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Genez

Junior Member
Oct 12, 2017
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We do need to have the right commands, too. Modern Bibles even change some of God's commands. 2 Timothy 2:15 is one such command that is changed. Do you study to shew yourself approved unto God? Or do you follow the Modern Bibles alteration on this verse? ..
What is your problem??????

2 Timothy 2:15

Do your best to present yourself to God as one approved, a worker who does not need
to be ashamed and who correctly handles the word of truth.
Give diligence to present thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to
be ashamed, handling aright the word of truth.


Tell me.. How can one handle rightly/correctly the Word of God? Without studying it?



You are really missing something....
 

Genez

Junior Member
Oct 12, 2017
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Because you are against the foundation of the faith (i.e., the Bible, the KJV).
You are for shape shifting Bibles and scholars, and not any real settled text that God has preserved for today.



And Jesus was worshiped by others. That does not mean we should be worshiped in the same way. While we are to follow the Lord, this takes discernment of God's Word. So, there is a vast difference between what our Lord does, vs. what we do. We obviously cannot die on the cross for people's sins and yet Jesus did this for us (being both God and man).



Did Jesus love us by going to the cross by dying in our place?
So does that mean we have to do the same exact thing? No, of course not. So again it takes proper study and rightly dividing the Word.
But if we believe we have an ever shape shifting text, or put our trust in Modern scribes to give us the Bible, how can we truly trust God in what He said?



,,,,
I remember when as a Jew how we celebrated the Easter Sedar. ;)
 
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What is your problem??????

2 Timothy 2:15

Do your best to present yourself to God as one approved, a worker who does not need
to be ashamed and who correctly handles the word of truth.
Give diligence to present thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to
be ashamed, handling aright the word of truth.


Tell me.. How can one handle rightly/correctly the Word of God? Without studying it?



You are really missing something....
There is a notable difference between the renderings in Modern Bibles, such as the NIV, and the KJV in this passage (2 Timothy 2:15).
  • KJV: "Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth."
  • Modern Bibles (e.g., NIV): "Do your best to present yourself to God as one approved, a worker who does not need to be ashamed and who correctly handles the word of truth."
The key differences here center on the words "study" (KJV) versus "do your best" (NIV) and "rightly dividing" (KJV) versus "correctly handles" (NIV).
  1. "Study" vs. "Do your best": In the KJV, "study" suggests a diligent, intentional effort to understand and discern the word of truth. The phrase implies a deeper commitment to learning and knowing Scripture thoroughly. "Do your best" in the NIV, while similar in spirit, has a broader meaning and does not necessarily imply focused, in-depth study. Instead, it can be interpreted more generally as simply trying one’s best in a broader sense, potentially losing the emphasis on deep, focused study of Scripture.
  2. "Rightly dividing" vs. "Correctly handles": "Rightly dividing" in the KJV conveys the idea of correctly discerning, interpreting, and teaching the word of truth with accuracy and precision, often understood as separating truth from error. "Correctly handles" in the NIV similarly suggests proper use and handling of Scripture but might lack the specific nuance of accurately distinguishing doctrinal truth.
So, while both translations call for diligence, the KJV’s language suggests a more intensive focus on studying Scripture to discern and apply its teachings accurately. In contrast, the wording in the NIV can imply a more general effort to use the word of truth correctly without the same emphasis on the meticulous study to divide truth rightly. This difference could lead readers to approach the Bible with a different mindset depending on which version they use.


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if God meant farthing He would have written farthing.

He did not.

it is important to Him to let us know this is a Greek word for a small Roman coin.
kjv simply butchers this.

that's all there is to be said.
Are you not for Mark Ward's parade of intelligibility?
Its not like foreign currency exchange calculators were common back then.
But again, even if this was an error (Which I do not believe it is), this would still be straining at gnats to the doctrinal points I brought up. I have over 50 of them and only showed you five.



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this is something you just have to come to grips with and make a decision about.

no axe.

just a little prick at the goads.
Acts 9:5 (KJV)

"And he said, Who art thou, Lord?​
And the Lord said, I am Jesus whom thou persecutest:​
it is hard for thee to kick against the pricks."​

The part that says, "it is hard for thee to kick against the pricks." is removed in Modern Bibles.
So we want all the words of God.


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Genez

Junior Member
Oct 12, 2017
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So you were once a Catholic who practiced the Christian seder also being a Jew?
Not sure what you are driving at here. Please explain.


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King James would be saying I celebrated the Easter Sedar.


Seems you are here to get us to dumb ourselves down by only reading the King James version.
 
