That's like saying the Pharisees were saved even though Jesus called them children of the devil .
Salvation is for the Whole World
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That's like saying the Pharisees were saved even though Jesus called them children of the devil .
Anyone that commits a sin is of (under his spell) the devil, until he repents (1 John 3:8).
I believe the scribes and the pharisees to be God's people, they just did not have a knowledge of the gospel. They were prideful, and liked to teach their doctrine, standing on corners to be seen. Jesus tells us to beware of the levin of the Pharisees.
Jesus said they were of their father the devil. I wonder who is right...
When the born again child of God, turns away from God, and is practicing sin, they are following instructions from the devil, until they repent.
The scribes and Pharisees, in all good conscience, thought they were serving God, but they had not come unto a knowledge of the truth.
If you think that you can determine who the elect are, and are not, I would remind you, that David got himself in serious trouble with God, for numbering Israel.
Jesus said they were of their father the devil. I wonder who is right...
Also, nobody was born again until the day of Pentecost.
Irrelevant.
The old testament saints are born again, in the same manner that the new testament saints are, and that, in part, is by the indwelling of the Holy Spirit.
Isaiah 63:11 - Then he remembered the days of old, Moses, and his people, saying, where is he that brought them up out of the sea with the shepherd of his flock? Where is he that put his Holy Spirit within him?
Some OT believers had the Holy Spirit put upon them, but nobody was born again until the day of Pentecost.
No OT believer was born again. It simply was not available.
John 7:39 (But this spake he of the Spirit, which they that believe on him should receive: for the Holy Ghost was not yet given; because that Jesus was not yet glorified.)
John 5:39-40 KJV
Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me.
[40] And
YE WILL NOT COME TO ME,
that ye might have life.
Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me.
[40] And
YE WILL NOT COME TO ME,
that ye might have life.
God is worthy
Matthew 15:26-28 KJV
But he answered and said, It is not meet to take the children's bread, and to cast it to dogs.
[27] And she said, Truth, Lord: yet the dogs eat of the crumbs which fall from their masters' table.
[28] Then Jesus answered and said unto her, O woman, great is thy faith: be it unto thee even as thou wilt. And her daughter was made whole from that very hour.
I took that to mean that Jesus wasn't praying for them in that prayer at that time.
"God is not slack, as some men count slackness; but is long suffering to us ward, not willing for any to perish, but for all to come to repentance."
Think of faith as a muscle that is used to get things done, it doesn't just sit there; existing.
The gifts of the Spirit function by faith, if you don't believe in them, you'll never use your gift(s), which scripture teaches we all have. Our prayer requests are also obtained of the Lord by our faith. Choosing to believe the Lord's word more than my circumstance as I persevere in believing him for the object of my request. The Lord who wants us to grow so so much, will often hold back the desired request even after the required faith is met, just to aid us in learning perseverance. This will often make the Lord to be the God of the last minute.
The thing you have to think about, is, who are the "any" and "all" under consideration. The word "us-ward" means that Peter is including himself in his warning to (2 Pet 1:1 - those who have like precious faith), telling them that when they commit a sin, in order to not perish=death=separate themselves from his fellowship, temporary, until they repent.
He is praying for those that he choose out of the world. He does not pray for the world that hates him.
Everyone is saved (or not) the in same way.
[Jhn 17:9 KJV] 9 I pray for them: I pray not for the world, but for them which thou hast given me; for they are thine.
[Jhn 6:39 KJV] 39 And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day.
The "us-ward" of 2 Pet 3:9 are the elect and not all of mankind. We can see that in the salutation of 2 Pet 1:1.
[2Pe 1:1 KJV] 1 Simon Peter, a servant and an apostle of Jesus Christ, to them that have obtained like precious faith with us through the righteousness of God and our Saviour Jesus Christ:
Jesus prayed to the Father while on the cross, "Father forgive them for they know not what they do."
I am picky about context when studying scripture, but I have to admit that I consider changing the meaning of the words in the original Greek text to be heresy. Things like arm = power, head = authority, and face = book, or all and any meaning otherwise than what's referenced by context.
