And the SMOKE of their torment...No eternal damnation for anyone, except the Devil
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For you it seems to be quite difficult. You love it when the Bible talks about everlasting life and the everlasting kingdom. Those must be literally everlasting! 
But when the Bible talks about everlasting destruction or death those aren’t literal to you. That’s because you can’t accept the unsaved are eternally destroyed…
Like you said: not very difficult to understand.
Now understand this:
2 Thessalonians 1:9
They will be punished with everlasting destruction and shut out from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of his might
Destroyed forever.
But when the Bible talks about everlasting destruction or death those aren’t literal to you. That’s because you can’t accept the unsaved are eternally destroyed…
Like you said: not very difficult to understand.
Now understand this:
2 Thessalonians 1:9
They will be punished with everlasting destruction and shut out from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of his might
Destroyed forever.
Matthew 25:46 says only the sheep get eternal life which means the goats don’t live forever to experience eternal torment. That’s why I know the “everlasting punishment” is death. They’ll be deader than a door nail.
You said this:
“Everlasting punishment is being tormented day and night for ever and ever in the Lake of Fire. It's sort of like... everlasting.”
The Bible doesn’t say that anywhere. Can you show me where the “everlasting punishment” for all of the unsaved is being tormented day and night forever?
You said this:
“Everlasting punishment is being tormented day and night for ever and ever in the Lake of Fire. It's sort of like... everlasting.”
The Bible doesn’t say that anywhere. Can you show me where the “everlasting punishment” for all of the unsaved is being tormented day and night forever?
You don’t need to repost it, but I stand by that post in full confidence.
I don’t know why you’re condemning me for him calling me a crying drunk or saying that I need to join up with atheists. Unbelievable.
Isaiah 5:20
Woe to those who call evil good and good evil, who put darkness for light and light for darkness, who put bitter for sweet and sweet for bitterness
I don’t know why you’re condemning me for him calling me a crying drunk or saying that I need to join up with atheists. Unbelievable.
Isaiah 5:20
Woe to those who call evil good and good evil, who put darkness for light and light for darkness, who put bitter for sweet and sweet for bitterness
Really? I've ASKED you for your evidence of your claims, and you won't provide any. So we know that you have no evidence. That makes YOU the LIAR.
The context was real clear. Your views about ceasing to exist line up with what atheists believe. So your views are LIKE theirs. That is obviously what I meant.
How is this of lie of mine. I never wrote that dictionary. In fact, I EXPLAINED what I meant. Too bad you either don't read my responses to you, or you did and you just keep LYING.
In fact, I NEVER said anything about being drunk. The definition I provided from the net was about being hyper-emotional or hyper-sensitive. Too bad you seem uninterested in my responses, and you just fire off your wildly incorrect claims.
The context was real clear. Your views about ceasing to exist line up with what atheists believe. So your views are LIKE theirs. That is obviously what I meant.
How is this of lie of mine. I never wrote that dictionary. In fact, I EXPLAINED what I meant. Too bad you either don't read my responses to you, or you did and you just keep LYING.
In fact, I NEVER said anything about being drunk. The definition I provided from the net was about being hyper-emotional or hyper-sensitive. Too bad you seem uninterested in my responses, and you just fire off your wildly incorrect claims.
That is a reference to the Lake of Fire in Revelation 20, and Matthew 25:46 makes it double-clear that this punishment is everlasting. It is obvious that you are set to reject this truth in spite of clear Biblical statements on the matter. I feel like I and talking to a concrete wall. I will leave you to your own devices then.
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Why do you ignore the FACT that the unbeliever's body will be resurrected mortally, only to DIE AGAIN? That is what the second death refers to.
But since you insist otherwise, when did the souls of unbelievers die the FIRST TIME, since you obviously think so?
For those who aren't getting this, in order to die a SECOND DEATH, requires a FIRST DEATH. So, when does the soul of unbelievers die the first time? And give Scriptural proof of that, please.
Nope. Rev 20:10 will apply to everyone who is cast into the LOF. If the GWT crowd gets treated differently than the beast and FP, where is the evidence for that? You don't have any proof.
What you have is presumption only. That's no way to study the Bible.
But since you insist otherwise, when did the souls of unbelievers die the FIRST TIME, since you obviously think so?
For those who aren't getting this, in order to die a SECOND DEATH, requires a FIRST DEATH. So, when does the soul of unbelievers die the first time? And give Scriptural proof of that, please.
Nope. Rev 20:10 will apply to everyone who is cast into the LOF. If the GWT crowd gets treated differently than the beast and FP, where is the evidence for that? You don't have any proof.
What you have is presumption only. That's no way to study the Bible.
Prove that God will destroy souls. With Scripture that says He will do this. All you have is your PRESUMPTION that "abe to" and "will" are the same thing, which they most certainly are not.
