Believing on his name
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Love is keeping His commandments and this not being burdensome. Right back to doing what He says because of who He is. Very circular actually. Once we get into all of these words like faith, love, etc., we end up with obedience as the common denominator. Love is commanded as you've said.
There is not one scripture in the New Testament that says that Holy Spirit baptism “saves” anyone. Where as 1Peter 3:21 does say that water baptism saves us. The fact that the Samaritans (1) were saved in Acts 8:12 when they believed and were baptized, (2) the fact that verse 16 says that the Holy Spirit had not fallen on them yet, and (3) the fact that they did not receive the Holy Spirit until the apostles, Peter and John came from Jerusalem and laid their hands on them in verse 17, PROVES that the Holy Spirit did not save those people and it does not save anyone today. The baptism that they received when they believed had to be water baptism because the Holy Spirit testifies that they had not received the Spirit yet in verse 16. The baptism mentioned in that verse was the same baptism that Peter commanded the Jews in Actsc2:38– “IN THE NAME OF JESUS CHRIST. Now, I have given you proof from the scriptures—you give me “proof” from the scriptures that shows people were “saved” by Holy Spirit baptism.
(1). Acts 2:38 was water baptism because Peter says that they would receive the gift of the Spirit AFTER baptism (shall receive- future tense).
(2). Acts 8 the Samaritans were saved when they believed and were water baptized several days before they ever received the Holy Spirit.
(3). The eunuch believed and was water baptized (Actsc8) because he says, “Here is WATER, why can’t I be baptized?” Then Phillip baptized him. Nothing is said about him even receiving the Holy Spirit. But he was SAVED just like Jesus said in Mark 16:16.
(4). Saul of Tarsus was water baptized because Ananias told him to “WASH AWAY” his sins in baptism. Nothing is said or even IMPLIED about the Holy Spirit.
(5) Acts 16. The jailer believed and was water baptized—nothing is said at all about him receiving the Holy Spirit.
People could not just go out and receive the Holy Spirit anytime they wanted to. It was only given at God’s discretion—not man’s. Only on two occasions was it out poured—in Acts 2 on the apostles and in Acts 10 on the gentiles. Both times it was for a “sign” of God’s approval. The only way a person could get the gifts of Holy Spirit was by an apostle laying their hands on you. That’s why the Samaritans in Acts 8 had to wait for the apostles Peter and John to come from Jerusalem to lay their hands on them so they could receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. The evangelist Phillip was already there in Samaria. Why didn’t he lay hands on them and give them the Spirit? Why have to wait on Peter and John? Phillip had had the apostles hands laid on him so he received the Spirit from them ( read Acts 6:5-6) why couldn’t Phillip lay his hands on those saved in Acts 8 and give them the Spirit? Because the miraculous gift of the Spirit could not be “passed on” from one person to another. It only could be given by having an apostle lay his hands on you. Phillip, although he had been given the Spirit , could not pass the Spirit on to any one else. Do you see the significance of this fact? That means when the last apostle died and the last person to receive the Spirit died, that was the end of miraculous gifts of the Spirit. Just exactly as 1 Corinthians 13:8-10 prophesied. We have the “PERFECT” will of God, James 2:25. All miraculous gifts of the Spirit have ceased! They were only needed while the Bible —the word of God was being written.
The scriptures do not teach nor even imply that the Holy Spirit SAVED Cornelius in Acts 10. Instead the fact that Peter COMMANDED him to be baptized (we know this was water baptism because they had already been baptized with the Spirit) proves that they were not saved yet; why COMMAND water baptism if Holy Spirit baptism saves you? Your belief contradicts such passages as 1 Peter 3:21 which says that we are saved by water baptism. Where as, understanding that Cornelius was NOT saved by Holy Spirit baptism, but WAS SAVED by water baptism, is in perfect harmony with 1 Peter 3:21. Any religious position you hold that contradicts even ONE other scripture in the Bible CAN NOT BE RIGHT, because the Bible can not contradict itself.
If the Bible has contradictions in its teaching, how can it be true? How can it be from God? How can we trust it? No, the Bible is from God, guided and written by the Holy Spirit. It has no contradictions in its teaching. It does not say in 1 Peter 3:21 that we are saved by water baptism and at the same time teach that we are not saved by water baptusm but we are saved by Holy Spirit baptism. Be honest. Where does the most evidence lie? Not with salvation by the Holy Spirit. People in the New Testament received the Spirit, yes, but for what purpose? Not salvation. It was always a “sign” to others.
Psalms 119:160 we do not have the “Truth” on any Bible subject until we read everything the Bible has to say about that subject. Put it all together and THEN you have the TRUTH on that subject. Why not do a very thorough study on the Holy Spirit in the New Testament? Prove it to yourself.
Hmmm. Okay:
1. Do you believe that physical circumcision a) is at least part of GRFS or b) is not part of GRFS?
2. Do you believe that physical baptism a) is at least part of GRFS or b) is not part of GRFS?
If the answers to 1 is a, then you disagree with TOP #24.
