What does born again mean?

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Locoponydirtman

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Baptism is accomplished by God’s sanctifying and justifying grace, but thru man who is the instrument Jn 3:22

Ez 36:25-27
25 Then will I sprinkle clean water upon you, and ye shall be clean: from all your filthiness, and from all your idols, will I cleanse you.
26 A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh.
27 And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them.
Thanks
Agreed.
 

ForestGreenCook

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Jul 8, 2018
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Romans 1:20
“For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:”

This scripture has reference to disobedient children of God, who hold the truth in unrighteousness.

The natural man, before he has been born spiritually, cannot hold back spiritual truths that he never had, thinking them to be foolishness.

Even though when we are born again spiritually, we still carry the burden of our fleshly nature that we do yield our bodies to, at times.

I have heard the expression that the born again child of God, when he is walking in the Spirit, is a very loving and caring person, but when he is walking in the flesh, is as filthy as the unregenerate.
 

ForestGreenCook

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Jul 8, 2018
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Romans 1:20
“For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:”

The atheist does not believe in the creation of God.
 

Dino246

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Jun 30, 2015
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Please explain how? Thanks
Mary ceased to be a virgin when Joseph had relations with her, following Jesus' birth.

Matthew 1:25 But he did not consummate their marriage until she gave birth to a son.

The implication is crystal-clear. Mary was no longer a virgin.
 
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While Jesus is alive He's teaching & promoting OT Mosaic law. The new covenant/testament doesn't begin until the death of the testor (Heb 9:16-17)

Regeneration - Vine's Expository Dictionary of New Testament Words: Regeneration

[ 1,,G3824, palingenesia ]
new birth" (palin, "again," genesis, "birth"), is used of "spiritual regeneration," Titus 3:5, involving the communication of a new life,

Strong's Concordance (G3824) paliggenesia: regeneration, renewal
3824 /paliggenesía ("renewal, rebirth") is used twice in the NT referring to: a) the re-birth of physical creation at Christ's return (Advent), which inaugurates His millennial kingdom (Mt 19:28; cf. Ro 8:18-25); and b) the re-birth all believers experience at conversion (Tit 3:5).
https://biblehub.com/greek/3824.htm

ephfourfive, Your posted/personal definition of regeneration. Tying the spiritual baptism phenomenon to water is flawed & incorrect.

Matt 3:11 I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance: but he that cometh after me is mightier than I, whose shoes I am not worthy to bear: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost, and with fire:
(MY NOTE: John the Baptist made clear that "Christ alone" would/could baptize with the Holy Spirit)


1 Cor 12:13 For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.
(MY NOTE: Translators capitalized Spirit to identify when referring the Holy Spirit. "Only Christ" can baptize with His eternally indwelling Holy Spirit.)


Col 2:11 In whom also ye are circumcised with the circumcision made without hands, in putting off the body of the sins of the flesh by the circumcision of Christ:
(MY NOTE: The baptism of the Holy Spirit is a SPIRITUAL circumcision/covenant. Done "WITHOUT hands" & without water)

Deut 30:6 (A) the Lord thy God will circumcise thine heart,

Emblem: a symbolic representation of a particular quality or concept.

Water baptism is an emblem of the true spiritual baptism/circumcision. Preformed only by Christ & without hands.

It's an outwardly public profession of being dead with Christ, and of being raised together with him in new resurrection life.

Living water verses: (Jn 4:10, 6:35, 7:37-39, Jer 17:13, Ps 36:7-9)

Jn 7:37 In the last day, that great day of the feast, Jesus stood and cried, saying, If any man thirst, let him come unto me, and drink.
(MY NOTE: Day 8, Feast of Tabernacles)

Jn 6:35 And Jesus said unto them, I am the bread of life: he that cometh to me shall never hunger; and he that believeth on me shall never thirst.

