Apostle Paul: But this I confess unto thee, that after the way (the law) which they call heresy, so worship I the God of my father’s believing all things which are written I the law and in the Prophets!

 

[Charlie24]

This is the problem: (Peter warned them) As also in all his epistles, speaking in them of things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they are unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the others scriptures, unto their own destruction.
Apostle Paul: But this I confess unto thee, that after the way (the law) which they call heresy, so worship I the God of my father’s believing all things which are written I the law and in the Prophets!

I'm sorry to say, my friend, you have just described your own self in 2 Peter.

Paul made it clear that it's either by grace or law, it can't be both. He made it clear there is no righteousness for fallen man in trying to keep the law. But you have it your way, nothing else I can do.

 

[gb9]

I'm sorry to say, my friend, you have just described your own self in 2 Peter.

Paul made it clear that it's either by grace or law, it can't be both. He made it clear there is no righteousness for fallen man in trying to keep the law. But you have it your way, nothing else I can do.

correct.

you either trust Christ 100% for salvation, or you perfectly keep the Law .

their is no 3rd alternative,,,,,,,

 

[Knowledged]

This is the problem: (Peter warned them) As also in all his epistles, speaking in them of things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they are unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the others scriptures, unto their own destruction.
Apostle Paul: But this I confess unto thee, that after the way (the law) which they call heresy, so worship I the God of my father’s believing all things which are written I the law and in the Prophets!

Last Scripture was Acts 24: 14

 

[Phoneman-777]

Can you provide proof of this in scripture, specifically, that the instructions were for missionary work and not for the church at large?

The proof is right there in Scripture: the instructions were for those in Jerusalem alone and Paul's letters to Gentile churches no where contain such instructions. Did not Paul say he became a Jew to win Jews and a gentile to win gentiles?
However, all through his letters we find the Ten Commandments, either all or in part, expressed as Christian duty.

We're pitting Paul's words in one portion against his words in another portion.

I don't think we are. Paul's revelation to us that "circumcision is nothing. Uncircumcision is nothing, but keeping the commandments of God" is what counts. See, the context is comparing the Mosaic Law with the Moral Law God wrote with His finger in stone.

 

[Phoneman-777]

Hebrews 4:9-10
9 There remaineth therefore a rest to the people of God.

10 For he that is entered into his rest, he also hath ceased from his own works, as God did from his.


Did God rest every 7th day? Nope. Just the once was enough.

So then HOW does a person rest when they are working at the Law? Its a complete CONTRADICTION of scripture, isn't it?


Matthew 11:28 Come unto me, all ye that labour and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.

Does the Lord only give this rest on saturdays as well? How is what the Lord gives in Matthew 11:28 related to Hebrews 4???


I don't expect someone who enjoys contradicting scripture to get it. But others reading certainly will.

You are to rest every seventh day from your work "as God did from His". What kind of work did God rest from, spiritual or literal? Obviously literal, so unless you're literally resting from work on Sabbath, you are guilty of breaking the 4th commandment and are just as much in trouble with God as if you refused to keep "thou shalt not steal" or "thou shalt have no other gods before Me".

 

[Knowledged]

correct.

you either trust Christ 100% for salvation, or you perfectly keep the Law .

their is no 3rd alternative,,,,,,,

This is in red: Christ speaking
Matt. 19:16 And behold, one came and said unto him, Good Master, what good thing shallI do, that I may have eternal life? Why Callisto thou me good? there is none good but one, that is God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments .

so one came to Christ and said good master (Rabbi) what should he do to enter into the kingdom of heaven
Christ gave reverence to the Father only God is good, but if you want to enter into the Kingdom of heaven keep the commandments.

please send that scripture that says you either trust Christ 100%for salvation, or you perfectly keep the law

 

[Knowledged]

This is in red: Christ speaking
Matt. 19:16 And behold, one came and said unto him, Good Master, what good thing shallI do, that I may have eternal life? Why Callisto thou me good? there is none good but one, that is God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments .

so one came to Christ and said good master (Rabbi) what should he do to enter into the kingdom of heaven
Christ gave reverence to the Father only God is good, but if you want to enter into the Kingdom of heaven keep the commandments.

please send that scripture that says you either trust Christ 100%for salvation, or you perfectly keep the law

1Peter 4:11 if any man speak, let him speak as the oracles of God (answer with a Scripture)

 

[gb9]

This is in red: Christ speaking
Matt. 19:16 And behold, one came and said unto him, Good Master, what good thing shallI do, that I may have eternal life? Why Callisto thou me good? there is none good but one, that is God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments .

so one came to Christ and said good master (Rabbi) what should he do to enter into the kingdom of heaven
Christ gave reverence to the Father only God is good, but if you want to enter into the Kingdom of heaven keep the commandments.

please send that scripture that says you either trust Christ 100%for salvation, or you perfectly keep the law

Jesus had not yet gone to the cross when He made this statement.

