Healing from God

[homwardbound]

Grace never meant to be taken for granted and used for any self gain. As the Corinthians did. And Paul wrote about it
Read Corinthians from beginning to end and then 2 Corinthian's
To get the whole of the entire Epistle Paul was speaking of, thanks
There is a gigantic difference in reading the entire whole over sifting out scriptures to make a point. God loves us all y'all
That does not change, never has, from day one of the fall of the first Adam. To see now the second Adam as Won for us, that reverses the curse of the firs Adam
Thanking Father indubitably, I have no chance any other way, thank you Father and Son as Won for us all to be one with Father and Son, that are One

 

[PaulThomson]

You are quite right regarding healing not being guaranteed.
The only thing God guarantees is physical death and ultimate justice,
which is the reason we sinners need salvation or healing from sin and its consequence.

Yikes! What about God's great and precious promises by which we escape through faith the corruption in the world?.

 

[TabinRivCA]

It is with genuine trepidation that I am starting this thread. I recently lost someone I cared about while trying to discuss this very thing. I honestly do not know what exactly to believe at this point and I am not, repeat, not asking to be told what to believe. I do not find in the Bible where everyonel is guaranteed healing and I do not see where God has some kind of quota on how much faith it takes to be healed. Obviosuly then, I am not in agreement with the WOF people. I don't care to be told that it is my fault if I am not healed (ps I am not waiting for a miracle of healing the convo I had involved someone that really needed healing) I have experienced a good number of what I guess I will call 'God interventions' and I certainly have the faith to ask God anything and we are encouraged to pour out our hearts to Him...love that verse in the Psalms

I cannot control this thread or demand people do not get all hot and bothered by what someone else says but for the love of God (literally I am not swearing), please try to be the person you demand others to be. I sure hope sincere and intelligent input might be achieved and of course scripture but also opinions and experience, understanding that experience is not proof of anything. It certainly is to the one who experiences it, but we cannot offer that as proof to those who have not.

Okay, so let's take the plunge if you are willing, hoping a few might be. I do have some things to say if the thread develops, so I pray that you can help me resolve some of what I currently am thinking about and even feeling. Thanks

One more thing though, I really dislike trite answers and people talking down to others so if that is your thing, I doubt I will respond but I am sure you will offend someone else enough to do it for me Oh and videos mocking others or 'exposing' faith healers are also just plain dumb as I can view those myself any ole good time I want. I've probably not seen it all, but I have seen enough.

I just saw your post and don't have time to read all 5 pgs but will post one of my experiences with healing. I've had a few dogs go to Heaven early and at the time just felt helpless to help them bc the Vet, like some Drs, can only see so far. Idk why some people have a problem with WOF preachers, wof is what produces healing. And as regards to accusing someone of not having enough faith, Jesus told His disciples they didn't have enough faith, a few times. Anyway, my boy dog Otto, got injured by his younger, bigger sisters jumping on his back to get to their daddy. He started yelping continuously, it was evening so I went to the vet store and got CBD oil and doggie aspirins. That helped a little and long story short, the vet gave him shots and 3 pain relievers & said his spine was bruised and would have to always stay away from the other dogs. Even w/the meds he was yelping and my kid told me to put him to sleep. Well, coincidentally I had been building up my faith, 'the just shall LIVE by faith, and decided to prove it. I proclaimed over him ' surely He bore all our diseases, pains and sorrows.....and by His stripes Otto is healed'. My kid took off he couldn't handle the obvious pain the dog was going through and I kept believing that what God promises He is able to deliver. This happened last yr spring and Otto is healed and chasing the girls like mad when they're in heat, lol, but I do have to keep an eye they don't get in a scrap. I'm going to post one of the best healing msgs I've ever heard it's repetitous but you'll get the point. Sorry for your loss, I have a daughter in glory✝❤

 

[pinebeach]

Five pages is alot. If you do go back and read some of the posts you will find people really approach or think about healing in different ways. I am not WOF but have no problem with anyone talking about or whatever. I do have a problem with someone shooting scripture at others and acting like if we do not agree with their post then we are without faith. If people did not have questions about healing, as I do myself, that would be one thing. But to just dismiss everyone and ignore that is not very helpful.