Jn 4:10 Jesus answered and said unto her, If thou knewest the gift of God, and who it is that saith to thee, Give me to drink; thou wouldest have asked of him, and he would have given thee living water.
(MY NOTE: All the Samaritan woman had to do was believe & ASK. All anyone need do, is BELIEVE & ASK!)

John 7:
37 In the last day, that great day of the feast, Jesus stood and cried, saying, If any man thirst, let him come unto me, and drink.

38 He that believeth on me, as the scripture hath said, out of his belly shall flow rivers of living water

39 But this spake he of the Spirit, which they that believe on him should receive: for the Holy Ghost was not yet given; because that Jesus was not yet glorified.
(MY NOTE: The true regeneration giving Living Water is Christ's salvation/sealing, eternal life giving, indwelling Holy Spirit. The invitation to drink of His Living Water/Holy Spirit is still open.

Rev 22:17 (B) let him that heareth; come. And let him that is athirst come. And whosoever will, let him take the water of life freely.

After salvation/Christ's eternally sealing spiritual baptism gift. His indwelling Holy Spirit (Matt 3:11, Acts 1:5)

There are two NT Commandments & two Ordinance the Lord invoked.

Love God 1st & love your brother believer. Publicly partake in water baptism & the Lords Supper.

Finally:
Find here the transformation from OT law (Jews only, no gentiles) to the NT, where the two (Jew & gentile) being made one (Eph 2:12-22)

Acts 10:44 While Peter yet spake these words, the Holy Spirit fell on all them which heard the word.
(MY NOTE: They Believed (vs43) & as Peter spoke (vs44) The Holy Spirit fell on then. No REPENTANCE of anykind here, No water baptism, No circumcision, they brought no sin sacrifice to the Temple, No law keeping etc)

Thru Faith & faith alone these gentiles were given/received the baptism OF & were eternally sealed BY Christ's indwelling Holy Spirit (vs45)

Acts 11:18 When they heard these things, they held their peace, and glorified God, saying, Then hath God also to the Gentiles granted repentance unto life
(MY NOTE: God GRANTED the gentiles repentance. Any person that believes they can conquer their sin nature (without Gods help) is mistaken 1 Jn 1:8) Best wishes, JJ
Sacred scripture:
Jn 3:5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.

Jn 3:5 Protestant version: Jesus answered, verily, verily, I say to thee, except a man be born of water; and then born again by the spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.

Protestant version refuted by
Jn 3:22 After these things came Jesus and his disciples into the land of Judaea; and there he tarried with them, and baptized. (They did not preach “faith alone” or “spiritual baptism”)

Acts 8:36-38 faith and baptism not faith alone or spiritual baptism and if the apostles preached faith alone how does the eunuch know about and ask for baptism? Thanks
 
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Mary ceased to be a virgin when Joseph had relations with her, following Jesus' birth.

Matthew 1:25 But he did not consummate their marriage until she gave birth to a son.

The implication is crystal-clear. Mary was no longer a virgin.
No way;
Matt 1:25 He knew her not till she had brought forth her firstborn son: and he called his name Jesus.

2 Samuel 6:23 tells us: Therefore Michal the daughter of Saul had no child UNTIL the day of her death.

Are we to assume that Michal had children after she died?

Until only states that they had no relation up to that point, the Bible does not say they had sex ever, before or after that point!

Lk 1:34 no sex ever!

Ezekiel 44:2 “This gate shall remain shut; it shall not be opened, and no one shall enter by it; for the Lord, the God of Israel, has entered by it; therefore it shall remain shut.”

Song of Solomon 4:12 A garden inclosed is my sister, my spouse; a spring shut up, a fountain sealed.

(Mary had become the temple & dwelling place of the Almighty, like the Ark of the Covenant in the Old Testament. Mary was a vessel consecrated to God alone?)

