Yes, except the 4th commandment evidently was part of the Levitical laws rather than a moral commandment,
because it was not re-commanded in the NT, but even the moral laws were expanded and redefined as doing good/
reflecting divine love every day.
Loss of salvation???
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Yes, except the 4th commandment evidently was part of the Levitical laws rather than a moral commandment,
because it was not re-commanded in the NT, but even the moral laws were expanded and redefined as doing good/
reflecting divine love every day.
24 "Therefore whoever hears these sayings of Mine, and does them, I will liken him to a wise man who built his house on the rock:
25 "and the rain descended, the floods came, and the winds blew and beat on that house; and it did not fall, for it was founded on the rock.
26 "But everyone who hears these sayings of Mine, and does not do them, will be like a foolish man who built his house on the sand:
27 "and the rain descended, the floods came, and the winds blew and beat on that house; and it fell. And great was its fall." (Matt. 7:24-27 NKJ)
Without understanding, there is no obedience.
Of course he did.
Yes. The point is this. Through his obedience, he learns what the father values.
I did answer it. We learn life principles from the commandments and apply them to our own lives.
What is your answer?
Those who don't shape their lives around Jesus' teaching, will shape their lives around another teacher or teachers.
That's one of the real problems. It will pick a predominant theological system to answer and guide from, so the user has to know enough about theology and the Word to recognize it and get it to work within or away from the established systems as much as possible.
It'll also try to become our friend and support us in whatever theological errancy we're in.
Interesting tool fraught with problems. Needs the Spirit to fill it with the Truth just like we do.
Well, at least now you're admitting that we must obey God...
although you have now created the limitation that we must also understand what we obey.
Within the word FAITH lies trust.
If we have faith in someone,,,we also trust that person.
The bible teaches that God's wisdom surpasses the undersanding of man.
It is very useful to understand why some commands are given.
But if we have FAITH in God we will also TRUST Him.
God gave many commands, rules and ordinances in the Law.
They were to be followed,,,whether they were understood or not.
Obedience. It always goes back to obedience.
We are to obey,,,,even if we do not understand.
Mature Christians understand that the 10C are not to rule over us but to keep us safe.
God's commands keep us safe....
even if we do not understand how.
Mark 1:40-45
40Now a leper came to Him, imploring Him, kneeling down to Him and saying to Him, “If You are willing, You can make me clean.”
41Then Jesus, moved with compassion, stretched out His hand and touched him, and said to him, “I am willing; be cleansed.” 42As soon as He had spoken, immediately the leprosy left him, and he was cleansed. 43And He strictly warned him and sent him away at once, 44and said to him, “See that you say nothing to anyone; but go your way, show yourself to the priest, and offer for your cleansing those things which Moses commanded, as a testimony to them.”
45However, he went out and began to proclaim it freely, and to spread the matter, so that Jesus could no longer openly enter the city, but was outside in deserted places; and they came to Him from every direction.
The Leper was healed by Jesus.
He was told not to tell anyone but the priest.
Instead he did not TRUST Jesus, he did not UNDERSTAND why and went and told of his healing.
This caused Jesus to be unable to enter into that city to preach and teach.
We are to trust in the Lord with all our heart....
Proverbs 3:5
I'm happy to hear that the children you're speaking of understand all that they were ordered.
My 2 year old did not understand why he should not run into the street from curbside.
All he understood is that he was not to do it.
My daughter did not understand why her brother was allowed to go places she was not allowed to go...
until she had her own daughter and understood that girls are in more danger.
YOU tell ME my answer.
I've given it several times now.
Apparently you don't really give attention to posts...
at least mine.
Yes to what you said: "Christian theology teaches that the Law has been abolished - except for the Moral Law which is eternal and will never be abolished. This would be the 10 commandments and anything that Jesus taught. I would exclude the Sabbath law....whatever day someone wants to worship is not of importance to me. Also, ...would you say the sign of the NC is baptism or communion?
NKJ Rom3:9 What then? Are we better than they? Not at all. For we have previously charged both Jews and Greeks that they are all under sin...........19 Now we know that whatever the law says, it says to those who are
The reason I left out v.10-18 is at least two-fold;
- it looks like v.19 ties back to v.9 - which is pretty easy to see content-wise as v.9 speaks of both Jews and Greeks which is idiom for all men - then v.19 takes up the all men (all mouths & all the world) issue.
- v.19 has some language that English tends to get creative with:
- Where it said "...to those who are under the law" it literally says as I changed it, "...to those who are IN the law"
- Gentiles are not said to be 'under the law" as I recall.
- But this verse seems to be telling us that all men are in the law - in the sphere/realm - or jurisdiction of the law, to use a use a legal phrase.
