GOD'S WORD vs. man's opinion like GWHs.

[Ouch]

Oh no I’d never call anyone names or anything like that.

and certainly I’m not a judge of anyone else neither you nor Gwh or anyone else who believes in the lord . Thier actions and words and even beliefs will be between them and the Jesus.

so my intention was just to present what the Bible says about baptism because that’s how other people who accept scripture hear about something like baptism

I respect you also I honestly try to respect everyone as best I can. I fail I’m sure sometimes too but it’s my intention.

but I’m not judging you or him was just talking about baptism

I agree with you 100%, I like your style.

How can you possibly come to any kind of understanding if we don't have a solid foundation?

If we all use HIS word we can all get along, if someone puts their opinion then how many different roads do we go down.

SO when someone adds their opinion I'm normally done with them, why go on?

But when someone lies and claims it to be true I fight for JESUS and press them to prove it. I'm hoping they really look in HIS word and repent.

 

[Ouch]

I don't know what your point is.

It's differently worded in different parts of the Bible.

Just accept it for what it is and move on.

Don't you think we should follow HIS word?

IT IS VERY IMPORTANT.

Can you find anyplace else where HIS titles are used?

So why do so many people follow it?

Colossians 3:17 And whatsoever ye do in word or deed, do all in the name of the Lord Jesus, giving thanks to God and the Father by him.

John 14:13-14
13 And whatsoever ye shall ask in my name, that will I do, that the Father may be glorified in the Son.

14 If ye shall ask anything in my name, I will do it.

John 16:23 And in that day ye shall ask me nothing. Verily, verily, I say unto you, Whatsoever ye shall ask the Father in my name, he will give it you.


So there is ONE place in HIS word that uses HIS TITLES.

JESUS raveled who he was in Matthew 28:19, he is the father, the Son and the Holy Ghost.

Look here, JESUS speaking to Nicodemus. JESUS is ON the earth and he is also in Heaven!!
John 3:13 And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven.
John 10:30 I and my Father are one.

John 14:9 Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Show us the Father?

1 Timothy 3:16 And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory.

 

[Pilgrimshope]

I agree with you 100%, I like your style.

How can you possibly come to any kind of understanding if we don't have a solid foundation?

If we all use HIS word we can all get along, if someone puts their opinion then how many different roads do we go down.

SO when someone adds their opinion I'm normally done with them, why go on?

But when someone lies and claims it to be true I fight for JESUS and press them to prove it. I'm hoping they really look in HIS word and repent.

Yeah I don’t have a disagreement with you and am not judging you in any way we just have different approaches . I’m certainly not a great servant of God bit lately I’ve been drawn to things like this (personally I mean )

“And the servant of the Lord must not strive; but be gentle unto all men, apt to teach, patient, in meekness instructing those that oppose themselves;

if God peradventure will give them repentance to the acknowledging of the truth;

and that they may recover themselves out of the snare of the devil, who are taken captive by him at his will.”
‭‭2 Timothy‬ ‭2:24-26‬ ‭

Im not saying anyone in this thread is “ captive tonthe devils Will” or anything just been noticing that if you present truth n a peaceful manner ….. there’s much more of a chance of god blessing the interaction and giving some fruit towards a change of thinking or “ repentance “

 

[2ndTimeIsTheCharm]

Don't you think we should follow HIS word?

IT IS VERY IMPORTANT.

Can you find anyplace else where HIS titles are used?

So why do so many people follow it?

Colossians 3:17 And whatsoever ye do in word or deed, do all in the name of the Lord Jesus, giving thanks to God and the Father by him.

John 14:13-14
13 And whatsoever ye shall ask in my name, that will I do, that the Father may be glorified in the Son.

14 If ye shall ask anything in my name, I will do it.

John 16:23 And in that day ye shall ask me nothing. Verily, verily, I say unto you, Whatsoever ye shall ask the Father in my name, he will give it you.


So there is ONE place in HIS word that uses HIS TITLES.

JESUS raveled who he was in Matthew 28:19, he is the father, the Son and the Holy Ghost.

Look here, JESUS speaking to Nicodemus. JESUS is ON the earth and he is also in Heaven!!
John 3:13 And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven.
John 10:30 I and my Father are one.

