Oh.....I am quite confident that the gallery who is watching the battle knows who the winner is down here in the arena
CJ Lovik with another prophecy backing up his 2030 return of Jesus
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Which one?
again, when has the ten kings given power during that roman empire
Lets take it further
In dan 7 it says this about that empire
‘The fourth beast shall be A fourth kingdom on earth, Which shall be different from all other kingdoms, And shall devour the whole earth, Trample it and break it in pieces.
24 The ten horns are ten kings Who shall arise from this kingdom. And another shall rise after them; He shall be different from the first ones, And shall subdue three kings.
25 He shall speak pompous words against the Most High, Shall persecutethe saints of the Most High,
And shall intend to change times and law. Then the saints shall be given into his hand For a time and times and half a time.
When did the roman empire of Christ's time fullfill the above things?
EDIT ^ ^
We and the creation are "waiting" "until" "the end of the (Church) age", when "they shall see" Jesus as King "coming in the clouds" "in that day" to wage war, defeating the armies of the beast who come against Israel, then to regather His brethren "the second time", whereupon He will "sit upon the throne of His glory" so located in the Temple in Jerusalem.
Mat 13:39
“The enemy who sowed them is the devil, the harvest is the end of the age, and the reapers are the angels.
Mat 13:40
“Therefore as the tares are gathered and burned in the fire, so it will be at the end of this age.
Mat 13:49
“So it will be at the end of the age. The angels will come forth, separate the wicked from among the just,
Mat 24:3
Now as He sat on the Mount of Olives, the disciples came to Him privately, saying, “Tell us, when will these things be? And what will be the sign of Your coming, and of the end of the age?”
Mat 28:20
“teaching them to observe all things that I have commanded you; and lo, I am with you always, even to the end of the age.” Amen.
Here is some truth for you......the truth about the Kingdom that will always win. What does this "end of the age" mean to you?
Mat 13:39
“The enemy who sowed them is the devil, the harvest is the end of the age, and the reapers are the angels.
Mat 13:40
“Therefore as the tares are gathered and burned in the fire, so it will be at the end of this age.
Mat 13:49
“So it will be at the end of the age. The angels will come forth, separate the wicked from among the just,
Mat 24:3
Now as He sat on the Mount of Olives, the disciples came to Him privately, saying, “Tell us, when will these things be? And what will be the sign of Your coming, and of the end of the age?”
Mat 28:20
“teaching them to observe all things that I have commanded you; and lo, I am with you always, even to the end of the age.” Amen.
You are basing your understanding of what you believe has or hasn't happened. I'm just asking is the 4th empire the Roman empire? If the answer is yes, then that is the time Daniel 2 is referring to whether or not you match the other details or not.
I'm only trying to establish WHEN Daniel 2 is referring to. Once that is done, the details can be worked out.
So what is the time period described in Daniel 2?
I am basing my understanding on what the text says
If the things in Dan 2 and Dan 7 occured in the origional roman empire. then there is nothing more I can say
if they have not (which in my view. they have not) then it must be some future empire.
its called a GAP..one empire two instances..
did you also know Rev 13, Rev 17 and Rev 20 also gives us things this beast will do?
For anyone to ignore this has to be considered a case of willful obfuscation IMO.
As any serious Bible student knows, the NT confirms and elaborates upon the prophecies of the OT. As in this case.
My friend. I have tried to be patient
1. Please tell me when I said it was not rome, especially since I said it was multiple times now (just not the rome of Jesus day)
2. Please answer when the ROME of Jesus day fulfilled what Daniel said about it
If you can not tell me when The Rome of Jesus did those things. I will assume either you do not know, you do not care, or you just do not want to look at it
Like I said. I just went through 2 chapters. I showed you multiple things the rome of Jesus day NEVER accomplished. I have 3 more chapters in revelations which tells us things the empire that Christ destroys will do, which also until this day has not yet taken place
Do you want to discuss. Or do you want to just mock..
I'm just trying to understand what you believe, not mock. I sincerely apologize that that is the way it came across.
I understand subsequent revelation is given in the NT. But if you say that the Roman empire is the 4th empire, and it says God sets up an eternal kingdom at that time, how can it be that the eternal kingdom has not been established?
The eternal kingdom will be established after the final gentile beast is destroyed
We are given characteristics of that beast. which means that beast will have to accomplish what God says it will accomplish
if it has not yet accomplished those things, That particular beast has not yet been fulfilled,
thats why I asked you about the ten kings..and the other things which we are told that beast will do.
I believe it is future because all those things (and much more) have not been accomplished yet.
