Has the Church Helped in Teaching Sexual Purity?

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Has the Church Helped in Teaching Sexual Purity?

  • Yes

    Votes: 2 22.2%
  • Unsure

    Votes: 3 33.3%
  • Other

    Votes: 4 44.4%

  • Total voters
    9
  • Poll closed .

notmyown

Senior Member
May 26, 2016
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#21
Sorry for the long title. I don't mean this to get too personal or too graphic. It's just something that has been on my heart and mind lately. It would help if you didn't mind saying what age group you are and if you have been married before. Share anything you like but like I said this is more opinion then digging in to anyones personal life. Thank you.
even if all that was ever preached from the pulpit was purity, think about just that one hour a week compared to the very LOUD voice of society 24/7.
 

notmyown

Senior Member
May 26, 2016
4,927
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#22
In many ways, I'm glad I never became a parent, because I don't know if I would have been able to guide young people through these ever-increasing challenges.
if you mean successfully, we can try, we can pray. who is up to such a task? i don't know anyone. :/
 

ThereRoseaLamb

Well-known member
Jan 17, 2023
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#23
Thank you all for your responses and your openness in your answers. I am taking my time to read them now while keeping an eye on severe weather in our area. Never know when you have to run for shelter.

Full disclosure, I posted in the family forum, that my nephew at 18 has gotten his gf pregnant. As a family the only word I could use is devastated. My nephews have been raised in church, told of the downfalls of sex too early. He came to me a couple years ago and I felt I was straightforward as I could be without having spoken to his parents first. My nephew wasn't running with the wrong people, he wasn't getting bad grades or rebelling, no red flags that I could see. He was in JORTC, preparing for a military career and was very dedicated to that. So much so that my younger nephew also got involved. They are up with the birds doing service for their community. And in 6 months dating his gf all that changed. And I thought, we are missing the mark somewhere. So I am reading your responses now and I just would appreciate if you kept my nephew and the whole situation in prayer. I will get back to your posts asap. Have a blessed day!
 

HeIsHere

Well-known member
May 21, 2022
5,980
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#24
I can relate to this. I think in some Christian circles, there's so much fear about mentioning anything even remotely related to sex that it creates an unhealthy curiousity - an artificial boundary which is normal for people to want to understand, but once understood, there is no boundary remaining to prevent transgression to where the boundary should have been placed - at sexual sin.

I remember a pastor at church once cut short a sermon reading from Song of Solomon because the verse mentioned the beloved's breasts. By the grace of God I was never involved in pornography, but I can understand boys becoming involved at first simply due to curiousity, because some Christians are so scared of explaining the basic facts of life given some people will, of their own volition, ultimately decide to go ahead and commit sexual sin.

I think Christians who put unneeded taboos on sensible talk of sex and female anatomy ultimately work to counteract a Christian understanding of sex and sexual purity.

Do you think men need to discuss female anatomy with other males?
How will this discussion help preserve the biblical view of marriage?
 

HeIsHere

Well-known member
May 21, 2022
5,980
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#25
Thank you all for your responses and your openness in your answers. I am taking my time to read them now while keeping an eye on severe weather in our area. Never know when you have to run for shelter.

Full disclosure, I posted in the family forum, that my nephew at 18 has gotten his gf pregnant. As a family the only word I could use is devastated. My nephews have been raised in church, told of the downfalls of sex too early. He came to me a couple years ago and I felt I was straightforward as I could be without having spoken to his parents first. My nephew wasn't running with the wrong people, he wasn't getting bad grades or rebelling, no red flags that I could see. He was in JORTC, preparing for a military career and was very dedicated to that. So much so that my younger nephew also got involved. They are up with the birds doing service for their community. And in 6 months dating his gf all that changed. And I thought, we are missing the mark somewhere. So I am reading your responses now and I just would appreciate if you kept my nephew and the whole situation in prayer. I will get back to your posts asap. Have a blessed day!

We live in an over the top sexualized society and we do not even realize it any more.
I am not sure we can expect different results from our youth when the church has had its part in promoting the great sexual revolution.
 

JohnDB

Well-known member
Jan 16, 2021
6,243
2,537
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#26
I have to wonder if one of the reasons the church has a hard time selling purity, and can only resort to fear-based tactics ("you'll go to hell!") is because so many of us know many people who followed all the rules, did all the right things, and yet things have turned out horribly for them. Two of the girls in my high school at the time I was there outwardly did "all the right things" and it resulted in abusive spouses taking their lives. In each case, the girls were shot to death by their husbands -- one in front of her 3 children, as the oldest, about 11 at the time, was trying frantically to call 911
EXACTLY.....