John 14:9 Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Show us the Father?

1 Timothy 3:16 And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory.

I'm just gonna go along with what the Bible says. It's not complicated.

 

[Ouch]

Yeah I don’t have a disagreement with you and am not judging you in any way we just have different approaches . I’m certainly not a great servant of God bit lately I’ve been drawn to things like this (personally I mean )

“And the servant of the Lord must not strive; but be gentle unto all men, apt to teach, patient, in meekness instructing those that oppose themselves;

if God peradventure will give them repentance to the acknowledging of the truth;

and that they may recover themselves out of the snare of the devil, who are taken captive by him at his will.”
‭‭2 Timothy‬ ‭2:24-26‬ ‭

Im not saying anyone in this thread is “ captive tonthe devils Will” or anything just been noticing that if you present truth n a peaceful manner ….. there’s much more of a chance of god blessing the interaction and giving some fruit towards a change of thinking or “ repentance “

Got, it.

I have issues, I'm retired State prison and have a hard time dealing with stupid and lazy.

So I don't have much tack at all.

I really don't care if people see or not, it's not up to me I just share HIS word and to try to get them to see.

I was once where they are, say this prayer and your saved, got baptized in JESUS titles. Never knew about the Holy Ghost. I was lost and thought I was good.

This I know, if it's in HIS word it's true.

If not it's lie from Satan, which I told hwh that exact point. I don't think he likes me lol.

It is what it is, I'm not here for a popularity contest and my daddy JESUS wasn't either HE called it like he seen it also.

This is a life and death matter and only those who OBEY HIM will be saved, tomorrow is not promised.

I for sure have asked people to forgive me when I read something wrong and said something I shouldn't have. No way am I'm perfect, but still under construction.

 

[GWH]

Yea I try to do the same and I know some things we don’t agree on but also we have had some decent discussions about things we do .

i learned from a church once how valuable this is and how destructive the opposite lesson is to a group of believers

“But why dost thou judge thy brother? or why dost thou set at nought thy brother? for we shall all stand before the judgment seat of Christ. For it is written, As I live, saith the Lord, every knee shall bow to me, And every tongue shall confess to God. So then every one of us shall give account of himself to God.

Let us not therefore judge one another any more: but judge this rather, that no man put a stumblingblock or an occasion to fall in his brother's way.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭14:10-13‬ ‭KJV‬‬

when we appear before the lord that great day I won’t have to give an account for anyone else’s words or deeds , but will have to give account of my own words and deeds.

I don’t agree with you about baptism being replaced but you’ve known that for a long time lot of other subjects haven’t been the same way . I appreciate the people who take time to post here even if i don’t agree it gives me reason to look into it in the Bible

Okay, but as we agree to disagree regarding this issue I would like for you to state my belief thusly:

"I believe John's WB that signified repentance was superseded by Christ's SB (per Matt. 3:11, cf. Rom. 5:5, 1Cor. 12:13) that WB continued to signify (in Acts 2:38 & 10:48) and is the understanding by modern Baptists that I had when I and then my children were WB). At no time was the washing with water essential, but rather it is faith in Christ's atonement (1Peter 3:21) that satisfies GRFS."

Thanks. It would be great if Ouch! were willing to quote me believing this Scripture-based belief and call it a lie if he dares.

 

[Pilgrimshope]

Got, it.

I have issues, I'm retired State prison and have a hard time dealing with stupid and lazy.

So I don't have much tack at all.

I really don't care if people see or not, it's not up to me I just share HIS word and to try to get them to see.

I was once where they are, say this prayer and your saved, got baptized in JESUS titles. Never knew about the Holy Ghost. I was lost and thought I was good.

This I know, if it's in HIS word it's true.

If not it's lie from Satan, which I told hwh that exact point. I don't think he likes me lol.

It is what it is, I'm not here for a popularity contest and my daddy JESUS wasn't either HE called it like he seen it also.

This is a life and death matter and only those who OBEY HIM will be saved, tomorrow is not promised.

I for sure have asked people to forgive me when I read something wrong and said something I shouldn't have. No way am I'm perfect, but still under construction.