If the answer to 2 is a, then you disagree with TOP #106.
1) Under the old covenant yes it was. Under the new covenant, no not at all
2) I honestly don't know, but it very well could be a requirement. At a minimum refusing to do so is rebellion and unbelief, but I don't know the consequences for that. Under the old covenant water baptism was a requirement for priests entering the Levitical priesthood. It may be a requirement for those being commissioned into the Melchizedek priesthood under the new covenant, or it may simply be symbolic. Don't know.
Romans 10:9 is centered on the Jews and their Shema "chant." They would "Confess with their mouth that they believed in the one God of Israel."
It is not a "way to salvation verse." If the Jews/Israel would SEE that Jesus Christ was Lord, their "chant" would be " Jesus Christ is Lord Messiah."
The demons, Jews, and many religions believe in God. But salvation comes from believing in the Lord Jesus Christ.
I believe Paul teaches that even under the OC it was the faith like Abraham that was salvific and physical circumcision was a "should" or "ought" but not a "must" or "need".
As a Baptist we were taught that water baptism was a symbol of saving faith, not a sacrament that is salvific.
Here are some relevant TOP:
TOP #24: The only circumcision that is salvific is that which is inward or of the heart and done by the Spirit. [RM 2:25-29, COL 2:11-12] Paul said that physical circumcision according to a written code has value only if one obeys the law, meaning perfectly per RM 3:23. The second passage (TOP #203) indicates that water baptism replaced fleshly circumcision as the outward sign of faith in God/Jesus.
TOP #25: All have sinned by breaking moral law but may be justified by God’s grace through faith in Christ’s redemption or atonement. [RM 3:9-26] The most familiar part of this passage is v. 23-24, “All have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, and are justified freely by his grace through the redemption that came by Christ Jesus.”
TOP #26: Abraham is the spiritual father of all who have saving faith in God and Jesus. [RM 4:1-25]
TOP #272: The OC is set aside because salvation via law was imperfect, and it is replaced via Jesus by a better NC able to save completely. [HB 7:18-25, 8:6-13, 10:1-9] In 8:8-12 Paul quoted JER 31:31-34, and in 8:13 he called the OC “obsolete” and soon to disappear. In 10:1 he called the OC a shadow of the coming NC. Another way of saying this truth is that the NC surpassed (MT 5:20) and superseded the OC.
TOP #273: The OC sacrifices were ceremonial external regulations applicable until the NC was revealed. [HB 9:9-10] Such regulations should not be confused with moral teachings reaffirmed by the NT.
TOP #274: Jesus mediated the NC by offering himself as the unblemished sacrifice for the sins of those who are called. [HB 9:11-26, 10:10-18] Paul called Christ’s atonement a “ransom” and noted that without the shedding of Christ’s blood there would be no forgiveness. Jesus said in MT 22:14 that many are called, and in JN 12:32 that when he was crucified he would draw all of humanity to believe in him.
TOP #275: Christ’s sacrifice made perfect forever those who are being made holy. [HB 10:14] This verse teaches both righteousness imputed at conversion and the need of converts to strive for actual righteous behavior the rest of their lives.
Here is an example of mental assent belief - "I believe that Jesus exists, is the Son of God and that His death, burial and resurrection "happened." Believing in Jesus/in His name goes beyond mental assent belief and also includes trust and reliance in Jesus Christ for salvation. I am trusting in the death, burial and resurrection of Christ as the ALL-sufficient means of my salvation. That goes beyond mere mental assent belief and is believing from the heart. Do you understand the difference?
That is not what James said. James is not advocating salvation by works in contradiction to Paul. (Romans 4:2-6; Ephesians 2:8,9) In James 2:14, we read of one who says/claims he has faith but has no works (to evidence his claim). That is not genuine faith, but a bare profession of faith. So, when James asks, "Can that faith save him?" he is saying nothing against genuine faith, but only against an empty profession of faith/dead faith. So, James does not teach that we are saved "by" works. His concern is to show the reality of the faith professed by the individual (James 2:18) and demonstrate that the faith claimed (James 2:14) by the individual is genuine. Simple! James is simply saying faith that is not accompanied by evidential works demonstrates that it's dead. If someone merely says-claims they have faith, but lack resulting evidential works, then they demonstrate that they have an empty profession of faith/dead faith and not authentic faith. (James 2:14)
Jesus clarifies the first clause with the second, "but he who does not believe will be condemned" so the first clause describes general cases without making a qualification for the unusual case of someone who believes but is not baptized. The omission of baptized with "does not believe" shows that Jesus does not make baptism absolutely necessary for salvation. Condemnation rests on unbelief and not on a lack of baptism. *NOWHERE does the Bible say, "baptized or condemned."