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are you saying it's good to update the language of a translation so it fits modern speech and makes it relevant to the people of the day and age the translation is made?
My reply: — It depends. If God is against it, then it would be forbidden, right?
Seeing, we are living in the last days, this complicates the matter greatly.

While anything is possible with God, certain requirements would need to be met in order to put at ease many KJV believers who believe the KJV is the perfect and inerrant words of God for today (which I do not think is possible in this age of apostasy). But by some slim chance I am wrong, here are some of the requirements I believe would help put at ease KJV believers (like myself).

Requirement #1. The translator team should be: Forty-seven Trinitarian conservative believers who believe the KJV is the perfect and inerrant words of God and who believe that their soul could be at stake if they add or take away from God’s words (even in English). These KJV believers would naturally also believe that the Critical Text (Vaticanus and Sinaticus) are corrupt and teach false doctrines (Note: As I stated before, I have personally cataloged over 50 of these).​
Requirement #2. Health permitting, these believers who work on this KJV update would have to fast and pray together intensely on to honor God with this project.​
Requirement #3. There should be at least 2-3 KJV believers who have either lived in Greece at one time and or live there currently and know how to speak, read, listen, write Modern Greek, and they also have done extensive study on the Koine Greek. The same should be said for the Hebrew.​
Requirement #4. The definition should be supported by the context whenever possible, and a detailed explanation by those willing in the team to explain this along with sources used for where they got their definition from (Also backed up by Koine Greek, and even Modern Greek when applicable).​
Requirement #5. All changes should be noted in the KJV (Similar to the KJVER).​
Requirement #6. KJV advocates who may not be a part of the project and who have offered criticisms against other KJV updates should be consulted (If possible).​
Requirement #7. There should be seven companies and a rigorous refinement process and the other companies in sevens should review each other’s work (just like with the original KJV). A final committee should then hammer out the details of these many companies or groups.​
Requirement #8. Only archaic words that are truly archaic should be changed. If a Greek word has a deeper meaning, it should simply have a star next to it for further study.​
Requirement #9. It should be checked for errors by both humans and Ai tools over two to three years by multiple professional editors and KJV-onlyists. Feedback from KJV advocates not officially on the project at this point is critical before it would be published as an actual physical Bible.​
Requirement #10. No footnotes to the Critical Text, and no critical text advocates are allowed to give any feedback whatsoever, and if so, it should be reported immediately to the whole team on the project. Prayer and fasting should then be done for this type of situation (For the critical text person to see the truth, and for the project to not be tainted by this individual seeking to destroy God’s preserved Word in English). While Modern Bibles could be consulted to help flesh out the 1600s English and the Greek and Hebrew, they should be discussed by the whole team and treated with the utmost suspicion.​
Requirement #11. An attempt should be made to do a more faithful update of Beza's fifth edition (1598) as a parallel Bible option. While Scrivener was close, he did not accomplish this task. In this update, it will show which was originally Beza’s edition, and what was updated slightly (20 translatable differences) in the Greek that are not present in Beza. The Greek words should either be color coded or marked to distinguish between Beza and the 20 translatable differences. A similar effort should be done for the Hebrew (Masoretic).​
Requirement #12. No words should be added or taken away. Words can only be changed to reflect the updated Modern word.​
Side Note:

A List of Common Critical Text Scholar false interpretations should be included along with a list of removed verses or words in Modern Bibles giving us the history of both the KJV, and the history of the corrupt Westcott and Hort Movement.


I say all this because you need a Bible that is as accurate to what the KJV translators created and you need a text that honors the church who believes in a perfect and inerrant Word as Scripture teaches. If not, you can forget it. You will not convince the die hard KJV advocate if one jot or tittle is out of place or it is mistranslated.
Right, I agree because I am one of those kind of KJV advocates who wants every jot and tittle (metaphorically speaking) in his KJV.
If a word was radically changed like from "farthing" to "asserion," it would need to have tons of sources and show the previous traditional KJV word at the bottom. Words like "hath" to "has" can simply be noted in beginning section of the KJV. Experts on ancient Rome involving their currency should be consulted, as well (and should be sited if in fact "asserion" is the proper coin mentioned here).

You said:
because there is zero equivalence between an ancient Roman currency and a short-lived 17th century British coin that was never, ever, ever used in Israel, ever. that's a transparent toadism excuse on your part.
Its speaking to an English audience who would not have known what the Roman currency was. The use of "farthing" in the KJV is not an error but a reflection of the translators' effort to make the text accessible to their contemporary audience.

