It is FINISHED.

[Lafftur]

Yes, it's me again....

Hello @awelight

They (the Ten Commandments) are the Highest and Holiest Laws of God. The Lord Himself taught them. He compressed them into two commandments:

Mat 22:37 And he said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
Mat 22:38 This is the great and first commandment.
Mat 22:39 And a second like unto it is this, Thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself.
Mat 22:40 On these two commandments the whole law is hanging, and the prophets.

The Law of Grace does not replace these two - Indeed, these two are the cornerstone of Grace.

If one says he believes in Jesus Christ but does not love God with all his heart, soul and mind - then that one is a liar and the Truth is not in him. If one says he believes in Jesus Christ and hates his neighbor - then the Truth is not in this one. If either of these two failures, are the norm for that person, then I doubt this person really knows the Jesus Christ of Holy Scripture.

Yes, the Law of Grace DOES replace those two and EVERY LAW that God required for SALVATION. Jesus Christ FULFILLED even the two greatest commandments that the whole law and the prophets hang on...... He did it ALL for us!

1 John 4:9-11

King James Version

9 In this was manifested the love of God toward us, because that God sent his only begotten Son into the world, that we might live through him.

10 Herein is love, not that we loved God, but that he loved us, and sent his Son to be the propitiation for our sins.

11 Beloved, if God so loved us, we ought also to love one another.

Only AFTER receiving Salvation by believing in Jesus Christ as our ONLY Savior, Lord and King, does the Holy Spirit pour God's Love in our hearts for God, for others and for ourselves. Now, we LOVE God and we love others as we love ourselves in a way that is pleasing in God's sight and lifegiving to others and ourselves.

 

[Lafftur]

Hello @Pilgrimshope

what do you make of all the constant and consistent warnings like this throughout the New Testament ?

“Therefore, brethren, we are debtors, not to the flesh, to live after the flesh. For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die:

but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭8:12-13‬ ‭

what’s he saying there to the church ?

He is saying what Jesus told us, "Deny yourself, take up your cross and follow Me."

Now, WHY did Jesus Christ say that?! Because He LOOOOOVES us! As Children of God, Believers in Christ we will be corrected and chasten by the Lord because He loves us but, NEVER will He take His Gift of Salvation away from us.

Did you notice that it's ONLY through the Spirit that we can mortify the deeds of the body? Only by the Holy Spirit indwelling us do we have power over our flesh. I love the precious Gift of the Holy Spirit!!!!

“This I say then, Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfil the lust of the flesh.

For the flesh lusteth against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh: and these are contrary the one to the other: so that ye cannot do the things that ye would.

Here is a secret for you..... stay humble.

When we get full of pride, we quench and grieve the Holy Spirit and our pride allows our flesh to operate. If we can stay humble, totally dependent on God's Holy Spirit and willing to suffer for righteousness sake then we can mortify the deeds of the body. By so doing, we shine as lights in a very dark world..... stay humble.

Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies, envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.”
‭‭Galatians‬ ‭5:16-17, 19

what’s he saying there to the church ?

Our inheritance in the Kingdom of God is our harvest according to our works, not the works of Christ for Salvation. Our salvation is SECURE IN CHRIST ALONE but, our works have rewards in Heaven and even here now on the Earth... every thought, every word and every deed is a seed... each of us needs to be careful what we're planting because we will reap what we have sown.

I've been known to plant a few weeds from time to time but, I'm learning just like the rest of us, to quickly repent and pull those weeds up by the root!! lol!

“But fornication, and all uncleanness, or covetousness, let it not be once named among you, as becometh saints; neither filthiness, nor foolish talking, nor jesting, which are not convenient: but rather giving of thanks.

Let no man deceive you with vain words: for because of these things cometh the wrath of God upon the children of disobedience. Be not ye therefore partakers with them.”
‭‭Ephesians‬ ‭5:3-4, 6-7‬ ‭KJV‬‬

why is he saying this stuff to the church ?

Why?! Because He LOOOOOOOVES us! Every good Father corrects and instructs His children. Don't hang around a bad crowd - don't follow people. Follow Christ alone.

It's NOT judgment without mercy or damnation. It's LOVE.

 

[Lafftur]

if we’re supposed to understand we’re saved there’s no more to it don’t worry about our actions why is Paul so Consistently reminding the church about their actions and how thier actions are going to Impact whether they experience Gods wrath or inheritance in his kingdom ?

I NEVER said "Don't worry about your actions, I said don't worry about your Salvation IN CHRIST! If a person BELIEVES in Jesus Christ as Savior, Lord and King....they are SAVED. Only God knows the ones that truly BELIEVE and ALL of them are SAVED.

After we are saved, we're newborn babes.... we got to grow up a bit.... it takes time and is a process... but, we're NEVER not God's Child. He loves us always.

it doesn’t seem like we should have to ignore more than half of Paul’s epistles to understand them , but it seems Like if we have to ignore them it’s because we may not understand them.

“For I know nothing by myself; yet am I not hereby justified: but he that judgeth me is the Lord. Therefore judge nothing before the time, until the Lord come, who both will bring to light the hidden things of darkness, and will make manifest the counsels of the hearts: and then shall every man have praise of God.”
‭‭1 Corinthians‬ ‭4:4-5‬ ‭

there’s a place for saying I believe and I’m forgiven but it should Never come at the expense of removing the warnings in the New Testament out how believers live those warnings are there to call Them to true repentance

God loves us, He will correct and chasten us and we will learn obedience by the things we suffer but, NEVER will we lose our Salvation in Christ ALONE.

“The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.”
‭‭2 Peter‬ ‭3:9‬ ‭

as long as we believe we’re immune from judgement well Never allow repentance to become part of our walk.

There's a difference between "correction/chasten" and judgment.... God is our Father, He loves us. It is not His Will to destroy us but, to save us and teach us His ways - the right way....so that we enjoy His blessings and are a blessing to others.

We don't get a FREE Ticket to sin.... If we sin, we will suffer. We will be corrected and chastened just, NEVER abandoned or disowned or orphaned. We are forever His Children. We will repent and He will forgive us.