“No way am I'm perfect, but still under construction.”

yes sir I think that covers all of us. It definately identifies me. And to that point is why I try to remember that before I learned things I know now as an old man I used to think a lot of things differently , there was a time I would have agreed that baptism isn’t a big deal and didn’t have much meaning …….

bit then later on I learned baptism is for the remission of sins in Jesus name and it was done in water before and also after the cross by Jesus apostles baptizing the Jews and also gentiles that converted and believed. All I’m the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins because we believe this message

“For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures;”
‭‭1 Corinthians‬ ‭15:3‬ ‭

So then Baptism in his name who died for our sins and rose up for our justification

“Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death? Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.

For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death,

we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection:

knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin. For he that is dead is freed from sin.

Likewise reckon ye also yourselves to be dead indeed unto sin,

but alive unto God through Jesus Christ our Lord.

Let not sin therefore reign in your mortal body, that ye should obey it in the lusts thereof. Neither yield ye your members as instruments of unrighteousness unto sin:

but yield yourselves unto God, as those that are alive from the dead, and your members as instruments of righteousness unto God.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭6:3-7, 11-13‬ ‭KJV‬‬

I realized baptism in his name is all about Jesus death for our sins burial and resurrection for our justification and being United with him through an act of faith . So now I know things I wouldn’t have known unless I acknowledged I could be wrong before and became open to scriptures like Roman’s 6 or Galatians 3 or Colossians 2 that echo what Roman’s is talking about and add more details such as north into Abraham’s inheritance through Christ

but no one could have changed my mind until I saw the scriptures myself and realized what was being said plainly ….. I think that’s a hard place to come to for many . Because for all of us it’s going to show us how wrong or uninformed we have been about a few things

 

[Ouch]

Okay, but as we agree to disagree regarding this issue I would like for you to state my belief thusly:

"I believe John's WB that signified repentance was superseded by Christ's SB (per Matt. 3:11, cf. Rom. 5:5, 1Cor. 12:13) that WB continued to signify (in Acts 2:38 & 10:48) and is the understanding by modern Baptists that I had when I and then my children were WB). At no time was the washing with water essential, but rather it is faith in Christ's atonement (1Peter 3:21) that satisfies GRFS."

Thanks. It would be great if Ouch! were willing to quote me believing this Scripture-based belief and call it a lie if he dares.

Johns was not only baptizing for repentance but also sins.
Mark 1:4 John did baptize in the wilderness, and preach the baptism of repentance for the remission of sins.

John also said this.
Matthew 3:11 I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance. but he that cometh after me is mightier than I, whose shoes I am not worthy to bear: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost, and with fire:

This is what John proficed.
Acts 2:3-4
3 And there appeared unto them cloven tongues like as of fire, and it sat upon each of them.
4 And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance.

The baptism continued as Luke 24:47 And that repentance and remission of sins should be preached in his name among all nations, beginning at Jerusalem.

This is what Luke was speaking of.
Acts 2:38-39
38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
39 For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.

So this is evidence using HIS word to prove that being baptized and receiving the Holy Ghost are two different things.

In Acts 8, 10 and 19 all line up with these scriptures they all had speaking on tongues and baptism in JESUS name.

ALL of HIS disciples were baptized in JESUS name and received the Holy Ghost and spoke in tongues.

Of course you can believe anything you like.

 

[Ouch]

“No way am I'm perfect, but still under construction.”

yes sir I think that covers all of us. It definately identifies me. And to that point is why I try to remember that before I learned things I know now as an old man I used to think a lot of things differently , there was a time I would have agreed that baptism isn’t a big deal and didn’t have much meaning …….

bit then later on I learned baptism is for the remission of sins in Jesus name and it was done in water before and also after the cross by Jesus apostles baptizing the Jews and also gentiles that converted and believed. All I’m the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins because we believe this message

“For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures;”
‭‭1 Corinthians‬ ‭15:3‬ ‭

So then Baptism in his name who died for our sins and rose up for our justification

“Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death? Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.

For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death,

we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection:

knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin. For he that is dead is freed from sin.

Likewise reckon ye also yourselves to be dead indeed unto sin,

but alive unto God through Jesus Christ our Lord.