You said:
but if your argument is kjv is 100% perfect because it purposefully mistranslated a word to make it relevant to an early 17th century audience then you are forced to confess it should be retranslated to make it relevant to a 21st century audience. it should say a dollar. a euro. 5 pesos.
I see what the KJV translators did as unique to their time, influenced by several factors. Since the creation of the KJV in 1611, Bible printing was still relatively new—dating back only to the Gutenberg Bible in 1455. The Catholics almost destroyed the KJV with a super bomb, and it caused three of the greatest revivals and formed the Protestant Christian world in English speaking countries. Its idioms are used by both believers and non-believers. It is the most printed book in the world. Between 1604, and 1611, their world was not like the one we live in. The KJV translators were limited, but that did not mean God was not moving them to preserve His words by such an effort. But yes. If there was a KJV update done today, the world we live in has more access to certain information, and we would be able to update that word to reflect the actual intended coin (if it was God's will).

You said:
which means it's not perfect.
I disagree.

You said:
it was only perfect for at best 10 days before the currency exchange rate changed. and it was only perfect then for a small number of people in one pagan land who used that specific currency at that specific month of that specific year.
I believe God can communicate to a certain group of people using their language and culture if He desires. If God made this change or choice Himself as a part of a translation effort He approved, then by all means, it is not an error or imperfect. Hypothetically speaking: Perhaps God wanted to use the coin as more of a symbolic reference and not focus on the exact precise precise reality of the coin itself from that culture back in the 1600s. Could this change with a future KJV update whereby God now wants to also convey the preciseness of the actual coin? I don't know. Only God could bring such an effort to pass whereby many things would happen whereby the world could see that such a book was special like the original 1611. I pray that does happen, even though I have my doubts seeing we are living in the last days.

You said:
or you have no consistent argument and you are willing to make up stories to support the kjv no matter what the truth is.
Not really. I may come up with theories, but I will not come up with actual stories and say they are true. What I have is faith. I believe every detail of the KJV is accurate in 1600s to reflect the originals.

You said:
i didn't pick this because i have an axe.
i have a sword with a very sharp point.
one tiny word destroys your worldview.
Scripture says God has chosen the foolish things of this world to confound the wise. What could be more foolish in the eyes of scholarly men than for God to preserve His Words in 1600's English?
I would say that if there was no good fruit and no positive impact of the KJV, then I would say you would be on to something here.
But there are many evidences that show that the KJV is the pure Word of God for today. I have 150 Reasons for the KJV and they are very good reasons. I even removed some points or reasons I did not think that were as strong.

In any event, may the Lord bless you (even if we disagree).


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King James would be saying I celebrated the Easter Sedar.


Seems you are here to get us to dumb ourselves down by only reading the King James version.
Again, Easter and Passover are simply synonyms. Its a fact that Tyndale invented the word "Passover." It's why Textus Receptus Bibles (Before the KJV) had used both Passover and Easter interchangeably.


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Genez

Junior Member
Oct 12, 2017
2,687
391
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I keep trying, hoping reason will find a way.

But, with some people?
Reason will not work, no matter how wrong they are.
 
Nov 28, 2023
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I keep trying, hoping reason will find a way.

But, with some people?
Reason will not work, no matter how wrong they are.
So you want me to abandon the Bible?
Because if there is one error, just one, it might as well be a thousand errors, or 783,137 errors.
I mean, stop and think a moment. Faith is not always logical. Do you think Abraham was thinking it made sense that God was telling him to sacrifice his son Isaac? I am sure it was not rational or logical to him at all. But what he had was faith and trust. He believed what God said despite the evidence or reasons, etcetera.


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Genez

Junior Member
Oct 12, 2017
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Again, Easter and Passover are simply synonyms. Its a fact that Tyndale invented the word "Passover." It's why Textus Receptus Bibles (Before the KJV) had used both Passover and Easter interchangeably.
...
Easter has its roots in Eshtar. A pagan holiday.
It was a fertility rite celebration.

Which explains why we see 'rabbits' 'eggs' associated with it.

Satan has embedded distortions into the church where pagan converts being weak in doctrine wanted to cling to their old ways.
 
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I keep trying, hoping reason will find a way.

But, with some people?
Reason will not work, no matter how wrong they are.
Again, its not like I woke up one morning and seen a light shining on the KJV or I threw a dart and it just so happened to land on the KJV. I have many great reasons why the KJV is the perfect Word of God for today. I have 150 Good Reasons for the KJV. This should not be possible if things are as you say.


