Baptist and Baptism

JaumeJ · Feb 24, 2023

This is a response to your selection of my post.

Again, I said this is a mystery taught us by the Father first and the Son the second time. Why force human thinking uon this, as you have admitted, mysstery.

In the gift of faith given me, I believe the Father first knowing this translates as I believe the Only Son first because they both teachus they are One. Yes it is a mystery yet to be revealed to us, by God, not by intellectuals who conceive doctrine from their puny brains. Belive God first, and all will be at peace.

Wansvic · Feb 24, 2023

wattie said:

Paul was told his sins would be washed away upon obedience to water baptism. (Acts 22:16) And Paul explained what actually occurs upon obedience to the God-given command to be water baptized; those who obey have been buried with Jesus into His death wherein their sins are destroyed. (Romans 6:3-6) Verse 5 states, IF we have been united together in the likeness of His death, certainly we also shall be in the likeness of His resurrection. That little word IF reveals much.

Paul certainly understood water baptism to be far more than just a public display.

Wansvic · Feb 24, 2023

JBTN said:

“Kefa answered them, “Turn from sin, return to God, and each of you be immersed on the authority of Yeshua the Messiah into forgiveness of your sins, and you will receive the gift of the Ruach HaKodesh!”
‭‭Acts of Emissaries of Yeshua (Act)‬ ‭2‬:‭38‬ ‭CJB‬‬
https://bible.com/bible/1275/act.2.38.CJB

Be immersed into forgiveness of sins. To me, this seems to more accurately reflect the Greek manuscripts. The medium for immersion is actually given in the verse itself. You don’t have to assume it’s a water immersion. No water is mentioned.

This mirrors exactly what we see here.

“In him you also, when you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation, and believed in him, were sealed with the promised Holy Spirit,”
‭‭Ephesians‬ ‭1‬:‭13‬ ‭ESV‬‬
https://bible.com/bible/59/eph.1.13.ESV

Doesn’t this describe an immersion into Christ by the Holy Spirit.

Immersion into Christ is immersion into forgiveness of sins.

“in whom we have redemption, the forgiveness of sins.”
‭‭Colossians‬ ‭1‬:‭14‬ ‭ESV‬‬
https://bible.com/bible/59/col.1.14.ESV

Being baptized in the name of Jesus is water baptism as other scripture reveals:
"Can anyone forbid water, that these should not be baptized who have received the Holy Spirit just as we have?” 48 And he commanded them to be baptized in the name of the Lord. Then they asked him to stay a few days." Acts 10:47-48

Wansvic · Feb 24, 2023

Angela53510 said:

Jesus said to baptize in the NAME of... The apostles knew who Jesus was, and obeyed the command by consistently baptizing in His name. No contradiction.

God's truth is established by the presence of 2-3 scriptures relavent to a topic, as scripture itself attests. All detailed records of water baptism prove what Jesus commanded the apostles to do.

Wansvic · Feb 24, 2023

Everlasting-Grace said:

The command to be water baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus for remission of sin was instituted by God for all those living in the NT after Jesus' death, burial and resurrection. The Jews wanted those obedient to the NT command of water baptism to abide by God's OT mandate of circumcision as well. God instituted the commands specific to each the Old and New Testament; therefore, neither was a manmade tradition.

Wansvic · Feb 24, 2023

JaumeJ said:

Is it not also written thatt we should go out into the world and baptize those who come to the Lord in the name of the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit?

Mat 28:19 Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:

Yes it does. What is the name?

Pilgrimshope · Feb 24, 2023

montana123 said:

amen really great post here’s some scripture to support what you’re saying

“The beginning of the gospel of Jesus Christ, the Son of God;

John did baptize in the wilderness, and preach the baptism of repentance for the remission of sins.”
‭‭Mark‬ ‭1:1, 4‬ ‭KJV‬‬

I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance:

but he that cometh after me is mightier than I, whose shoes I am not worthy to bear: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost, and with fire:”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭3:11‬ ‭KJ

“And he said unto them, These are the words which I spake unto you, while I was yet with you, that all things must be fulfilled, which were written in the law of Moses, and in the prophets, and in the psalms, concerning me. Then opened he their understanding, that they might understand the scriptures, and said unto them,

Thus it is written, and thus it behoved Christ to suffer, and to rise from the dead the third day:

and that repentance and remission of sins should be preached in his name among all nations, beginning at Jerusalem. And ye are witnesses of these things.”
‭‭Luke‬ ‭24:44-48‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“, but wait for the promise of the Father, which, saith he, ye have heard of me.