The Lord has magnified his word above all his name and the scriptures is one of a very few things that will cross over to heaven when this world ends. The Lord means exactly what he says and if our doctrines and or understanding do not conform to the full council of God or all of the scripture, then it's not the Lord who has it wrong.
You are correct in holding to the fact that all of the scriptures must harmonize.
Some of the Jews that were responsible in wanting Jesus to be crucified were already born again, and those were the ones that Jesus was asking his Father to forgive.
When a person is born again, God transforms them from being spiritually dead in sins (Eph 2:1) to being spiritually alive in Christ with the indwelling of the Holy Spirit.
One part of that transformation is that God exchanges the heart of stone of the natural person(1 Cor 2:14) to a heart of flesh, (Esek 11:19 and 2 Cor 3:3) that can be "pricked" (Acts 2:36-37) to feel guilt about spiritual things.
To show the contrast in their response, when hearing Stephen preach the same accusing sermon (Acts 51-54) that Peter preached on the day of Pentecost, Those natural beings, being cut to the heart, responded by gnashing on Stephen with their teeth.
Jesus is right .
What of this, from John 20, immediately following Jesus' resurrection?
10 Then the disciples returned to their homes. 11 But Mary stood outside the tomb weeping.
And as she wept, she bent down to look into the tomb, 12 and she saw two angels in white
sitting where the body of Jesus had lain, one at the head and the other at the feet.
13 “Woman, why are you weeping?” they asked.
“Because they have taken my Lord away,” she said, “and I do not know where they have put Him.”
14 When she had said this, she turned around and saw Jesus
standing there; but she did not recognize that it was Jesus.
15 “Woman, why are you weeping?” Jesus asked. “Whom are you seeking?”
Thinking He was the gardener, she said, “Sir, if you have carried
Him off, tell me where you have put Him, and I will get Him.”
16 Jesus said to her, “Mary.”
She turned and said to Him in Hebrew, “Rabboni!” (which means “Teacher”).
17 “Do not cling to Me,” Jesus said, “for I have not yet ascended to the Father. But go and
tell My brothers, ‘I am ascending to My Father and your Father, to My God and your God.’ ”
18 Mary Magdalene went and announced to the disciples, “I have
seen the Lord!” And she told them what He had said to her.
19 It was the first day of the week, and that very evening, while the disciples were together with
the doors locked for fear of the Jews, Jesus came and stood among them. “Peace be with you!”
He said to them. 20 After He had said this, He showed them His hands and His side.
The disciples rejoiced when they saw the Lord.
21 Again Jesus said to them, “Peace be with you. As the Father has sent Me, so also I am sending you.”
22 When He had said this, He breathed on them and said, “Receive the Holy Spirit."
Hey Forest...
Jesus tells us in Jn 16: 7 KJV "Nevertheless I tell you the truth; it is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you."
It's just not possible for a person to have been born again or born of the Spirit while Jesus was still here. And to take that idea one step farther, I'll add that the new covenant was not as yet inaugurated because Jesus was still alive and a testament is not in effect while its testator lives. For myself, I suspect that the new covenant didn't become active until Jesus presented his blood to the Father in the true temple in New Jerusalem which the Lord himself pitched.
I used New Jerusalem rather than heaven because scripture tells us that New Jerusalem is the mother of us all. : )
It is my belief, that the scriptures teach that the old testament saints are born again in the same manner as the new testament saints are, with the indwelling of the Holy Spirit. One of the verses that reinforces that is Isaiah 63:11 - Then he remembered the days of old, Mosos, and his people, saying, where is he that brought them up out of the sea, with the shepherd of his flock? Where is he that PUT HIS HOLY SPIRIT WITHIN HIM?
God is a 3 in 1 God. The Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit, each having a different function. My belief, according to the scriptures, is that the Holy Spirit, also, has different functions. He indwells us as a part of being born again, He reveals the truths of the scriptures to those who have been born again, and He is a comforter to the born again.