If water baptism is absolutely required for salvation, then we would expect Jesus to mention it in the following verses. (3:15,16,18; 5:24; 6:29,40,47; 11:25,26) Yet what is the 1 requirement that Jesus mentions 9 different times in each of these complete statements *BELIEVES. *What happened to baptism? *Hermeneutics. If he who believes will be saved, then he who believes and is baptized will be saved as well, yet nowhere did Jesus say that whoever is not baptized will be condemned.
John 3:18 - He who believes in Him is not condemned; but he who (is not water baptized? - NO) does not believe is condemned already, because he has not (been water baptized? - NO) because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.
Faith only or alone per James 2:24 equates to an empty profession of faith/dead faith that remains alone/barren of works. (James 2:14) That is not genuine faith but a bare profession of faith which is not to be confused with faith that trusts in Jesus Christ alone for salvation/God imputes righteousness apart from works. (Romans 4:5-6)
James is not using the word "justified" to mean "accounted as righteous" but is shown to be righteous. James is discussing the evidence of faith (says-claims to have faith but has no works/I will show you my faith by my works - James 2:14-18) and not the initial act of being accounted as righteous with God. (Romans 4:2-3) James 2:24 is a major stumbling block for works-salvationists.
More eisegesis on your part. In Acts 16:31, Paul clearly stated: BELIEVE ON THE LORD JESUS CHRIST AND YOU WILL BE SAVED. Not believe and get baptized and you will be saved. So, what is the only requirement in Acts 16:31? Just deal with it and stop trying to twist the scriptures.
According to your eisegesis but not according to (Mark 16:16(b); John 3:15,16,18; 5:24; 6:29,40,47; 11:25,26) You need to stop boasting in your baptism and believe in Jesus/have faith in/trust in Jesus Christ alone for salvation.
Are you condemning believers who have placed their faith in Jesus Christ alone for salvation and are not trusting in water baptism for salvation? You seem to have more faith in water baptism to save you than you do in the death, burial and resurrection of Christ to save you, which is disturbing! Either we are trusting 100% in Jesus Christ alone for salvation or else we are 100% lost. (John 3:18; 6:40; 10:9; 14:6; Acts 10:43; 16:31; Romans 1:16; 3:24-28; 4:5-6; 5:1; 1 Corinthians 1:18-21; 2 Corinthians 4:3,4)
The Holy Spirit says that baptism is for Believers in Acts 8:37. Belief is only the first step but no one is going to ask to be baptized if they are an UNBELIEVER! That’s why baptism is not mentioned in a lot of scriptures on faith—faith must come first. But nothing in ANY of those scriptures on faith does the word “only” or “alone” appear. Not one of them says “ believe only” or have “faith alone.” It is ridiculous to argue that baptism is not necessary because God did not include it with UNBELIEF! Doesn’t COMMON SENSE tell you that if a person does not believe he will not be baptized? God did not need to say it— He credited us with enough sense to understand that fact. I guess that does not include you. But most people understand that stating the OBVIOUS is unnecessary. And saying that a person who does not believe and that same person who is an unbeliever, does not get baptized is condemned IS STATING THE OBVIOUS! If that is your best argument you are in trouble, in more ways than one.
I don’t have to condemn or judge anyone. The word of God does that for me. John 12:48 Jesus said those who REJECT His words have one that judges him. The word that He has spoken shall judge them in the last day.
Yes, I have faith in water baptism because it is the word of God -1 Peter 3:21– that tells me it saves me. I have faith in that. I believe God. I trust Him to do what He has promised. I know God did not lie when He said BAPTISM SAVES US. You are the one who is the UNBELIEVER. You will answer To Him for that.
All of those scriptures in John that you gave, (1) does not say anything about repentance. I guess you do not think repentance is necessary, do you? I mean, you ARE using these same scriptures to prove that baptism is not necessary to salvation aren’t you? Well, then, if those mean baptism is not necessary because they do not mention baptism, then repentance cannot be required and neither can confession be required because THEY are not in any of those verses either.. But I thought in one of your posts you said repentance WAS necessary for a “change of conduct.” Which is it ? Is repentance necessary for salvation? Is confession “unto salvation, like Romans 10:10 says? Neither repentance nor confession are mentioned in Any of the scriptures you gave in John. Does that mean they are not necessary to salvation? That is the argument you are using to say that baptism is not necessary. If it is true for baptism, it is also true for repentance and confession. I think everyone who reads this can see that.
