Was Judas Iscariot saved, or was he not?

[lrs68]

Judas' damnable sin was that he didn't believe in Christ. He was a follower of Christ for 3 years, so he was a Christian in that sense, and he apparently believed Jesus was Israel's messiah, but he believed that Jesus had come to save the nation of Israel from the Romans, rather than to save the people of Israel from their sins.

IMO the rulers convinced Judas that if Jesus wasn't stopped, the Romans would take away their land and nation. The nation was obviously more important to them than was the truth.

Then gathered the chief priests and the Pharisees a council, and said, What do we? for this man doeth many miracles. If we let him thus alone, all men will believe on him: and the Romans shall come and take away both our place and nation. And one of them, named Caiaphas, being the high priest that same year, said unto them, Ye know nothing at all, Nor consider that it is expedient for us, that one man should die for the people, and that the whole nation perish not. John 11:47-50​

This fear may have motivated Judas to betray Jesus to the rulers thinking that the rulers would have a talk with Jesus to explain this to him. Which would explain his remorse when he realized they meant to kill him instead.

If all of this is true, then Judas wasn't a true Christian, but he was a Christian zionist who saw Israel's promised redemption as being deliverance from Rome rather than as being deliverance from sin. So Judas appears to be the forerunner of Christian zionism, and those who follow that doctrine can be considered to be following in Judas' footsteps.

I doubt the Disciples had inside information about the San Hedrin Council. I believe Judas believed Yeshua was supposed to kill the Romans and instead He preached to forgive them. Judas probably had his own endeavors and Yeshua wasn't moving in the right direction.

But to kill yourself after Yeshuas capture and death probably means he felt extremely guilty for his actions and instead of going back for forgiveness just jumped onto a short rope.

 

[ChristRoseFromTheDead]

I doubt the Disciples had inside information about the San Hedrin Council.

If this one disciple had inside contacts it's not a stretch to think that Judas also has some access.

And Simon Peter followed Jesus, and so did another disciple: that disciple was known unto the high priest, and went in with Jesus into the palace of the high priest. But Peter stood at the door without. Then went out that other disciple, which was known unto the high priest, and spake unto her that kept the door, and brought in Peter. John 18:15-16​

 

[pinebeach]

So given that all your sins have the exact same root as Judas's, what do you sell Jesus out for?

I'm interested. What is the exact same root you are referring to here?

 

[Suze]

Read Matthew , chapter 27 verses 3-5 .

 

[tourist]

Suze said:
I'm also interested in what people think about Saul , does anyone think that he was forgiven ?

Hoping we could open another thread regarding King Saul.

If God reveals the truth in His Word, the true sins of King Saul and Judas Iscariot will be revealed to us. Thus, by receiving what God reveals, we will not follow their example or repeat what they did.

Maybe our true sins will be revealed as well.

 

[Dino246]

Scripture tells us plainly.
If the scripture tell us plainly. Can you tell it what do you read ang what do you believe?

I believe what is written in Scripture. You can read it for yourself.

Reading Scripture alone is not the basis for knowing the truth. It requires humility and the grace of God to guide a person into the truth revealed in His Word.

You are wrong about this; Scripture is truth.

 

[Dino246]

Based on the tone of your statement, it appears that you already understand what Judas's actual sin was

Yes. I understand what Judas’ sin was because I read the Scripture that tells us what his sin was.

 

[PennEd]

He was given same powers as the other Disciples when Yeshua sent them 2x2.

Where does it say he wasn't ever saved?

The fact he was given same healing powers as the others indicates more so he was once saved than never ever saved.

These dudes did miraculous deeds just like Judas.
Were they saved at one time?

Matthew 7 NIV

True and False Disciples​

“Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. 22;Many will say to me on that day, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name and in your name drive out demons and in your name perform many miracles?’23 Then I will tell them plainly, ‘I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!’

Not to mention it’s common knowledge that a person needs to prove THEIR positive statement, and others do not need to prove a negative.

You have not in the slightest proven that Judas was saved. That’s because you can’t. He wasn’t, and there is zero Biblical evidence that he was.

 

[rewriter]

I'm interested. What is the exact same root you are referring to here?

All humans above an extremely young age have a sense that they are separable distinct entities. Psychiatry recognizes that as a lie that causes innumerable problems, including every one spelled out in Romans. Quantum physics also recognizes it as a lie, that in truth we are all interconnected and that whatever someone does to any other entity within creation we do to ourselves. What greater root could possibly exist? Because of this false belief, we attack ourselves as well as the rest of creation, and without outside healing, condemn ourselves to death.

 

[Godsgood]

I am arguing that ALL sin, every person's, including Judas. is based on the false assumption that we are physically separate individual entities and that based off of that assumption we act predominately to benefit our false individual view of our separateness. We will act to benefit others, but predominately to the extent that it feels like a benefit to our separate self, "I feel good about myself when I do ..., so I do it. Psychiatry recognizes this sense of separateness as the source of many, perhaps most, mental issues, extreme cases evolve into mental illness, quantum physics recognizes also recognizes this as a fallacy, yet how many people recognize, and act with awareness that everything we to others effects ourselves, from the smallest act to the largest including concerns about money. Thus, there is absolutely no true uniqueness about Judas's act, just another variation on a general theme that we all follow.

As for God's moral law, read through it and see if it does not fully follow this understanding, recall it is all based on Love God with all your heart soul and mind and love your neighbor as yourself, not love yourself first and your neighbor with what you can spare.