- Where it said "...to those who are under the law" it literally says as I changed it, "...to those who are IN the law"
- This is pre-Moses
- It's been awhile, but I recall that 9 of the 10 Commandments can be seen in Genesis.
- God is talking to Cain about sin
- Israel who was given the written law was supposed to be a priest nation representing God to men
- Paul says the law can be seen working in Gentile consciences.
I agree with those who say God's Law is still in place. IMO, some form of it has been in place since the beginning. RE: Christians not being under law - I currently agree with those who see this mainly meaning being under it's curse and likely also under it's driving force to make us sin in order to learn what sin is.
According to Paul, for us it's part of God's Word to instruct us about righteousness.
I would think the ability to carry on a coherent conversation would be at least one of the qualifications for a seat of judgment. But of course, there's always the kangaroo court.
With regard to our Perfect High Priest,
Heb 5:7 During the days of His early life, He offered up prayers and petitions with loud cries and tears to the One who could save Him from death, and He was heard because of His reverence. Heb 5:8 Although He was a Son, He learned obedience from what He suffered. Heb 5:9 And having been made perfect, He became the source the source of eternal salvation to all who obey Him.
Your statement of the father's values generates the thought of faith, considering, "without faith, it is impossible to please God (Heb 11:6)..."
And this colors in Jesus' lessons in obedience from what He suffered, in that He learned to remain, standing fast, in faith throughout those things that He suffered. He held reverence of His Father's authority and power to save Him from death. And in the instance of the boy's reverence for his father, he obeys because he trusts his father's motive for his command to be one of preservation and later turns the bat into a tool of preservation. It's hard to accept that the boy begins unaware of the father's motivation, as it would seem to me that a communicative father, with interest in maintaining an intimate relationship with his son, would offer his son his reason regardless of his understanding of them and which, in that case, the son would just have to 'take his word for it.' Even so, the son would eventually learn obedience in suffering or going without swinging his bat in the house all that he wanted, as he continues to realize the preservation of his house.
And, if he is as observant, he might also make note of his friend's house, who is permitted the indulgence.
I never denied that we must obey God.
Yes, of course. But we are talking about obeying the commandments of Jesus Christ, which are neither ambiguous nor hidden. Knowledge and understanding are a major theme in the New Testament. We could multiply examples. But for now, notice Peter's emphasis on knowledge in the following passage. 2 Peter 1:2-8
Paul often prays that his readers will be granted a "knowledge of the truth" or "knowledge of him," or "a spirit of wisdom and knowledge," or "knowledge and discernment."
Early in Israel's interaction with Yahweh, they may have lacked understanding, but as they lived under the Law for many years, they learned about what God values. Paul says that the Law was their tutor. Children don't always know why their parents give them rules to follow, but eventually, children grow up to be adults and they learn the reasons for the rules.
When Jesus came, he more fully instructed Israel about God's values. He corrected the Jewish religious leaders and taught the crowds directly. In other words, Israel grew up and became an adult.
Let's think this through a little bit more. What if the man said nothing at all to anyone except the priests? What then? Would his healing remain a secret? Really?
Why were the priests involved if not for the sake of man's participation in the ritual/religious life of the community? After his healing, the man was expected to participate in public worship. This meant that a man who was formerly ostracized by his community because of an illness was suddenly allowed to attend the Synagogue. And this would go without notice?
What was the man supposed to do? Lie about how he was healed? No, if he were honest, he would give Jesus Credit.
From what I've seen, since the first century there has always been some form of law/Moses based ideology.
You likely know more of the ECF than I, but they were against it and some of their battles were directly against it.
In the current environment, 1900's on, it looks mainly to be the Hebrew Roots movement and similar in Messianic Judaism and some offshoots of it.
But there were and are others.
SDA is mainly 10C observant but not full Torah as I understand.
But what if its is important to God why He wrote it in the Ten Commandments- His Testimony Exo31:18 and it was never pick the day you want. He only blessed and sanctified one day for holy use, not all.
Exo 20:8 “Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy. 9 Six days you shall labor and do all your work, 10 but the seventh day is the Sabbath of the LORD your God. In it you shall do no work: you, nor your son, nor your daughter, nor your male servant, nor your female servant, nor your cattle, nor your stranger who is within your gates. 11 For in six days the LORD made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them, and rested the seventh day. Therefore the LORD blessed the Sabbath day and hallowed it.
Can we apply this same logic to the other 9 commandments. God didn't really mean adultery with our spouses its anyone we have a relationship with. God didn't really mean to not lie- just when it works for us.
Doubt in what God says is the begging of all the problems. God spelled out what He meant and told us not to add or subtract from it. Deut4:2 Ecc3:14 Mat5:18-19 because He would not Psa89:34
Jesus is LORD of the Sabbath day, Mat2:27-28 not the day we choose.