For John truly baptized with water;

but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost not many days hence.

But ye shall receive power, after that the Holy Ghost is come upon you: and ye shall be witnesses unto me both in Jerusalem, and in all Judæa, and in Samaria, and unto the uttermost part of the earth.”
‭‭Acts‬ ‭1:4-5, 8‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost, and with fire:”

“And suddenly there came a sound from heaven as of a rushing mighty wind, and it filled all the house where they were sitting. And there appeared unto them cloven tongues like as of fire, and it sat upon each of them. And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance.

But Peter, standing up with the eleven, lifted up his voice, and said unto them, Ye men of Judæa, and all ye that dwell at Jerusalem, be this known unto you, and hearken to my words: But this is that which was spoken by the prophet Joel; And it shall come to pass in the last days, saith God, I will pour out of my Spirit upon all flesh: And your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, And your young men shall see visions, And your old men shall dream dreams: And on my servants and on my handmaidens I will pour out in those days of my Spirit; and they shall prophesy:”
‭‭Acts‬ ‭2:2-4, 14-18‬ ‭

The promise of the father

“Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, ( water for repentance and remission )

and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.( spirit from Jesus ) For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.

Then they that gladly received his word were baptized: and the same day there were added unto them about three thousand souls.”
‭‭Acts‬ ‭2:38-39, 41‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“While Peter yet spake these words, the Holy Ghost fell on all them which heard the word. And they of the circumcision which believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because that on the Gentiles also was poured out the gift of the Holy Ghost. For they heard them speak with tongues, and magnify God.

Then answered Peter, Can any man forbid water, that these should not be baptized, which have received the Holy Ghost as well as we? And he commanded them to be baptized in the name of the Lord. Then prayed they him to tarry certain days.”
‭‭Acts‬ ‭10:44-48‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“that the blessing of Abraham might come on the Gentiles through Jesus Christ; that we might receive the promise of the Spirit through faith.

For if the inheritance be of the law, it is no more of promise: but God gave it to Abraham by promise.

But the scripture hath concluded all under sin, that the promise by faith of Jesus Christ might be given to them that believe. For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus. For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ. And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.”
‭‭Galatians‬ ‭3:14, 18, 22, 26-27, 29‬ ‭KJV‬‬

Pilgrimshope · Feb 24, 2023

Wansvic said:

“Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.”
‭‭Acts‬ ‭4:12‬ ‭KJV‬‬

Pilgrimshope · Feb 24, 2023

Wansvic said:

“Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ. For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.

And ye are complete in him, which is the head of all principality and power:

in whom also ye are circumcised with the circumcision made without hands, in putting off the body of the sins of the flesh by the circumcision of Christ: buried with him in baptism, wherein also ye are risen with him through the faith of the operation of God, who hath raised him from the dead.”
‭‭Colossians‬ ‭2:8-12‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“If ye then be risen with Christ, seek those things which are above, where Christ sitteth on the right hand of God. Set your affection on things above, not on things on the earth. For ye are dead, and your life is hid with Christ in God.”
‭‭Colossians‬ ‭3:1-3‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“God forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein? Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death? Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.

knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin. For he that is dead is freed from sin.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭6:2-4, 6-7‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“Let not sin therefore reign in your mortal body, that ye should obey it in the lusts thereof. Neither yield ye your members as instruments of unrighteousness unto sin:

but yield yourselves unto God, as those that are alive from the dead, and your members as instruments of righteousness unto God.

For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace. Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death,

or of obedience unto righteousness?

But God be thanked, that ye were the servants of sin, but ye have obeyed from the heart that form of doctrine which was delivered you. ( baptism is an act of faith we hear , believe and do )

Being then made free from sin,

ye became the servants of righteousness.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭6:12-14, 16-18‬ ‭KJV‬‬

it’s too bad we can’t agree on what baptism even is and th t we argue over spirit and water because alot of the epistles explain such in depth meaning and explain it very well why we get baptized is a big part of the doctrine that’s always saying things like

( you died , you are not who you were , leave the old person behind in death and follow Jesus on life ) all rhe things we read about us dying and being raised with Christ is coming from the doctrine about being baptized into his death because he died for our sins , when we get baptized we’re accepting the atonement for our souls it’s why his name is mentioned because our sins are being placed upon the atonement and then we are buried with him who died for our sins , and are given a brand new life with him in his resurrection as were raised up from the water.