But while we are in John, look at chapter 12:42, “ Nevertheless, among the chief rulers, MANY BELIEVED ON HIM, but did not “confess” him lest they should be put out of the synagogue.” Do you believe these people who believed on him were saved? That’s what all of those other scriptures In John say— all the ones you wanted us to read. tThese other verses on faith—like John 3:16-18, 5:24, 6:29, etc. none say anything about repentance and confession. You must not believe these are required, either. If they ARE REQUIRED to be saved, then so is baptism even though they are not mentioned in these verses. Yet, here are some people who have done EXACTLY what John 3:16 says, they believe on Jesus as the Son of God. The Holy Spirit is writing this so I Know they believed because He said they did and He would know. Their faith was not doubted nor qualified by the Holy Spirit by saying they didn’t”trust”, or they didn’t repent, or anything else. To argue that these people did not really believe is to call the Holy Spirit a liar because He says that they did. Don’t you think the Holy Spirit would KNOW whether they were believers or not? And He says they were believers in Jesus Christ—whatever Jesus claimed to be, they believed Him. By your arguments and the scriptures you used, you think they were saved! But the scriptures indicate they were not because they refused to “confess” Him. Confession is a different command than “believe”. They are not the same in meaning or action. This, again, with many other scriptures proves that “faith only” will not save; and harmonizes exactly with What James says in 2:24. If confession is required to be saved, then they can’t possibly be saved by faith alone, as you believe. If repentance is necessary to be saved, then it can not be by “faith only.” It can’t be both ways! Either you are saved by faith alone or faith only as you are quoting those verses in John to prove, OR you also have to repent ( Acts 17:30) and confess ( Roman’s 10:10), AND be baptized ( 1 Peter 3:21) which means “NOT by faith only. (James 2:24). Which is it?? It can’t be both.
It is for believers. Genuine believers (Acts 10:43-47) and not make believers who trust in works for salvation.
Unbelievers are not only atheists. If one's belief in Jesus Christ does not go beyond mere "mental assent" belief and falls short of believing in/having faith in/trusting in Jesus Christ as the ALL-sufficient means of one's salvation, then one is also an unbeliever. Only saving belief in Jesus which is from the heart qualifies one to be a believer in regard to obtaining salvation. Saving belief in Jesus is not merely a first step in receiving salvation. Saving belief in Jesus is unto salvation. (John 1:12; 3:15,16,18,36; 5:24; 6:29,40,47; 11:25,26; Acts 4:4; 5:14; 10:43; 13:39; 13:48; 16:31; Romans 1:16; 3:22; 4:5-6; 10:4; 1 Corinthians 1:21; Galatians 2:16; 3:22; Ephesians 1:13; 1 John 5:13)
In post #26 I gave you an example of mental assent belief vs. saving belief and I asked you if you understand the difference, but you did not answer my question. It seems obvious to me that you still don't understand. Neither did I prior to my conversion.
The Bible makes it clear in many passages of scripture that man is saved through belief/faith - "apart from additions or modifications." (John 1:12; 3:15,16,18,36; 5:24; 6:29,40,47; 11:25,26; Acts 10:43; 13:39; 15:7-9; 16:31; 26:18; Romans 1:16; 3:22-28; 4:5-6; 5:1-2; 10:4; 1 Corinthians 1:21; Galatians 2:16; 3:6-14, 22, 26; Ephesians 2:8,9; Philippians 3:9; 2 Timothy 3:15; 1 John 5:13 etc..).
Now you don't need to add the word "alone" next to "belief/faith" in each of these passages of scripture in order to figure out that the words, "belief/faith" stand alone in connection with receiving eternal life/salvation. Hence, FAITH ALONE. Do these many passages of scripture say belief/faith "plus something else?" Plus, baptism? Plus, works? NO. So, then it's faith (rightly understood) in Jesus Christ alone. *Not to be confused with an empty profession of faith/dead faith that remains "alone" - barren of works. (James 2:14-24)
If water baptism was absolutely necessary for salvation, then God would not make so many statements in Scripture in which He promises eternal life/salvation to those who simply believe/place faith in Jesus Christ for salvation. The second clause in Mark 16:16 - but he who does not believe shall be condemned clearly clarifies the first clause which is in harmony with what Jesus said in (John 3:15,16,18; 5:24; 6:29,40,47; 11:25,26) If he who believes shall be saved then he who believes and is baptized shall be saved as well.
If one is an atheist, yes. Now these many people in Matthew 7:22-23 obviously believed in the existence of Jesus and in certain facts about Jesus and they even referred to Him as 'Lord' yet what did Jesus say in Matthew 7:21 and Matthew 7:23? So, what was the problem? These many people were trusting in their works for salvation and not in Jesus Christ alone. Sound familiar? These many people had "mental assent" belief in Jesus, yet their belief fell short of saving belief. See John 6:40 and compare with Matthew 7:21.
Your pride is showing. God did need to say it and it takes more than mere human wisdom to understand the things of the Spirit of God. (1 Corinthians 1:18-21; 2:11-14)
Atheists don't get baptized but make believers get baptized all the time, especially in various false religions and cults that claim to be Christian but preach a false gospel. I am blown away by how naive you really are. Faulty human logic is your best argument and if you continue to refuse to believe the gospel then you are in big trouble! The apostle Paul made it clear in 2 Corinthians 4:3,4 why people do not believe the gospel.
You already judged me when you said - You are the one who is the UNBELIEVER. You will answer To Him for that. Jesus drew the line in the sand on who will and won't be condemned. John 3:18 - He who believes in Him is not condemned; but he who (is not water baptized? - NO) does not believe is condemned already, because he has not (been water baptized? - NO) because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.
