Are You Rapture Ready?

[farmerjoe]

Promises of the Lord

1 Thess 1:10 and to wait for his Son from heaven, whom he raised from the dead—Jesus, who rescues us from the coming wrath.

1 Thess 5:9 For God did not appoint us to suffer wrath but to receive salvation through our Lord Jesus Christ.

Not being appointed to wrath is attributed to salvation and turning to God - NOT a rapture!

But let us, who are of the day, be sober, putting on the breastplate of faith and love; and for an helmet, the hope of salvation. For God hath not appointed us to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ, Who died for us, that, whether we wake or sleep, we should live together with him.

For they themselves shew of us what manner of entering in we had unto you, and how ye turned to God from idols to serve the living and true God;

And to wait for his Son from heaven, whom he raised from the dead, even Jesus, which delivered us from the wrath to come.

 

[farmerjoe]

When you say Jesus taught a gathering after the trib,are you referring to mat 24?

29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:
30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.
31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.


That postrib gathering can not be the rapture on several points.
1) it is in power and great glory
The rapture is not in power and great glory.
2) he SENDS angels to gather.
In the rapture Jesus gathers.
3) the ANGELS gather from heaven, not earth.
In the rapture,the gathering by Jesus is from earth.

If you keep reading, Jesus THEN gives the rapture depiction ( one taken/ one left behind), using Noah's gathering.
Ahem....preflood...pretrib.

All postribs reframe mat 24.
It is AUTOMATICALLY modified by them.
Almost the entire chapter gets modified by postribbers.

You said,

"If you keep reading, Jesus THEN gives the rapture depiction ( one taken/ one left behind), using Noah's gathering."

It's typical for pre-tribbers to misunderstand the separation of the sheep and goats. After all, they can't get anything right anyway. Old Hal, Jerry, and Timmy have really done a number on their brain.

Where one is taken and one left behind is the judgment that determines who does and who doesn't enter the Millennial reign.

 

[2ndTimeIsTheCharm]

Not being appointed to wrath is attributed to salvation and turning to God - NOT a rapture!

But let us, who are of the day, be sober, putting on the breastplate of faith and love; and for an helmet, the hope of salvation. For God hath not appointed us to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ, Who died for us, that, whether we wake or sleep, we should live together with him.

For they themselves shew of us what manner of entering in we had unto you, and how ye turned to God from idols to serve the living and true God;

And to wait for his Son from heaven, whom he raised from the dead, even Jesus, which delivered us from the wrath to come.

They keep ignoring that this promise was given to the church at Philadelphia. But if you check its history, it mover got raptured or removed when persecution of Christians hit that area. As a matter of fact, 11 of them got martyred along with Polycarp. The point of that promise was that God "kept" their faith and none of them fell away from Him.


🕊

 

[farmerjoe]

 

[farmerjoe]

Why are you guys so nasty?

That alone should tell you you are so far off.
That, and reframing your opponents position, while not having a clue as to what we beleive.
Get honest
Get a bible.
Calm down and debate.

You're an abomination. Your accusations alone prove you've been outdone. It's not difficult to know what pre-tribbers believe because it's all over the web. Pre-trib is a false hope of escapism. I'm impressed at how many people have fallen for the devil's devices on this.

When people like you say idiot things like 'get a bible' that shows their foolishness.

 

[farmerjoe]

In the following passages we are told that we would suffer tribulation up to the time when Christ shall come to be glorified in His saints. This passage alone thoroughly debunks pre-tribulationism.

"That no man should be moved by these afflictions; for yourselves know that we are appointed thereunto. For verily, when we were with you, we told you before that we should suffer tribulation; even as it came to pass, and ye know. So that we ourselves glory in you in the churches of God for your patience and faith in all your persecutions and tribulations that ye endure: [Which is] a manifest token of the righteous judgment of God, that ye may be counted worthy of the kingdom of God, for which ye also suffer: Seeing [it is] a righteous thing with God to recompense tribulation to them that trouble you; \par

And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels. In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ: Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power; When he shall come to be glorified in his saints, and to be admired in all them that believe (because our testimony among you was believed) in that day.

 

[farmerjoe]

Jesus taught the pretrib rapture.
Conversely, postrib rapture doctrine is found NOWHERE in the bible.
Just the facts.

So no, we do not avoid Jesus words like the plague.

The bible ends with the bride calling out for the groom.
The parting words, the words Jesus, the author of the bible, is for us to be calling out to him...AHEM, TO COME FOR US, His BRIDE.
Postribs need not do any of it, as they will tell you that we will be disappointed when we find out Jesus lied.

Ask yourself if any postribbers end their teaching with "watch and be ready. I now call out to Jesus the bride groom, come Lord Jesus"
Nope they never do that.
In fact, they mock anyone doing that.

By all means show the forum WHERE Jesus taught the pre-trib rapture! You're on!

We need to prepare to endure tribulation. It's crazy to think you won't be here to endure it.

 

[farmerjoe]

IF I am not appointed to wrath, why then would I believe I'm going thru 7 years of it?!?

Because not being appointed to wrath is attributed to Salvation-not a rapture

 

[Psalm1]

By all means show the forum WHERE Jesus taught the pre-trib rapture! You're on!

