THE REQUIREMENTS FOR ETERNAL LIFE ACCORDING TO JESUS
- Thread starter vassal
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That is what vassal teaches and it is not found in scripture.
Do you keep them every day, all day, 7 days a week, 12 months of the year.
You no longer sin? Jesus died a sinless death on our behalf. HE kept them during His life on earth. Think. Surely you must know that the Bible states if we break even the smallest bit, we have broken all of it.
The Holy Spirit was not given to help you keep the commandments. Sure He can and does strengthen us and enable us to live for Christ, but that is not why He was sent. Why would God send the Holy Spirit to help us with the commandments when He sent Jesus
to do that on our behalf and die a sinless death so that we could be forgiven for our sins?
Instead of mouthing off false teaching, study the Bible and you will find Jesus instituted the New Covenant and believers who are IN Him are not judged by the commandments.
What one sows
so shall he reap.
Go play with your toy car collection.
You're a disgrace to the christian religion.
And some others on this forum.
Wow.
Is this what the NT taught?
You think I should reread it again?
Maybe?
Here's what I figure the NT teaches:
Since it teaches that if I've broken just one rule....
then it's as if I've broken them all...
Well then, by jove...
I'm going to break them all !!
And as often as I can.
Does that sound right to you?
After all Jesus was perfect so that I wouldn't have to be.
Right?
Yeah.
That's the ticket !
Wow.
Had this all wrong all these years.
I thought Jesus said that we are to obey Him and KEEP His commandments !
You mean...I was wrong about this?
You mean...it's OK to sin and disobey God because Jesus died so we could disobey God?
Too bad I didn't know this 50 years ago....!
OK bro.
Thanks for the advice.
So since I'm IN the New Covenant it means I won't be judged by all the disobedience and sinning I plan on doing starting right away tomorrow.
But I'm good since I'm in this here New Covenant you speak of.
Can I be sure I'm in it?
Do you think that maybe I might not be in it because I seem to want to help Jesus save me by doing good works and this is a sin?
Let me know what you think.
Maybe I'm not in the NC because I don't sin enough ??
Those Heb10 verses speak of paying close attention to one another to literally irritate/provoke one another to love and good works which is the purpose for assembling. It goes from there to show that this is the opposite of sinning willfully.
It's speaking of helping one another to grow into Spiritual Maturity - a.k.a. Perfection - and to get past all the sinning - and thus to be living a faithfully obedient & loving relationship with God and one another.
In my experience it's very difficult to find an assembly that is doing this and it's clear that this digital assembly is far from doing this.
I have to agree with @vassal on finding a church.
James 3 ...there was allot of stuff going on then about works and faith. Then some false teachers.. to be a teacher you must be willing to be taught. Then as the word says.. to the one much is given.. they will be much to answer for. So if your a teacher vs just a believer you will have to answer for.. so to speak more.
Out of all I have read here I have never read one saying "its not important to obey God". Then this .. for me I don't know personally .. I can guess but don't know why some do this "its really concerning the judgment of the soul will be left up to God for each and ever one of us. " Well if your a believer we have passed from death unto life.. we have been judged already.. hello CHRIST died and rose. And there is no condemnation to us that are in Christ Jesus
This Christian attacking Christians. From I read so far.. welcome to the club ..based just on your posts here not all but some. Seems you know better but freely didn't make the right choice.
That choice? "I actually join a forum for the fellowship and discussion. Won't get much of that around here." If what you say is true.. why come here? Its texted...you never see the person. We tend to inject our personal feelings into some text and .. think....yes yes that is why the said that. When in truth we still don't know the heart. Its no how they speak.. its how we speak.. its no how they.. all...treat us its how we treat them. I am not here to tell anyone how to live.. to believe in Jesus Christ as lord ..yes amen. But.. as its written they don't answer to man.. I like what one man of God said so so so many years ago "I ask I want to be a blessing to all". I am not here to get blessed.. I want to be a blessing to all.
Agreed.
But taught by who?
Some guy on the internet?
Or the Apostles who knew Jesus and lived with Him for years.
The fact that it's important to obey God is what I'm saying.
So what is the debate about?
If we do not obey God,,,His wrath remains:
John 3:36
36 "He who believes in the Son has eternal life; but he who does not obey the Son will not see life, but the wrath of God abides on him."
If we do not obey God...
If we do not believe Him....
His wrath remains on us.
So if there is no condemnation for those that are IN Christ....
does it mean we can lead a sinful life and still be IN Christ?
What does being IN Christ mean anyway?
The NT teaches that we are to walk in the spirit and not in the flesh.
