what must we do to get saved?

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christiancanadian

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#61
#61
If Saved, Always Saved
There is nothing wrong with the term “Once Saved, Always Saved,” but I prefer the statement, “If Saved, Always Saved” better. If a person is genuinely saved, then there is no possible way that person could ever be unsaved. Christianity is not a philosophy that can be renounced. It is not an organization that can be resigned. It is not a business that can be dissolved. Christianity is a new birth, a supernatural act of God Almighty in response to one's faith in Jesus as the Christ. Once a sinner has been born-again into the family of God, all the hordes of Hell cannot change that. God NEVER disowns His children
 
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watchmen

Banned
#62
Apr 23, 2009
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#62
christiancanadian said:
Do we have a license to sin once we are saved? Of course not. But for you to say that you no longer sin is living in denial. If you no longer sin...then your a better man than the Apostle Paul who wrote that he was still the "chief sinner" long AFTER he was saved.
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#1 Committing a sin and living in sin are two far different things.
#2 Paul was referring back to before he got saved. That is God had saved the chief of sinners he could save anyone. Paul was not saying he still sinned.
 
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KingdomGeneration

Guest
#63
#63
No one is saying that we do not sin, no man is perfect however, if you truly love God then put your trust in Him. Obey His commands and see that He is true to His word. This is how we learn to walk in true faith and full trust.

Obedience is all about trust not works.
 
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watchmen

Banned
#64
Apr 23, 2009
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#64
christiancanadian said:
If Saved, Always Saved
There is nothing wrong with the term “Once Saved, Always Saved,” but I prefer the statement, “If Saved, Always Saved” better. If a person is genuinely saved, then there is no possible way that person could ever be unsaved.
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This is absolutely untrue. Someone who was truly saved can make a conscience decision to turn from the salvation they once received. Thereby ''loosing'' or better yet returning their salvation.
 
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watchmen

Banned
#65
Apr 23, 2009
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#65
KingdomGeneration said:
No one is saying that we do not sin, no man is perfect however, if you truly love God then put your trust in Him. Obey His commands and see that He is true to His word. This is how we learn to walk in true faith and full trust.

Obedience is all about trust not works.
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Amen........... :)
 
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KingdomGeneration

Guest
#66
#66
If one does not trust God enough to obey Him on earth then how can one trust God to redeem them after death? The easiest way to tell if someone is truly saved or not is to look at their fruit. Your fruit reflects what lives inside of your heart.

Again, there's is a huge difference in simply believing in God and actually trusting in God. Do you truly trust God enough to obey Him?
 
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KingdomGeneration

Guest
#67
#67
Ever wonder why it feels as though your prayers go answered? Ever sometimes feel as though God is so far away? Ever struggle with some kind of sin that you know is wrong yet you can't seem to kick the habit?

I have. Although I fully believed in God, it wasn't until I fully understood what it means to love God and put my trust in Him that I was delivered from lust and now see the hand of God clearly moving in my life.

I sincerely believe that God will not honor the prayers of someone He knows He not trust. Can He trust you?
 
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KingdomGeneration

Guest
#68
#68
How is that every thread about repentance or salvation seems to turn into a debate on OSAS? This is getting ridiculous.
 
MahogonySnail

MahogonySnail

Banned
#69
Jan 8, 2009
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#69
If a person is genuinely saved, then there is no possible way that person could ever be unsaved.
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Unless Jesus says, "I never knew you", unless Jesus said "you unfaithful servant", unless Jesus says. Unless we say, "Jesus I don't want anything to do with you anymore". Pastors and churches alike think that when you've met a set list of requirements, you are saved and can never lose it. They're doctrine is not based on what God says or scripture, but on what they tell each other and what they learnt at bible school or in their denomination. They might have to believe that doctrine to stay in that denomination, otherwise they may be kicked out. At the end of the day, and when all is said and done, a guy in shining white clothes and a white beard will either like you, or not like you. But let's not say what God can or cannot do, that He "can't" unsave us. If God is powerful enough to save us, He is also powerful enough to "unsave us". Fear God who can throw both soul and body into hell. Whether that soul be saved at one time or not. It is all about Jesus's opinion of you. That is why babies and homeless people can go to heaven. Have we ever thought why faith and belief is important?
 