“in meekness instructing those that oppose themselves; if God peradventure will give them repentance to the acknowledging of the truth;

and that they may recover themselves out of the snare of the devil, who are taken captive by him at his will.”
‭‭2 Timothy‬ ‭2:25


if I tell a thief he’s forgiven already for what he is going to do, it’s not going to stop him from stealing it’s going to make him be more free with it.

No, no, no.... there's always a consequence and a penalty for sin. Jesus Christ paid our eternal death penalty of sin but, consequences are still in effect meaning...we'll suffer and be miserable if we choose to sin and it will cause God sadness because we're missing out on His blessing, He has to correct us instead.... and our sin causes others around us to suffer.... sin is just a big MESS! However, NEVER do we lose God's Gift of Salvation In Christ.

if I tell a thief “your forgiven from all you stole , now go and stop Stealing from people or else you’ll end up In prison “

it’s going to incentivize him to stop stealing and fear what will happen if he doesn’t. He’s going to Know grace because I forgave his sins he’s not going to think I’m a weak fool that approves of theft.

Yes, exactly!

either way he’s been forgiven and learned to repent So in the end when the time comes to take account , he’s going to have the same witness others had some took it and repented , others were told “ repentance has nothing to do with anything your already forgiven ‘“

A true Believer will morn over their sin and repent and receive Jesus Christ as Savior Lord and King. They will be comforted that Jesus Christ has forgiven them and all their sins are washed away in His Blood and God's Righteousness is given them in the Body of Jesus Christ. Hallelujah!

We all Have to answer to the same judge in the end

Yes, we all have to pass through the fire of His judgment..... all our works will be judged.


1 Corinthians 3:11-13

King James Version

11 For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ.

12 Now if any man build upon this foundation gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, stubble;

13 Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is.

 

[FreeGrace2]

Hello @Pilgrimshope



He is saying what Jesus told us, "Deny yourself, take up your cross and follow Me."

Now, WHY did Jesus Christ say that?! Because He LOOOOOVES us! As Children of God, Believers in Christ we will be corrected and chasten by the Lord because He loves us but, NEVER will He take His Gift of Salvation away from us.

Did you notice that it's ONLY through the Spirit that we can mortify the deeds of the body? Only by the Holy Spirit indwelling us do we have power over our flesh. I love the precious Gift of the Holy Spirit!!!!



Here is a secret for you..... stay humble.

When we get full of pride, we quench and grieve the Holy Spirit and our pride allows our flesh to operate. If we can stay humble, totally dependent on God's Holy Spirit and willing to suffer for righteousness sake then we can mortify the deeds of the body. By so doing, we shine as lights in a very dark world..... stay humble.



Our inheritance in the Kingdom of God is our harvest according to our works, not the works of Christ for Salvation. Our salvation is SECURE IN CHRIST ALONE but, our works have rewards in Heaven and even here now on the Earth... every thought, every word and every deed is a seed... each of us needs to be careful what we're planting because we will reap what we have sown.

I've been known to plant a few weeds from time to time but, I'm learning just like the rest of us, to quickly repent and pull those weeds up by the root!! lol!



Why?! Because He LOOOOOOOVES us! Every good Father corrects and instructs His children. Don't hang around a bad crowd - don't follow people. Follow Christ alone.

It's NOT judgment without mercy or damnation. It's LOVE.

Dear lady,

You are one of very few believers who even speak of the fact that believers are capable of grieving/quenching the Holy Spirit. That sure puts a dent into the theology of "Lordship salvation".

I can't blame believers for not understanding the purpose of the indwelling of the Spirit, and the mechanics of how to be filled, which is a direct command. I do blame seminaries for failing to properly teach their students these spiritual dynamics. Most believers think that performing the "spiritual disciplines" is what makes one "spiritual". Not so.

Paul's commands regarding the grieving/quenching of the Spirit are commands to STOP doing it. He wasn't saying "don't start", but to QUIT!!

How often do believers in the pews even hear about any of this? I'm guessing far too few.

Thank you for your very thoughtful post.

 

[BroTan]

I absolutely LOOOVE the Ten Commandments but, they are part of the Law that God gave to Moses. The Apostles understood the Law of GRACE and knew that there was no reason to put any burdens of the Mosiac Law on the new Gentile converts that were saved by grace by faith in Jesus Christ ALONE.

This is the conclusion the Apostles came up with concerning the requirements of the Law for the Gentiles:

Acts 15:22-29

King James Version


22 Then pleased it the apostles and elders with the whole church, to send chosen men of their own company to Antioch with Paul and Barnabas; namely, Judas surnamed Barsabas and Silas, chief men among the brethren:

23 And they wrote letters by them after this manner; The apostles and elders and brethren send greeting unto the brethren which are of the Gentiles in Antioch and Syria and Cilicia.

24 Forasmuch as we have heard, that certain which went out from us have troubled you with words, subverting your souls, saying, Ye must be circumcised, and keep the law: to whom we gave no such commandment:

25 It seemed good unto us, being assembled with one accord, to send chosen men unto you with our beloved Barnabas and Paul,

26 Men that have hazarded their lives for the name of our Lord Jesus Christ.

27 We have sent therefore Judas and Silas, who shall also tell you the same things by mouth.

28 For it seemed good to the Holy Ghost, and to us, to lay upon you no greater burden than these necessary things;

29 That ye abstain from meats offered to idols, and from blood, and from things strangled, and from fornication: from which if ye keep yourselves, ye shall do well. Fare ye well.

(NOTICE - The Apostles and Elders said NOTHING ABOUT KEEPING THE SABBATH)

However, "Keeping the Sabbath" was a righteous work that was recorded in the Body of Jesus Christ for us while He was on the Earth. Jesus kept the Sabbath and He is LORD of the Sabbath and He healed on the Sabbath and told a man to pick up his bed and walk.... on the Sabbath!!!

It's perfectly fine if you want to keep the Sabbath but, DO NOT make it a LAW that one MUST do to be SAVED or keep or maintain their salvation.



Wrong! WE are NOT keeping the Law because it is IMPOSSIBLE for us to do so! Our righteousness and ANY attempts at keeping the Law is filthy rags.