Let not sin therefore reign in your mortal body, that ye should obey it in the lusts thereof. Neither yield ye your members as instruments of unrighteousness unto sin:

but yield yourselves unto God, as those that are alive from the dead, and your members as instruments of righteousness unto God.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭6:3-7, 11-13‬ ‭KJV‬‬

I realized baptism in his name is all about Jesus death for our sins burial and resurrection for our justification and being United with him through an act of faith . So now I know things I wouldn’t have known unless I acknowledged I could be wrong before and became open to scriptures like Roman’s 6 or Galatians 3 or Colossians 2 that echo what Roman’s is talking about and add more details such as north into Abraham’s inheritance through Christ

but no one could have changed my mind until I saw the scriptures myself and realized what was being said plainly ….. I think that’s a hard place to come to for many . Because for all of us it’s going to show us how wrong or uninformed we have been about a few things

AGAIN AMEN, seek and ye shall find.

Wise men still seek HIM.

GOD answers KNEE mail.

Pride is a terrible thing, we all need to be humble as a little child.

OBEY without questing.

OBEY without debating, because I know more then JESUS does, he needs to listen to me more!! Yes I joking.

GOD BLESS YOU.

 

[pinebeach]

Prove being filled with the Holy Ghost fills us with love.

I'm not sure who is saying what here, but we are not automatically filled with love. If we were, the world would be a very different place I think.

Also, what is a Kerygma

 

[pinebeach]

Why do you say love is not a gift of the Holy Ghost? God first loves, which is why he gives the other gifts that follow.
You priortize this 'speaking in tongues', a gift which demonstratably not many beleivers know they have, but you seem to nully the one commandment that Jesus Christ gives the church: To love each other.

He most likely states that because love is not a gift of the Holy Spirit. Scripture indicates that love is a fruit of the Holy Spirit.

22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, forbearance, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, 23 gentleness and self-control. Against such things there is no law. Galatians 5: 22-23.

I would hesitate to say otherwise as that would be contrary to God's word and that trumps anything we might think. As a practical metaphor, as love is a fruit, that makes it plain that we have to grow or exhibit that fruit. Fruit on trees grows. It does not magically appear. So it really does not matter one iota what anyone says about it if they are in disagreement with what we find in the Bible. Nothing against you personally, but I think that a good number of people are not taught the truth as we find it in scripture so it is always best to line up our thoughts and what we profess by the word we say we believe in.

 

[GWH]

I'm not sure who is saying what here, but we are not automatically filled with love. If we were, the world would be a very different place I think.

Also, what is a Kerygma

I think that question is meant for me.

A crisis that threatened a Philippian jailer with death prompted him to ask Paul and Silas the most important question in life: “What must I do to be saved?” (Acts 16:30) This question is most important, because—as sinful and mortal souls—we need saving from corruption, both moral and physical. We need saving from physical death if we value or enjoy life, and we need saving from immorality or evil-doing if it results in unhappy existence, especially after this lifetime.

The reply of Paul and Silas was this: “Believe in the Lord Jesus.” (Acts 16:31) This is God's requirement for salvation (GRFS) in a nutshell. Jesus Himself expressed GRFS even more succinctly using three, four and five letter words: “Ask… seek… knock…” (Matt. 7:7).

GRFS may be denoted by the use of the Greek word kerygma, meaning proclamation or preaching, referring to the good news (Gospel) concerning salvation to heaven and from a just hell (the DOD, cf. Rom. 1:16, Gal. 1:6-12, Col. 1:21-23). This Gospel was preached by Peter (in Acts 2:22-24) and summarized by Paul (in 1Cor. 15:1-8). The salient points include: Jesus was a man, accredited by God (to be Messiah), who died on a cross, but who was raised or resurrected from the dead. Messiah is the Way to heaven.