You are not doing that and I don't disagree that God heals. I have questions for someone saying God always heals and if He does not, then you must be doing something wrong.

 

[pinebeach]

So, sorry, I never meant this as you interpreted it, I know nothing of myself, Father knows all

The best I can say is "God loves us all" otherwise Son would not have ever gone to the cross willingly. He would have fought as flesh does that. He did not. That be my example I have got in my walk and am no better than anyone else ever seeing Luke 18:9-14 Justified in forgiveness given only by God through Son as risen
Love to you, I am no better than anyone else ever

No problem at all. Thing is, I didn't interpet it. I asked you to please explain what you meant. Thanks

 

[pinebeach]

and your unbelieving and critical attitude towards other ----is appalling ---go read your OP Post and many others of your posts here you criticize and deem yourself the right to tell other how they should post and not to post this and that --etc -----you should be ashamed of yourself ----everyone should be able to post what they feel --and you squash that ----your feeding your EGO my Friend --your not feeding God's word here -----

You are playing to an audience. The 2 of them appeciate your post. I have never even come across your posts anywhere but you have all that to say about me. You are doing a fine job of illustrating some of the reasons I started this op to begin with.

 

[HealthAndHappiness]

It is with genuine trepidation that I am starting this thread. I recently lost someone I cared about while trying to discuss this very thing. I honestly do not know what exactly to believe at this point and I am not, repeat, not asking to be told what to believe. I do not find in the Bible where everyonel is guaranteed healing and I do not see where God has some kind of quota on how much faith it takes to be healed. Obviosuly then, I am not in agreement with the WOF people. I don't care to be told that it is my fault if I am not healed (ps I am not waiting for a miracle of healing the convo I had involved someone that really needed healing) I have experienced a good number of what I guess I will call 'God interventions' and I certainly have the faith to ask God anything and we are encouraged to pour out our hearts to Him...love that verse in the Psalms

I cannot control this thread or demand people do not get all hot and bothered by what someone else says but for the love of God (literally I am not swearing), please try to be the person you demand others to be. I sure hope sincere and intelligent input might be achieved and of course scripture but also opinions and experience, understanding that experience is not proof of anything. It certainly is to the one who experiences it, but we cannot offer that as proof to those who have not.

Okay, so let's take the plunge if you are willing, hoping a few might be. I do have some things to say if the thread develops, so I pray that you can help me resolve some of what I currently am thinking about and even feeling. Thanks

One more thing though, I really dislike trite answers and people talking down to others so if that is your thing, I doubt I will respond but I am sure you will offend someone else enough to do it for me Oh and videos mocking others or 'exposing' faith healers are also just plain dumb as I can view those myself any ole good time I want. I've probably not seen it all, but I have seen enough.

I can sympathize with you and others who suffer, having nearly died from the fallout of parents murdered by those they entrusted to help them.

Maybe I missed the key sentence for the theme of your original post. I see what you are not for, which is fine. I'm just not sure what the purpose of the thread is.
Can you clarify that for me and others who may be interested in the discussion?

 

[pinebeach]

I can sympathize with you and others who suffer, having nearly died from the fallout of parents murdered by those they entrusted to help them.

Maybe I missed the key sentence for the theme of your original post. I see what you are not for, which is fine. I'm just not sure what the purpose of the thread is.
Can you clarify that for me and others who may be interested in the discussion?

I'm not asking about healing for myself nor did I create the op for any reason other than to just 'hear' what others have to say about something I am not really convinced of. I absolutely believe God heals and have seen it. Please just read the op. I did try to be clear about the purpose or reason for it. I'm not suffering whatsoever so I'm not sure where you get that idea? Thanks

Very sorry your parents were murdered.

