"You will be as gods"

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Nov 14, 2024
72
23
8
Kansas
#1
In Genesis 3:1-7, satan convinced Eve (and then Adam) to partake of the only thing God told them to avoid. He was a lawyer more than a salesman. A salesman would've focused on how good the fruit looked, tasted, etc. He didn't mention any of those but focused on convincing Eve that God had put restrictions on humanity and that the only way to break free of [all] restrictions (just like God has no restrictions) was to be like God, ie. to be a god (similar to the angels) yourself.

In Acts 17, Paul told the Athenians that God placed restrictions on all humanity, stating, "He has made from one blood every nation of men to dwell on all the face of the earth and determined their preappointed times and the boundaries of their dwellings so that they should seek the Lord." The "boundaries of their dwellings" that Paul mentioned don't only refer to where people live as people can move around the planet and now off the planet if they want. Those boundaries have to do with God's design: all Creation and its creatures have boundaries including angels.

God is the only one without any boundaries except the ones He has set for Himself. Everyone and everything else has had their boundaries set for them. (Boundaries include limitations of being human, of being male or female, biology, nature, psychology: God chose all these things for all creatures including angels. No creature or person chose for themselves. For example, no one chooses when to be born, where to be born, to what family, what sex or race they will be, their purpose and calling and reason for living or for being born, etc.)
This was part of the reason for the rebellion of 1/3 of the angels (and the intermixing of angels and humans as well)-- they wanted to break free of God's design/boundaries. This need to 'break free' of God's design/purpose/boundaries also drives much of LGBTQ+ among many other dynamics and people.

Psalm 2 says that there are/will be people and world rulers who will try hard to divorce themselves from God's design in an effort to be their own gods. It says that such people think (ie. the attitude in their hearts is) "Let us break Their (the Godhead's) bonds in pieces and cast away Their cords from us." These bonds and cords are the restrictions God placed on people (eg. He made them male and female) which some work hard to break free from. In Romans 1, Paul talks at length about what happens when people decide to rebel against God's design in an effort to 'break free' of those bonds, cords, restrictions, limitations. Paul says that because these people refuse to basically stay in their lane and want to be 'more' than God made them to be, they actually become less, stating that such people"professing themselves to be wise, they became fools."

This is a fascinating dynamic that the Bible mentions often but that you can see in everyday life as well if you know to look: the dynamic is that if someone insists on being 'more' than God made them to be (or more than they actually are), they will actually become less. We see this first happen to lucifer. He was in a very high position, but when he insisted on being 'greater/more' than he actually was and flew up higher to take the Throne, God didn't kick lucifer back down to his original position; He punted him way way way lower in position: he went from Heaven to earth. This dynamic is throughout Jesus's life as well. He had more understanding of God and Scripture at 12 years old than men who were not only way older but who were also teachers of Scripture; this was because Jesus didn't promote Himself and try to be God but accepted His position as it was. He later said to God, "I thank You Father, Lord of Heaven and earth, that You have hidden [the mysteries of the Kingdom] from the wise and prudent (ie. those looked at as or expected to be wise and prudent) and have revealed them to babes (ie. people who retain their actual position and don't pretend to be). more/greater than they are)" (Matt. 11:25).

That is God's MO. (Psalm 119:98-100.) He resists the proud (or those who want to be greater/more) but makes Himself available to the humble (or those who are content with their position and don't insist they're more than they really are). I've been to several countries and especially in western nations will you see the desire to "be as gods", primarily in America. The desire and pressure to be 'prestigious gods' rather than 'simple humans' makes people anxious, pretentious, superficial, narcissistic (insufferable to be honest), hateful of others (usually without even knowing it), and chronically unhappy. God made us to be interdependent. In America, we say we are 'better' than that, individualistic, and don't need others. Ie. we're dependent rather than independent. Because we rejected 'our original estate' (our actual state) of interdependence and instead chose to 'ascend' to independence so we could be exalted, the law (dynamic) mentioned in Romans 1:22 kicked into effect (like clockwork when a new clock or watch is first started): "Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools" or "Pretending to be greater, they became lesser." Every time someone presumes to be higher up than they are, they 'lose points' and become less. This of course is rarely immediately obvious but in the spirit, it does happen immediately. lucifer was dispatched from Heaven immediately after he rebelled and tried to 'break free'; so were Adam and Eve. I think this dynamic is fascinating because it is unexpected (it's backward to go down as soon as you go up) and because it happens without exception every time. Americans, exalted above all other people, are the most broken, impoverished, lost, and in need of God's intervention. This is according to the spiritual principle-- mentioned many times in the Bible but functioning well before the Bible began to be written-- that God is close to the humble/reasonable but neglects the prideful/deluded. The sin of lucifer (pride, rebellion, a desire to be God) is bountiful in Amerida. But of course, where sin abounds.
 