We need to prepare to endure tribulation. It's crazy to think you won't be here to endure it.

Can you settle down and get a bible?
All that name calling and mess?

Mat 24.
38 For as in the days that were BEFORE THE FLOOD they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark,

39 And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

40 THEN shall two be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left.

41 Two women shall be grinding at the mill; the one shall be taken, and the other left.

42 Watch therefore: for ye know not what hour your Lord doth come.

READ IT SLOW.
BEFORE THE FLOOD...what?

NORMAL LIFE AND WORKING, PLANNING FOR THE FUTURE.

ONE TAKEN, ONE LEFT.
(HALF TAKEN ....HALF LEFT)

WATCH AND BE READY.

You saying all that is false?

Absolutely none of that fits "after the trib".
None of it.

Jesus depicted 2 COMINGS in mat 24.
Vivid and impossible to miss.

If you want to talk , then let's talk.
If you are here to belittle, and attack, and hate on folks....GO PLAY.
I Don't play games.

 

[Psalm1]

Because not being appointed to wrath is attributed to Salvation-not a rapture

IOW, you are appointed to wrath....in your doctrine.

...as you have declared in your doctrine.

 

[Psalm1]

By all means show the forum WHERE Jesus taught the pre-trib rapture! You're on!

We need to prepare to endure tribulation. It's crazy to think you won't be here to endure it.

Yes.
I am spot on.
Jesus said " pray That you might be counted worthy to escape the things about to come upon the whole earth and stand before the son of man."

I prat that prayer Jesus commanded me to pray.

Do you?

I actually don't see how you could.

 

[Psalm1]

You said,

It's typical for pre-tribbers to misunderstand the separation of the sheep and goats. After all, they can't get anything right anyway. Old Hal, Jerry, and Timmy have really done a number on their brain.

Where one is taken and one left behind is the judgment that determines who does and who doesn't enter the Millennial reign.

1) you either can't answer the question, or you were so busy posturing it escaped you.
2) those taken, are taken BEFORE THE FLOOD.
3) Nowhere in the future will 1/2 of earth's population be wicked, and half righteous.
3) nowhere in the future will all of earth's population be destroyed in a flood.

It is beyond obvious that Jesus is using an analogy.
It is up to the reader to use common sense.

Postrib doctrine has the ones taken as a "wicked, half of earth's population".

How they invented it is bizarre.
Flat out ridiculous invention.

Really??? Before the flood/ 7 yr trib, a wicked people rapture/ "one taken"
Huh?

Then Jesus says to watch and be ready.
Who is to be ready pretrib?

So only righteous people go through the 7 year trib?

Please explain mat 24.

 

[Psalm1]

In the following passages we are told that we would suffer tribulation up to the time when Christ shall come to be glorified in His saints. This passage alone thoroughly debunks pre-tribulationism.

"That no man should be moved by these afflictions; for yourselves know that we are appointed thereunto. For verily, when we were with you, we told you before that we should suffer tribulation; even as it came to pass, and ye know. So that we ourselves glory in you in the churches of God for your patience and faith in all your persecutions and tribulations that ye endure: [Which is] a manifest token of the righteous judgment of God, that ye may be counted worthy of the kingdom of God, for which ye also suffer: Seeing [it is] a righteous thing with God to recompense tribulation to them that trouble you; \par

And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels. In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ: Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power; When he shall come to be glorified in his saints, and to be admired in all them that believe (because our testimony among you was believed) in that day.

Rev 19, the second coming on white horses is when he comes in vengeance, power and destruction.

Compare that with Rev 14:14.

14 And I looked, and behold a white cloud, and upon the cloud one sat like unto the Son of man, having on his head a golden crown, and in his hand a sharp sickle.
15 And another angel came out of the temple, crying with a loud voice to him that sat on the cloud, Thrust in thy sickle, and reap: for the time is come for thee to reap; for the harvest of the earth is ripe.
16 And he that sat on the cloud thrust in his sickle on the earth; and the earth was reaped.

No postribber, to my knowledge, has ever honestly unpacked Rev 14:14.

It can not be the same as Rev 19 return on millions of horses.
Never will fit.
Never has.

Rev 14:14.
Read it and make it fit.

I will wait.

 

[Psalm1]

Where did Jesus teach pre-trib? He said the gathering occurs after the tribulation. Paul said it occurs at Jesus' coming - the parousia and at the LAST trump. What does Strong's say about the last trump?

"the trumpet which will sound AT THE LAST DAY, 1 Corinthians 15:52"

The Disciples asked, "What is the sign of thy parousia and the consummation of the age."

Coming - PAROUSIA presence
the coming, arrival, advent
the future visible return from heaven of Jesus, to raise the dead, hold the last judgment, and set up formally and gloriously the kingdom of God

Are you going to put me on ignore also?

Are you saying the rapture is on the last day?

 

[Psalm1]

Yes. Jesus was very direct and succinct about this. The only people who believe this are His own people who are getting ready to endure the GT.

John 6:39 "And this is the will of him who sent me, that I shall lose none of all those he has given me, but raise them up at the last day."