The Lord Our Righteousness! Only IN CHRIST are we righteous because of HIS WORKS, NOT ours! Believing in Jesus Christ as Savior by faith is credited to us as righteousness because we receive His Righteousness.




Wrong again!

It's the people that teach against the Lord's Law of Grace are teaching traditions of men.

(NOTICE - The Apostles and Elders said NOTHING ABOUT KEEPING THE SABBATH)

However, "Keeping the Sabbath" was a righteous work that was recorded in the Body of Jesus Christ for us while He was on the Earth. Jesus kept the Sabbath and He is LORD of the Sabbath and He healed on the Sabbath and told a man to pick up his bed and walk.... on the Sabbath!!!

It's perfectly fine if you want to keep the Sabbath but, DO NOT make it a LAW that one MUST do to be SAVED or keep or maintain their salvation.

The Apostle Paul knew and kept Gods law including the seventh day sabbath. Now lets take a look at; (Acts 13:13-15, 42, 44) (v.13) Now when Paul and his company loosed from Pa’-phus, they came to Per’-ga in Pam-phyl’-I-a: and John departing from them returned to Jerusalem. (v.14) But when they departed from Per’-ga, they came to An’-ti-och in Pi-sid’-I-a, and went into the synagogue on the sabbath day, and sat down. Paul went into the church (synagogue) on the sabbath day the seventh day not the first day (Sunday). (v.15) And after the reading of the law and the prophets the rulers of the synagogue sent unto them, saying, Ye men and brethren, if ye have any word of exhortation for the people, say on. (v.42) And when the Jews were gone out of the synagogue, the Gentiles besought that these words might be preached to them the next sabbath.

The Gentiles didn’t asked Paul to come preach us something different next Sunday. They wanted Paul to preach to them the same thing that he taught the Jews, the next sabbath. Even the Gentiles knew that if they were going to serve the same God that Paul and the Jews (Israelites) served that they would have to serve him on the day that God had set up. (v.42) And the next sabbath day came almost the whole city together to hear the word of God. Not the next Sunday but the next sabbath.

Wrong! WE are NOT keeping the Law because it is IMPOSSIBLE for us to do so! Our righteousness and ANY attempts at keeping the Law is filthy rags.

The Lord Our Righteousness! Only IN CHRIST are we righteous because of HIS WORKS, NOT ours! Believing in Jesus Christ as Savior by faith is credited to us as righteousness because we receive His Righteousness.

Wrong again!

It's the people that teach against the Lord's Law of Grace are teaching traditions of men.

In the following verses Moses is telling the Israelites that God chose them strictly out of His love for them.Deuteronomy (7:7) The LORD did not set his love upon you, nor choose you, because ye were more in number than any people; for ye were the fewest of all people:

(8) But because the LORD loved you, and because he would keep the oath which he had sworn unto your fathers, hath the LORD brought you out with a mighty hand, and redeemed you out of the house of bondmen, from the hand of Pharaoh king of Egypt.

(9) Know therefore that the LORD thy God, he is God, the faithful God, which keepeth covenant and mercy with them that love him and keep his commandments to a thousand generations;

Note in verse (9) Moses states a condition that God requires in order for Him to keep covenant and have mercy. And that is an individual must love God and keep His commandments. The scriptures will show that there is only one way to love God and that is by keeping His commandments.

Note that Jesus states in the following verse that in order to love Him one has to keep His commandments.

John (14:15) If ye love me, keep my commandments.

Jesus further defines the love He requires when He states in the following verse that those who have His commandments and keep them are those that love Him. One does not have to guess at Jesus definition of love He made it clear.

John (14:21) He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself to him.

Jesus also reinforced what was said in Deuteronomy verse (9) by adding that those that love Him will be loved by the Father. How does one love Jesus? by keeping His commandments and Moses said God will keep covenant and have mercy with those who keep His commandments. So therefore by following Jesus one shall receive love from Him as well as mercy from the Father.

Note in these scriptures it did not say those who profess their love for Jesus or those that claim that Jesus knows what in their heart. Jesus made a clear and direct statement if one has His commandments and keeps them they are the ones who love Him. The statement that Jesus made as well as the condition Moses gave in Deuteronomy verse (9) were based on behalf of an individuals actions not their feeling or emotions or conditions. To exhibit love towards Jesus one must engage in a specific action and that action is being obedience to the word of God. And one will see that they are to be obedient regardless of their feeling or the surrounding circumstances.

Jesus states again in the following verses what is required of an individual to receive His love.

John (15:9) As the Father hath loved me, so have I loved you: continue ye in my love. (10) If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love.

Notice Jesus use the word if ye keep my commandments, so what happen if ye do not keep his commandments. The above verse shows to be loved of Jesus one needs to be obedient. Jesus also states in verse (10) that He was obedient to the Father by keeping His commandments and therefore abides in His love. Now Jesus is the example man is to follow and just as He was obedient to the word of God we have to be obedient to God’s word.

 

[BroTan]

Oh @BroTan, it's the flesh and pride that actually thinks it can KEEP the Law and gets upset when others are falling short of keeping the Law. It's a religious spirit that tries to keep everyone under the law of works.

Jesus Christ has set us free from the Law of Works and has put us under the Law of Grace because no one can keep ALL the Law, God knows this. If we could keep the Law, Jesus would not have had to die for us. Don't you see?

Jesus Christ spoke of TWO Commandments that fulfill ALL the Law and the Prophets.....

1 - LOVE the Lord your God with ALL your heart, soul, mind, body and strength; and
2 - LOVE your neighbor as you love yourself.

IN CHRIST, even these TWO Commandments are fulfilled for us because Jesus Christ obeyed His Father by denying His own will so He could do the Father's Will and no greater love is there than one lay his life down for another....even for his enemies.. while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us.

In your explanation of Love fulfilling the commandments, you NEVER mentioned us having "Love for God." The flesh and pride cannot know or love God.

Jesus Christ has set us free from the Law of Works and has put us under the Law of Grace because no one can keep ALL the Law, God knows this. If we could keep the Law, Jesus would not have had to die for us. Don't you see?