Very good. You know some verses that speak to the destruction of the resurrected bodies of unbelievers.
Here is proof that unbelievers will be resurrected in their mortal bodies:
Dan 12:2 - Multitudes who sleep in the dust of the earth will awake: some to everlasting life, others to shame and everlasting contempt.
John 5:28,29
28 “Do not be amazed at this, for a time is coming when all who are in their graves will hear his voice
29 and come out—those who have done what is good will rise to live, and those who have done what is evil will rise to be condemned.
Acts 24:15 -
and I have the same hope in God as these men themselves have, that there will be a resurrection of both the righteous and the wicked.
This is why there will be a SECOND DEATH of the unbelievers, and why the LOF is also called the second death. Their mortal bodies will die again.
Very good. You know some verses that speak to the destruction of the resurrected bodies of unbelievers.
Here is proof that unbelievers will be resurrected in their mortal bodies:
Dan 12:2 - Multitudes who sleep in the dust of the earth will awake: some to everlasting life, others to shame and everlasting contempt.
John 5:28,29
28 “Do not be amazed at this, for a time is coming when all who are in their graves will hear his voice
29 and come out—those who have done what is good will rise to live, and those who have done what is evil will rise to be condemned.
Acts 24:15 -
and I have the same hope in God as these men themselves have, that there will be a resurrection of both the righteous and the wicked.
This is why there will be a SECOND DEATH of the unbelievers, and why the LOF is also called the second death. Their mortal bodies will die again.
oyster67 said:
Everlasting punishment is being tormented day and night for ever and ever in the Lake of Fire. It's sort of like... everlasting.
Keep rejecting Rev 20:10, which involves the first 2 unbelievers who will be cast into the LOF and the verse is very clear about how long they will be tormented. So, yes, there is a SINGLE VERSE that does say that, and it clearly involves human beings.
What you can't prove is your claim that none of the crowd at the GWT judgment will get a different result from being thrown into the LOF.
The resurrected yet mortal bodies of the unbelievers.
No, death means exactly what it is describing, and in every case, it is the body that will die. And those who will be cast into the LOF will actually and literally DIE AGAIN, hence, the SECOND DEATH.
You are clearly kicking against the goads here.
Your hyper-sensitive and hyper-emotional sentiments just keep getting in the way.
Everlasting punishment is being tormented day and night for ever and ever in the Lake of Fire. It's sort of like... everlasting.
Keep rejecting Rev 20:10, which involves the first 2 unbelievers who will be cast into the LOF and the verse is very clear about how long they will be tormented. So, yes, there is a SINGLE VERSE that does say that, and it clearly involves human beings.
What you can't prove is your claim that none of the crowd at the GWT judgment will get a different result from being thrown into the LOF.
The resurrected yet mortal bodies of the unbelievers.
No, death means exactly what it is describing, and in every case, it is the body that will die. And those who will be cast into the LOF will actually and literally DIE AGAIN, hence, the SECOND DEATH.
You are clearly kicking against the goads here.
Your hyper-sensitive and hyper-emotional sentiments just keep getting in the way.
This was the one I wanted taken taken down, not that one. ANYWAY, good thing that one was because I think that 'timing' is correct and so I THANK YOU for that verse. I don't know if that was the outcome you were thinking but I am thinking it was because it came so fast and easy. AGAIN, Thanks for the bump.
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Lucy-Pevensie said:
Yes, everlasting. Not very difficult to understand is it?
Yet she made it very clear that, to her, it is "not very difficult to understand". And you challenge her own statement that ONLY SHE is authorized to make about her own understanding.
Do you think you are god, or something? Get real. You're really off the edge here.
Why wouldn't she. And when the Bible talks about everlasting punishment, we believe it.
They SURE ARE literal. But they refer to the BODY of the unsaved. The resurrected but mortal bodies.
We don't think so. It's very obvious, in fact.
The resurrected bodies of unbelievers, obviously.
btw, there are believers who died so violently that the bodies were utterly destroyed. Yet, God will resurrect them back to perfect shape in the resurrection. So the life of the physical body is said to have eterlasting life.
Yes, everlasting. Not very difficult to understand is it?
Yet she made it very clear that, to her, it is "not very difficult to understand". And you challenge her own statement that ONLY SHE is authorized to make about her own understanding.
Do you think you are god, or something? Get real. You're really off the edge here.
You love it when the Bible talks about everlasting life and the everlasting kingdom. Those must be literally everlasting!
But when the Bible talks about everlasting destruction or death those aren’t literal to you. That’s because you can’t accept the unsaved are eternally destroyed…
We don't think so. It's very obvious, in fact.
The resurrected bodies of unbelievers, obviously.
btw, there are believers who died so violently that the bodies were utterly destroyed. Yet, God will resurrect them back to perfect shape in the resurrection. So the life of the physical body is said to have eterlasting life.