I've had Roman Catholics, Mormons and Campbellites cite John 12:48 to me before as if to imply I have rejected His words because I don't believe their false doctrine and all three of those false religions teach different doctrine yet all claim to be right but can't all be right. Something to think about.
You just admitted that you have faith in water baptism to save you which means that you don't have faith in Jesus Christ alone for save you. Now guess who the unbeliever is?
You trust in your church and your eisegesis. You only read part of 1 Peter 3:21 and ignored the rest so you did not get the full picture on what God said. In Peter 3:21, Peter tells us that baptism now saves you, yet when Peter uses this phrase, he continues in the same sentence to explain exactly what he means by it. He said that baptism now saves you-not the removal of dirt from the flesh (that is, not as an outward, physical act which washes dirt from the body--that is not what saves you), "but an appeal to God for a good conscience, through the resurrection of Jesus Christ" (that is, as an inward, spiritual transaction between God and the individual, a transaction that is symbolized by/signified in the outward ceremony of water baptism).
Just as the eight people in the ark were "saved THROUGH water" as they were IN THE ARK. They were not literally saved "by" the water. Hebrews 11:7 is clear on this point (..built an ARK for the SAVING of his household--which is a type of Christ). *The context reveals that only the righteous (Noah and his family) were dry and therefore safe. In contrast, only the wicked in Noah's day came in contract with the water and they all perished.
This article may help you - IS SALVATION BY CHRIST or By Baptism? / Bob L. Ross |
Again, your pride is showing. I have faith in Jesus Christ alone for salvation. Jesus Christ is the Word and is God. (John 1:1) I have placed my faith in Jesus Christ alone for salvation. I am trusting in His death, burial and resurrection of Christ as the ALL-sufficient means of my salvation (Romans 1:16; 1 Corinthians 15:1-4) I am a BELIEVER, yet you have the audacity to call me an unbeliever simply because I have not placed my faith in water baptism for salvation in addition to placing my faith in Jesus Christ alone for salvation. I can see that the church of Christ has really done a number on you. Sigh..
Those who believe in Christ unto salvation/have placed their faith in Jesus Christ alone for salvation and are saved have already repented in the process of changing their mind and choosing to believe in Christ/place faith in Christ unto salvation. (Acts 3:19; 5:31; 10:43-47; 11:17,18; 5:7-9; 20:21) When only repentance is mentioned in connection with salvation, belief/faith is implied or assumed. When only belief/faith is mentioned in connection with salvation, repentance is implied or assumed. Where you have one you must have the other. Two sides to the same coin. Not so with baptism. You can repent and believe the gospel but not yet be water baptized. Water baptism 'follows' saving belief/faith in Christ (Acts 10:43-47) so it's not implied or assumed along with belief/faith. Repentance is necessary for salvation (Luke 13:3) because if we don't repent (change our mind) then we won't believe the gospel/place our faith in Jesus Christ for salvation and be saved.
The church of Christ reverses the scriptural order of repentance and faith in salvation, but repentance actually 'precedes' saving belief/faith.
Matthew 21:32 - For John came to you to show you the way of righteousness, and you did not believe him, but the tax collectors and the prostitutes did. And even after you saw this, you did not repent and believe him. *Notice the order.
Mark 1:15 - The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand: repent and believe the gospel. *Notice the order.
Acts 20:21 - testifying both to Jews and to Greeks of repentance toward God and of faith in our Lord Jesus Christ. *Notice the order.
In regard to confession, the word of faith is in our mouth and heart together (Romans 10:8-10) so confession is a confirmation of faith (which is why we will be saved if we confess) and is not a work for salvation after we believe unto righteousness, as Campbellites teaches. Believers confess by the Holy Spirit (with divine influence) upon conversion and after that Jesus is Lord. (1 Corinthians 12:3) So, confession is implied or assumed and does not need to be mentioned along with belief/faith in every verse. Simply believing in our head (and not in our heart) that God raised Him from the dead does not result in righteousness and simply reciting and giving "lip service" to the words "Jesus is Lord" not by divine influence from the Holy Spirit is not unto salvation.
Again, water baptism 'follows' saving belief/faith in Christ (Acts 10:43-47) so it's not implied or assumed along with belief/faith.
In John 12:42, do we know the real condition of these "believing" rulers' hearts? Was it (mere mental assent belief James 2:19) or (trust and reliance saving belief John 3:16)? We do know that they loved men's praises (vs. 43) more than God's (John 5:44). Some may argue that the unwillingness of the chief rulers to confess Christ in this isolated situation throws doubt on the complete genuineness of their faith and others may argue that they simply have a weak moment in this isolated situation in front of the Pharisees. Does this mean they never confessed Christ at all? So, your argument is inconclusive.