MahogonySnail

MahogonySnail

Banned
#70
Jan 8, 2009
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#70
He is also powerful enough to "unsave us".
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AndI would suggest that it is as simple as withdrawing His Spirit from us.

Rom 8:8 So then they who are in the flesh cannot please God.
Rom 8:9 But you are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if the Spirit of God dwells in you. But if anyone has not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of His.

Rom 8:13 For if you live according to the flesh, you shall die. But if you through the Spirit mortify the deeds of the body, you shall live.


Rom 8:14 For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.


There are people around not led by the Spirit, they may not even have the Spirit. They can recite doctrine and creeds but so can the devil.
 
O

onenesswill

Guest
#71
#71
dolly_d said:
Peter answered them, "Every one of you must repent and be baptized in the name of Jesus the Messiah for the forgiveness of your sins. Then you will receive the Holy Spirit as a gift.
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The answer is found in Acts 2:38 and is absolutely correct. A complete understanding of the salvation message is found in my new book, "Understanding the Trinity at www.understandingthetrinity.com
 
MahogonySnail

MahogonySnail

Banned
#72
Jan 8, 2009
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#72
If we relate salvation to the person Jesus Christ. Everything about salvation and how to be saved becomes clearer. This issue of OSAS or non-OSAS then becomes a non-issue, because it's based upon a faulty belief that a magic thing called faith and doing a set number of things gets you an automatic ticket into heaven that you can never lose, a lifetime pass. But let's think about this in terms of the person Jesus. Why do we have to have faith to be saved? Because Jesus doesn't like anyone who doesn't trust Him, neither does the Father. The Saviour is not going to save someone who doesn't believe Him. It's not because faith somehow instills some sort of "magic" or starts some mysterious supernatural cycle of events that causes you to get a ticket to heaven. Faith of itself is nothing, it's a means to an end, faith is in the person, it's the person that is important aka Jesus. And why do we need to repent? Because Jesus can't take anyone seriously who doesn't. Why do we need works? Because good works please the Saviour. Again, a christian without any good works can only be a hypocrite (i.e. a pretender). Can good works save us? No, if we have no faith, they can't save us. But faith and works do go together.

The OSAS believeres are forgetting that salvation is a person. if you fall lout of favor with him (eg through denying him, rejecting your faith etC), will he still feel obliged to save you?

The non-OSAS believers forget the power and mercy and grace and patience of Christ. That Christ abides with sinners and the backslider even when churches have already rejected them, even if they are in that state for years, He never leaves nor forsakes them. Jesus would only lose His own as a very last resort or in cases of severe unfaithfulness (eg beating fellow servants).
 
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mcap

Guest
#73
#73
This is not true.I was saved and baptized at age 17.I then became a alcoholic and porn addict.If what you say is true I didn't need to do what I recently did,was saved again and baptized again.
 
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KingdomGeneration

Guest
#74
#74
mcap said:
This is not true.I was saved and baptized at age 17.I then became a alcoholic and porn addict.If what you say is true I didn't need to do what I recently did,was saved again and baptized again.
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My life is very simular. I was raised in church but walked away due to various circumstances. I returned to faith in my 30's also. Considering less than 4% of christians are saved after the age of 30, both you and I are nothing short of miracles!
 
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christiancanadian

Guest
#75
#75
KingdomGeneration said:
How is that every thread about repentance or salvation seems to turn into a debate on OSAS? This is getting ridiculous.
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If you actually take the time to look back over prior posts, you'll see that it was your friend 'Watchmen' who first brought up the topic of losing one's salvation. I wasn't surprised at that he does not believe in eternal security.

Of course, it is indeed an issue for those who practise 'Lordship Salvation' who think they need to stop sinning before they are saved. And then maintain a sinless life by their own works in order to be saved. Basically it's Grace + works.