The church is great at "do's and donts " but extremely thin on the why of any of it other than as you have stated here.

There's actually a laundry list of reasons for physical purity that have nothing to do with Hell or displeasing God or any other sort of fear mongering...but since the church isn't teaching them nobody knows them.

And they haven't taught them for a very very very long time.

Why is pornography bad?

How close to the line can a young couple get without crossing it?

Everyone has had sex: will I remain unmarried if I hold out for a 39 year old virgin?

There are answers to these questions that have the kid's best interests at heart....not condemnation and browbeating.
 
Sep 15, 2019
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#27
Do you think men need to discuss female anatomy with other males?
How will this discussion help preserve the biblical view of marriage?
It's normal (in my view) to want to understand how the world works, which includes about sex. I think as females are a little more complicated than males, and as there is often more of a taboo about talking female anatomy, if there is not a Christian way for this information to be communicated, boys will turn to other means to obtain the information, which may involve pornography, but certainly will not include the clear boundaries that God puts on sex (i.e. reserved for marriage).

My point was really if even pastors are too scared to quote verses the bible speaks plainly of (e.g. Song of Solomon 4:5) this spreads to the parents and teachers in Christian schools, and they in turn don't speak plainly or clearly about sex to their children or students (really a parent's job in my opinion, but in this fallen world, Christian schools can be the next best thing). The children then seek out the information through other means, which doesn't have the same safeguards and cautions that scripture provides. I don't believe scripture prohibits learning about sex - it restricts sexual activity to within marriage. When the prohibitions are put on the wrong thing (e.g. learning about sex), natural curiosity will overcome this, but then nothing is left for where the prohibition should have been - engaging in sex outside of marriage.
 

HeIsHere

Well-known member
May 21, 2022
5,980
2,306
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#28
It's normal (in my view) to want to understand how the world works, which includes about sex. I think as females are a little more complicated than males, and as there is often more of a taboo about talking female anatomy, if there is not a Christian way for this information to be communicated, boys will turn to other means to obtain the information, which may involve pornography, but certainly will not include the clear boundaries that God puts on sex (i.e. reserved for marriage).

My point was really if even pastors are too scared to quote verses the bible speaks plainly of (e.g. Song of Solomon 4:5) this spreads to the parents and teachers in Christian schools, and they in turn don't speak plainly or clearly about sex to their children or students (really a parent's job in my opinion, but in this fallen world, Christian schools can be the next best thing). The children then seek out the information through other means, which doesn't have the same safeguards and cautions that scripture provides. I don't believe scripture prohibits learning about sex - it restricts sexual activity to within marriage. When the prohibitions are put on the wrong thing (e.g. learning about sex), natural curiosity will overcome this, but then nothing is left for where the prohibition should have been - engaging in sex outside of marriage.
Well you did not really answer my question, but skirted around it.

Do you think in biblical times men taught women about sex or women taught men about sex?
 
Sep 15, 2019
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#29
Well you did not really answer my question, but skirted around it.

Do you think in biblical times men taught women about sex or women taught men about sex?
Oh. Preferably not, I would suggest. I didn't realise that was the question.
 

HeIsHere

Well-known member
May 21, 2022
5,980
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#30
Oh. Preferably not, I would suggest. I didn't realise that was the question.
It wasn't my original question, but along the same lines.

I suspect in biblical times the women taught the women and the men taught the men and perhaps after marriage the husband and wife discussed sex.
 

ThereRoseaLamb

Well-known member
Jan 17, 2023
4,790
2,079
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#31
We live in an over the top sexualized society and we do not even realize it any more.
I am not sure we can expect different results from our youth when the church has had its part in promoting the great sexual revolution.
I was born just after the "revolution". Could you explain what you mean by the church promoting it?
 

ThereRoseaLamb

Well-known member
Jan 17, 2023
4,790
2,079
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#32
What do you mean by sexual purity? My church has warned against premarital sex but I have never understood what "sexual purity" really means. Does it mean avoiding activities with the opposite gender? There are dances called purity balls which I find offputting.