Even the so-called reformers did not contradict the dogma’s of Mary mother of God, immaculate, perpetual virgin assumed into heaven after her death by Christ

Martin Luther

It is an article of faith that Mary is Mother of the Lord and still a virgin. … Christ, we believe, came forth from a womb left perfectly intact. (Weimer’s The Works of Luther, English translation by Pelikan, Concordia, St. Louis, v. 11, pp. 319-320; v. 6. p. 510.)

John Calvin

(On the Heretic Helvidius) Helvidius displayed excessive ignorance in concluding that Mary must have had many sons, because Christ’s “brothers” are sometimes mentioned. (Harmony of Matthew, Mark and Luke, sec. 39 [Geneva, 1562], vol. 2 / From Calvin’s Commentaries, translated by William Pringle, Grand Rapids, Michigan: Eerdmans, 1949, p.215; on Matthew 13:55)

[On Matt 1:25:] The inference he [Helvidius] drew from it was, that Mary remained a virgin no longer than till her first birth, and that afterwards she had other children by her husband . . . No just and well-grounded inference can be drawn from these words . . . as to what took place after the birth of Christ. He is called “first-born”; but it is for the sole purpose of informing us that he was born of a virgin . . . What took place afterwards the historian does not inform us . . . No man will obstinately keep up the argument, except from an extreme fondness for disputation. (Pringle, ibid., vol. I, p. 107)

Under the word “brethren” the Hebrews include all cousins and other relations, whatever may be the degree of affinity. (Pringle, ibid., vol. I, p. 283 / Commentary on John, [7:3])

John Wesley

‘I believe that He [Jesus] was made man, joining the human nature with the divine in one person; being conceived by the singular operation of the Holy Ghost, and born of the blessed Virgin Mary, who, as well after as before she brought Him forth, continued a pure and unspotted virgin’ (‘Letter to a Roman Catholic’, The Works of Rev. John Wesley, vol 10, p. 81).
thanks
 

Webers.Home

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Titus 3:5 . . He saved us, not on the basis of deeds which we have done in
righteousness, but according to His mercy, by the washing of regeneration
and renewing by the Holy Spirit,

The Greek word translated "regeneration" appears in only two places in the
entire Bible. One is in Titus and the other is in Matt 19:28, which says:

"And Jesus said unto them: Verily I say unto you, that in the regeneration
when the Son of man shall sit on the throne of his glory; you who have
followed me shall sit upon twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of
Israel."

That "regeneration" in Matthew is likely the brand spanking new cosmos told
of in Isaiah 65 and Revelation 21. If so, then the "regeneration" spoken of in
Titus is likely referring to something brand spanking new too.

The Greek word translated "renewing" pertains to renovation; which
basically means to restore; like as in getting antique cars back to their
factory condition. Renovation implies the fact that something or someone
needs repairs and/or reconstruction.

* In Doctor Laura's book "10 Stupid Things Men Do To Mess Up Their Lives"
she lists trying to fix a broken women. (chuckle) Men are natural-born
renovators. Well; that might work okay with replacing a faulty electrical
outlet, and/or repainting a picket fence, but men really should make an effort
to stifle their Mr. Good Wrench impulses in a relationship. (Just saying)
_
 
Jan 4, 2023
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Titus 3:5 . . He saved us, not on the basis of deeds which we have done in
righteousness, but according to His mercy, by the washing of regeneration
and renewing by the Holy Spirit,


The Greek word translated "regeneration" appears in only two places in the
entire Bible. One is in Titus and the other is in Matt 19:28, which says:


"And Jesus said unto them: Verily I say unto you, that in the regeneration
when the Son of man shall sit on the throne of his glory; you who have
followed me shall sit upon twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of
Israel."


That "regeneration" in Matthew is likely the brand spanking new cosmos told
of in Isaiah 65 and Revelation 21. If so, then the "regeneration" spoken of in
Titus is likely referring to something brand spanking new too.