but we argue about many baptisms instead of learning about baptism and growing in the faith teaching us we died and are not the old sinner anymore we now have Gods spirit inside us the same who chi raised Jesus up from the dead is in us and will raise us up when we face death

wattie · Feb 24, 2023

Pilgrimshope said:

amen really great post here’s some scripture to support what you’re saying

“The beginning of the gospel of Jesus Christ, the Son of God;

John did baptize in the wilderness, and preach the baptism of repentance for the remission of sins.”
‭‭Mark‬ ‭1:1, 4‬ ‭KJV‬‬

I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance:

but he that cometh after me is mightier than I, whose shoes I am not worthy to bear: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost, and with fire:”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭3:11‬ ‭KJ

“And he said unto them, These are the words which I spake unto you, while I was yet with you, that all things must be fulfilled, which were written in the law of Moses, and in the prophets, and in the psalms, concerning me. Then opened he their understanding, that they might understand the scriptures, and said unto them,

Thus it is written, and thus it behoved Christ to suffer, and to rise from the dead the third day:

and that repentance and remission of sins should be preached in his name among all nations, beginning at Jerusalem. And ye are witnesses of these things.”
‭‭Luke‬ ‭24:44-48‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“, but wait for the promise of the Father, which, saith he, ye have heard of me.

For John truly baptized with water;

but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost not many days hence.

But ye shall receive power, after that the Holy Ghost is come upon you: and ye shall be witnesses unto me both in Jerusalem, and in all Judæa, and in Samaria, and unto the uttermost part of the earth.”
‭‭Acts‬ ‭1:4-5, 8‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost, and with fire:”

“And suddenly there came a sound from heaven as of a rushing mighty wind, and it filled all the house where they were sitting. And there appeared unto them cloven tongues like as of fire, and it sat upon each of them. And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance.

But Peter, standing up with the eleven, lifted up his voice, and said unto them, Ye men of Judæa, and all ye that dwell at Jerusalem, be this known unto you, and hearken to my words: But this is that which was spoken by the prophet Joel; And it shall come to pass in the last days, saith God, I will pour out of my Spirit upon all flesh: And your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, And your young men shall see visions, And your old men shall dream dreams: And on my servants and on my handmaidens I will pour out in those days of my Spirit; and they shall prophesy:”
‭‭Acts‬ ‭2:2-4, 14-18‬ ‭

The promise of the father

“Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, ( water for repentance and remission )

and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.( spirit from Jesus ) For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.

Then they that gladly received his word were baptized: and the same day there were added unto them about three thousand souls.”
‭‭Acts‬ ‭2:38-39, 41‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“While Peter yet spake these words, the Holy Ghost fell on all them which heard the word. And they of the circumcision which believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because that on the Gentiles also was poured out the gift of the Holy Ghost. For they heard them speak with tongues, and magnify God.

Then answered Peter, Can any man forbid water, that these should not be baptized, which have received the Holy Ghost as well as we? And he commanded them to be baptized in the name of the Lord. Then prayed they him to tarry certain days.”
‭‭Acts‬ ‭10:44-48‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“that the blessing of Abraham might come on the Gentiles through Jesus Christ; that we might receive the promise of the Spirit through faith.

For if the inheritance be of the law, it is no more of promise: but God gave it to Abraham by promise.

But the scripture hath concluded all under sin, that the promise by faith of Jesus Christ might be given to them that believe. For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus. For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ. And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.”
‭‭Galatians‬ ‭3:14, 18, 22, 26-27, 29‬ ‭KJV‬‬

You are referencing the Holy Spirit empowering a church here AND water baptism. Acts 2.. at Pentecost.. is a group of already saved believers being empowered.

The disciples were surely saved before they had the Holy Spirit come 'in the midst' of them.

You gotta seperate the different types of works of the Holy Spirit out. Then it becomes clear what is about individual salvation and what is a different work of the Holy Spirit.

A group of believers being empowered by the Holy Spirit isn't getting eternal salvation.

wattie · Feb 24, 2023

Wansvic said:

Following commands.. believers fail in very often. Acts of service to God after being saved we waver in. We can do them of course.. and God wants us to do them.. but He knows we can't do them 100 percent.

Romans 6-- also isn't about water baptism. This is the work of regeneration of the Holy Spirit when a sinner entrusts their salvation with Jesus.

Water baptism by immersion is a picture of the salvation process, and a commitment to a life salvaged to God. It's a picture of what has already been done in a believers life.. not the means of eternal salvation.

And I'm done with this.