They attack Bible-believing Christians with shallow accusations which simply CANNOT be substantiated with the Scriptures. A person who has been genuinely saved, has repented concerning their sins, i.e., they realized their GUILT and just condemnation to hellfire, and then turned to Christ in faith for forgiveness. The garbage that Lordship Salvationists teach is not found anywhere in the Scriptures. They mandate repentance FROM sins to be saved, but this is not Scriptural. Biblically, we are to repent OF our sins, i.e., agree with what God says about them. God says we are all sinners (Romans 3:10,19-23). If we realize our guilt, and deserved condemnation to hell, then we only need to turn to Christ in faith to be saved. Repentance from sin is an entirely different matter. Just because a person believes upon Christ as Savior doesn't automatically mean that their life is cleaned up. It takes time for a new believer to grow in the Lord. A person doesn't just get saved and INSTANTLY stop drinking, smoking, cursing, etc. Now some believers DO, but most don't.
 
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christiancanadian

Guest
#76
#76
watchmen said:
This is absolutely untrue. Someone who was truly saved can make a conscience decision to turn from the salvation they once received. Thereby ''loosing'' or better yet returning their salvation.
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The problem is that Lordship Salvation confuses the ROOT of a believer's faith, i.e., faith in Christ (Romans 4:5), with the FRUIT of that faith, i.e., good works (James 2:18). The ROOT should bring forth the FRUIT; but the FRUIT cannot come before the ROOT. DO you understand the difference? Lordship Salvationists are demanding the FRUIT as a prerequisite to salvation. They are putting the cart before the horse. 2nd Corinthians 5:17 states... "Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new." Carefully notice that the Bible says, "...if any man BE IN CHRIST..." He is already saved, and then the change comes AFTERWARDS. Lordship Salvation puts the cart before the horse. You cannot mutate the ROOT and the FRUIT of a believer's faith into one, for in so doing you have created a works-based salvation, which is NO salvation at all. Lordship Salvation is a two-headed monstrosity, and is straight from the pits of Hell.

You also never answered my question... How many sins do you have to commit for a believer to lose their salvation?
 
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watchmen

Banned
#77
Apr 23, 2009
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#77
christiancanadian said:
If you actually take the time to look back over prior posts, you'll see that it was your friend 'Watchmen'
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This is a lie. You brought it up in the very first response to the O.P. in this thread.
christiancanadian said:
Being saved is by God's grace alone. When a person recognizes their sin, believes that Jesus Christ died on the cross for their sins (Jesus took our place), and put their faith and trust in him-that person is born again. Jesus has paid that person's sin debt in full with his blood. They immediately receive the Holy Spirit. They are saved and eternally secure. Salvaion is a free-gift from God. Salvation is by God's grace alone.
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You claim that people who get saved are now eternally secure. This is the false teaching of OSAS and was brought into the conversation by you at the very outset of this thread.
 
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watchmen

Banned
#78
Apr 23, 2009
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#78
christiancanadian said:
The problem is that Lordship Salvation confuses the ROOT of a believer's faith, i.e., faith in Christ (Romans 4:5), with the FRUIT of that faith, i.e., good works (James 2:18). The ROOT should bring forth the FRUIT; but the FRUIT cannot come before the ROOT. DO you understand the difference? Lordship Salvationists are demanding the FRUIT as a prerequisite to salvation.
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This is also an untrue statement. Fruit is evidence of salvation not a prerequisite. Further more no fruit and or bad fruit is evidence that one is not saved, regardless of the profession.

Lordship salvation is the gospel truth. If Jesus Christ is not your Lord then He cannot be your Savior. You cannot have your cake and eat it too.
 
MahogonySnail

MahogonySnail

Banned
#79
Jan 8, 2009
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#79
"Lordship salvation" as a doctrine has it's problems too, as you said, putting the cart before the horse. If it is interpreted that way of course.
 
MahogonySnail

MahogonySnail

Banned
#80
Jan 8, 2009
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#80
The problem with lordship salvation is that usually proponents of it tell people what fruits they must have in order to be saved. That's a no no because it's different for each of us. God gifts each person differently and each person has different things they need to overcome. Another problem with this doctrine is that it may demand rapid growth and doesn't allow for the fact that the fruit of salvation is rarely seen within the first few years of being a believer. There's no black or white on this issue a person may be a believer for years until they bear fruit. But they are still saved even if they have no fruit.
 
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