The Greek word translated "renewing" pertains to renovation; which
basically means to restore; like as in getting antique cars back to their
factory condition. Renovation implies the fact that something or someone
needs repairs and/or reconstruction.


* In Doctor Laura's book "10 Stupid Things Men Do To Mess Up Their Lives"
she lists trying to fix a broken women. (chuckle) Men are natural-born
renovators. Well; that might work okay with replacing a faulty electrical
outlet, and/or repainting a picket fence, but men really should make an effort
to stifle their Mr. Good Wrench impulses in a relationship. (Just saying)
_
Aka new creation in Christ?
Thanks
 

Webers.Home

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May 28, 2018
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I believe that He [Jesus] was made man, joining the human nature with the
divine in one person

It's commonly assumed that Christ was born a demigod; which is a singular
individual who is half human and half divine. But Christ was born 100%
human only because when the Word came into the world per John 1:14, he
left his divinity at the door. (Phil 2:6-8)

* Christ's status improved considerably after his crucifixion when God
elevated him to the name and rank of God. (Isa 52:13-15, Dan 7:13-14,
Phil 2:9-11)
_
 

FlyingDove

Senior Member
Dec 27, 2017
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Sacred scripture:
Jn 3:5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.

Jn 3:5 Protestant version: Jesus answered, verily, verily, I say to thee, except a man be born of water; and then born again by the spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.

Protestant version refuted by
Jn 3:22 After these things came Jesus and his disciples into the land of Judaea; and there he tarried with them, and baptized. (They did not preach “faith alone” or “spiritual baptism”)

Acts 8:36-38 faith and baptism not faith alone or spiritual baptism and if the apostles preached faith alone how does the eunuch know about and ask for baptism? Thanks
Leaving our fruitless discussion at we disagree. You're free to promote your heart, as am I. May His grace be multiplied to your & yours, JJ
 
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It's commonly assumed that Christ was born a demigod; which is a singular
individual who is half human and half divine. But Christ was born 100%
human only because when the Word came into the world per John 1:14, he
left his divinity at the door. (Phil 2:6-8)


* Christ's status improved considerably after his crucifixion when God
elevated him to the name and rank of God. (Isa 52:13-15, Dan 7:13-14,
Phil 2:9-11)
_
Christ is a divine person who became man
Thanks
 

Webers.Home

Well-known member
May 28, 2018
5,134
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Christ is a divine person who became man

It's far more accurate to say the Word is a divine person who became Christ;
and when the Word altered the nature of his existence to become a man, he
left his divinity at the door.

I am both frustrated and baffled by the number of Christians I encounter
online who are thoroughly incapable of grasping the meaning of Phil 2:6-11.
I just don't get it. But for sure, it's a very serious mistake.

1John 4:2-3 . . Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits,
whether they are of God; because many false prophets have gone out into
the world. By this you know the Spirit of God: Every spirit that confesses
that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is of God, and every spirit that does
not confess that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is not of God. And this is
the spirit of the Antichrist, which you have heard was coming, and is now
already in the world.

I'm sorry ephfourfive, but I must banish you to my ignore list. I don't want
to see any more of your comments ever again.
_
 

Dino246

Senior Member
Jun 30, 2015
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No way;
Matt 1:25 He knew her not till she had brought forth her firstborn son: and he called his name Jesus.

2 Samuel 6:23 tells us: Therefore Michal the daughter of Saul had no child UNTIL the day of her death.

Are we to assume that Michal had children after she died?

Until only states that they had no relation up to that point, the Bible does not say they had sex ever, before or after that point!

Lk 1:34 no sex ever!

Ezekiel 44:2 “This gate shall remain shut; it shall not be opened, and no one shall enter by it; for the Lord, the God of Israel, has entered by it; therefore it shall remain shut.”

Song of Solomon 4:12 A garden inclosed is my sister, my spouse; a spring shut up, a fountain sealed.

