Loss of salvation???

[Inquisitor]

AI is neither good nor bad. It's a tool, period. Fed information from various, often contrary, sources. It has no reasoning.



There are a multitude, only one is right. (Not going to debate that as it's been debated to death) And, despite the broadstroke.... I personally am not indoctrinated. I have a brain and I read the Bible myself.

That is a good reply and you are fully entitled to hold any interpretation, you wish to hold as doctrine.

You can force AI to a conclusion on almost any topic in the scripture.

But AI will kick back if the evidence in the scripture is insufficient, to reach that conclusion.

 

[Inquisitor]

Which means?
Some will go to their grave never knowing what the Word of God actually says.
They've been duped.

They'll cherry-pick a few verses to make a point, and throw the rest out.

I have no time for them, either.
I was just alerting others to what we are dealing with some here.

And, besides?
Interesting part?
Some parts of the KJV are better.
That is... if someone is making a case for abortion not being murder.
Little do they know.

May I ask you Genez, if you have noticed that nearly all interpretations tend to cherry pick verses.

One of the most noticeable cherry picking is done by the Christian sects.

You have seen this many times and so have I.

 

[GWH]

It lands on being informative without conclusion.

The same query to the basic search engine (whatever it was I used) came back and said, NO, the Christian can't lose salvation.

I suppose we'll be applying 1Cor1 & 3 soon - well, my search engine (or AI or robot) says....

Well, our website is both informative and provides a harmonization.

 

[GWH]

Here is the question I asked Microsoft Copilot.

So a Christian must apply themselves to the faith to be saved. Therefore, OSAS cannot be true.
You cannot one day become a Christian and then forget about Jesus.
And live your own life to the full; a life devoid of love, a life of continuous denial and sin.
Please state whether OSAS is true or not.

The doctrine of "Once Saved, Always Saved" (OSAS) is not explicitly stated in the New Testament, and many passages challenge its validity. Scripture emphasizes the necessity of perseverance, obedience, and active faith for salvation.
Scriptural Evidence Against OSAS

1. Matthew 24:13: "But the one who endures to the end will be saved." This implies that salvation is contingent upon enduring in faith and obedience.
2. Hebrews 6:4-6: Warns of the impossibility of repentance for those who have fallen away after being enlightened.
3. James 2:17: "Faith by itself, if it is not accompanied by action, is dead." Faith must be active and lived out through obedience.
4. Revelation 3:5: "The one who is victorious will, like them, be dressed in white. I will never blot out the name of that person from the book of life." This suggests that names can be removed from the book of life if one does not remain faithful.

The Call to Obedience
Jesus and the apostles repeatedly stress the importance of obeying God's commandments:

• John 14:15: "If you love me, keep my commandments."
• 1 John 2:3-6: "We know that we have come to know him if we keep his commands."

Conclusion
Based on the New Testament, salvation requires ongoing faith, obedience, and perseverance. The idea that one can become a Christian and then live a life devoid of love and obedience contradicts the teachings of Jesus and the apostles. Therefore, OSAS does not align with the scriptural emphasis on enduring faith and active obedience

Amen!

 

[Musicmaster]

May I ask you Genez, if you have noticed that nearly all interpretations tend to cherry pick verses.

One of the most noticeable cherry picking is done by the Christian sects.

You have seen this many times and so have I.

Painting all doctrinal belief systems with the broad brush strokes of this accusation is just too easy. Can prove your claim?

MM

 

[Kroogz]

May I ask you Genez, if you have noticed that nearly all interpretations tend to cherry pick verses.

No.

Painting all doctrinal belief systems with the broad brush strokes of this accusation is just too easy. Can prove your claim?

MM

BINGO.

 

[Kroogz]

Painting all doctrinal belief systems with the broad brush strokes of this accusation is just too easy. Can prove your claim?

MM

Many believers have pointed out and explained the rewards, discipline, shame, harsh discipline, saved as if through fire scriptures to the loss of salvation crowd.

But few want to contend with NEVER perish. No, Absolutely NO condemnation. A forever advocate. Sealed. Nothing can separate us. You have eternal life.

They make the clear and undeniable ambiguous.

And try to make the ambiguous clear and undeniable.

 

[Musicmaster]

May I ask you Genez, if you have noticed that nearly all interpretations tend to cherry pick verses.

One of the most noticeable cherry picking is done by the Christian sects.

You have seen this many times and so have I.

Granted, I understand that you said "nearly all," which likely has a high level of truth to it. I just like to see how you proved this...if at all.

MM

 

[Genez]

That is a good reply and you are fully entitled to hold any interpretation, you wish to hold as doctrine.

You just said?

That is a good reply and you are fully entitled to hold any interpretation, you wish to hold as doctrine?

God says that is a lie. They are free to choose error if they wish. But, not entitled.

Those who feel entitled will be denied, and will lose rewards.
They will painfully find out that they will not be entitled to rewards God wanted to give them.
Denied, because their rebellion against the Spirit will make it impossible.

