Question for those who believe in a Pre-Tribulation Rapture

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TabinRivCA

TabinRivCA

Well-known member
#81
Oct 23, 2018
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#81
Musicmaster said:
I'm not sure why he thought that the rapture was at all associated with the Second Coming. They are not at all similar. Those who really do know the Bible can differentiate that from what is written about the character of the two entrances of the Lord into this realm. The angels, at Christ's departure said that He would return in like manner for us. The character of the Second coming is vastly different in character, considering that He will then be returning in wrath, destroying His enemies. That is not at all what will happen at His coming for His body, which is showering us with blessing as He was doing at His departure.

So, Graham, like so many other super stars, got it wrong by comparing the rapture, when His Feet never touch the ground, with His Second Coming when His Feet do touch down upon the earth and the mountain splits in half, destroying the wicked city of spiritual Babylon in the process, otherwise known as ancient Jerusalem. The cataclysm of that mountain splitting by way of the fault they have already found running east and west through Zion, yeah. It's going to be epic in its destruction of that wicked, spiritual Sodom of a city.

MM
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Scripture for ancient Jerusalem being spiritual Babylon, please.
 
Musicmaster

Musicmaster

Active member
#83
Feb 8, 2021
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#83
TabinRivCA said:
Scripture for ancient Jerusalem being spiritual Babylon, please.
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So, you're going to stick with Peter writing his epistle from within Babylonian ruins inhabited by nothing but pagan nomads. Where does scripture back up any idea Peter was in Babylon...ever? If you think you have something better than mere antagonism, them we're all ears...

Or, how about Rome as being Babylon, or New York...please...

See how lacking that is?

MM
 
Genez

Genez

Junior Member
#85
Oct 12, 2017
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#85
Musicmaster said:
Paul was speaking to the body of Christ, not Israel. The body of Christ will dwell in "heavenly places," not the New Earth nor the New Jerusalem.

MM
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Yes... we will be in heaven and commute to earth to reign with Him. In a flash it would be done.

You ever leave your house to go to work?
 
sawdust

sawdust

Active member
#86
Feb 12, 2024
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Darwin, NT
#86
Musicmaster said:
The Evangelical teaching that the Church is the bride of Christ, it's false, and here's why:

Revelation 21:9-10, 12, 14, 24-26
9 And there came unto me one of the seven angels which had the seven vials full of the seven last plagues, and talked with me, saying, Come hither, I will shew thee the bride, the Lamb's wife.
10 And he carried me away in the spirit to a great and high mountain, and shewed me that great city, the holy Jerusalem, descending out of heaven from God, ...
12 And had a wall great and high, [and] had twelve gates, and at the gates twelve angels, and names written thereon, which are [the names] of the twelve tribes of the children of Israel: ...
14 And the wall of the city had twelve foundations, and in them the names of the twelve apostles of the Lamb. ...
24 And the nations of them which are saved shall walk in the light of it: and the kings of the earth do bring their glory and honour into it.
25 And the gates of it shall not be shut at all by day: for there shall be no night there. 26 And they shall bring the glory and honour of the nations into it.

As we can see, it's the names of all the tribes of Israel, and the apostles that were written upon it, not Europe, America, Africa, or any other names of nations. Instead, we see that the nations bring tribute into the city, which would imply that they live outside the city for them to bring into the city the glory and honor from outside the city that will rest upon the new earth.

The body of Christ will not live there, and here's why:

2 Corinthians 5:1 For we know that if our earthly house of [this] tabernacle were dissolved, we have a building of God, an house not made with hands, eternal in the heavens.

Paul was speaking to the body of Christ, not Israel. The body of Christ will dwell in "heavenly places," not the New Earth nor the New Jerusalem.

MM
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Ah I see. Ok I understand better now why you say what you say. I will need to look into it further although, I'm not sure it is quite as simple as you say. :)
 
Musicmaster

Musicmaster

Active member
#87
Feb 8, 2021
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#87
Genez said:
Yes... we will be in heaven and commute to earth to reign with Him. In a flash it would be done.

You ever leave your house to go to work?
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At least Sawdust is willing to look into it more than just sit back on the laurels and ridicule and antagonize.

How pathetic indeed.

MM
 
Musicmaster

Musicmaster

Active member
#88
Feb 8, 2021
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#88
sawdust said:
Ah I see. Ok I understand better now why you say what you say. I will need to look into it further although, I'm not sure it is quite as simple as you say. :)
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There are more complex levels to which we may go, but I wanted to make it easy enough for the sake of other readers who prefer direct and concise reasoning and scripture.

MM
 
TabinRivCA

TabinRivCA

Well-known member
#89
Oct 23, 2018
12,834
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#89
Musicmaster said:
Read post #78

MM
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'2 Corinthians 11:2: Paul expresses his commitment to the Corinthian church by saying, “I am jealous for you with a godly jealousy. I promised you to one husband, to Christ, so that I might present you as a pure virgin to him.”
Musicmaster said:
So, you're going to stick with Peter writing his epistle from within Babylonian ruins inhabited by nothing but pagan nomads. Where does scripture back up any idea Peter was in Babylon...ever? If you think you have something better than mere antagonism, them we're all ears...

Or, how about Rome as being Babylon, or New York...please...

See how lacking that is?

MM
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I stick with Scripture not guesswork. You don't have Scripture for your assumption?
 
TMS

TMS

Senior Member
#90
Mar 21, 2015
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#90
homwardbound said:
And for those that say one remains dead and does not see after life. I say what about the transfiguration, the disciples seeing Moses and Elijah and Jesus in white,
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God can raise us when ever He chooses
God has the power of life

Moses died and God choose to raise him
Technically Jesus had not paid the price but we will not go into the legal side.

Moses represents the dead that are raised and Elijah represents the living that meet the Lord in the air. First fruits of the resurrection.

The Bible does not contradict itself.
Ecc 9:5-6
5 For the living know that they shall die: but the dead know not any thing, neither have they any more a reward; for the memory of them is forgotten. 6 Also their love, and their hatred, and their envy, is now perished; neither have they any more a portion for ever in any thing that is done under the sun.
 
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