I hope you understand that what is for the flesh, the body, or physical life is separate from spiritual life. They cannot be mixed. I’m sorry, but from my understanding of your explanation, it applies to the physical life of humans. Physical life refers to things like economics, science, and politics. There are sins that apply only to physical life. However, what we are discussing here is spiritual life, the things that belong to God.
MATTHEW 22:21
21 They say unto him, Caesar's. Then saith he unto them, Render therefore unto Caesar the things which are Caesar's; and unto God the things that are God's.

 

[Godsgood]

Yes. I understand what Judas’ sin was because I read the Scripture that tells us what his sin was.

Then can you tell us how was Judas's sin unique compared to our sins?

What is our sins?

What is Judas sin?

 

[Godsgood]

I believe what is written in Scripture. You can read it for yourself.


You are wrong about this; Scripture is truth.

You may continue to hold the position that Scripture is already the truth. You are free to do so. However, so that the lost sheep will not believe your position, the Lord God will inevitably expose that your stance is not truly based on the truth. For plain Scripture is not yet the truth itself, but only the revelation of the Lord God in His Word; the truth is found in that revelation. The Lord said that endless study of the Scriptures alone will not lead one to the truth.
2 TIMOTHY 3:7
7 Ever learning, and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth.

Therefore, the chosen of God, when reading the Word of God, recognize that it is not yet the truth itself. As a result, they seek mercy from the Lord to reveal the truth in His Word.

 

[Godsgood]

Yes. I understand what Judas’ sin was because I read the Scripture that tells us what his sin was.

Then can you tell us how was Judas's sin unique compared to our sins?

What is our sins?

What is Judas sin?

Dino, If you claim to know the sins of people, including the unique sin of Judas, yet you choose not to answer this, then you are likely being either dishonest or withholding the truth. You say you know, but you do not.

 

[Suze]

Matthew chapter 27 , verses 3-5 , did any of u read it ? If yes , what do u think about what it says ?

 

[Suze]

Matthew chapter 27 , verses 3-5 , did any of u read it ? If yes , what do u think about what it says ?

 

[Suze]

These dudes did miraculous deeds just like Judas.
Were they saved at one time?

Matthew 7 NIV

True and False Disciples​

“Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. 22;Many will say to me on that day, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name and in your name drive out demons and in your name perform many miracles?’23 Then I will tell them plainly, ‘I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!’

Not to mention it’s common knowledge that a person needs to prove THEIR positive statement, and others do not need to prove a negative.

You have not in the slightest proven that Judas was saved. That’s because you can’t. He wasn’t, and there is zero Biblical evidence that he was.

I hate to b contentious , however , no where in the Bible is anyone referred to as ' saved ' . No , it doesn't say that Judas was / is saved , because that term is not applied to believers . Please read Matthew Ch 27 v 3-5 . I'm not giving my opinion either way because , my opinion doesn't matter , all that matters is what the Bible says . Again , I promise I'm not trying to b contentious , just pointing out a scripture and asking what people think when they read it .

 

[Suze]

These dudes did miraculous deeds just like Judas.
Were they saved at one time?

Matthew 7 NIV

True and False Disciples​

“Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. 22;Many will say to me on that day, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name and in your name drive out demons and in your name perform many miracles?’23 Then I will tell them plainly, ‘I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!’

Not to mention it’s common knowledge that a person needs to prove THEIR positive statement, and others do not need to prove a negative.

You have not in the slightest proven that Judas was saved. That’s because you can’t. He wasn’t, and there is zero Biblical evidence that he was.

I apologise , there r two instances , 1st Corinthians and Ephesians , where the term' saved ' is used , just two .

 

[DavidLamb]

I hate to b contentious , however , no where in the Bible is anyone referred to as ' saved ' . No , it doesn't say that Judas was / is saved , because that term is not applied to believers . Please read Matthew Ch 27 v 3-5 . I'm not giving my opinion either way because , my opinion doesn't matter , all that matters is what the Bible says . Again , I promise I'm not trying to b contentious , just pointing out a scripture and asking what people think when they read it .

I don't want to be contentious either but surely it is wrong to say that nowhere in the Bible is anyone referred to as "saved." Just a few verses where Christian believers are referred to as "saved":

(Act 2:47) Praising God, and having favour with all the people. And the Lord added to the church daily such as should be saved.

(Act 16:31) And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house.

(Rom 10:13) For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.

(Eph 2:8) For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:

Then there are the verses that talk of salvation, that is, being saved.

 

[HealthAndHappiness]

I don't want to be contentious either but surely it is wrong to say that nowhere in the Bible is anyone referred to as "saved." Just a few verses where Christian believers are referred to as "saved":

(Act 2:47) Praising God, and having favour with all the people. And the Lord added to the church daily such as should be saved.

(Act 16:31) And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house.

(Rom 10:13) For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.

(Eph 2:8) For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:

Then there are the verses that talk of salvation, that is, being saved.

I used to attend an Evangelical mega church until the pastor told everyone that we should not use the term saved. The entire sermon was against making the lost feel uncomfortable because if they were told their need to be saved, that would imply that they are not going to Heaven.

I learned that he followed Andy Stanley and listened to his sermon too...
What a waste of time to invest in a church to have this kind of deal breaker occur after way too many years.

 

[HealthAndHappiness]

I don't want to be contentious either but surely it is wrong to say that nowhere in the Bible is anyone referred to as "saved." Just a few verses where Christian believers are referred to as "saved":

(Act 2:47) Praising God, and having favour with all the people. And the Lord added to the church daily such as should be saved.

(Act 16:31) And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house.

(Rom 10:13) For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.

(Eph 2:8) For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:

Then there are the verses that talk of salvation, that is, being saved.

I was looking for that old sermon and couldn't find it.
However, I ran across a 6 minute illustration of where Andy Stanley's at now in his doctrinal decline. (6 minutes about his gay friend who left his wife and child for another man.)