The Laws of works are not talking about the Commandments, but the animal sacrificial law. Paul explained this in; (Hebrews 10: (v.1) For the law (what law, the law of animal sacrifice?) having a shadow of good things to come, and not the very image of the things, can never with those sacrifices which they offered year by year continually make the comers thereunto perfect. (v.9) Then said he, (Jesus) Lo, I come to do thy will, O God. He taketh away the first that he may establish the second. (v.10) By which will we are sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all. 11 And every priest standeth daily ministering and offering oftentimes the same sacrifices, which can never take away sins: 12 but this man, after he had offered one sacrifice for sins for ever, sat down on the right hand of God; 13 from henceforth expecting till his enemies be made his footstool. 14 For by one offering he hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified.

The point that is not understand is that we all have sin, but until Jesus came, there was no way of getting out from under your sins. So God institute a Priesthood and laws that went with the priesthood to control the sinning, and so the Lord use animal Sacrificial laws, even though it could not remove sins.

When Jesus died on the cross that was the end of the first covenant, which consisted of the blood of animals and the keeping of God’s commandments. And his death also brought in the second covenant, which consist of the blood of Jesus and the keeping of God’s commandments.

(v.18) Now where remission of these is, there is no more offering for sin. In other words, no more animals are going to die for your sins. (20) by a new and living way, which he hath consecrated for us, through the veil, that is to say, his flesh; (21) and having an high priest over the house of God; (v.26) For if we sin willfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins.


Now do we understand what’s being said here? If you sin willfully after you have knowledge of what the truth is, no more animals are going to die for you. (v.27) But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries. Now if you are being deceived into believing that once you are under God’s grace you no longer have to keep his commandments, all you have to look forward to is the day of judgement and the lake of fire (fiery indignation).

 

[JeffA]

There is absolutely NO reason that we should not keep the Sabbath.
Likewise, we should not be celebrating the birth (and rebirth) of Mithra.
Nor should we celebrate the Ishtar fertility feast.
We should have distanced ourselves from these long ago.

What do you suppose it does to a child's belief in Jesus when he/she discovers that Santa is not real?
Does the child reason that "I've been lied to about Santa, but the Baby Jesus part is real."
Lot's of sneaky deception going on.

 

[BroTan]

Since human beings are born spiritually dead, there is NO WAY for the "death" in Rom 8:6 to be spiritual death. rather, "to be carnally minded" is to be thinking and functioning from your human (sinful) nature. That dead describes the condition of fellowship when in the carnal state. The believer is out of fellowship, due to the sin. Psa 66:18 says that if we (the believer) consider sin, He (God) will not hear us. That is "death" of fellowship. Just like the prodigal son in Luke 15. Throughout the parable, Jesus described the idiot son as SON. There was ALWAYS relationship. But what was "lost" and "died" was fellowship.

In Jesus' day, if a son did what the prodigal did, it would be seen as the height of offense; like telling ol' dad "I wish you were dead, so I could get my cut, but since you aren't dead yet, just give me my share and I'll split". How's that for offensive behavior?

And when the son repented and confessed (1 John 1:9), how did the father describe the son's state after leaving? "my son was lost, was dead". That's how. Obviously the son didn't die, and certainly did know exactly where he was and knew how to get home.

So "lost" and "dead" here are metaphors for loss of fellowship with the father.


You are confused about how to understand "death" in the Bible. And there is nothing in the verses you quoted that are about the "second death", as you claim.

Yes, the first death is because of sin. When Adam sinned, there were 2 deaths on that day. The literal Hebrew says "dying, you shall die".

The "dying" refers to physical death, which is the aging process, which ultimately always leads to physical death. So, that very day Adam ate of that fruit, he began to age and ultimately died physically. That is the first death. In fact, heb 9:27 says it is appointed for man to die ONCE, and after that, the judgment.

So, what is the second death? Revelation twice describes the lake of fire as the "second death". Since unbelievers are already spiritually dead, it can't refer to spiritual death.

The Bible says that all unbelievers will be resurrected for the GWT judgment. Acts 24:15, John 5:28,29.

This resurrection, unlike that of all believers, will NOT involve a glorified body. So, unbelievers will get one more time in their physical bodies, to attend the GWT judgment.

After the judgment, the unbeliever will be cast into the lake of fire (Rev 20:11-15). That is when their physical body will die AGAIN, or the second death.

So, all believers will die physically just once. But all unbelievers will die twice physically.

You are confused about how to understand "death" in the Bible. And there is nothing in the verses you quoted that are about the "second death", as you claim.

I'm not confuse at you all, just have to study and read more, it's all in the word of God. It's only so much I can teach in one post, but I believe people should ask questions instead of assume anything else.


Paul says in Hebrews 9: 27 And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment:

So let's take a quick look at the Judgement which is the second death in Revelation 20: 11 And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them. 12 And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works. 13 And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works. 14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.

Let's look at that second death again in Revelation 21: I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end. I will give unto him that is athirst of the fountain of the water of life freely. 7 He that overcometh shall inherit all things; and I will be his God, and he shall be my son. 8 But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.

That's all conditions of sins, why? Because it's written in (1John 3:4) Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law. Now we have just read the biblical definition of sin, the transgression (breaking) of the law (commandments.) It doesn’t matter what you or I think sin is, it’s what God says sin is that counts.

 

[JeffA]

The Laws of works are not talking about the Commandments, but the animal sacrificial law. Paul explained this in; (Hebrews 10: (v.1) For the law (what law, the law of animal sacrifice?) having a shadow of good things to come, and not the very image of the things, can never with those sacrifices which they offered year by year continually make the comers thereunto perfect. (v.9) Then said he, (Jesus) Lo, I come to do thy will, O God. He taketh away the first that he may establish the second. (v.10) By which will we are sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all. 11 And every priest standeth daily ministering and offering oftentimes the same sacrifices, which can never take away sins: 12 but this man, after he had offered one sacrifice for sins for ever, sat down on the right hand of God; 13 from henceforth expecting till his enemies be made his footstool. 14 For by one offering he hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified.

The point that is not understand is that we all have sin, but until Jesus came, there was no way of getting out from under your sins. So God institute a Priesthood and laws that went with the priesthood to control the sinning, and so the Lord use animal Sacrificial laws, even though it could not remove sins.