Jesus, a jewish man born under the Law, said this to another jewish man, born under the Law.

 

[Knowledged]

last book in the New Testament: Rev. 22:14 Bless are they that do His commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into city. ( That the only way you can walk through those gates because the LORD has spoken it!)

 

[Knowledged]

Jesus had not yet gone to the cross when He made this statement.

Jesus, a jewish man born under the Law, said this to another jewish man, born under the Law.

Deu 4:44 And this is the law which Moses set before the children of Israel ( Moses gave Israel the law)

John 15:10 if ye love me keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have my Father’s commandment, and abide in his love. (Christ kept and taught the law)

you say he took them back when he died

Hebrews 10:16 This is the covenant that I will make with them after those day, saith the Lord, I will put my laws into their hearts, and in their minds will I write th‘em; (only to give them back to those who make the Kingdom)
1 Corinthians 14:33 For God is not the author of confusion
Its been fun lol!

 

[Phoneman-777]

Hebrews 4:8–10 (NKJV): 8 For if Joshua had given them rest, then He would not afterward have spoken of another day. 9 There remains therefore a rest for the people of God. 10 For he who has entered His rest has himself also ceased from his works as God did from His.

why do people want Gods children to go back to work?

Legalism: attempting to perform obedience motivated by an effort to earn salvation -- which is both impossible and useless because the lost can't obey even if they wanted to (Romans 8:7 KJV) and even perfectly flawless obedience is "unprofitable" (Luke 17:10 KJV).​

​

Reasonable Service: Obedience motivated by eternal gratitude toward God Who died to save us and now sits enthroned on our heart enabling us by His indwelling power to perform it.​

​

Hebrews 4:9-10 KJV says the saved are to rest on Sabbath "as God did" to demonstrate their rest in Jesus as part of their reasonable service. Why do so many professing Christians insist that our rest in Jesus is demonstrated by working on Sabbath?

 

[Everlasting-Grace]

Legalism: attempting to perform obedience motivated by an effort to earn salvation -- which is both impossible and useless because the lost can't obey even if they wanted to (Romans 8:7 KJV) and even perfectly flawless obedience is "unprofitable" (Luke 17:10 KJV).​

​

Reasonable Service: Obedience motivated by eternal gratitude toward God Who died to save us and now sits enthroned on our heart enabling us by His indwelling power to perform it.​

​

Hebrews 4:9-10 KJV says the saved are to rest on Sabbath "as God did" to demonstrate their rest in Jesus as part of their reasonable service. Why do so many professing Christians insist that our rest in Jesus is demonstrated by working on Sabbath?

Hebrews 4 is speaking about the eternal rest. Not the rest on a particular day. It is talking abut resting from trying to obey the law. Which is ceasing from your work.

 

[Phoneman-777]

Hebrews 4 is speaking about the eternal rest. Not the rest on a particular day. It is talking abut resting from trying to obey the law. Which is ceasing from your work.

Well, that's not the whole of it: When you get down to verses 9-10, it talks about the grace-saved, blood-washed, born-again, spiritually alive "people of God".

And, what does it say concerning these "people of God"?

"It is therefore the duty of the people of God to keep the Sabbath. For he that hath entered into His rest, he hath ceased from his own works, as God did from His." - Lamsa's Peshitta​

​

Question: Do you have something against the "reasonable service" of Christian duty, among which is keeping the Fourth Commandment of the Ten Commandments not one of which any sane person will argue we may freely break?

 

[Everlasting-Grace]

Well, that's not the whole of it: When you get down to verses 9-10, it talks about the grace-saved, blood-washed, born-again, spiritually alive "people of God".

And, what does it say concerning these "people of God"?

"It is therefore the duty of the people of God to keep the Sabbath. For he that hath entered into His rest, he hath ceased from his own works, as God did from His." - Lamsa's Peshitta​

​

Question: Do you have something against the "reasonable service" of Christian duty, among which is keeping the Fourth Commandment of the Ten Commandments not one of which any sane person will argue we may freely break?

Thats not it at all. It says plainly as God rested..

Its not about a certain day. Its about resting from the work of the law

I have nothign against works, I do however have something against improper interpretation.

Question. Do you believe a person can forfiet their salvation?

 

[Knowledged]

Jesus had not yet gone to the cross when He made this statement.

Jesus, a jewish man born under the Law, said this to another jewish man, born under the Law.

So what are you saying after He died he changed his mind
Hebrews 13:8 Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and today, and for ever.