I do believe that the church teaching on chastity is fine and Biblical but not really sure what "sexual purity" means. Whatever it is, I find it extreme and unnecessary.
I'm not sure I meant it any certain way. I know for a while there many were wearing purity rings, promising not to have sex until marriage. Some seemed to think that was a farce. IDK if any studies were done on it. I know parents will have their own rules as to when and how their child can date. I guess I'm just kind of comparing sex as taught in schools vs what influence the church has on the subject. I mean, we seem to be fine letting our schools teach how to put on condom on a banana but people get their hackles up if the church so much as mentions sex. Especially to teens.
 

ThereRoseaLamb

Well-known member
Jan 17, 2023
4,790
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#33
I cant say as didnt go to any christian school, but we do have parenting books in the church library and some of them mention it (and also separate books for men and women) but as far as I know its not taught explicitly

Even in womens conferences nobody really talks about it. I think people know basic hygiene and there are of course sanitary bins in womens toilets but whether the church ever teaches about menstruation I wouldnt know.

The most children may get is in year 5 and 6 a nurse comes to school with some pads and tampns and give you a booklet about what your vagina looks like on the inside. Its not mentioned how sex is done and its presumed parents would tell children about birds and bees.

Most parents dont or only mention in passing. I know young children are curious and they sometimes ask me or they may have seen their parents do it (by accident) or if living on a farm animals mate.

Yeah, it seems to me that secular schooling is where most people have gotten their sex education. I'm not sure what year it started but I went through it and my hubby is 5 yrs older and he went through it. I think what I'm seeing here is that most of what we learn about our bodies and sex is taught in school and very few parents step in because they believe school covered it. So I guess that begs the next question, did your (anyone posting here) parents teach you about sex or leave it up to school education? My mother was a nurse so at the right age, she would update us on what we needed to know. She didn't feel it was up to the school to teach such personal things so I think we were quite informed for our ages.
 

ThereRoseaLamb

Well-known member
Jan 17, 2023
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#34
Ever wonder WHY we are supposed to avoid fornication?

Ever notice all the drama and crap that people who sleep around eventually have to deal with? ;)

Our pastor wasn't always a Christian. Once he was one of the good ole boys down at the bar, smoking weed and etc.

I don't know about any other churches, but at our church we understand the reasons why we should avoid that kind of stuff. Our pastor is quite frank (without being pornographic) about the grief it brings.

See I fear that is not the case in many churches. I do not recall any church I attended bringing up the issue. Now in their defense, I began to travel when I was 16 and didn't attend Sunday school after that time. But I still don't believe anything much, if anything was said about it.

I do understand that people that come out of the world see those pitfalls faster than people who are churchified. My own father didn't grow up in church. My grandmother raised 5 boys on her own. But again, that was something you didn't talk about, the shame was too great and long after she became a Christian she never could forgive herself for her failings. It just seems to me that the church has its blinders on when it comes to sex, not only for our youth but how it affects marriages too.
 

MsMediator

Well-known member
Mar 8, 2022
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#35
I think, to be honest, everything goes back to bad or imperfect parenting. The child is getting the rebellion streak from somewhere. No one here mentioned the parents, but are trying to point the finger at the church or society. With good parenting, a child should be able to withstand the influences of society and see the importance of chasity. However, the parents are not getting the message through in some way. There could be many reasons, such as parents not getting along on their own, being able to communicate with their kids well, etc.
 

ThereRoseaLamb

Well-known member
Jan 17, 2023
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#36
This reminds me of when I was in Lutheran grade school and the boys were discussing women's bodies among themselves, because they didn't understand how sex worked as far as the female mechanics were concerned.

One boy thought the crucial part on a woman for sex was the belly button.

He said he later figured everything out, but it was due to seeking out pornographic materials (and these were the days long before the internet, when kids who weren't told about sex might find out from a stack of magazines they found hidden in their parent's closets.)
This reminds me of my mother saying her mother told her "a man is not a stick" and that was her sex education. She says that to this day she has no idea what that meant. lol Sometimes though it seems that with all the information we have today that you would think this issue would almost be erased. We even have tv shows showing the hardships of teen pregnancy. For some reason it still isn't taking hold.
 

ThereRoseaLamb

Well-known member
Jan 17, 2023
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#37
Oh trust me I know that all too well...

I think a large part of it is the conviction that "I'm smart enough to avoid the penalty." We are certain we have figured out how to get what we want and get around the downside that comes with it.

Sometimes we think this over and over and over. No matter how often we get hurt, or hurt others, we keep thinking "Okay THIS time I've got it mastered."