When Jesus died on the cross that was the end of the first covenant, which consisted of the blood of animals and the keeping of God’s commandments. And his death also brought in the second covenant, which consist of the blood of Jesus and the keeping of God’s commandments.

(v.18) Now where remission of these is, there is no more offering for sin. In other words, no more animals are going to die for your sins. (20) by a new and living way, which he hath consecrated for us, through the veil, that is to say, his flesh; (21) and having an high priest over the house of God; (v.26) For if we sin willfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins.


Now do we understand what’s being said here? If you sin willfully after you have knowledge of what the truth is, no more animals are going to die for you. (v.27) But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries. Now if you are being deceived into believing that once you are under God’s grace you no longer have to keep his commandments, all you have to look forward to is the day of judgement and the lake of fire (fiery indignation).

You make some very good points here. Thanks.
I would think that anyone that willfully and repeatedly breaks God's commandments and with no concern of judgement is real danger of losing their salvation. It could be argued that they were not "born again" to begin with.

On another level, it would be very difficult for anyone to live out their life without "willfully" breaking a commandment from time to time. A good amount of repentance would be in order.

It would be impossible for anyone but Jesus to live a sin-free life.

I wrote a song last year about this topic. Just a home recording with the lyrics. I hope it has some meaning to you.

(2) Forgiveness - YouTube

 

[Lafftur]

The Apostle Paul knew and kept Gods law including the seventh day sabbath. Now lets take a look at; (Acts 13:13-15, 42, 44) (v.13) Now when Paul and his company loosed from Pa’-phus, they came to Per’-ga in Pam-phyl’-I-a: and John departing from them returned to Jerusalem. (v.14) But when they departed from Per’-ga, they came to An’-ti-och in Pi-sid’-I-a, and went into the synagogue on the sabbath day, and sat down. Paul went into the church (synagogue) on the sabbath day the seventh day not the first day (Sunday). (v.15) And after the reading of the law and the prophets the rulers of the synagogue sent unto them, saying, Ye men and brethren, if ye have any word of exhortation for the people, say on. (v.42) And when the Jews were gone out of the synagogue, the Gentiles besought that these words might be preached to them the next sabbath.

The Gentiles didn’t asked Paul to come preach us something different next Sunday. They wanted Paul to preach to them the same thing that he taught the Jews, the next sabbath. Even the Gentiles knew that if they were going to serve the same God that Paul and the Jews (Israelites) served that they would have to serve him on the day that God had set up. (v.42) And the next sabbath day came almost the whole city together to hear the word of God. Not the next Sunday but the next sabbath.





In the following verses Moses is telling the Israelites that God chose them strictly out of His love for them.Deuteronomy (7:7) The LORD did not set his love upon you, nor choose you, because ye were more in number than any people; for ye were the fewest of all people:

(8) But because the LORD loved you, and because he would keep the oath which he had sworn unto your fathers, hath the LORD brought you out with a mighty hand, and redeemed you out of the house of bondmen, from the hand of Pharaoh king of Egypt.

(9) Know therefore that the LORD thy God, he is God, the faithful God, which keepeth covenant and mercy with them that love him and keep his commandments to a thousand generations;

Note in verse (9) Moses states a condition that God requires in order for Him to keep covenant and have mercy. And that is an individual must love God and keep His commandments. The scriptures will show that there is only one way to love God and that is by keeping His commandments.

Note that Jesus states in the following verse that in order to love Him one has to keep His commandments.

John (14:15) If ye love me, keep my commandments.

Jesus further defines the love He requires when He states in the following verse that those who have His commandments and keep them are those that love Him. One does not have to guess at Jesus definition of love He made it clear.

John (14:21) He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself to him.

Jesus also reinforced what was said in Deuteronomy verse (9) by adding that those that love Him will be loved by the Father. How does one love Jesus? by keeping His commandments and Moses said God will keep covenant and have mercy with those who keep His commandments. So therefore by following Jesus one shall receive love from Him as well as mercy from the Father.

Note in these scriptures it did not say those who profess their love for Jesus or those that claim that Jesus knows what in their heart. Jesus made a clear and direct statement if one has His commandments and keeps them they are the ones who love Him. The statement that Jesus made as well as the condition Moses gave in Deuteronomy verse (9) were based on behalf of an individuals actions not their feeling or emotions or conditions. To exhibit love towards Jesus one must engage in a specific action and that action is being obedience to the word of God. And one will see that they are to be obedient regardless of their feeling or the surrounding circumstances.

Jesus states again in the following verses what is required of an individual to receive His love.

John (15:9) As the Father hath loved me, so have I loved you: continue ye in my love. (10) If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love.

Notice Jesus use the word if ye keep my commandments, so what happen if ye do not keep his commandments. The above verse shows to be loved of Jesus one needs to be obedient. Jesus also states in verse (10) that He was obedient to the Father by keeping His commandments and therefore abides in His love. Now Jesus is the example man is to follow and just as He was obedient to the word of God we have to be obedient to God’s word.

Everything that Moses stated as a condition as Law (including the Sabbath) has been FULFILLED by Jesus Christ for us. It is the Father's Will that we BELIEVE that the Blood of Jesus Christ takes away all our sins and the Body of Jesus Christ imputes the Righteousness of God in us. We are FOREVER SAVED. Salvation is SECURE in Christ.

I do NOT have to attend church on Saturday to maintain salvation. All the works of the law have been fulfilled.

Now, He wants my First Love... It's absolutely wonderful to abide in the Father's Love and Jesus' Love. Obeying their commandments is not grievous at all..... very lifegiving and full of joy but, I'm not obeying because I'm afraid of losing Salvation, I'm obeying because I absolutely loooooove God...He's sooooo gooooood. Salvation is SECURE IN CHRIST ALONE.

 

[Lafftur]

When Jesus died on the cross that was the end of the first covenant, which consisted of the blood of animals and the keeping of God’s commandments. And his death also brought in the second covenant, which consist of the blood of Jesus and the keeping of God’s commandments.

You got the Second Covenant wrong.... you seem to be forgetting about the BODY of Jesus Christ that is the Human Fulfillment of the Law for us which INCLUDES the SABBATH.