 

[studentoftheword]

The 2 of them appeciate your post.

What they appreciate is ------NOT MY POST----BUT THE TRUTH ------and ALL GLORY IS GOD"S for THAT ------

 

[Gideon300]

Thanks for your reply. It kinda balances out the way I am thinking. As you say, God does not make us sick and we do live in a fallen world. You were healed of conditions you created yourself and God is merciful and saw that. See, I also look at cases in scripture where people were not apparently healed; for example Paul told Timothy to take some wine for his stomach ailment. So, why didn't he just tell him to claim healing or some such? Or tell him to have the elders pray for him? Or walk around saying he was healed when he was still in pain? And if you ask about that or about the people you mention above, you get some beat around the bush response that just, in my understanding, actually answer the hard questions.

Thanks again.

You are welcome. I hope to speak the whole truth, not take a few Bible verses and make a doctrine out of them. I fell for the prosperity gospel early in my Christian life. It's tempting to put God in a box. I do not believe that the age of miracles has passed. I do believe that the baptism of the Holy Spirit is for all believers who desire it. But I reject the notion that speaking in tongues is a necessary sign. For sure I do not know everything - I'm not God! I'm still learning after 50 plus years in Jesus.

 

[PaulThomson]

Five pages is alot. If you do go back and read some of the posts you will find people really approach or think about healing in different ways. I am not WOF but have no problem with anyone talking about or whatever. I do have a problem with someone shooting scripture at others and acting like if we do not agree with their post then we are without faith. If people did not have questions about healing, as I do myself, that would be one thing. But to just dismiss everyone and ignore that is not very helpful.

You are not doing that and I don't disagree that God heals. I have questions for someone saying God always heals and if He does not, then you must be doing something wrong.

There is something off with the statement "God always heals and if He does not, then ..."

I would say, God has already made healing available to all through Jesus Christ our Lord, and if we don't experience healing, then we need to understand better the way which God has provided for us to appropriate what he has already made available and we need to conform better to His instructions.

 

[GWH]

I think there are times he purposely does not heal, my eyes for instance been trying to heal them for eight years now never once were my prayers for healing answered but I did say to him before I lost my eye sight that I would give up these eyes if it meant I could see with his.

So perhaps he purposely hasn't healed my eyes because he wants me to learn to see with his not mine. now for someone with cancer in need of healing and is not healed only God knows why he would allow for such a thing to persist but it could be that it only takes one dedicated person to pray for the healing

Yes, which is most of the time. Miraculous healing is rare, because we are mortal souls are taught by illness and death our need of God's salvation.

Each person's cross to bear may be due to genetic and environmental luck rather than to divine intervention. I know that I am lucky to have had loving/Christian parents, who had no unhealthy habits including overeating, but my brother's genes seem to be weaker than mine in some ways, although he does not require glasses for distance as I have since high school, and his hearing is better than mine.

My faith grew stronger as I associated with Christian friends at the BSU during college, whereas his was weakened in college
by associating with judgmental Christians in his BSU. My wife is a strong Christian, but two brothers are agnostic if not atheist
while the third is a paranoid schizo-trans Christian. God knows why the differences and will judge justly.

 

[GWH]

1

Yikes! What about God's great and precious promises by which we escape through faith the corruption in the world?.

Yikes! "Escape" = salvation from "sin and its consequences" guaranteed for those who accept Christ.
Yay!

 

[PaulThomson]

1

Yikes! "Escape" = salvation from "sin and its consequences" guaranteed for those who accept Christ.
Yay!

You posted -

The only thing God guarantees is physical death and ultimate justice,

So, now you are adding salvation.

So, death and ultimate justice are not the only things God guarantees then.

 

[GWH]

You posted -


So, now you are adding salvation.