Nov 14, 2024
115
42
28
#2
In God's kingdom, the way up is definitely down. We see this foremost in Jesus' mindset which ought to be our mindsets as well.

Phl 2:5
Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus:
Phl 2:6
Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God:
Phl 2:7
But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men:
Phl 2:8
And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross.
Phl 2:9
Wherefore God also hath highly exalted him, and given him a name which is above every name:
Phl 2:10
That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth;
Phl 2:11
And that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.

Jesus' path to exaltation was one of humility and obedience, and no servant is above his master.

When his disciples were jockeying for positions in his coming kingdom, Jesus had to inform them that the greatest among them would be the one who was the last of all, and the servant of all.

Mar 9:33
And he came to Capernaum: and being in the house he asked them, What was it that ye disputed among yourselves by the way?
Mar 9:34
But they held their peace: for by the way they had disputed among themselves, who should be the greatest.
Mar 9:35
And he sat down, and called the twelve, and saith unto them, If any man desire to be first, the same shall be last of all, and servant of all.

Apparently, they did not get the message the first time because Jesus had to repeat it to them again only shortly thereafter.

Mar 10:35
And James and John, the sons of Zebedee, come unto him, saying, Master, we would that thou shouldest do for us whatsoever we shall desire.
Mar 10:36
And he said unto them, What would ye that I should do for you?
Mar 10:37
They said unto him, Grant unto us that we may sit, one on thy right hand, and the other on thy left hand, in thy glory.
Mar 10:38
But Jesus said unto them, Ye know not what ye ask: can ye drink of the cup that I drink of? and be baptized with the baptism that I am baptized with?
Mar 10:39
And they said unto him, We can. And Jesus said unto them, Ye shall indeed drink of the cup that I drink of; and with the baptism that I am baptized withal shall ye be baptized:
Mar 10:40
But to sit on my right hand and on my left hand is not mine to give; but it shall be given to them for whom it is prepared.
Mar 10:41
And when the ten heard it, they began to be much displeased with James and John.
Mar 10:42
But Jesus called them to him, and saith unto them, Ye know that they which are accounted to rule over the Gentiles exercise lordship over them; and their great ones exercise authority upon them.
Mar 10:43
But so shall it not be among you: but whosoever will be great among you, shall be your minister:
Mar 10:44
And whosoever of you will be the chiefest, shall be servant of all.
Mar 10:45
For even the Son of man came not to be ministered unto, but to minister, and to give his life a ransom for many.

We live in a world where most people seek a place of preeminence, or a place of authoritative rule over others, and where very few people desire to serve others. Unfortunately, that world includes many people within the professing church. People really need to take heed to the following admonitions in scripture.

Ecc 7:16
Be not righteous over much; neither make thyself over wise: why shouldest thou destroy thyself?

Also:

Luk 12:47
And that servant, which knew his lord's will, and prepared not himself, neither did according to his will, shall be beaten with many stripes.
Luk 12:48
But he that knew not, and did commit things worthy of stripes, shall be beaten with few stripes. For unto whomsoever much is given, of him shall be much required: and to whom men have committed much, of him they will ask the more.

Additionally:

Jas 3:1
My brethren, be not many masters, knowing that we shall receive the greater condemnation.
Jas 3:2
For in many things we offend all. If any man offend not in word, the same is a perfect man, and able also to bridle the whole body.

With much wisdom, and with much authority, comes much accountability on the day of judgement, and we all would be wise to recognize the same.

1Pe 5:6
Humble yourselves therefore under the mighty hand of God, that he may exalt you in due time:
1Pe 5:7
Casting all your care upon him; for he careth for you.
 
Oct 24, 2012
16,512
484
83
#3
In Genesis 3:1-7, satan convinced Eve (and then Adam) to partake of the only thing God told them to avoid. He was a lawyer more than a salesman. A salesman would've focused on how good the fruit looked, tasted, etc. He didn't mention any of those but focused on convincing Eve that God had put restrictions on humanity and that the only way to break free of [all] restrictions (just like God has no restrictions) was to be like God, ie. to be a god (similar to the angels) yourself.