Pilgrimshope · Feb 24, 2023

wattie said:

Its amazing how far we to explain away things that are written like the fact there is one baptism not two or three of four

“There is one body, and one Spirit, even as ye are called in one hope of your calling; one Lord, one faith, one baptism, one God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in you all.”
‭‭Ephesians‬ ‭4:4-6‬ ‭KJV‬‬

But many see this and say no no oil has it wrong there are two or three or four

when you say “ water “ baptism it’s just baptism this baptism

“Then Philip opened his mouth, and began at the same scripture, and preached unto him Jesus. And as they went on their way, they came unto a certain water: and the eunuch said, See, here is water; what doth hinder me to be baptized?

And Philip said, If thou believest with all thine heart, thou mayest. And he answered and said, I believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God.

And he commanded the chariot to stand still: and they went down both into the water, both Philip and the eunuch; and he baptized him.”
‭‭Acts‬ ‭8:35-38‬ ‭KJV‬‬

baptism is performed in water there’s no other baptism what John was talking about is receiving the Holy Ghost it doesn’t replace baptism for remission there’s just one baptism the church has ever been taught to do it’s the same rule John had preaching Jesus and baptizing those who repent and believe the gospel

It’s done in water because that’s what God sent John the Baptist to do.

john never said anything about us performing a different baptism he said Jesus would baptize the church C with the holy ghost later and as you see after that they continued in the same “ water baptism “ people refer to in other words they continued in the one baptism

Same for gentiles as for Jews

“While Peter yet spake these words, the Holy Ghost fell on all them which heard the word. And they of the circumcision which believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because that on the Gentiles also was poured out the gift of the Holy Ghost. For they heard them speak with tongues, and magnify God. Then answered Peter, Can any man forbid water, that these should not be baptized, which have received the Holy Ghost as well as we? And he commanded them to be baptized in the name of the Lord. Then prayed they him to tarry certain days.”
‭‭Acts‬ ‭10:44-48‬ ‭KJV‬‬

either those darn apostles kept baptizing in water and just didn’t understand or the modern day theories and ideas about how everything means something else and not what it says is just not really worth anyone’s time and it would be better to learn what’s in scripture and not what the many doctrines and books tell us it really means

Magenta · Feb 24, 2023

Wansvic said:

The Name Game

Cameron143 · Feb 24, 2023

Magenta said:

Careful. You'll be doing the Freddie next.

Magenta · Feb 24, 2023

Cameron143 said:

Kruger, or Mercury? .

Cameron143 · Feb 24, 2023

Magenta said:

Actually I was thinking Freddie and the Dreamers. You'll like the video.

JaumeJ · Feb 25, 2023

Wansvic said:

It is the name of God. The word God may be traced back to Sanskrit where the trail fades, not going to its actual root beginning.
It could be Elohim, the plural of El, which in erstqhile times meant the mighty ones and became used as we use the word, God, today. El would be the singular.
Perhaps you are awaiting the title Yahweh which my research and my thingking says it is the gerund, noun, form of the Hebrew word, haya, which is the infinitive, to be. However this version of our ver, to be, is tansitive, not intransitive. Ergo it means to will to be something no human may attain to perform.
There are many other titles describing our Maker, however His singular name will not be revealed until Yahweh turns us all back to a pure tongue so we may all call Him by One Name, Zepheniah.
You and I could go on and on forever.

**bye the way, the name and its meaning gives some light to the fact that our Maker is the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit, but that light comes with revelation or with prayerful meditation upon its meaning.

Wansvic · Feb 25, 2023

wattie said:

What do you think the words of Ananias mean? "And now why tarriest thou? arise and be baptized and wash away thy sins calling upon the name of the Lord." Acts 22:16

Wansvic · Feb 25, 2023

JaumeJ said:

I was of course referring to the Lord Jesus. This is clear since the apostles administered all water baptisms in the name of Jesus. Also, in Jesus dwells all the fulness of the Godhead. (Col 2:9) And most importantly, there is none other name under heaven WHEREBY we must be saved. (Acts 4:12)

Wansvic · Feb 25, 2023

Magenta said:

It's no laughing matter when you consider what scripture says about THAT NAME. "Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, WHEREBY we must be saved. (Acts 4:12) That's why being obedient to the command to be water baptized in His name is so crucial.

Paul mentions the importance of whose name to use in baptism. "Has Christ been divided into factions? Was I, Paul, crucified for you? Were any of you baptized in the name of Paul? Of course not!" 1 Cor 1:13

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