Galatians 5:16-17
16 But I say, walk by the Spirit, and you will not carry out the desire of the flesh.
17 For the flesh sets its desire against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh; for these are in opposition to one another, so that you may not do the things that you please.
Yes. I agree.
Jesus said that we are to love one another.
Not much love around here, is there?
I do wonder why.
What we SHOULD be doing is posting scritpure and discussing it.
I stated why.
If you notice...I'm not here much.
Too much back-biting going on.
I do like to spread the message of the gospel BTW and so will be here from time to time.
However, yes, I do find it difficult to have any real discussion.,
We're not here to know anyone's heart.
Only God knows that.
We can only know what a person posts.
And nothing should ever be assumed by another member.
Well then be a blessing.
I agree with you.
Apparently some here do not agree with you.
I find it fascinating that this question brings out the dogmas, formulas, quotations from all kinds of sources...etc. I believe that the question was about what Jesus taught about our eternal destination. According to Jesus we all have eternal life. The only question is where will experience it.
Perhaps the longest quote of Jesus we have recorded is focused exactly on the question of what is required for salvation. First, let's look at what might be called Christian Geometry.
In most 21st century Christianity the direction is only vertical. We "below" raise our songs to God. We lift up our prayers to God. We raise our hands in worship upward toward God as if he lives somewhere up there. We are obsessed with My salvation, My relationship with God. My faith. My worship. My bible study. My beliefs. My, My, My.
What if Christianity is not just vertical? What if horizontal Christianity is just as important as vertical Christianity? What if we go through our entire life and not even recognize, much less practice our horizontal Christianity? Together horizontal Christianity and vertical Christianity create a cross. Is this the cross we are called to bear?
Jesus provides some insights.
“Do not lay up for yourselves treasures on earth, where moth and rust destroy and where thieves break in and steal, but lay up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where neither moth nor rust destroys and where thieves do not break in and steal. For where your treasure is, there your heart will be also. “No one can serve two masters, for either he will hate the one and love the other, or he will be devoted to the one and despise the other. You cannot serve God and money. “Enter by the narrow gate. For the gate is wide and the way is easy that leads to destruction, and those who enter by it are many. For the gate is narrow and the way is hard that leads to life, and those who find it are few. “Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. On that day many will say to me, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and cast out demons in your name, and do many mighty works in your name?’ And then will I declare to them, I never knew you; depart from me, you workers of lawlessness. Whoever does not take his cross and follow me is not worthy of me. Whoever finds his life will lose it, and whoever loses his life for my sake will find it.
"It is impossible for a good tree to produce bad fruit - as impossible as it is for a bad tree to produce good fruit. Do not men know what a tree is by its fruit? You cannot pick figs from briars or gather a bunch of grapes from a blackberry bush! A good man produces good things from the good stored up in his heart, and a bad man produce evil things from his own stores of evil. For a man's words will always express what has been treasured in his heart."
"And what is the point of calling me, 'Lord, Lord', without doing what I tell you to do?" Bear fruit in keeping with repentance.”
Repentance is not purely a mental “awareness” of our sins. It is actions taken to turn from those sins. “I tell you; but unless you repent, you will all likewise perish.” Have you ever met someone that claims to have repented but kept doing exactly what they claim they repented of? If you have offended a brother or sister, is feeling bad and asking God for forgiveness real repentance? What if it always means going to the person you have offended and asking them for forgiveness...that is real repentance. What role should forgiving others, reconciliation with others and judgement of others have in our Christian lives, in our priorities and in our teaching?
Is it not time to include our called for horizontal service to and worship of God through our daily activities? What is the point of calling Him Lord without doing what He tells us to do? Our Christian calling is horizontal. We are to be salt, light, servants, lovers, healers, truth tellers, and reconciliation providers. We are to love our neighbor as much as we love ourselves. Our Christian faith is vertical, however, our love of God is validated by our love for our neighbors. Follow Jesus example.
In Jesus description of his return and final judgement, what we “believe” is not listed as a criterion. However what our faith leads us to do counts as it is the only validation of our faith. In Matthew 25 Jesus tells us clearly, When the Son of Man comes in His glory, and all the angels with Him, He will sit on His glorious throne. All the nations will be gathered before Him, and He will separate the people one from another, as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats. He will place the sheep on His right and the goats on His left. Then the King will say to those on His right, ‘Come, you who are blessed by My Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world. For I was hungry and you gave Me something to eat, I was thirsty and you gave Me something to drink, I was a stranger and you took Me in, I was naked and you clothed Me, I was sick and you looked after Me, I was in prison and you visited Me.’