You're making the Second Covenant about the Blood of Jesus and US keeping God's commandments which puts us back UNDER OUR WORKS for Salvation....

Why do you suppose Jesus Christ said, "Eat My Flesh (Body) AND drink My Blood" ?


John 6:51-57

King James Version

51 I am the living bread which came down from heaven: if any man eat of this bread, he shall live for ever: and the bread that I will give is my flesh, which I will give for the life of the world.

52 The Jews therefore strove among themselves, saying, How can this man give us his flesh to eat?

53 Then Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except ye eat the flesh of the Son of man, and drink his blood, ye have no life in you.

54 Whoso eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood, hath eternal life; and I will raise him up at the last day.

55 For my flesh is meat indeed, and my blood is drink indeed.

56 He that eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood, dwelleth in me, and I in him.

57 As the living Father hath sent me, and I live by the Father: so he that eateth me, even he shall live by me.

 

[Lafftur]

You make some very good points here. Thanks.
I would think that anyone that willfully and repeatedly breaks God's commandments and with no concern of judgement is real danger of losing their salvation. It could be argued that they were not "born again" to begin with.

Keep in mind, ONLY God knows the heart... meaning ONLY God will know those that truly BELIEVE in Jesus Christ.

On another level, it would be very difficult for anyone to live out their life without "willfully" breaking a commandment from time to time. A good amount of repentance would be in order.

It would be impossible for anyone but Jesus to live a sin-free life.

I wrote a song last year about this topic. Just a home recording with the lyrics. I hope it has some meaning to you.

(2) Forgiveness - YouTube

I loved your song! You are absolutely correct! You can repent and call on Him (Jesus Christ) when you fall and stumble and He is faithful to forgive you ALWAYS!

 

[Pilgrimshope]

I NEVER said "Don't worry about your actions, I said don't worry about your Salvation IN CHRIST! If a person BELIEVES in Jesus Christ as Savior, Lord and King....they are SAVED. Only God knows the ones that truly BELIEVE and ALL of them are SAVED.

After we are saved, we're newborn babes.... we got to grow up a bit.... it takes time and is a process... but, we're NEVER not God's Child. He loves us always.



God loves us, He will correct and chasten us and we will learn obedience by the things we suffer but, NEVER will we lose our Salvation in Christ ALONE.



There's a difference between "correction/chasten" and judgment.... God is our Father, He loves us. It is not His Will to destroy us but, to save us and teach us His ways - the right way....so that we enjoy His blessings and are a blessing to others.

We don't get a FREE Ticket to sin.... If we sin, we will suffer. We will be corrected and chastened just, NEVER abandoned or disowned or orphaned. We are forever His Children. We will repent and He will forgive us.



No, no, no.... there's always a consequence and a penalty for sin. Jesus Christ paid our eternal death penalty of sin but, consequences are still in effect meaning...we'll suffer and be miserable if we choose to sin and it will cause God sadness because we're missing out on His blessing, He has to correct us instead.... and our sin causes others around us to suffer.... sin is just a big MESS! However, NEVER do we lose God's Gift of Salvation In Christ.



Yes, exactly!



A true Believer will morn over their sin and repent and receive Jesus Christ as Savior Lord and King. They will be comforted that Jesus Christ has forgiven them and all their sins are washed away in His Blood and God's Righteousness is given them in the Body of Jesus Christ. Hallelujah!



Yes, we all have to pass through the fire of His judgment..... all our works will be judged.


1 Corinthians 3:11-13

King James Version

11 For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ.

12 Now if any man build upon this foundation gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, stubble;

13 Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is.

“After we are saved, we're newborn babes.... we got to grow up a bit.... it takes time and is a process... but, we're NEVER not God's Child. He loves us always.”

yeah I think just different language we have now a promise made by Jesus Christ that will Be fulfilled

“And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature. He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.”
‭‭Mark‬ ‭16:15-16‬ ‭KJV‬‬

comes along with this one

“And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of man be lifted up: that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life. For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.”
‭‭John‬ ‭3:14-16‬ ‭KJV‬‬

We should believe this promise , and should fully believe the warnings also and teachings is all I’m saying. Your right there’s a growth process but it’s more like this

“Now ye are clean through the word which I have spoken unto you. Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, except it abide in the vine; no more can ye, except ye abide in me.

I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing.

If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned.

If ye abide in me, and my words abide in you, ye shall ask what ye will, and it shall be done unto you. As the Father hath loved me, so have I loved you: continue ye in my love. If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love.”
‭‭John‬ ‭15:3-7, 9-10‬ ‭

that’s meant to keep Us in line humble us if we need it

“For the earth which drinketh in the rain that cometh oft upon it, and bringeth forth herbs meet for them by whom it is dressed, receiveth blessing from God:

but that which beareth thorns and briers is rejected, and is nigh unto cursing; whose end is to be burned.”
‭‭Hebrews‬ ‭6:7-8‬ ‭

in the end we need to have the
right fruit in our life and be rid of the wrong fruit of the flesh a lot of us never allow that part to happen.


We need to do good not harm, right not wrong , make Peace not arguments , forgive and never hold a grudge , be sharing and giving to those were able
To help being courteous kind sincere honest and faithful kind people.

part of what sets us straight is the fear that comes from the truth about judgement. We all Have to do it

“For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad. Knowing therefore the terror of the Lord, we persuade men; but we are made manifest unto God; and I trust also are made manifest in your consciences.”
‭‭2 Corinthians‬ ‭5:10-11‬ ‭KJV‬‬

We can acknowledge it now and repent or later.

 

[FreeGrace2]

I'm not confuse at you all, just have to study and read more, it's all in the word of God. It's only so much I can teach in one post, but I believe people should ask questions instead of assume anything else.

Why would I ask a question about something that someone is confused about? There's your question, if you were hoping for one.

I was trying to inform you that the word "death" is used 7 different ways in the Bible. You need to understand which one is being referenced when you come to that word.

Paul says in Hebrews 9: 27 And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment:

So let's take a quick look at the Judgement which is the second death in Revelation 20: 11 And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them. 12 And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works. 13 And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works. 14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.