In Acts 17, Paul told the Athenians that God placed restrictions on all humanity, stating, "He has made from one blood every nation of men to dwell on all the face of the earth and determined their preappointed times and the boundaries of their dwellings so that they should seek the Lord." The "boundaries of their dwellings" that Paul mentioned don't only refer to where people live as people can move around the planet and now off the planet if they want. Those boundaries have to do with God's design: all Creation and its creatures have boundaries including angels.

God is the only one without any boundaries except the ones He has set for Himself. Everyone and everything else has had their boundaries set for them. (Boundaries include limitations of being human, of being male or female, biology, nature, psychology: God chose all these things for all creatures including angels. No creature or person chose for themselves. For example, no one chooses when to be born, where to be born, to what family, what sex or race they will be, their purpose and calling and reason for living or for being born, etc.)
This was part of the reason for the rebellion of 1/3 of the angels (and the intermixing of angels and humans as well)-- they wanted to break free of God's design/boundaries. This need to 'break free' of God's design/purpose/boundaries also drives much of LGBTQ+ among many other dynamics and people.

Psalm 2 says that there are/will be people and world rulers who will try hard to divorce themselves from God's design in an effort to be their own gods. It says that such people think (ie. the attitude in their hearts is) "Let us break Their (the Godhead's) bonds in pieces and cast away Their cords from us." These bonds and cords are the restrictions God placed on people (eg. He made them male and female) which some work hard to break free from. In Romans 1, Paul talks at length about what happens when people decide to rebel against God's design in an effort to 'break free' of those bonds, cords, restrictions, limitations. Paul says that because these people refuse to basically stay in their lane and want to be 'more' than God made them to be, they actually become less, stating that such people"professing themselves to be wise, they became fools."

This is a fascinating dynamic that the Bible mentions often but that you can see in everyday life as well if you know to look: the dynamic is that if someone insists on being 'more' than God made them to be (or more than they actually are), they will actually become less. We see this first happen to lucifer. He was in a very high position, but when he insisted on being 'greater/more' than he actually was and flew up higher to take the Throne, God didn't kick lucifer back down to his original position; He punted him way way way lower in position: he went from Heaven to earth. This dynamic is throughout Jesus's life as well. He had more understanding of God and Scripture at 12 years old than men who were not only way older but who were also teachers of Scripture; this was because Jesus didn't promote Himself and try to be God but accepted His position as it was. He later said to God, "I thank You Father, Lord of Heaven and earth, that You have hidden [the mysteries of the Kingdom] from the wise and prudent (ie. those looked at as or expected to be wise and prudent) and have revealed them to babes (ie. people who retain their actual position and don't pretend to be). more/greater than they are)" (Matt. 11:25).

That is God's MO. (Psalm 119:98-100.) He resists the proud (or those who want to be greater/more) but makes Himself available to the humble (or those who are content with their position and don't insist they're more than they really are). I've been to several countries and especially in western nations will you see the desire to "be as gods", primarily in America. The desire and pressure to be 'prestigious gods' rather than 'simple humans' makes people anxious, pretentious, superficial, narcissistic (insufferable to be honest), hateful of others (usually without even knowing it), and chronically unhappy. God made us to be interdependent. In America, we say we are 'better' than that, individualistic, and don't need others. Ie. we're dependent rather than independent. Because we rejected 'our original estate' (our actual state) of interdependence and instead chose to 'ascend' to independence so we could be exalted, the law (dynamic) mentioned in Romans 1:22 kicked into effect (like clockwork when a new clock or watch is first started): "Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools" or "Pretending to be greater, they became lesser." Every time someone presumes to be higher up than they are, they 'lose points' and become less. This of course is rarely immediately obvious but in the spirit, it does happen immediately. lucifer was dispatched from Heaven immediately after he rebelled and tried to 'break free'; so were Adam and Eve. I think this dynamic is fascinating because it is unexpected (it's backward to go down as soon as you go up) and because it happens without exception every time. Americans, exalted above all other people, are the most broken, impoverished, lost, and in need of God's intervention. This is according to the spiritual principle-- mentioned many times in the Bible but functioning well before the Bible began to be written-- that God is close to the humble/reasonable but neglects the prideful/deluded. The sin of lucifer (pride, rebellion, a desire to be God) is bountiful in Amerida. But of course, where sin abounds.
Thank you for the reminder
 