This is a faithful saying:​

​

For if we died with Him,​

We shall also live with Him.​

If we endure,​

We shall also reign with Him.​

If we deny Him,​

He also will deny us.​

​

2 Timothy 2:11-12​

 

[GWH]

Many believers have pointed out and explained the rewards, discipline, shame, harsh discipline, saved as if through fire scriptures to the loss of salvation crowd.

But few want to contend with NEVER perish. No, Absolutely NO condemnation. A forever advocate. Sealed. Nothing can separate us. You have eternal life.

They make the clear and undeniable ambiguous.

And try to make the ambiguous clear and undeniable.

No, we try to make the clear need for perseverance palatable to you OSASists,
which I was before I learned the "sour 16" by reading the NT, which is why
I want to harmonize them with the few verses you mentioned.

 

[Genez]

No, we try to make the clear need for perseverance palatable to you OSASists,
which I was before I learned the "sour 16" by reading the NT, which is why
I want to harmonize them with the few verses you mentioned.

Not sure what you think you see is what you see.
Could you please provide the passages you have been using to indicate about perserverance?

 

[studier]

NO!!!! That is mechanical!

You do realize systematic traditions are stringing together verses via words and topical studies, don't you?

Do you also realize that God has had men on this earth for thousands of years doing such in-depth studies, compiling and documenting studies of every word in the Bible, going through countless secular writings to help define words, routing through ancient trash dumps to find evidence of how biblical words were used in biblical times, etc., etc., etc., and that this work is still going on even to the point of still scouring the globe looking for any more manuscripts that may exist?

Seriously, get out once in a while and explore what other members of the family are doing and thinking. The continued R&D is going to proceed with or without your agreement.

Pay attention to how @Inquisitor is asking questions of AI. Old dogs, new tricks. We're going to be faced with this more and more and very rapidly at its ever-increasing rate of development.

 

[studier]

It's no wonder these guys do not like R.B. Thieme Jr.
He was straight.

God does not change.
Only excuses do.

I liked him. I liked his son.

I came to disagree with Free Grace Dispensationalism.

It's not the man, it's the message (recall that one?)

 

[Genez]

You do realize systematic traditions are stringing together verses via words and topical studies, don't you?

Do you also realize that God has had men on this earth for thousands of years doing such in-depth studies, compiling and documenting studies of every word in the Bible, going through countless secular writings to help define words, routing through ancient trash dumps to find evidence of how biblical words were used in biblical times, etc., etc., etc., and that this work is still going on even to the point of still scouring the globe looking for any more manuscripts that may exist?

Seriously, get out once in a while and explore what other members of the family are doing and thinking. The continued R&D is going to proceed with or without your agreement.

Pay attention to how @Inquisitor is asking questions of AI. Old dogs, new tricks. We're going to be faced with this more and more and very rapidly at its ever-increasing rate of development.

Do you also realize that the Greek meraning of words have been wrongly translated at times?

Stringing them together only will reinforce error.

 

[Genez]

I liked him. I liked his son.

I came to disagree with Free Grace Dispensationalism.

It's not the man, it's the message (recall that one?)

Explain... "Free Grace Dispensationalism?"

I never heard him using that term.

 

[Genez]

I liked him. I liked his son.

I came to disagree with Free Grace Dispensationalism.

I never heard him using that term.

I have seen that term bantered around by Christians as meaning something entirely different than anything he taught.

What RB Thieme, Jr taught never came close to how the term is being used today.

 

[studier]

Do you also realize that the Greek meraning of words have been wrongly translated at times?

Stringing them together only will reinforce error.

Sure. I've redeemed the past 3+/- decades translating and retranslating and checking Lexical definitions and grammatical constructions and at times researching to see what others think.

Your last statement leaves me shaking my head... Word studies are not really a part of hermeneutics instruction, but I've found them to be some of the most instructive forms of study. To come to an understanding of how God uses a word can be key to opening up broader understanding in the Text. 1Cor2:13

 

[Genez]

Sure. I've redeemed the past 3+/- decades translating and retranslating and checking Lexical definitions and grammatical constructions and at times researching to see what others think.

Your last statement leaves me shaking my head... Word studies are not really a part of hermeneutics instruction, but I've found them to be some of the most instructive forms of study. To come to an understanding of how God uses a word can be key to opening up broader understanding in the Text. 1Cor2:13

Noted....

 

[studier]

Explain... "Free Grace Dispensationalism?"

I never heard him using that term.

Try AI or your basic search engine. Look up Dallas Theological Seminary and Lewis Sperry Chafer's Systematic Theology. That's a good start.

 

[Gideon300]

We in Christ in Spirit can review the presented Scriptures and point being made. As was said, it's a compilation of information that has been put forth through teachings.

It supports loss of salvation so I'm not surprised some will just condemn it without reviewing it and explaining why and where it's right or wrong. So, the new excuse for not explaining Scripture is that it's AI. Same practice different nemesis.

Since the Bible does not support the loss of salvation, I'm not surprised if believers reject AI.