The Apostle Peter at one point failed to confess Jesus before men (John 18:17-27), but after the Holy Spirit was given, he was a different man who boldly confessed Him. (Acts 4:8-13) We know that Peter was saved even though he had a weak moment and the same may be true for these chief rulers as well. Does the text specifically say that they were saved or not saved? If the chief rulers truly believed (trusted in Christ for salvation) even though they had a weak moment, then they were saved. (John 3:16) If their lack of confession was the result of a lack of genuine belief, then they are not saved. (John 3:18)
Those verses don't need to say anything about repentance and confession because repentance and confession are already implied or assumed. Repent "change our mind" new direction of this change of mind belief/faith in Jesus Christ for salvation. Two sides to the same coin. You place repentance "after" belief/faith and basically turn it into a work for salvation. This explains why you don't understand. The word of faith is in our mouth and heart together, and confession is a confirmation of faith but you place confession "after" one believes unto righteousness and basically turn it into a work for salvation, which further explains why you don't understand. (1 Corinthians 2:14)
Baptism "follows" salvation through belief/faith so baptism is not required for salvation. (Acts 10:43-47)
You just don't understand.
I already thoroughly explained this, but I will expect the truth to just continue to go right over your head and there is a reason for that. Once again, the Apostle Peter at one point failed to confess Jesus before men (John 18:17-27), but after the Holy Spirit was given, he was a different man who boldly confessed Him. (Acts 4:8-13) We know that Peter was saved even though he had a weak moment and the same may be true for these chief rulers as well. Does the text specifically say that they were saved or not saved? If the chief rulers truly believed (trusted in Christ for salvation) even though they had a weak moment, then they were saved. (John 3:16) If their lack of confession was the result of a lack of genuine belief, then they are not saved. (John 3:18) You need to get it through your head that confession is not a work for salvation after faith.You have proved absolutely nothing except that you don't understand the difference between genuine faith and a spurious faith. "Faith only" per James 2:24 is an empty profession of faith/dead faith that produces no works. That is not genuine faith but a bare profession of faith that merely claims to be genuine but demonstrates by the lack of works that it's dead. (James 2:14) *Not to be confused with faith that trusts in Jesus Christ alone for salvation. (Romans 4:5-6; Ephesians 2:8,9) You cannot seem to grasp this deeper faith that trusts in Jesus Christ alone for salvation. This also explains why you have so much faith in water and works for salvation. Believers have placed their faith in Jesus Christ alone for salvation. Believers don't turn repentance, confession and baptism into works for salvation "after" salvation through faith either. Your false gospel is the result of bad semantics, flawed hermeneutics and eisegesis.
You just don't get it. We are saved the moment that we place our faith in Jesus Christ alone for salvation. (Ephesians 2:8,9) The word of faith is in our mouth and heart together (Romans 10:8-10) and confession is a confirmation of faith that is by the Holy Spirit (1 Corinthians 12:3) which is why we will be saved if we confess. One does not believe unto righteousness and remain lost until next week, after one rounds up a group of people at Walmart and verbally confesses Christ to them as a work for salvation and then is finally saved next week. That is not how it works. Your misunderstanding of confession along with your erroneous 4 step plan of salvation that culminates in salvation by water baptism (which negates Romans 10:8-10) is a hot mess!
I could explain this to you until I'm blue in the face, but you still won't get it. Listen closely: What a genuine believer means by salvation through faith (rightly understood) in Jesus Christ alone for salvation (Romans 4:5-6; Ephesians 2:8,9) is not the same thing as what James means by "faith only" which is an empty profession of faith/dead faith that remains alone - "barren of works" (James 2:14) so I'm not trying to have it both ways based on your erroneous argument! Repentance is a change of mind which precedes saving faith in Christ (two sides to the same coin) so it's not "faith only" in that sense. It's faith in Jesus Christ alone for salvation and repentance preceded faith and this kind of faith does not remain "alone" - barren of good works. (Ephesians 2:10)
Man is saved by faith that trusts in Jesus Christ alone for salvation. (Romans 4:5-6; Ephesians 2:8,9) Repentance preceded faith and confession confirmed faith. (Acts 10:43-47) Repentance and confession are not works for salvation that follow salvation through faith. Water baptism "follows" salvation through faith. So, it's not faith only in that sense and James is talking about feeding and clothing the poor in regard to works in James 2:15-16 and not repentance, confession and baptism.
Man is saved through faith and not by works (Romans 4:5-6; Ephesians 2:8,9; Titus 3:5; 2 Timothy 1:9); yet genuine faith is (evidenced) by works. (James 2:14-24).
*Jesus Christ saves us through faith based on the merits of His finished work of redemption "alone" and not based on the merits of our works. (Romans 3:24-28)
It is through faith "in Jesus Christ alone" (and not based on the merits of our works) that we are justified on account of Christ (Romans 4:5-6; 5:1; 5:9); yet the faith that justifies does not remain alone (unfruitful, barren) if it is genuine. (James 2:14-24) *Perfect Harmony*
Now I do understand your confusion. Prior to my conversion several years ago, been there, done that. I really wish that I could remove the veil from your eyes allowing you to see but only the Lord can do that. All I can do is plant seeds and continue to pray for you.