We're not alone though. Solomon was the wisest person ever, and he thought he could have what he want and get around what God said would result from it...
I got entangled with a man once. I told myself at first that it was "ministry" because that was how it began. Before long it became a relationship. One night he called me drunk and I knew all the red flags were there, but it didn't stop me. My mother gently reminded me I was headed too far from the path, what I knew was right. But I was like a fly caught in the light of a bug zapper. It was like I could not turn loose and I believe he saw that and used it against me. Luckily, even at the age I was, I had a praying mother. And that person was taken away across the country to a job where his true intent was revealed and my eyes were painfully opened. What a blessing a praying mother is, at any age.
 

Lanolin

Well-known member
Dec 15, 2018
23,460
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#38
Yeah, it seems to me that secular schooling is where most people have gotten their sex education. I'm not sure what year it started but I went through it and my hubby is 5 yrs older and he went through it. I think what I'm seeing here is that most of what we learn about our bodies and sex is taught in school and very few parents step in because they believe school covered it. So I guess that begs the next question, did your (anyone posting here) parents teach you about sex or leave it up to school education? My mother was a nurse so at the right age, she would update us on what we needed to know. She didn't feel it was up to the school to teach such personal things so I think we were quite informed for our ages.
no my parents didnt teach me anything about it, they were not teachers

Mum just said dont sleep with any boys till you married and that was it.
I did ask her once about what it was like to have babies and she said was like going to the toilet. I remember asking my aunties about boys they said 'oh you have this feeling' but otherwise no as talking about that stuff with your parents/mum was too embarassing.

One of mums friends was a midwife and knew all about having babies but she never had babies herself when she was married.

At school everyone was 'going round' with each other from an early age from primary. I was a late developer so stayed quite innocent up to around age 16 (where it seems everyone was on heat) although def was aware of things before that age.

I read my sisters Dolly magazines that seemed to answer q's about it. Also womens magazines would sometimes mention it in their personal columns. I had an older sister but dont remember ever discussing anything with her about it. We had cats, and the neighbours had a female cat that they never bothered getting her spayed so she was always attracting toms. She was forever pregnant and thats mostly how I learned about sex. And cats mating is a noisy affair. Like a gangbang.
 

ThereRoseaLamb

Well-known member
Jan 17, 2023
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#39
In all the churches I've gone to, the pastors have never directly talked about sex in their sermons and how to overcome its temptations. I appreciate that you are asking about sexual purity because you're right, it's not just about avoiding having sex out of marriage. It's also about not committing sexual deviance whether within marriage or outside of it.

For me personally, I had learned to control sexual desire by being fully submitted to the Holy Spirit - He really does make a big difference! But it took quite a while to learn that even though the Bible says it plainly. I wish the churches talked a whole lot more about the Holy Spirit's role in helping us live according to holy standards. Submitting to the Holy Spirit and letting Him empower us really does make it so much easier to resist not only having sex outside of marriage, but keeping out of sexual deviance as well.


Perfect response! It seems that the church is struggling to reach their own, let alone those outside the walls. And sex is a huge issue as we see. It's not just the temptation of sex before marriage, but who you are having it with. We have young people that are buying into lies about who they are and that who they have sex with defines who they are. And the church seems lost in all of this. It's like they are white knuckling their way through the mire and muck with no real answers or help for lost youth, let alone adults. We can't seem to find deliverance, we can seem to shield our own children from the world. How can we then reach out to others?
 

NotmebutHim

Senior Member
May 17, 2015
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#40
I think another big elephant in the room regarding sexual purity is the ideal that ALL male sexuality is inherently "dirty" and "harmful to women".

Some of this comes from the idea of asceticism, which teaches that all physical needs/pleasures are bad and that one should always avoid such if he/she wants to remain spiritual. Some of it also comes from the (mis)use of Jesus' warning against adultery in the heart as a "hammer" or "club" on Christian men. I could go into a long explanation of what the word "lust" means in the context of Matthew 5, but the gist is that Matthew 5:28 has been interpreted by some to mean that anytime a man looks at a woman and feels sexually attracted to her, regardless of the circumstances and regardless of his or her marital status, that it is automatically adultery in the heart. Finding a woman sexually attractive is not inherently sinful; coveting her (if she is another man's wife or girlfriend) definitely is.

It is my belief that books such as "Every Man's Battle" are promoting asceticism and "male sexuality is dirty/sinful". I also don't care for the notion that a man shouldn't feel sexually attracted to a woman because she is "somebody's daughter". Well I would submit that the man is "somebody's son."

"Purity culture" hurts men based on how they think, and it hurts women based on how they present themselves.

$0.02