Salvation is for the Whole World

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ForestGreenCook

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Jul 8, 2018
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You don't get it, all I did was Submit to when He called me. From other than submission, God, has been preparing my life to become Saved, to be in a place to hear Him, and know you are broken down to His Righteousness through Needing Him. And when you submit to Him, He steps on inside and from then on, you just Rely upon Him for everything.

How you handle life, people, friends, family, co-workers, church members, and all the other trials including you in this discussion, you let God lead and if the Truth remains hidden that is no excuse.

You were already reborn spiritually in order to submit to the things of the Spirit (1 Cor 2:14). You have the promise of eternal inheritance, you just don't have the comfort, joy, and satisfaction of giving God all the praise for his sovereign grace in saving you eternally.
 

Mem

Senior Member
Sep 23, 2014
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I guess you're seeing something in the verses (I included) which I don't, but to me, there is no wiggle room in them:
the old will be gone, and the new will replace it.

[Rev 21:1 KJV] 1 And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.
Yes, we obviously view things differently if you consider putting faith in God hearing the Word that comes from Him and believing it, is rendering oneself 'deserving' of salvation. On the other hand, I see doing nothing while the instruction is given to believe, and yet expecting salvation, as actually the idea of entitlement.
 

ForestGreenCook

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Jul 8, 2018
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Read Carefully!

Those so called unchosen weren't so unchosen after all.

They made a Choice to not LIVE..

All mankind, including us, made the choice to not seek God. (Psalms 53:2-3). That is why God intervened, to eternally save most of mankind. (Eph 1:3-4).
 

rogerg

Well-known member
Jul 13, 2021
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Yes, we obviously view things differently if you consider putting faith in God hearing the Word that comes from Him and believing it, is rendering oneself 'deserving' of salvation.
What would you call it? Look, if you believe that faith is a product of oneself and it is God's requirement for your salvation,
should you do so (which I don't believe is possible, nor do I believe our faith that which saves), then in effect,
you are rendering yourself deserving, by which, you would have then saved yourself.
 
Jun 20, 2022
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You were already reborn spiritually in order to submit to the things of the Spirit (1 Cor 2:14). You have the promise of eternal inheritance, you just don't have the comfort, joy, and satisfaction of giving God all the praise for his sovereign grace in saving you eternally.
But I do give God all the Praise and Glory for my personal Salvation experience between Him and myself.

I also Praise God and give Him the Glory for creating me to have the ability to choose to Submit to Him.

I Praise Him for giving me Free Will to know my love for Him is Genuine and Real!!
 
Jun 20, 2022
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All mankind, including us, made the choice to not seek God. (Psalms 53:2-3). That is why God intervened, to eternally save most of mankind. (Eph 1:3-4).
God gave them the Choice, but they rather rebell then to surrender ..
 

Mem

Senior Member
Sep 23, 2014
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What would you call it? Look, if you believe that faith is a product of oneself and it is God's requirement for your salvation,
should you do so (which I don't believe is possible, nor do I believe our faith that which saves), then in effect,
you are rendering yourself deserving, by which, you would have then saved yourself.
The gift is salvation to all, and of course you cannot accept the gift for all, or you likely would, but only for yourself. And it is through faith, believing without seeing, that you receive it for yourself. Otherwise, how do you know you have it?
 

ForestGreenCook

Well-known member
Jul 8, 2018
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Read Carefully!

Those so called unchosen weren't so unchosen after all.

They made a Choice to not LIVE..

Ezk 33:11, is speaking of the wickedness of his elect, when they are enticed to commit a sin, which separates them from their fellowship with God, temporary, until God chastens them to repent. Death=separation, according to Greek.

God chastens, only those that he loves. The wicked, mentioned in Psalms 73, are those that he does not love, as I pointed out in my post #478, who are not in trouble as other men, neither are they plagued (divenly punished) like other men.

Harmonizing the scriptures will open your eyes to see the truth.
 

HeIsHere

Well-known member
May 21, 2022
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Accepting the gift is not but trying to invoke or lay claim to it BY your accepting of it, is. Anything
that must be done by someone to get it, makes it into a work regardless of how little or how much is required.
The Bible describes it not only as a gift, but as a free gift. That means it is PLACED into one's possession by God
with the intervention or action of man neither necessary nor possible.
You are desirous to take the title of Saviour away from Christ and place it upon yourself.
It's not complicated.

You have made this up, this is not stated in scripture.

Free means no payment required
Gift means it is something we receive freely, no compulsion

Show me any scripture that states receiving a gift is a work?
 

rogerg

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Jul 13, 2021
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The gift is salvation to all, and of course you cannot accept the gift for all, or you likely would, but only for yourself. And it is through faith, believing without seeing, that you receive it for yourself. Otherwise, how do you know you have it?
The gift of salvation is not to all but only to those whom God had chosen for such. Without there being election, there could be no grace, otherwise, it would/must be of works - there is no third alternative - either one or the other.
Regarding how one knows? The Bible is replete with verses that inform us of the attributes of the saved, but those verses
must be understood in light of the whole Bible, not just of themselves.
 

