Faith or Law?

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Dino246 said:
What you describe is exercising faith which in that sense is fundamentally no different from any other activity we are "commanded" to do. It does not mean that faith (in and of itself) is obedience. ;)
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Believing is obeying the commandment to believe, so I reasoned that if exercising faith is synonymous with believing, then it would qualify as obedience. Thank you for your counsel. I'll work on refining a better expression of my idea, unless the fallacy of it might be made more clear to me.
 
Mem said:
Believing is obeying the commandment to believe, so I reasoned that if exercising faith is synonymous with believing, then it would qualify as obedience. Thank you for your counsel. I'll work on refining a better expression of my idea, unless the fallacy of it might be made more clear to me.
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Perhaps another example may help...

We are commanded to give of our resources for the benefit of the Church and for the poor. In that sense, giving is one way of expressing obedience, but we do not define "obedience" by using the word "giving". They are distinct concepts. Similarly, attending a local church is being obedient, but the definition of "obedience" does not include "local church attendance".

My previous assertion, "Faith is not obedience" goes to the root definitions of the words. Those who exercise faith may or may not be doing so out of a sense of obedience, but when it comes to defining the two terms, neither utilizes the other.
 
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Dino246 said:
Perhaps another example may help...

We are commanded to give of our resources for the benefit of the Church and for the poor. In that sense, giving is one way of expressing obedience, but we do not define "obedience" by using the word "giving". They are distinct concepts. Similarly, attending a local church is being obedient, but the definition of "obedience" does not include "local church attendance".

My previous assertion, "Faith is not obedience" goes to the root definitions of the words. Those who exercise faith may or may not be doing so out of a sense of obedience, but when it comes to defining the two terms, neither utilizes the other.
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What is obedience, then? Specifically, can it be defined merely in terms as an acknowledgment the righteousness of any certain command or the authority? As example in the question, while I might not ever drive over 35 mph, I am fully obeying all speed limits, except in the case of school zones, of course.
 
Mem said:
What is obedience, then? Specifically, can it be defined merely in terms as an acknowledgment the righteousness of any certain command or the authority? As example in the question, while I might not ever drive over 35 mph, I am fully obeying all speed limits, except in the case of school zones, of course.
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Obedience is doing what you are told (directed, commanded, required, obligated) to do (or refraining from doing something prohibited). It involves an inherent or expressed acknowledgement of the authority of the person or entity directing (or restricting) your behaviour. We as Christians recognize God's authority over us, so we do as He directs us to do in His word and refrain from doing what He says is prohibited or otherwise bad for us or others. In this way we act "in obedience" to God.

Obedience is distinct from compliance which is doing what is requested (or demanded) when there is no authority. Compliance may look outwardly like obedience but the heart attitude is different. It is also different from cooperation which is shared work toward some desired outcome.
 
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Dino246 said:
Your reasoning is flawed.

If we are saved by "our faith in" anything, it is the strength of our faith that matters, regardless of the "what" in which we put our faith. Whether it is in Jesus, or in the faith of Jesus, the only difference is one of degree of separation. The former is direct, the latter is indirect, but both are "our faith in" something. There is much scholarly debate on the issue, and both sides have their adherents. I do not consider this a salvific issue.
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No, if we have faith in Jesus we believe in Him and what He through God has done for us and live accordingly

If we have the faith of Jesus we possess it and believe and do as He did.

As Galatians 2:20 states, We are dead but alive. Yet not us, but CHRIST LIVES IN US. And the Life we now live in the flesh, we live by the FAITH OF the Son of God who gave Himself for us.

So. Say not in our heart, Bring Christ down from above or up from the deep. But say, the Word is nigh unto us. In our hearts and in our mouths, that is the word of faith in which we preach.

If the Word, the Law is in our heart through Christ we are a new creation of God who has reconciled all things unto us and has given us this ministry of reconciliation.

Now as Jesus we do as we have been made not because we have to, but because we want to and can not help ourselves. The just live by this faith. And this faith establishes the Law because is part of who we are now in and through Christ.
Dino246 said:
The KJV is not the objective standard by which all English translations are judged.
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Amen
 
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