The normative way of stating the kerygma/GRFS in the NT is “Accept Christ Jesus as Lord” (as in 2Cor. 4:5 & Col. 2:6). The main points of Christian orthodoxy implicit in this statement can be explained or elaborated in a creed as follows:

1. There is a/one all-loving and just Lord or Creator God (Deut. 6:4, John 3:16, 2Thes. 1:6), who is both able (2Tim. 1:12) and willing (1Tim. 2:3-4, Ezek. 33:11) to provide all morally accountable human beings salvation or heaven—a wonderful life full of love, joy and peace forever.
2. Human beings are selfish or sinful (Rom. 3:23, 2Tim. 3:2-4, Col. 3:5), miserable (Gal. 5:19-21), and hopeless (Eph. 2:12) or hell-bound at the judgment (Matt. 23:33 & 25:46) when they reject God’s salvation (John 3:18, Rom. 2:5-11).
3. Jesus is God’s Messiah/Christ and incarnate Son, the way that God has chosen (John 3:16, Acts 16:30-31, Phil. 2:9-11) of providing salvation by means of his atoning death on the cross for the payment of the penalty for the sins of humanity (Rom. 3:22-25 & 5:9-11), followed by his resurrection to reign in heaven (1Cor. 15:14-28).
4. Thus, every person who hears the NT Gospel needs to repent and accept God’s grace or justification in Jesus as Christ/Messiah the Lord or Supreme Commander (Luke 2:11, John 14:6, Acts 16:31), which means trying to obey His commandment to love one another (Matt. 22:37-40, John 13:35, Rom. 13:9)—forever (Matt. 10:22, Psa. 113:2).
5. Then God’s Holy Spirit will establish a saving relationship with all who truly accept/love Him (Rev. 3:20) that will eventually achieve heaven after Christ returns at God’s resurrection of all saved souls when everyone cooperates fully with His will (John 14:6, 17&26, Rom. 8:6-17, Gal. 6:7-9, Eph. 1:13-14, Heb. 10:36, 12:1, Jam. 1:2-4).

 

[pinebeach]

I think that question is meant for me.

A crisis that threatened a Philippian jailer with death prompted him to ask Paul and Silas the most important question in life: “What must I do to be saved?” (Acts 16:30) This question is most important, because—as sinful and mortal souls—we need saving from corruption, both moral and physical. We need saving from physical death if we value or enjoy life, and we need saving from immorality or evil-doing if it results in unhappy existence, especially after this lifetime.

The reply of Paul and Silas was this: “Believe in the Lord Jesus.” (Acts 16:31) This is God's requirement for salvation (GRFS) in a nutshell. Jesus Himself expressed GRFS even more succinctly using three, four and five letter words: “Ask… seek… knock…” (Matt. 7:7).

GRFS may be denoted by the use of the Greek word kerygma, meaning proclamation or preaching, referring to the good news (Gospel) concerning salvation to heaven and from a just hell (the DOD, cf. Rom. 1:16, Gal. 1:6-12, Col. 1:21-23). This Gospel was preached by Peter (in Acts 2:22-24) and summarized by Paul (in 1Cor. 15:1-8). The salient points include: Jesus was a man, accredited by God (to be Messiah), who died on a cross, but who was raised or resurrected from the dead. Messiah is the Way to heaven.

The normative way of stating the kerygma/GRFS in the NT is “Accept Christ Jesus as Lord” (as in 2Cor. 4:5 & Col. 2:6). The main points of Christian orthodoxy implicit in this statement can be explained or elaborated in a creed as follows:

1. There is a/one all-loving and just Lord or Creator God (Deut. 6:4, John 3:16, 2Thes. 1:6), who is both able (2Tim. 1:12) and willing (1Tim. 2:3-4, Ezek. 33:11) to provide all morally accountable human beings salvation or heaven—a wonderful life full of love, joy and peace forever.
2. Human beings are selfish or sinful (Rom. 3:23, 2Tim. 3:2-4, Col. 3:5), miserable (Gal. 5:19-21), and hopeless (Eph. 2:12) or hell-bound at the judgment (Matt. 23:33 & 25:46) when they reject God’s salvation (John 3:18, Rom. 2:5-11).
3. Jesus is God’s Messiah/Christ and incarnate Son, the way that God has chosen (John 3:16, Acts 16:30-31, Phil. 2:9-11) of providing salvation by means of his atoning death on the cross for the payment of the penalty for the sins of humanity (Rom. 3:22-25 & 5:9-11), followed by his resurrection to reign in heaven (1Cor. 15:14-28).
4. Thus, every person who hears the NT Gospel needs to repent and accept God’s grace or justification in Jesus as Christ/Messiah the Lord or Supreme Commander (Luke 2:11, John 14:6, Acts 16:31), which means trying to obey His commandment to love one another (Matt. 22:37-40, John 13:35, Rom. 13:9)—forever (Matt. 10:22, Psa. 113:2).
5. Then God’s Holy Spirit will establish a saving relationship with all who truly accept/love Him (Rev. 3:20) that will eventually achieve heaven after Christ returns at God’s resurrection of all saved souls when everyone cooperates fully with His will (John 14:6, 17&26, Rom. 8:6-17, Gal. 6:7-9, Eph. 1:13-14, Heb. 10:36, 12:1, Jam. 1:2-4).