The rest as you can see from the pre-trib posts won't prepare and will end up not being strong enough to withstand the antichrist's threats and intimidations. They will give in and take the mark.


🕊

What should a postribber do to be strong?
To be able to go through the gt till the white horse coming?

Now you are aware, I suppose, that the AC kills all refusing the mark,and actually, there is none alive to "rapture" at the white horse coming?

But you can believe otherwise if Jesus teaching is bothersome.

 

[Psalm1]

Y

In the following passages we are told that we would suffer tribulation up to the time when Christ shall come to be glorified in His saints. This passage alone thoroughly debunks pre-tribulationism.

"That no man should be moved by these afflictions; for yourselves know that we are appointed thereunto. For verily, when we were with you, we told you before that we should suffer tribulation; even as it came to pass, and ye know. So that we ourselves glory in you in the churches of God for your patience and faith in all your persecutions and tribulations that ye endure: [Which is] a manifest token of the righteous judgment of God, that ye may be counted worthy of the kingdom of God, for which ye also suffer: Seeing [it is] a righteous thing with God to recompense tribulation to them that trouble you; \par

And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels. In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ: Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power; When he shall come to be glorified in his saints, and to be admired in all them that believe (because our testimony among you was believed) in that day.

Yes indeed.
We suffer tribulation now and in the future.
Right now, and up to the pretrib rapture, where one is taken to heaven, and one left behind to deal with the AC.
Half the church stays (as you have the faith for)
It is up to you.
Jesus takes The worthy ones only. The carnal believers stay.

Good point.

 

[2ndTimeIsTheCharm]

John 6:39 "And this is the will of him who sent me, that I shall lose none of all those he has given me, but raise them up at the last day."

This is for those who belong to the Lord. Build up your faith in Christ to endure to the end, even if means being martyred.

Luke 17:33 Whoever tries to keep their life will lose it, and whoever loses their life will preserve it.


🕊

 

[WiselyWoven]

Jesus said " pray That you might be counted worthy to escape the things about to come upon the whole earth and stand before the son of man."

"worthy to escape" is NOT synonymous with "evacuation."

escape = to flee out of, to flee away, to seek safety in flight = NO CONNECTION with any so-called rapture

The entire flood account is one of God providentially guiding his people through the calamity - NOT evacuating them out of it.

Mat 24:38-42...BEFORE THE FLOOD...THEN...

READ IT SLOW.
BEFORE THE FLOOD...what?

Absolutely none of that fits "after the trib".
None of it.

This mistake is the result of a serious lack of discernment. He cannot understand that the flood was mentioned simply as an EXAMPLE of what happens to the unprepared.

In verse 3, Jesus was asked, "what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?" He goes on to state many things, which are all IN RELATION TO what happened historically - they do not involve the flood itself; the flood is past history.

Context is everything. The poor guy is hung up in the flood and can't see the subsequent tribulation for the trees.

"For as [IOW, this is a metaphor, a simile, for illustrative purpose] in the days that were before the flood...so shall also the coming of the Son of man be." (v. 38 & 39)

Watch therefore: for ye know not what hour your Lord doth come. (v. 42)
Therefore be ye also ready: for in such an hour as ye think not the Son of man cometh. (v.44)

Meanwhile, what awaits the pre-trib rapture theory follower:

The lord of that servant shall come in a day when he looketh not for him, and in an hour that he is not aware of. And shall cut him asunder, and appoint him his portion with the hypocrites: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth. (v. 50 & 51)

Pray for Psalm1, that the scales would fall from his eyes that he may receive sight.

 

[Amargosa]

"worthy to escape" is NOT synonymous with "evacuation."

escape = to flee out of, to flee away, to seek safety in flight = NO CONNECTION with any so-called rapture

The entire flood account is one of God providentially guiding his people through the calamity - NOT evacuating them out of it.


This mistake is the result of a serious lack of discernment. He cannot understand that the flood was mentioned simply as an EXAMPLE of what happens to the unprepared.

In verse 3, Jesus was asked, "what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?" He goes on to state many things, which are all IN RELATION TO what happened historically - they do not involve the flood itself; the flood is past history.

Context is everything. The poor guy is hung up in the flood and can't see the subsequent tribulation for the trees.

"For as [IOW, this is a metaphor, a simile, for illustrative purpose] in the days that were before the flood...so shall also the coming of the Son of man be." (v. 38 & 39)

Watch therefore: for ye know not what hour your Lord doth come. (v. 42)
Therefore be ye also ready: for in such an hour as ye think not the Son of man cometh. (v.44)

Meanwhile, what awaits the pre-trib rapture theory follower:

The lord of that servant shall come in a day when he looketh not for him, and in an hour that he is not aware of. And shall cut him asunder, and appoint him his portion with the hypocrites: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth. (v. 50 & 51)

Pray for Psalm1, that the scales would fall from his eyes that he may receive sight.

When was Noah and his family spared from the flood; pre flood, mid flood or post flood?

 

[WiselyWoven]

When was Noah and his family spared from the flood; pre flood, mid flood or post flood?

Noah was not "spared from the flood." Noah was on the ark for about one full year.