The Gospels and the Mystery
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The publicizing a requirement is not illogical; not publishing it would be.
[2Co 2:15-16 KJV]
15 For we are unto God a sweet savour of Christ, in them that are saved, and in them that perish:
16 To the one [we are] the savour of death unto death; and to the other the savour of life unto life. And who [is] sufficient for these things?
I said, "certain powers". You are taking liberties with what I posted.
And with that, I'm done.
No, I only read the Bible but thanks for the compliment. You weren't aware those verses are in the Bible?
[Eph 2:1 KJV] 1 And you [hath he quickened], who were dead in trespasses and sins;
[Col 2:13 KJV] 13 And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses;
I was showing you that the word “redeemer” is often used as a physical deliverer.
Sure it can, but physical redemption is always meant to picture spiritual redemption. And that's what I was attempting to show you. Read the entire passage. The language suggests Job understood more than simply physical redemption.
the scripture says they knew salvation was coming, that the Son would come and suffer, but not when:
1 Peter 1:10-12
Of this salvation the prophets have inquired and searched carefully, who prophesied of the grace [that would come] to you, searching what, or what manner of time, the Spirit of Christ who was in them was indicating when He testified beforehand the sufferings of Christ and the glories that would follow. To them it was revealed that, not to themselves, but to us they were ministering the things which now have been reported to you through those who have preached the gospel to you by the Holy Spirit sent from heaven—things which angels desire to look into.
how do you long to look into something that you don't even know exists?Adam is saved by faith, covered by the blood of the Lamb.
you will just have to apologize to him, in glory.
please listen to the lecture series i posted for you. no reason to remain obstinately ignorant when food is on your plate in front of you. i will check back in a few weeks to see how you liked it.
I was redering to your hypothetical conditionals.
But to answer your question, I'll quite Paul:-
What then shall we say was gained by Abraham, t our forefather
according to the flesh? For if Abraham was justified by works, he has something to boast about, but not before God. For what does the Scripture say? “Abraham believed God, and it was counted to him as righteousness.” romans 4:2-3
And I am sure you have read Hebrews chapter 11?
I'll finish with the first couple of verses in Hebrews 12 :-
Therefore, since we are surrounded by so great a cloudof witnesses, let us also lay aside every weight, and w sin which clings so closely, and let us run with endurance the race that is set before us, looking to Jesus, the founder and perfecter of our faith, a who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising b the shame, and is seated at the right hand of the throne of God.
Let's just say that I am indeed aware of those verses, but I do not subscribe to the interpretation Sproul applied to them, along with all those who are with him on that bandwagon.
MM
It wasn't until the Council of Jerusalem that the salvation of the Gentiles became such a hot topic that it had to be dealt with decisively. Something like 15 years down the road from Pentecost.
Abraham and Jesus are friends.
Your assertion that he does not know Him is baseless.
we don't need a while new thread in some far distant future to establish that, and it is 100% germaine to the question of whether the gospel of Christ existed before 33 AD.
Frankly Sproul was a disaster. Hardcore Reformed with all of the baggage.
Massive baggage.
Death as God describes death = separation.
The Calvinist interpretation of those passages are a disaster. Epic epic disaster.
Among many others.
the doctrine of human depravity in existant recorded post apostolic Christian theology dates back to at least Augustine and comes from scripture not imagination. Genesis 3, Romans 5.
we have freedom but we are also constrained by sinfulness. only the degree to which that corruption constrains us is up for debate.
if we were capable of goodness Christ died for nothing.
If we were not capable of choice Christ likewise died for nothing.
I'm just wondering how much depravity unfallen Eve and unfallen angels had........before they were deceived and "fell to their deaths".
No, it doesn't mean separation, it means death. Nekros is the word used in the verses I provided.
Separation as death is a different word, although they both either explicitly mean, or imply dead or death.
You don't like to accept that death actually means death? That is why your interpretations are usually so wrong
Henceforth don't bother me with your interpretations because I am not going to respond to them again.
[Eph 2:1 KJV] 1 And[G2532] you[G5209] [hath he quickened], who were[G5607] dead[G3498] in trespasses[G3900] and[G2532] sins;[G266]
[Col 2:13 KJV] 13 And[G2532] you,[G5209] being[G5607] dead[G3498] in[G1722] your sins[G3900] and[G2532] the uncircumcision[G203] of your[G5216] flesh,[G4561] hath he quickened together[G4806] with[G4862] him,[G846] having forgiven[G5483] you[G5213] all[G3956] trespasses;[G3900]
Dead:
nekros (Key) G3498
- properly
- one that has breathed his last, lifeless
- deceased, departed, one whose soul is in heaven or hell
- destitute of life, without life, inanimate
- metaph.
- spiritually dead
- destitute of a life that recognises and is devoted to God, because given up to trespasses and sins
- inactive as respects doing right
- destitute of force or power, inactive, inoperative
- spiritually dead
thanatos (Key) G2288
- the death of the body
- that separation (whether natural or violent) of the soul and the body by which the life on earth is ended
- with the implied idea of future misery in hell
- the power of death
- since the nether world, the abode of the dead, was conceived as being very dark, it is equivalent to the region of thickest darkness i.e. figuratively, a region enveloped in the darkness of ignorance and sin
- metaph., the loss of that life which alone is worthy of the name,
- the misery of the soul arising from sin, which begins on earth but lasts and increases after the death of the body in hell
- the miserable state of the wicked dead in hell
- in the widest sense, death comprising all the miseries arising from sin, as well physical death as the loss of a life consecrated to God and blessed in him on earth, to be followed by wretchedness in hell
Paul persecuted the church that is very true, he despised christ and his message, that is also true.
But,
On the road to damascus Paul encounteres the risen Lord and believed that one and same gospel he once despised. The one and only gospel.
None of the apostles preached what was handed down to them from men, only that which came from Christ. As with Paul the ither apostle received the gospel by revelation, by the word himself, as they walked with him.
I find it interestingnthat you miss out the ret of acts 21?
21and they have been told about you [Paul] that you [Paul] teach all the Jews who are among the Gentiles to forsake Moses, telling them not to circumcise their children or w walk according to our customs.
Not only that, but, Luke tells us :-
When we [Luke, Paul etc] had come to Jerusalem, the brothers received us gladly Acts 21:17)
Even better they glorified God for Pauls ministry and we kniw they all taught the one and same gospel from the jerusalem counsel Acts 15.
Anyhiw lets go back to acts 21 for this really just ends your argument, and shows it untenable.
Acts 21:23—24 read caredully!
Do therefore what we (James and the Jewish christians in Jerusalem) tell you(Paul) . We have four men y who are under a vow;
24take these men and purify yourself along with them and pay their expenses, so that they may shave their heads.
Thus all will know that there is nothing in what they have been told about you, but that you(Paul) yourself also live in observance of the law.
James is saying to Paul to do the nazarite vow, and all will know that Paul himself lives in observance of the law.
Theres your problem right there.... Your choice makes Christs work efficacious.
Your saying its your choice that makes Christs person and work (atonement etc) effective.
You would not be able to substatiate such a claim from scripture, from mans mind yes, from scripture, no!