I think this is from you?

Exercising my gift of editing

I have not seen that as a gift from the Holy Spirit as the gifts are listed in the Bible, so are you saying you believe you are gifted with editing? I have various gifts myself but they are not 'spiritual' gifts. I am 'saved' and I know what that means. So, you are saying that the initialism GRFS means God's requirement for salvation.

Why are you making things so complicated?

 

[pinebeach]

to remove baptism we would have to come to the conclusion two of Jesus apostles didint understand it as well as we do because they absolutely continued to baptize in water after the cross

May I ask where did someone state we no longer need to be baptized? I don't have the time or the inclination, frankly, to read the whole thread but I did have my interest piqued by some of what I did read so I joined in. But would you tell me where someone said baptism was removed?

I would appreciate it. Thanks

 

[pinebeach]

Thank you sir, AMEN.

I am tying to get GWH to back up what comes out of his mouth.

He is the one who says being spirit baptism replaced water baptism.

OK I see that now. So Pilgrim never mind.

I don't know how some can get simple things so mixed up. Water baptism does not at all replace being baptiized in or with the Holy Spirit.

 

[pinebeach]

This thread is like a mental 'spin' class

 

[Pilgrimshope]

May I ask where did someone state we no longer need to be baptized? I don't have the time or the inclination, frankly, to read the whole thread but I did have my interest piqued by some of what I did read so I joined in. But would you tell me where someone said baptism was removed?

I would appreciate it. Thanks

Naw honestly I have no interest in further arguing especially with someone new lol

we were discussing whether baptism for remission of sins had been removed and replaced by some “ spiritual baptism “ which is just removing baptism from the equation in my opinion . But again no interest in arguing for the sake of it

 

[GWH]

I think this is from you?

I have not seen that as a gift from the Holy Spirit as the gifts are listed in the Bible, so are you saying you believe you are gifted with editing? I have various gifts myself but they are not 'spiritual' gifts. I am 'saved' and I know what that means. So, you are saying that the initialism GRFS means God's requirement for salvation.

Why are you making things so complicated?

If you are content with the simple version, then stick with “Accept Christ Jesus as Lord” (as in 2Cor. 4:5 & Col. 2:6).
I have been seeking to learn more of GW per the urging of Hebrews 6:1-3.

I believe a gift may be viewed as spiritual if it is used for godly purposes, such as edifying the body of Christ.
Jesus and Paul exemplified editing when they cited OT Scripture and applied it to the NT Gospel.

 

[Ouch]

I'm not sure who is saying what here, but we are not automatically filled with love. If we were, the world would be a very different place I think.

Also, what is a Kerygma

First example of being filled.

Acts 2:3-4
King James Version
3 And there appeared unto them cloven tongues like as of fire, and it sat upon each of them.

4 And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance.

 

[GWH]

OK I see that now. So Pilgrim never mind.

I don't know how some can get simple things so mixed up. Water baptism does not at all replace being baptiized in or with the Holy Spirit.

Not sure what you see now, but I hope you saw what I believe:

I believe John's WB that signified repentance was superseded by Christ's SB (per Matt. 3:11, cf. Rom. 5:5, 1Cor. 12:13) that WB continued to signify (in Acts 2:38 & 10:48) and is the understanding by modern Baptists that I had when I and then my children were WB). At no time was the washing with water essential, but rather it is faith in Christ's atonement (1Peter 3:21) that satisfies GRFS."

I also believe that WB replaced circumcision as the outward rite/work signifying saving faith (cf. Rom. 4).