(Mary had become the temple & dwelling place of the Almighty, like the Ark of the Covenant in the Old Testament. Mary was a vessel consecrated to God alone?)

Even the so-called reformers did not contradict the dogma’s of Mary mother of God, immaculate, perpetual virgin assumed into heaven after her death by Christ

Martin Luther

It is an article of faith that Mary is Mother of the Lord and still a virgin. … Christ, we believe, came forth from a womb left perfectly intact. (Weimer’s The Works of Luther, English translation by Pelikan, Concordia, St. Louis, v. 11, pp. 319-320; v. 6. p. 510.)

John Calvin

(On the Heretic Helvidius) Helvidius displayed excessive ignorance in concluding that Mary must have had many sons, because Christ’s “brothers” are sometimes mentioned. (Harmony of Matthew, Mark and Luke, sec. 39 [Geneva, 1562], vol. 2 / From Calvin’s Commentaries, translated by William Pringle, Grand Rapids, Michigan: Eerdmans, 1949, p.215; on Matthew 13:55)

[On Matt 1:25:] The inference he [Helvidius] drew from it was, that Mary remained a virgin no longer than till her first birth, and that afterwards she had other children by her husband . . . No just and well-grounded inference can be drawn from these words . . . as to what took place after the birth of Christ. He is called “first-born”; but it is for the sole purpose of informing us that he was born of a virgin . . . What took place afterwards the historian does not inform us . . . No man will obstinately keep up the argument, except from an extreme fondness for disputation. (Pringle, ibid., vol. I, p. 107)

Under the word “brethren” the Hebrews include all cousins and other relations, whatever may be the degree of affinity. (Pringle, ibid., vol. I, p. 283 / Commentary on John, [7:3])

John Wesley

‘I believe that He [Jesus] was made man, joining the human nature with the divine in one person; being conceived by the singular operation of the Holy Ghost, and born of the blessed Virgin Mary, who, as well after as before she brought Him forth, continued a pure and unspotted virgin’ (‘Letter to a Roman Catholic’, The Works of Rev. John Wesley, vol 10, p. 81).
thanks
I'm not interested in the opinions of men. Mary is not a perpetual virgin. Such a notion is foolish and contrary to all common sense, as well as contrary to biblical truth.
 

oyster67

Senior Member
May 24, 2014
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This scripture has reference to disobedient children of God, who hold the truth in unrighteousness.
That Scripture refers to...
Romans 1:20
“For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:”
 
Jan 4, 2023
186
22
18
.



It's far more accurate to say the Word is a divine person who became Christ;
and when the Word altered the nature of his existence to become a man, he
left his divinity at the door.


I am both frustrated and baffled by the number of Christians I encounter
online who are thoroughly incapable of grasping the meaning of Phil 2:6-11.
I just don't get it. But for sure, it's a very serious mistake.


1John 4:2-3 . . Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits,
whether they are of God; because many false prophets have gone out into
the world. By this you know the Spirit of God: Every spirit that confesses
that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is of God, and every spirit that does
not confess that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is not of God. And this is
the spirit of the Antichrist, which you have heard was coming, and is now
already in the world.


I'm sorry ephfourfive, but I must banish you to my ignore list. I don't want
to see any more of your comments ever again.
_
That does not mean he ceased being God
 
Jan 4, 2023
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I'm not interested in the opinions of men. Mary is not a perpetual virgin. Such a notion is foolish and contrary to all common sense, as well as contrary to biblical truth.
All of the church fathers are men, are they foolish too?
Is it ok to have a common meal on the ark of the covenant or to hold a teen rock & roll dance in God’s temple?
Thanks
 

Dino246

Senior Member
Jun 30, 2015
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13,320
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All of the church fathers are men, are they foolish too?
Is it ok to have a common meal on the ark of the covenant or to hold a teen rock & roll dance in God’s temple?
Thanks
When you learn how to read without making ridiculous leaps of misinterpretation, you should read the Bible.