My 5 minutes was up before I could update and finish this.
Man is saved by faith that trusts in Jesus Christ alone for salvation. (Romans 4:5-6; Ephesians 2:8,9) Repentance preceded faith (Acts 20:21) and confession confirmed faith. (Romans 10:8-10; 1 Corinthians 12:3) Repentance and confession are not works for salvation that follow salvation through faith, yet water baptism does "follow" salvation through faith. (Acts 10:43-47) So, it's not faith only in the sense that you keep implying and in regard to works, James is talking about feeding and clothing the poor (James 2:15-16) and is not using your argument about repentance, confession and baptism.
I've been typing for 3 hours straight this morning on three different Christian forum sites. It's time for a coffee break.
Why not do a study to find out how people in the New Testament were saved? You can be sure that if you are saved the same way they were saved, you will have God’s approval and truly have salvation. The Bible is true, isn’t it? God does not lie, does He? Can’t we trust what the Bible teaches us;? what the Bible says?
Men, on the other hand can deceive you. God warns many times about false prophets, false teachers, and the commandments of men. He tells us to “Try” or “test” the different “spirits,” to see if they are from God. He says in Acts 17 that people should “Search the scriptures” to see if teachings are true.
(1) “Admit you are a sinner”—while the scriptures teach that we ALL are sinners, I don’t remember any scripture that commands us to admit that in order to be saved. If there is no scripture to prove this, then it must be a “commandment of men.”
(2) “Believe Jesus is Lord and Savior.”—this is true and there are many scriptures that teach this. And while this is true and taught in the Bible, James 2:24 tells us that salvation is NOT by “faith only”, it is NOT by faith alone. In All of the scriptures in the New Testament that teach we are to believe or have faith, they do not say faith “alone” or faith only” (except James 2:24). This means that there can also be OTHER REQUIREMENTS for salvation.
The question “WHAT MUST I DO TO BE SAVED?” Is asked twice in the New Testament. Once in Acts 2:37 by the Jews at Pentecost and also in Acts 16:29 by the Philippian jailer. Aren’t you curious to know what the answer is to that question answered by God’s apostles? I mean they can’t be wrong. They would not be lying. Their answer to this question would surely be from God and would be the TRUTH. Here is what Peter, God’s apostle said in Acts 2:38–“ REPENT AND BE BAPTIZED, in the name of Jesus Christ, for the remission of sins…”. And here is Paul’s answer to the jailer—“ BELIEVE ON THE LORD JESUS CHRIST and you will be saved…I see you have PART of God’s answer for salvation in your post. Faith is certainly necessary, but not faith alone. You have not done ALL God has commanded you to do to be saved, if you have not also obeyed what Peter said. “Repent and be baptized.” These two answers do not cancel out each other. It is not a choice—one or the other, like going through a buffet line and saying “I’ll have this but I don’t want that.” This is God you are dealing with and His word. No part of His word can be disobeyed or ignored and still reap salvation. Let me assure you that Acts 2:38 is correct by telling you that this also is what JESUS CHRIST says to do in order to be saved in Mark 16:16–“ He that believes and is baptized shall be saved.” That incorporates BOTH ANSWERS given by Peter and Paul. Do you see what God wants you to do? He wants you to obey ALL He has said about salvation.
“Confession” is good and is definitely commanded by Jesus in the Bible. Matt. 10:32 and Roman’s 10:10. But there is not a scripture in the New Testament that commands us to “confess to following Jesus.” God tells us what He wants us to confess. 1 John 4:15 GOD says, “Whoever CONFESSES THAT JESUS IS THE SON OF GOD, God abides in him.” We also have a God-approved example of a man making that exact confession just before he is baptized in Acts 8:37. It’s important that you make the RIGHT confession; the one that God wants you to make.
So how does GOD answer the question of “What must I do to be saved?
(1) BELIEVE - Acts 16:30
(2) REPENT - Acts 2:38
(3) CONFESS THAT JESUS IS THE SON OF GOD -
1 John 4:15 and Acts 8:37
(4) BE BAPTIZED - Acts 2:38, Mark 16:16,
1 Peter 3:21
How does this compare with:
(1) admit you are a sinner
(2) believe Jesus is Lord and Savior
(3) confess to following Him.
You’re done!
????
Which is GOD’s plan of salvation?
God said, “ There is a way that SEEMS RIGHT but it leads to destruction.” Be careful.; obey God, not men.
Amen and Amen.
This is what makes the Christian faith distinct and completely UNIQUE from all other faiths, traditions and philosophies...... it is not based on merit.
Yet, there is this continuous assault on this most necessary distinguishing fact >>> ... we cannot merit/achieve salvation and there is no single meritorious work we can do for salvation or the remission of sins.