Then the righteous will answer Him, ‘Lord, when did we see You hungry and feed You, or thirsty and give You something to drink? When did we see You a stranger and take You in, or naked and clothe You? When did we see You sick or in prison and visit You?’
And the King will reply, ‘Truly I tell you, whatever you did for one of the least of these brothers of Mine, you did for Me.’
This is Jesus telling us clearly that no matter what we claim to believe, if it does not result in a conversion from self-service to the service of others you remain Goats.
Perhaps the longest quote of Jesus we have recorded is focused exactly on the question of what is required for salvation. First, let's look at what might be called Christian Geometry.
In most 21st century Christianity the direction is only vertical. We "below" raise our songs to God. We lift up our prayers to God. We raise our hands in worship upward toward God as if he lives somewhere up there. We are obsessed with My salvation, My relationship with God. My faith. My worship. My bible study. My beliefs. My, My, My.
What if Christianity is not just vertical? What if horizontal Christianity is just as important as vertical Christianity? What if we go through our entire life and not even recognize, much less practice our horizontal Christianity? Together horizontal Christianity and vertical Christianity create a cross. Is this the cross we are called to bear?
Jesus provides some insights.
“Do not lay up for yourselves treasures on earth, where moth and rust destroy and where thieves break in and steal, but lay up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where neither moth nor rust destroys and where thieves do not break in and steal. For where your treasure is, there your heart will be also. “No one can serve two masters, for either he will hate the one and love the other, or he will be devoted to the one and despise the other. You cannot serve God and money. “Enter by the narrow gate. For the gate is wide and the way is easy that leads to destruction, and those who enter by it are many. For the gate is narrow and the way is hard that leads to life, and those who find it are few. “Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. On that day many will say to me, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and cast out demons in your name, and do many mighty works in your name?’ And then will I declare to them, I never knew you; depart from me, you workers of lawlessness. Whoever does not take his cross and follow me is not worthy of me. Whoever finds his life will lose it, and whoever loses his life for my sake will find it.
"It is impossible for a good tree to produce bad fruit - as impossible as it is for a bad tree to produce good fruit. Do not men know what a tree is by its fruit? You cannot pick figs from briars or gather a bunch of grapes from a blackberry bush! A good man produces good things from the good stored up in his heart, and a bad man produce evil things from his own stores of evil. For a man's words will always express what has been treasured in his heart."
"And what is the point of calling me, 'Lord, Lord', without doing what I tell you to do?" Bear fruit in keeping with repentance.”
Repentance is not purely a mental “awareness” of our sins. It is actions taken to turn from those sins. “I tell you; but unless you repent, you will all likewise perish.” Have you ever met someone that claims to have repented but kept doing exactly what they claim they repented of? If you have offended a brother or sister, is feeling bad and asking God for forgiveness real repentance? What if it always means going to the person you have offended and asking them for forgiveness...that is real repentance. What role should forgiving others, reconciliation with others and judgement of others have in our Christian lives, in our priorities and in our teaching?
Is it not time to include our called for horizontal service to and worship of God through our daily activities? What is the point of calling Him Lord without doing what He tells us to do? Our Christian calling is horizontal. We are to be salt, light, servants, lovers, healers, truth tellers, and reconciliation providers. We are to love our neighbor as much as we love ourselves. Our Christian faith is vertical, however, our love of God is validated by our love for our neighbors. Follow Jesus example.
In Jesus description of his return and final judgement, what we “believe” is not listed as a criterion. However what our faith leads us to do counts as it is the only validation of our faith. In Matthew 25 Jesus tells us clearly, When the Son of Man comes in His glory, and all the angels with Him, He will sit on His glorious throne. All the nations will be gathered before Him, and He will separate the people one from another, as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats. He will place the sheep on His right and the goats on His left. Then the King will say to those on His right, ‘Come, you who are blessed by My Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world. For I was hungry and you gave Me something to eat, I was thirsty and you gave Me something to drink, I was a stranger and you took Me in, I was naked and you clothed Me, I was sick and you looked after Me, I was in prison and you visited Me.’
Then the righteous will answer Him, ‘Lord, when did we see You hungry and feed You, or thirsty and give You something to drink? When did we see You a stranger and take You in, or naked and clothe You? When did we see You sick or in prison and visit You?’
And the King will reply, ‘Truly I tell you, whatever you did for one of the least of these brothers of Mine, you did for Me.’
This is Jesus telling us clearly that no matter what we claim to believe, if it does not result in a conversion from self-service to the service of others you remain Goats.