Jul 3, 2015
60,089
29,423
113
#4

Acts 17:26-27 ~ From one man He made every nation of men, that they should inhabit the whole earth; and He determined their appointed times and the boundaries of their lands. God intended that they would seek Him and perhaps reach out for Him and find Him, though He is not far from each one of us. :)
 
Oct 24, 2012
16,512
484
83
#5

Acts 17:26-27 ~ From one man He made every nation of men, that they should inhabit the whole earth; and He determined their appointed times and the boundaries of their lands. God intended that they would seek Him and perhaps reach out for Him and find Him, though He is not far from each one of us.:)
lifes boundaries, are like a game of chess thank you for the scripture
 

bluto

Senior Member
Aug 4, 2016
2,107
534
113
#6
In Genesis 3:1-7, satan convinced Eve (and then Adam) to partake of the only thing God told them to avoid. He was a lawyer more than a salesman. A salesman would've focused on how good the fruit looked, tasted, etc. He didn't mention any of those but focused on convincing Eve that God had put restrictions on humanity and that the only way to break free of [all] restrictions (just like God has no restrictions) was to be like God, ie. to be a god (similar to the angels) yourself.

In Acts 17, Paul told the Athenians that God placed restrictions on all humanity, stating, "He has made from one blood every nation of men to dwell on all the face of the earth and determined their preappointed times and the boundaries of their dwellings so that they should seek the Lord." The "boundaries of their dwellings" that Paul mentioned don't only refer to where people live as people can move around the planet and now off the planet if they want. Those boundaries have to do with God's design: all Creation and its creatures have boundaries including angels.

God is the only one without any boundaries except the ones He has set for Himself. Everyone and everything else has had their boundaries set for them. (Boundaries include limitations of being human, of being male or female, biology, nature, psychology: God chose all these things for all creatures including angels. No creature or person chose for themselves. For example, no one chooses when to be born, where to be born, to what family, what sex or race they will be, their purpose and calling and reason for living or for being born, etc.)
This was part of the reason for the rebellion of 1/3 of the angels (and the intermixing of angels and humans as well)-- they wanted to break free of God's design/boundaries. This need to 'break free' of God's design/purpose/boundaries also drives much of LGBTQ+ among many other dynamics and people.

Psalm 2 says that there are/will be people and world rulers who will try hard to divorce themselves from God's design in an effort to be their own gods. It says that such people think (ie. the attitude in their hearts is) "Let us break Their (the Godhead's) bonds in pieces and cast away Their cords from us." These bonds and cords are the restrictions God placed on people (eg. He made them male and female) which some work hard to break free from. In Romans 1, Paul talks at length about what happens when people decide to rebel against God's design in an effort to 'break free' of those bonds, cords, restrictions, limitations. Paul says that because these people refuse to basically stay in their lane and want to be 'more' than God made them to be, they actually become less, stating that such people"professing themselves to be wise, they became fools."

This is a fascinating dynamic that the Bible mentions often but that you can see in everyday life as well if you know to look: the dynamic is that if someone insists on being 'more' than God made them to be (or more than they actually are), they will actually become less. We see this first happen to lucifer. He was in a very high position, but when he insisted on being 'greater/more' than he actually was and flew up higher to take the Throne, God didn't kick lucifer back down to his original position; He punted him way way way lower in position: he went from Heaven to earth. This dynamic is throughout Jesus's life as well. He had more understanding of God and Scripture at 12 years old than men who were not only way older but who were also teachers of Scripture; this was because Jesus didn't promote Himself and try to be God but accepted His position as it was. He later said to God, "I thank You Father, Lord of Heaven and earth, that You have hidden [the mysteries of the Kingdom] from the wise and prudent (ie. those looked at as or expected to be wise and prudent) and have revealed them to babes (ie. people who retain their actual position and don't pretend to be). more/greater than they are)" (Matt. 11:25).