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Genez

Junior Member
Oct 12, 2017
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So you want me to abandon the Bible?
Because if there is one error, just one, it might as well be a thousand errors, or 783,137 errors.
I mean, stop and think a moment. Faith is not always logical. Do you think Abraham was thinking it made sense that God was telling him to sacrifice his son Isaac? I am sure it was not rational or logical to him at all. But what he had was faith and trust. He believed what God said despite the evidence or reasons, etcetera.
Nope...

Since you are stuck with what you wish to believe? Stay with it. At least the KJV is better than nothing.

As for me, I hope to learn to stop seeing KJV Only types as an embarrassment. when witnessing to people possessing common sense, and hopefully gaining the Holy Spirit. Or, is that Holy Ghost? Since parts of the KJV puts it. "Ghost." Yet, it's the same Greek word. (but, never mind that)...

To each his own level...
 
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Easter has its roots in Eshtar. A pagan holiday.
It was a fertility rite celebration.

Which explains why we see 'rabbits' 'eggs' associated with it.

Satan has embedded distortions into the church where pagan converts being weak in doctrine wanted to cling to their old ways.
No. Passover and Easter are merely synonyms that both refer to the Jewish Passover.
In various languages, we can see that Easter is taken from the word Pascha.



But more importantly, as I stated before, the word Easter and the word Passover were used interchangeably in the English bibles in more occurrences of various verses before the 1611. Different dictionaries also confirm this truth, as well.

I would recommend picking up the book called, “Don’t Passover Easter” by Brian C. Ross.
The Kindle version is like 3 bucks (last I checked). Well worth it. He shows you the references.

Source:
https://www.amazon.com/Dont-Passover-Easter-Defense-Acts-ebook/dp/B089M91K1Z/



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Genez

Junior Member
Oct 12, 2017
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Again, its not like I woke up one morning and seen a light shining on the KJV or I threw a dart and it just so happened to land on the KJV. I have many great reasons why the KJV is the perfect Word of God for today. I have 150 Good Reasons for the KJV. This should not be possible if things are as you say.


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The rationales someone has given for it are perfect for your kind of mentality. But not a perfect translation.
 
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Nope...

Since you are stuck with what you wish to believe? Stay with it. At least the KJV is better than nothing.
Aw, poor little KJV boy. Well, I am simple and I just read and believe. I am not looking to doubt the Bible or go to some guru and kiss his ring to get the words of God. I already have them. Do you have em?

You said:
As for me, I hope to learn to stop seeing KJV Only types as an embarrassment. when witnessing to people possessing common sense, and hopefully gaining the Holy Spirit. Or, is that Holy Ghost? Since parts of the KJV puts it. "Ghost." Yet, it's the same Greek word. (but, never mind that)...

To each his own level...
The only embarrassment is the Westcott and Hort Movement that exists today with their never ending shape shifter Bibles.
I believe a Christian has not reached any level if they attack the real Bible (the KJV).
You cannot destroy the foundations. For if the foundations be destroyed, what can the righteous do?

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The rationales someone has given for it are perfect for your kind of mentality. But not a perfect translation.
Ever watch Brandon Peterson's videos before?
He demonstrates what should be impossible involving the King James Bible.
His micro pattern video series is mind blowing.


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Genez

Junior Member
Oct 12, 2017
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No. Passover and Easter are merely synonyms that both refer to the Jewish Passover.
In various languages, we can see that Easter is taken from the word Pascha.



But more importantly, as I stated before, the word Easter and the word Passover were used interchangeably in the English bibles in more occurrences of various verses before the 1611. Different dictionaries also confirm this truth, as well.

I would recommend picking up the book called, “Don’t Passover Easter” by Brian C. Ross.
The Kindle version is like 3 bucks (last I checked). Well worth it. He shows you the references.

Source:
https://www.amazon.com/Dont-Passover-Easter-Defense-Acts-ebook/dp/B089M91K1Z/



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Where do you get your stuff from?

The Danish word for Easter is påske, and "Happy Easter" in Danish is God påske!. Påske is pronounced "goo POHS-keh".

And, the Danish word for Passover is the same we use in Judaism. Pesach.

Of course.... Jesus was crucified at the time, Jews celebrated with candy rabbits and painted eggs for their own fertility rites.


Bryan C. Ross analyzes the use of Easter. He does so using pre-King James translations. Those were Catholic translations that the King James followed after. Paganism snuck in via the Catholic Church. King James scholarship did not see the need for correction.

Modern translation have corrected it.

You got to keep in mind I was a Jew. To read that Jesus was crucified on Easter made it look like Christianity is a form of paganism.. And stupid. It's bad witness. But, that don't bother you.