Hey pinebeach....
there's a good chance you misunderstood my post.
But thanks for the compliment anyway.
I'll take all I can get on this forum.
Hope you're going in the right direction with this.
Vertical.
OK
This is necessary.
Very good.
What good is the praising and worhsipping IF we do nothing for our fellow man?
Did Jesus come only to die for mankind's sins
or
also to bring the Kingdom of God on earth?
Agreed.
But some do not like to pick up any cross.
Some want Jesus to carry that cross all by Himself.
If I remember, I think someone from the crowd helped Jesus carry his cross to Golgotha.
Shouldn't we be doing the same??
Yes sir.
And I find that some that claim to be unconditionally saved do seem to have a dark heart from words that come out of their mouth.
I believe there is too much COMFORT in Christianity today.
And I'm one that believes that we are supposed to have God's comfort...
but have some brought this idea too far and are now teaching what Jesus did NOT teach....
Perhaps we need to get back to posting what Jesus taught and not what WE THINK He taught?
Amen brother!
Great post !
(I'd like to tag in @studier)
@Toknow @biblestudent78
Yes, good post.
Reminds me of a few things:
The promotion of John5:24 by some who seemingly desire the vertical assurance apart from the horizontal necessity to which I supplemented with:
How Jesus did not let the vertical stand on its own apart from adding the horizontal:
How John learned so well from Jesus:
Yes, good post.
Reminds me of a few things:
The promotion of John5:24 by some who seemingly desire the vertical assurance apart from the horizontal necessity to which I supplemented with:
NKJ 1John3:14 We know that we have passed from death to life, because we love the brethren. He who does not love his brother abides in death.
How Jesus did not let the vertical stand on its own apart from adding the horizontal:
NKJ Matt22:36-40 "Teacher, which is the great commandment in the law?" 37 Jesus said to him, "'You shall love the LORD your God with all your heart, with all your soul, and with all your mind.' 38 "This is the first and great commandment. 39 "And the second is like it: 'You shall love your neighbor as yourself.' 40 "On these two commandments hang all the Law and the Prophets."
How John learned so well from Jesus:
1John4:20-21 If someone says, "I love God," and hates his brother, he is a liar; for he who does not love his brother whom he has seen, how can he love God whom he has not seen? 21 And this commandment we have from Him: that he who loves God must love his brother also.
Greatest Commandments
Mat 22:27 Jesus said to him, “‘You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, with all your soul, and with all your mind.’ 38 This is the first and great commandment. 39 And the second is like it: ‘You shall love your neighbor as yourself.’
Which Jesus was quoting OT Deut6:5 Lev 19:18
So they are grounded in OT principles, not new ones.
When it comes to loving someone, is it based on what we feel on how we are to love someone or should it be based on what that person tells us is how to love them. In the case of God, He only taught loving Him with the accordance of keeping His commandments. So how can we love God with all our heart, soul and mind but not keep His commandments. The answer is plainly we can't. So to separate the greatest commandments to love God with our all, from the commandments where God tells us how to love Him, is sadly a very deceitful doctrine.
The first time God introduces this principle of how we are to love Him is right in the Testimony of God - written by God, spoken by God- the Ten Commandments. God literally tells us how to love Him so its impossible to separate the greatest commandments from the commandments on how God tells us to love Him.
Exo 20:6 but showing mercy to thousands, to those who love Me and keep My commandments.
If we look at the first time loving God with all our heart, mind and soul was stated, what was happening when this was stated.
The Ten Commandments right where love to God was written down by God Himself was repeated- 40 years after God gave them His commandments both spoken by God and written by God.
After they were repeated this was stated...
Deut 6:1 “Now this is the commandment, and these are the statutes and judgments which the Lord your God has commanded to teach you, that you may observe them in the land which you are crossing over to possess, 2 that you may fear the Lord your God, to keep all His statutes and His commandments which I command you, you and your son and your grandson, all the days of your life, and that your days may be prolonged. 3 Therefore hear, O Israel, and [a]be careful to observe it, that it may be well with you, and that you may multiply greatly as the Lord God of your fathers has promised you—‘a land flowing with milk and honey.’
4 “Hear, O Israel: [b]The Lord our God, the Lord is one! 5 You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, with all your soul, and with all your strength.
6 “And these words which I command you today shall be in your heart. 7 You shall teach them diligently to your children, and shall talk of them when you sit in your house, when you walk by the way, when you lie down, and when you rise up. 8 You shall bind them as a sign on your hand, and they shall be as frontlets between your eyes. 9 You shall write them on the doorposts of your house and on your gates.