Let's look at that second death again in Revelation 21: I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end. I will give unto him that is athirst of the fountain of the water of life freely. 7 He that overcometh shall inherit all things; and I will be his God, and he shall be my son. 8 But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.

That's all conditions of sins, why? Because it's written in (1John 3:4) Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law. Now we have just read the biblical definition of sin, the transgression (breaking) of the law (commandments.) It doesn’t matter what you or I think sin is, it’s what God says sin is that counts.

Per Heb 9:27 and the lake of fire being called the second death, do you understand WHY it is called the SECOND death?

 

[know1]

I have a question for you? Are you connected to or learning some of things you have said from any "Word of Faith" teachers? Like maybe Kenneth Copeland and others like him? Secondly, Your statement here: "]You don't know if they believed only and neither does the word of God state that."

If your referring to Lafftur quoting Acts 10:43-48 it certainly does say they were saved upon believing. Follow the sequence of events. At Acts 10:43-44 Peter is speaking and the Holy Spirit upon all those who were listening to the message." What message? Read vs43. Then at vs45, "And all the circumcised "BELIEVERS" who had come with Peter were amazed, (Why were they amazed?) BECAUSE THE GIFT OF THE HOLY SPIRIT had been poured out upon the Gentiles ALSO. Also means just like they were saved.

Vs46, verifies them receiving the Holy Spirit because they were hearing them speaking with tongues and "EXALTING" God. I don't know of anybody that exalts or praises God that is not a Chirstian, do you? At vs47, Peter says, "Surely no one can refuse the water for them to be baptized who have received the Holy Spirit just as we did, can he?"

You have here a "model" where they were saved "BEFORE" water baptism. This means that water baptism is not a requirement for salvation like many religions and cults teach. And btw, as a side note, the thief on the cross simply believed and Jesus said he would be with Him "this day" in Paradise. The point is the fact that God knows the heart and you don't know it, I don't and neither does anybody else. PS: Read 1 John 5:11-12.

IN GOD THE SON,
bluto

You are ASSUMING they were saved, because the Spirit of God came on them, but is a person really born again or saved when that happens?
In Matt 10:1, Jesus gave the 12 disciples power to heal the sick, cleanse the lepers, raise the Dead, and cast out devils, by The same Spirit that was in Jesus, which was the Holy Spirit.
Judas Iscariot was one of the 12 whom the Spirit of God came on, giving him power, even as the other disciples had. And yet, we all know where Judas Iscariot went. We all know, he was not born again or saved. And what about the 70 elders the spirit of God came on? They didn't have to do a thing, and yet the Spirit of God came on them as well, even the same Spirit that was on Moses, all because of the promise God gave him.
Paul said, One believes unto righteousness, not unto justification, but unto righteousness, which is what they did. The reason why Peter immediately wanted them baptized in water, even as John the Baptist baptized people in water for the remission of sins, was to get them to repent and verbally confess their sins. Even as Jesus commanded the disciples to, baptize them in the name of the father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost, for the remission of sins.
And in so doing, they would not only repent of their sins, but would also verbally confess Jesus as their lord and savior, thereby doing a corresponding work to what they believed in their heart.
A person believes unto righteousness, but the corresponding work is unto justification, even as James stated of Abraham in chapter 2 verses 21 through 24.
James States that Abraham believed God and it was imputed to him for righteousness, but it wasn't FULFILLED UNTIL AFTER he offered Isaac up on the altar to be the sacrificial lamb, a type of, or symbolic of Jesus.
At the same time, I would like to clarify the words, works, good works, and acts of faith.
They're obviously is more than one kind of works.
The works Paul is speaking of is works you can achieve without God. Such as, giving to the poor, tithing, praying, and the like. Those are righteous works and morally good, but it is not the same kind of saving works James is speaking of. For Paul says we are not saved by works, yet James says the contrary, that being, without works, rather, a corresponding work, we are not saved.
The works James speaks of is, first of all, specific. It is a single act spoken or acted upon that corresponds with the person's faith.
So the main point I would like to bring up is, you can't have part of God's word saying, believe only, and the other part saying, you must have a corresponding work. It is either one or the other. And if you say it is to believe only then that would negate or make obsolete, everything Paul said, James said, and what Jesus said.

 

[know1]

The second thing James' works speak of, is the kind that only God can perform. Such as, healings, deliverances, salvation, and the like.
Paul speaks of, works of the law, where James speaks of, works of faith.
One work you can do without God's help, and the other, you cannot.

 

[Beckie]

While reading the Bible, I simply asked the Holy Spirit why did Jesus meet with Moses and Elijah? Why not Abraham and King David?

@Beckie

Pride is easily offended and will reject Truth but, humility will not take offense and will seek Truth. Don't let Pride block you from receiving understanding of His Word from the Holy Spirit.

God is no respecter of any person. It rains on the just and the unjust.

To understand scripture all we need to do is humble ourselves, pick up our Bible, open it up, read It and ask the Holy Spirit to give us understanding.... ask the Holy Spirit questions.... listen, we will hear Him speak to us in our thoughts - we'll be amazed at all the wonderful Truths He will show us!!!

The Holy Spirit is ALWAYS present with the Word of God - people just ignore Him, neglect Him or quench and grieve Him or are not aware that He is ALWAYS present - on EVERY page of the Bible ready to give understanding to those that ask Him questions with just a simple open heart desiring to know God and understand His Word.

Meditate on Psalm 23..... The Lord is my Shepherd..... ask the Holy Spirit why did David call God his Shepherd? The Holy Spirit will answer you!! Enjoy!!!

2Pe 1:20 Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation.

 

[Lafftur]

2Pe 1:20 Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation.

Correct! It’s the Holy Spirit’s interpretation of scripture.

For what man knoweth the things of a man, save the spirit of man which is in him? even so the things of God knoweth no man, but the Spirit of God. Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the spirit which is of God; that we might know the things that are freely given to us of God.
1 Corinthians 2:11-12 - https://www.biblegateway.com/passage?search=1 Corinthians 2:11-12&version=KJV

 

[awelight]

Hello @awelight



Go back, read the scripture again concerning the Mount of Transfiguration.... ask the Holy Spirit for understanding.