That is God's MO. (Psalm 119:98-100.) He resists the proud (or those who want to be greater/more) but makes Himself available to the humble (or those who are content with their position and don't insist they're more than they really are). I've been to several countries and especially in western nations will you see the desire to "be as gods", primarily in America. The desire and pressure to be 'prestigious gods' rather than 'simple humans' makes people anxious, pretentious, superficial, narcissistic (insufferable to be honest), hateful of others (usually without even knowing it), and chronically unhappy. God made us to be interdependent. In America, we say we are 'better' than that, individualistic, and don't need others. Ie. we're dependent rather than independent. Because we rejected 'our original estate' (our actual state) of interdependence and instead chose to 'ascend' to independence so we could be exalted, the law (dynamic) mentioned in Romans 1:22 kicked into effect (like clockwork when a new clock or watch is first started): "Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools" or "Pretending to be greater, they became lesser." Every time someone presumes to be higher up than they are, they 'lose points' and become less. This of course is rarely immediately obvious but in the spirit, it does happen immediately. lucifer was dispatched from Heaven immediately after he rebelled and tried to 'break free'; so were Adam and Eve. I think this dynamic is fascinating because it is unexpected (it's backward to go down as soon as you go up) and because it happens without exception every time. Americans, exalted above all other people, are the most broken, impoverished, lost, and in need of God's intervention. This is according to the spiritual principle-- mentioned many times in the Bible but functioning well before the Bible began to be written-- that God is close to the humble/reasonable but neglects the prideful/deluded. The sin of lucifer (pride, rebellion, a desire to be God) is bountiful in Amerida. But of course, where sin abounds.
Since the subject of "gods" has been brought up I thought it would be instructive that Jesus Himself brought it up at John 10:30-38. Specifically, at vs34-36. "Jesus answered them/the Jews, "Has it not been written in your Law, "I said you are Gods.?" (Jesus is quoting Psalm 82:6) Vs35, "If he called them gods, to whom the word of God came (and the Scripture cannot be broken. Vs36, "do you say of Him whom the Father sanctified and sent into the world, Your blaspheming, because I said, "I am the Son of God?" So my question is why did Jesus bring up Psalm 82:6? What point was He making? Btw, please read the whole context starting at John 10:3.0.

IN GOD THE SON,
bluto
 
Nov 14, 2024
72
23
8
Kansas
#7
Since the subject of "gods" has been brought up I thought it would be instructive that Jesus Himself brought it up at John 10:30-38. Specifically, at vs34-36. "Jesus answered them/the Jews, "Has it not been written in your Law, "I said you are Gods.?" (Jesus is quoting Psalm 82:6) Vs35, "If he called them gods, to whom the word of God came (and the Scripture cannot be broken. Vs36, "do you say of Him whom the Father sanctified and sent into the world, Your blaspheming, because I said, "I am the Son of God?" So my question is why did Jesus bring up Psalm 82:6? What point was He making? Btw, please read the whole context starting at John 10:3.0.

IN GOD THE SON,
bluto
I have no idea. I'll be waiting for an answer with you.

Note: if you take time to ask God to reveal the answer to you and keep asking, He'll reveal it. FYI. I have never taken the time to look into that prayerfully but maybe you can make some time for it.
 
Nov 14, 2024
72
23
8
Kansas
#8

Acts 17:26-27 ~ From one man He made every nation of men, that they should inhabit the whole earth; and He determined their appointed times and the boundaries of their lands. God intended that they would seek Him and perhaps reach out for Him and find Him, though He is not far from each one of us.:)
If I had a favorite sermon in the entire NT it would be that one from Mars Hill because of the way Paul spoke the message to the Greeks/Athenians in their own 'language' (ie. not just speaking in Greek but also empathizing with them and speaking as if he was an Athenian himself). Everything he said made perfect sense to them, whereas to Jews it wouldn't have resonated nearly the same way, until he mentioned the supernatural-- ie. Jesus rising from the dead-- then their eyes started rolling around. Brilliant message. He definitely received that message in the moment (rhema), directly from God.
 
Jul 3, 2015
60,089
29,423
113
#9
If I had a favorite sermon in the entire NT it would be that one from Mars Hill because of the way Paul spoke the message to the Athenians in their 'language' (ie. he empathized with and spoke as one of them). Everything he said made perfect sense to them, whereas to Jews it wouldn't have resonated nearly the same way, until he mentioned the supernatural-- ie. Jesus rising from the dead-- then their eyes started rolling around. Brilliant message. He definitely received that message in the moment (rhema), directly from God.

1 Corinthians 9:22b I have become all things to all people so that by all possible means I might save some. :)