Keep God's commands in your heart
Teach them to your children
Talk about them daily
Let His Word guide your life constantly
And it includes the 4th commandment, because the greatest commandments to love God with all their heart, mind and soul was the condition of the Israelites receiving their inheritance:
But what happened, did they love God with all their heart, mind and soul and received their inheritance?
Sadly many did not because...
The Sabbath is part of the greatest commandments to love God with all our heart, mind and soul. Profaning the Sabbath God relates to breaking another commandment- idol worship because we are replacing the words of God with another voice.
The devil is trying to take away our inheritance as well that we have not yet entered Rev22:14NKJV
Will we listen to the same voices that deceived those in the wilderness we are told not to follow in their example of disobedience Heb4:11 or will we join ourselves to the LORD Isa 56:6 and stay faithful to Him not forgetting something He asked us to Remember. Exo20:8-11 and keep if we love Him Exo20:6 both written and spoken by God.
Mat 22:27 Jesus said to him, “‘You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, with all your soul, and with all your mind.’ 38 This is the first and great commandment. 39 And the second is like it: ‘You shall love your neighbor as yourself.’
Which Jesus was quoting OT Deut6:5 Lev 19:18
So they are grounded in OT principles, not new ones.
When it comes to loving someone, is it based on what we feel on how we are to love someone or should it be based on what that person tells us is how to love them. In the case of God, He only taught loving Him with the accordance of keeping His commandments. So how can we love God with all our heart, soul and mind but not keep His commandments. The answer is plainly we can't. So to separate the greatest commandments to love God with our all, from the commandments where God tells us how to love Him, is sadly a very deceitful doctrine.
The first time God introduces this principle of how we are to love Him is right in the Testimony of God - written by God, spoken by God- the Ten Commandments. God literally tells us how to love Him so its impossible to separate the greatest commandments from the commandments on how God tells us to love Him.
Exo 20:6 but showing mercy to thousands, to those who love Me and keep My commandments.
If we look at the first time loving God with all our heart, mind and soul was stated, what was happening when this was stated.
The Ten Commandments right where love to God was written down by God Himself was repeated- 40 years after God gave them His commandments both spoken by God and written by God.
After they were repeated this was stated...
Deut 6:1 “Now this is the commandment, and these are the statutes and judgments which the Lord your God has commanded to teach you, that you may observe them in the land which you are crossing over to possess, 2 that you may fear the Lord your God, to keep all His statutes and His commandments which I command you, you and your son and your grandson, all the days of your life, and that your days may be prolonged. 3 Therefore hear, O Israel, and [a]be careful to observe it, that it may be well with you, and that you may multiply greatly as the Lord God of your fathers has promised you—‘a land flowing with milk and honey.’
4 “Hear, O Israel: [b]The Lord our God, the Lord is one! 5 You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, with all your soul, and with all your strength.
6 “And these words which I command you today shall be in your heart. 7 You shall teach them diligently to your children, and shall talk of them when you sit in your house, when you walk by the way, when you lie down, and when you rise up. 8 You shall bind them as a sign on your hand, and they shall be as frontlets between your eyes. 9 You shall write them on the doorposts of your house and on your gates.
Keep God's commands in your heart
Teach them to your children
Talk about them daily
Let His Word guide your life constantly
And it includes the 4th commandment, because the greatest commandments to love God with all their heart, mind and soul was the condition of the Israelites receiving their inheritance:
But what happened, did they love God with all their heart, mind and soul and received their inheritance?
Sadly many did not because...
The Sabbath is part of the greatest commandments to love God with all our heart, mind and soul. Profaning the Sabbath God relates to breaking another commandment- idol worship because we are replacing the words of God with another voice.
The devil is trying to take away our inheritance as well that we have not yet entered Rev22:14NKJV
Will we listen to the same voices that deceived those in the wilderness we are told not to follow in their example of disobedience Heb4:11 or will we join ourselves to the LORD Isa 56:6 and stay faithful to Him not forgetting something He asked us to Remember. Exo20:8-11 and keep if we love Him Exo20:6 both written and spoken by God.
You're the only one throwing out insults. Dino is well behaved - you on the other hand come across as an arrogant jerk.
That's odd that you would say the above.
Given that the council in Acts 15 concluded with the apostles telling the Gentiles, that they must avoid
sexual immorality.
Adultery is sexual immorality and I can only conclude that the ten commandments got the boot.
Is it ok to covet?
Of course, it is not ok but that does not mean Gentiles are under the law.
You cannot place Gentiles under the law in Exodus that is a big mistake.