Christ Jesus did ALL the work, it is His merit, and we accept His Work on our behalf.
He alone did all of the work to justify and sanctify us, ie, to get us in right relationship with God, but he expects us to do the work of abiding and walking in him and doing what he says.
If you think (abiding and walking ) will save you spiritually then I would disagree.
Amen! That salvation is by grace through faith and is not by works is not hard to understand. It's just hard for works-salvationists to ACCEPT. It's a shame that human pride will not allow works-salvationists to trust in Jesus Christ as the ALL-sufficient means of their salvation, giving Him all the glory, honor and merit for our salvation. Instead, works-salvationists boast in self - self promotion, self righteousness and self preservation. For such folks, their hands are full of their works and they will not let go in order to receive Christ through faith.
For such folks, believing is mere mental assent, repentance is moral self-reformation, confession is lip service and water baptism was just a bath. Repentance is actually a change of mind which "precedes" believing in Christ unto salvation (Acts 11:17,18; 20:21) and confessing with our mouth that Jesus is Lord and believing in our heart that God has raised Him from the dead are not two separate steps to salvation but are chronologically together. (Romans 10:9,10) The word of faith is in our mouth and heart together. (Romans 10:8) Water baptism "follows" salvation through believing in Him (Acts 10:43-47) believing the gospel/faith. (Acts 15:7-9)
The natural man just cannot understand. (1 Corinthians 2:11-14)
You just don't understand.
You have proved absolutely nothing except that you don't understand the difference between genuine faith and a spurious faith. "Faith only" per James 2:24 is an empty profession of faith/dead faith that produces no works. That is not genuine faith but a bare profession of faith that merely claims to be genuine but demonstrates by the lack of works that it's dead. (James 2:14) *Not to be confused with faith that trusts in Jesus Christ alone for salvation. (Romans 4:5-6; Ephesians 2:8,9) You cannot seem to grasp this deeper faith that trusts in Jesus Christ alone for salvation. This also explains why you have so much faith in water and works for salvation. Believers have placed their faith in Jesus Christ alone for salvation. Believers don't turn repentance, confession and baptism into works for salvation "after" salvation through faith either. Your false gospel is the result of bad semantics, flawed hermeneutics and eisegesis.
You just don't get it. We are saved the moment that we place our faith in Jesus Christ alone for salvation. (Ephesians 2:8,9) The word of faith is in our mouth and heart together (Romans 10:8-10) and confession is a confirmation of faith that is by the Holy Spirit (1 Corinthians 12:3) which is why we will be saved if we confess. One does not believe unto righteousness and remain lost until next week, after one rounds up a group of people at Walmart and verbally confesses Christ to them as a work for salvation and then is finally saved next week. That is not how it works. Your misunderstanding of confession along with your erroneous 4 step plan of salvation that culminates in salvation by water baptism (which negates Romans 10:8-10) is a hot mess!
I could explain this to you until I'm blue in the face, but you still won't get it. Listen closely: What a genuine believer means by salvation through faith (rightly understood) in Jesus Christ alone for salvation (Romans 4:5-6; Ephesians 2:8,9) is not the same thing as what James means by "faith only" which is an empty profession of faith/dead faith that remains alone - "barren of works" (James 2:14) so I'm not trying to have it both ways based on your erroneous argument! Repentance is a change of mind which precedes saving faith in Christ (two sides to the same coin) so it's not "faith only" in that sense. It's faith in Jesus Christ alone for salvation and repentance preceded faith and this kind of faith does not remain "alone" - barren of good works. (Ephesians 2:10)
Man is saved by faith that trusts in Jesus Christ alone for salvation. (Romans 4:5-6; Ephesians 2:8,9) Repentance preceded faith and confession confirmed faith. (Acts 10:43-47) Repentance and confession are not works for salvation that follow salvation through faith. Water baptism "follows" salvation through faith. So, it's not faith only in that sense and James is talking about feeding and clothing the poor in regard to works in James 2:15-16 and not repentance, confession and baptism.
Man is saved through faith and not by works (Romans 4:5-6; Ephesians 2:8,9; Titus 3:5; 2 Timothy 1:9); yet genuine faith is (evidenced) by works. (James 2:14-24).
*Jesus Christ saves us through faith based on the merits of His finished work of redemption "alone" and not based on the merits of our works. (Romans 3:24-28)
It is through faith "in Jesus Christ alone" (and not based on the merits of our works) that we are justified on account of Christ (Romans 4:5-6; 5:1; 5:9); yet the faith that justifies does not remain alone (unfruitful, barren) if it is genuine. (James 2:14-24) *Perfect Harmony*
Now I do understand your confusion. Prior to my conversion several years ago, been there, done that. I really wish that I could remove the veil from your eyes allowing you to see but only the Lord can do that. All I can do is plant seeds and continue to pray for you.
It’s not a matter of understanding what you are saying; your doctrine does not align with the teachings of the Bible and I cannot accept your false doctrine.