Sipsey

Well-known member
Sep 27, 2018
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No, it is not possible of "opening it" in order to have it. A spiritually dead person cannot give to themselves spiritual life any more than physically dead person can give to themselves physical life because they are oblivious to the fact that they are dead.

We are told that it is God who must first place within us a new heart and a new spirit. The verses that tell us that, leaves no
room for man's participation in it for acquiring it, but only of God - no conditions are mentioned other than of God who WILL do it.
The things you mention above do happen, but as a byproduct of salvation through the Holy Spirit, not as a cause of salvation.
Notice in the below verse that God says "I will" and does not say "we will", nor that "you must".

[Eze 36:26 KJV]
26 A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh.
We are all given a measure of faith by God, after all He says explicitly, “we have no excuse.”

Saving grace is that tiny amount that we apply. One man hears the Gospel and says, “I hear what you say and I understand and believe it.’ Another says, “I hear and understand your Gospel, but do not believe it.”

It is when the Holy Sprit takes that minute initial faith and appies it to our soul, that we are quickened/

That is the difference, and why throughout the OT and NT we are told to believe and choose.
 

ForestGreenCook

Well-known member
Jul 8, 2018
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The gift is salvation to all, and of course you cannot accept the gift for all, or you likely would, but only for yourself. And it is through faith, believing without seeing, that you receive it for yourself. Otherwise, how do you know you have it?
We receive this undeserved gift of salvation by God's sovereign grace, while we are, yet, dead spiritually in our sins, unable to respond to spiritual things (Eph 2"1 & 1 Cor 2:14).


Jesus's sacrifice for those that God gave to him (John 6:39), was not a sacrifice that was offered to mankind, for mankind's acceptance, but was an offering to God, for God's acceptance, and God was well pleased (2 Pet 1:17).
 

Mem

Senior Member
Sep 23, 2014
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Regarding how one knows? The Bible is replete with verses that inform us of the attributes of the saved, but those verses
must be understood in light of the whole Bible, not just of themselves.
So, according to your view, no one can actually know they are saved except by certain evidence? It seems to me your position is that the evidence is the assurance.
 

rogerg

Well-known member
Jul 13, 2021
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You have made this up, this is not stated in scripture.

Free means no payment required
Gift means it is something we receive freely, no compulsion

Show me any scripture that states receiving a gift is a work?
Guess you were unable to grasp my prior post. I said that receiving a gift is not a work but having to do something TO receive it, is.
Everyone saved has received the gift of eternal life, but none having done anything in order to receive it.
If you have to do something for it, and should you do that and get it, then without question, a payment has been made. It would then be
a quid pro quo.

[Rom 5:15 KJV]
15 But not as the offence, so also [is] the free gift. For if through the offence of one many be dead, much more the grace of God, and the gift by grace, [which is] by one man, Jesus Christ, hath abounded unto many.

[Eph 2:4-6 KJV]
4 But God, who is rich in mercy, for his great love wherewith he loved us,
5 Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved;)
6 And hath raised [us] up together, and made [us] sit together in heavenly [places] in Christ Jesus:
 

rogerg

Well-known member
Jul 13, 2021
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So, according to your view, no one can actually know they are saved except by certain evidence? It seems to me your position is that the evidence is the assurance.
Yes, but there is substantial evidence of that put forth in the Bible.
 

ForestGreenCook

Well-known member
Jul 8, 2018
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You have made this up, this is not stated in scripture.

Free means no payment required
Gift means it is something we receive freely, no compulsion

Show me any scripture that states receiving a gift is a work?

Action involves movement. Any action that is required to receive a gift is works. When a person is spiritually dead, they cannot receive spiritual gifts (1 Cor 2:14) (Eph 2:1).

There is a scripture that tells the born again person to work out his own salvation. Salvation=deliverance. Those who are born again can work out their own deliverance, by following God's commandments, and repenting when they commit a sin.
 

Mem

Senior Member
Sep 23, 2014
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Yes, but there is substantial evidence of that put forth in the Bible.
It is much easier to mimic the evidence then to show faith, since "faith is the evidence of things not seen."
 

Mem

Senior Member
Sep 23, 2014
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We receive this undeserved gift of salvation by God's sovereign grace, while we are, yet, dead spiritually in our sins, unable to respond to spiritual things (Eph 2"1 & 1 Cor 2:14).


Jesus's sacrifice for those that God gave to him (John 6:39), was not a sacrifice that was offered to mankind, for mankind's acceptance, but was an offering to God, for God's acceptance, and God was well pleased (2 Pet 1:17).
This is a scripture pretzel, and unsalted at that.
 

ForestGreenCook

Well-known member
Jul 8, 2018
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Another says, “I hear and understand your Gospel, but do not believe it.”

You are not taking into consideration, 1 Cor 2:14, that the natural man, before he has been quickened to the new spiritual life (Eph 2"1) cannot discern the things of the Spirit.