Rev 13:
13 Then I stood on the sand of the sea. And I saw a beast rising up out of the sea, having seven heads and ten horns,[b] and on his horns ten crowns, and on his heads a blasphemous name. 2 Now the beast which I saw was like a leopard, his feet were like the feet of a bear, and his mouth like the mouth of a lion. The dragon gave him his power, his throne, and great authority. 3 And I saw one of his heads as if it had been mortally wounded, and his deadly wound was healed. And all the world marveled and followed the beast. 4 So they worshiped the dragon who gave authority to the beast; and they worshiped the beast, saying, “Who is like the beast? Who is able to make war with him?”
5 And he was given a mouth speaking great things and blasphemies, and he was given authority to continue[c] for forty-two months. 6 Then he opened his mouth in blasphemy against God, to blaspheme His name, His tabernacle, and those who dwell in heaven. 7 It was granted to him to make war with the saints and to overcome them. And authority was given him over every tribe,[d] tongue, and nation. 8 All who dwell on the earth will worship him, whose names have not been written in the Book of Life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.
Rev 17:
7 But the angel said to me, “Why did you marvel? I will tell you the mystery of the woman and of the beast that carries her, which has the seven heads and the ten horns. 8 The beast that you saw was, and is not, and will ascend out of the bottomless pit and go to perdition. And those who dwell on the earth will marvel, whose names are not written in the Book of Life from the foundation of the world, when they see the beast that was, and is not, and yet is.[c]
9 “Here is the mind which has wisdom: The seven heads are seven mountains on which the woman sits. 10 There are also seven kings. Five have fallen, one is, and the other has not yet come. And when he comes, he must continue a short time. 11 The beast that was, and is not, is himself also the eighth, and is of the seven, and is going to perdition.
12 “The ten horns which you saw are ten kings who have received no kingdom as yet, but they receive authority for one hour as kings with the beast. 13 These are of one mind, and they will give their power and authority to the beast. 14 These will make war with the Lamb, and the Lamb will overcome them, for He is Lord of lords and King of kings; and those who are with Him are called, chosen, and faithful.”
Rev 19: 9 And I saw the beast, the kings of the earth, and their armies, gathered together to make war against Him who sat on the horse and against His army. 20 Then the beast was captured, and with him the false prophet who worked signs in his presence, by which he deceived those who received the mark of the beast and those who worshiped his image. These two were cast alive into the lake of fire burning with brimstone. 21 And the rest were killed with the sword which proceeded from the mouth of Him who sat on the horse. And all the birds were filled with their flesh.
Rev 20:
20 Then I saw an angel coming down from heaven, having the key to the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand. 2 He laid hold of the dragon, that serpent of old, who is the Devil and Satan, and bound him for a thousand years; 3 and he cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal on him, so that he should deceive the nations no more till the thousand years were finished. But after these things he must be released for a little while.
We can also go to Dan 9, Matt 24 and other passages to get a complete story
So you will not tell me when those things happened?
Just say ok??
thats not very convincing
None of those say the kingdom didn't begin during the Roman empire. Daniel 2 says it did. That means you are basing your conclusion on what you believe is being taught and not what the word of God plainly says.
I'm ok if you want to do that.
Did I ask when it started? No, so why did you answer as if I did?
I asked when the roman empire of Christ's day fulfilled those things.
Can you tell me when??
Sure. Sometime during the Roman empire.
Just because you don't see how they fit doesn't mean they don't.
I know this view isn't popular these days. But if the eternal kingdom was established during the Roman empire, it is the only one that fits.
Btw...there are explanations for all that you asked about. But I didn't try to answer any because it wouldn't matter if you don't first understand when the eternal kingdom began.
This is a little tricky, so see if you can follow me here...
The text doesn't exactly state it as you have stated it, above ^ .
The text instead says (specifically), "and in the days of those KINGS [plural]..." - Daniel 2:44 Hebrew Text Analysis (biblehub.com)
... but think about it, it can't be talking about either ALL FOUR of the beast-kingdoms (which are successive) nor about ONLY the 4th beast-kingdom (as that is singular, as are the others named before it in this text);
Thus, what I believe it is referring to instead ("and in the days of those KINGS [PLURAL]"), is the time [yet future to us] when the 4th beast-kingdom [Rome] possesses (also--same time) the "10 kings [plural]" aspect (as shown here:... in v.24 at the bottom of the list - https://www.blueletterbible.org/lexicon/h4430/nasb95/wlc/ss1/0-3/ )... which feature it did not have in the first century (but are "future").
"... when they behold the beast which WAS, and IS NOT, and YET SHALL BE [FUTURE tense]" (to the time Rev was written-95ad)
God let us know those things so we can know when it happens.. We can't see it because it has never happened.
I don't interpret prophecy that way When God says these things will happen. they will
It don't fit at all. In fact the roman empire continued long after Christ left. and long after Israel was destroyed..just another in a long line of evidence
I know when the eternal kingdom will begin.
I know it has not.. I can share more proof (I actually did an indepth study of the 4 beasts) . But I just shared bits and pieces. and you have not given me any reason to change my view..