Jesus Christ was not being examined as The Word of God, He was being examined as THE LAMB OF GOD and THE MESSIAH - THE CHRIST, The Anointed One..... Shiloh.


Genesis 49:9-11

King James Version

9 Judah is a lion's whelp: from the prey, my son, thou art gone up: he stooped down, he couched as a lion, and as an old lion; who shall rouse him up?

10 The sceptre shall not depart from Judah, nor a lawgiver from between his feet, until Shiloh come; and unto him shall the gathering of the people be.

11 Binding his foal unto the vine, and his ass's colt unto the choice vine; he washed his garments in wine, and his clothes in the blood of grapes:


All the "works/acts" that Jesus Christ literally performed and did... day in and day out were recorded in His physical body.... He fulfilled ALL the WORKS/ACTS that God required from us for Salvation and all that the Prophets had written concerning Him.

God had prepared Himself a Body.... The Lamb of God....


Hebrews 10:1-17

King James Version

1 For the law having a shadow of good things to come, and not the very image of the things, can never with those sacrifices which they offered year by year continually make the comers thereunto perfect.

2 For then would they not have ceased to be offered? because that the worshippers once purged should have had no more conscience of sins.

3 But in those sacrifices there is a remembrance again made of sins every year.

4 For it is not possible that the blood of bulls and of goats should take away sins.

5 Wherefore when he cometh into the world, he saith, Sacrifice and offering thou wouldest not, but a body hast thou prepared me:

6 In burnt offerings and sacrifices for sin thou hast had no pleasure.

7 Then said I, Lo, I come (in the volume of the book it is written of me,) to do thy will, O God.

8 Above when he said, Sacrifice and offering and burnt offerings and offering for sin thou wouldest not, neither hadst pleasure therein; which are offered by the law;

9 Then said he, Lo, I come to do thy will, O God. He taketh away the first, that he may establish the second.

10 By the which will we are sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all.

11 And every priest standeth daily ministering and offering oftentimes the same sacrifices, which can never take away sins:

12 But this man, after he had offered one sacrifice for sins for ever, sat down on the right hand of God;

13 From henceforth expecting till his enemies be made his footstool.

14 For by one offering he hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified.

15 Whereof the Holy Ghost also is a witness to us: for after that he had said before,

16 This is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, saith the Lord, I will put my laws into their hearts, and in their minds will I write them;

17 And their sins and iniquities will I remember no more.

Jesus Christ was examined by the Law and the Prophets and His Body was transfigured by becoming full of light... His Body was the Perfect Lamb of God with no blemish, spot or wrinkle. He had fulfilled ALL Righteousness FOR US!




No, Moses and Elijah were NOT in their glorified bodies yet. No one had their glorified physical bodies until Jesus Christ rose from the dead. Jesus had not yet been crucified.

The scriptures say NOTHING of Moses and Elijah being in glorified bodies.... just that they appeared and talked with Jesus Christ... ONLY Jesus Christ's face and clothing became full of light.


Matthew 17:1-9

King James Version

1 And after six days Jesus taketh Peter, James, and John his brother, and bringeth them up into an high mountain apart,

2 And was transfigured before them: and his face did shine as the sun, and his raiment was white as the light.

3 And, behold, there appeared unto them Moses and Elias talking with him.

4 Then answered Peter, and said unto Jesus, Lord, it is good for us to be here: if thou wilt, let us make here three tabernacles; one for thee, and one for Moses, and one for Elias.

5 While he yet spake, behold, a bright cloud overshadowed them: and behold a voice out of the cloud, which said, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased; hear ye him.

6 And when the disciples heard it, they fell on their face, and were sore afraid.

7 And Jesus came and touched them, and said, Arise, and be not afraid.

8 And when they had lifted up their eyes, they saw no man, save Jesus only.

9 And as they came down from the mountain, Jesus charged them, saying, Tell the vision to no man, until the Son of man be risen again from the dead.

I appreciate your reply but have a couple of corrections to what you said about my post.

In Matthew 17:1-9, you don't get the whole story. This is why one must study all of the four Gospel writers and compare one to the other. Let's look at Luke's account:

Luke 9:29 And as he was praying, the fashion of his countenance was altered, and his raiment became white and dazzling.
Luke 9:30 And behold, there talked with him two men, who were Moses and Elijah;

This portion Matthew included in his account, in verses: 2 &3. However, Matthew did not record the following in his account.

Luke 9:31 who appeared in glory, and spoke of his decease which he was about to accomplish at Jerusalem.

Therefore, if we put verses: 30 & 31 together we have:

Luke 9:30, 31 And behold, there talked with him two men, who were Moses and Elijah; who appeared in glory, and spoke of his decease which he was about to accomplish at Jerusalem.

To most Christians, this would seem to be a problem. After all - as you pointed out - Christ had not yet died or Resurrected. This seeming contradiction, goes away, when one has the proper understanding of Eternity and Time. A very, very deep subject of the Scriptures.



By the way - Antinomianism means: Without Law.



In the discussion, about the Ten Commandments, you did not comment on part of my post. The part where I said: The Lord condensed the Ten Commandments into two. So I will post it again for you:

Mat 22:37 And he said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
Mat 22:38 This is the great and first commandment.
Mat 22:39 And a second like unto it is this, Thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself.
Mat 22:40 On these two commandments the whole law hangs, and the prophets.

Matthew 22:37 - Covers the first four Commandments and Matthew 22:39 - Covers the last six Commandments. Jesus Christ fulfilled all aspects of the Law - This is very true. We are no longer under the Mosaic Law and have no further need of the Ceremonial Laws.

BUT, These two Commandments, given by our Lord, will remain for an Eternity. Why? Because they declare the Righteousness of God. We cannot perfectly keep them and they cannot save anyone of us. However, they are constant reminders of what God expects from His people.

 

[BroTan]

Why would I ask a question about something that someone is confused about? There's your question, if you were hoping for one.

I was trying to inform you that the word "death" is used 7 different ways in the Bible. You need to understand which one is being referenced when you come to that word.


Per Heb 9:27 and the lake of fire being called the second death, do you understand WHY it is called the SECOND death?

Peace in the mighty name of Jesus, I'm going to jump out of this conversation for peace.