So, death and ultimate justice are not the only things God guarantees then.

Yikes aren't we cranky this morning!
The first statement referred to humanity; the second to those with saving faith.
I thought the difference was obvious, so excuse me for being wrong in your case.
(May I recommend going back to bed and getting up on the right side? :^)
P.S. We could add guaranteed condemnation for unbelievers.

 

[homwardbound]

No problem at all. Thing is, I didn't interpet it. I asked you to please explain what you meant. Thanks

God simply loves us all, is what I mean to always say. Believe, receive and see, if you haven't yet. I think you do and are learning the same as me, in process, putting behind me, whatever is behind me, trusting God by God I remain forgiven by God in t=risen Son Jesus and am willing to learn from all things happening, good or bad
God has never left me as I have seen me do to others and others have done to me, how about you?

 

[pinebeach]

There is something off with the statement "God always heals and if He does not, then ..."

I would say, God has already made healing available to all through Jesus Christ our Lord, and if we don't experience healing, then we need to understand better the way which God has provided for us to appropriate what he has already made available and we need to conform better to His instructions.

I agree with what you have written here.

 

[pinebeach]

You are welcome. I hope to speak the whole truth, not take a few Bible verses and make a doctrine out of them. I fell for the prosperity gospel early in my Christian life. It's tempting to put God in a box. I do not believe that the age of miracles has passed. I do believe that the baptism of the Holy Spirit is for all believers who desire it. But I reject the notion that speaking in tongues is a necessary sign. For sure I do not know everything - I'm not God! I'm still learning after 50 plus years in Jesus.

I came across the WOF/prosperity theology years back after growing up in a church that taught nothing on the gifts but I was saved in that church and water baptized in that church. I attended a series of meetings in a Pentecostal church and ran into the WOF stuff and name it and claim it. Very bad experience.
I don't know if speaking in tongues is really a sign for being filled? I would say I have known people who were filled for sure but did not speak in tongues. One thing for sure, the Holy Spirit does not create assembly line believers. I agree about doctrines.

Thanks

 

[homwardbound]

There is something off with the statement "God always heals and if He does not, then ..."

I would say, God has already made healing available to all through Jesus Christ our Lord, and if we don't experience healing, then we need to understand better the way which God has provided for us to appropriate what he has already made available and we need to conform better to His instructions.

Be given everything we need for life and godliness, no more care to heal flesh over Spirit healed forever in eternity, where there is no sin or pain again

 

[PaulThomson]

Yikes aren't we cranky this morning!
The first statement referred to humanity; the second to those with saving faith.
I thought the difference was obvious, so excuse me for being wrong in your case.
(May I recommend going back to bed and getting up on the right side? :^)
P.S. We could add guaranteed condemnation for unbelievers.

Your statement was a response to the OP where @pinebeach wrote -

I do not find in the Bible where everyone is guaranteed healing and I do not see where God has some kind of quota on how much faith it takes to be healed.

Clearly, @pinebeach was not meaning that there is some doctrine out there that no one, Christian or non-Christian, will ever be sick. @pinebeach seems to be referring to the doctrine that guarantees that everyone who trusts Jesus for healing will be healed, whether Christian or non-Christian.

In that context, your comment -

You are quite right regarding healing not being guaranteed.
The only thing God guarantees is physical death and ultimate justice...

- implied that "You are quite right regarding healing not being guaranteed to those who are trusting Jesus for it, whether Christian or non-Christian.
The only thing God guarantees to those trusting Jesus for something, is physical death and ultimate justice..."

However, those trusting Jesus for translation at His coming are guaranteed never to die; and those trusting Jesus for mercy are guaranteed that mercy will triumph over the ultimate justice they deserve; and there are other things that God guarantees to those trusting Jesus for them, such as wisdom, rewards for deeds done in His service, authority over demons for those who submit to His authority, etc.

So, I don't think your aphorism was correct.