Are you a monergist or a synergist?

[HeIsHere]

1. We do not cooperate with God, this would be us saving ourselves in doing whatever works are required.
2. The woman in the corner of a burning house who is rescued by the fireman because she chose to trust him. and receive his help. did not cooperate with the fireman, she placed her faith in him, knowing she could not save herself
3. repenting is just a change of heart. or going from a state of unbelief to a state of faith. it is not really doing something. Those who have repented will receive the gift God is offering to them in faith. this again is not a work. you are just receiving the gift in faith. On Christmas day when a child take a gift handed to him, he is not cooperating. He is receiving a gift in faith from someone who loves him.

This is what scripture teachers, our faith placed in Christ for salvation is non meritorious because it is the condition God sets.

After Pentecost God was pouring our His spirit on people to help the church get established under tremendous persecution, however those statements in scripture are time specific under very specific conditions.

Even Paul told King Agrippa he obeyed!

19“And so, King Agrippa, I obeyed that vision from heaven.
Acts 26:19

Very clearly Paul informs us that people retain the ability to either respond positively or not, God desires humility and genuineness.

 

[PennEd]

It says they know they deserve death

by defenition, by defenition then they would understand they need saved.

Again, recognizing they deserve death, and believing in the need for a Savior, are two completely different things. And even if there is the recognition, they certainly don’t have the faith to believe Jesus is that Savior.

Death row inmates are a great example of this. Interesting to read their last words.

Some, have genuinely repented, and are remorseful, and even speak the Name of Christ.

Others, know they deserve death, have zero remorse, and say things like, “ you can kiss my a$$!”

That is a question you can ask God.

I call it pride..

The pharisee rejected God in pride

the tax collector was humbled.

the question is. How did the tax collector get humbled

Same answer. God granted repentance. He did it.

The gift of faith is offered to everyone as is the gift of faith.

If everyone had the faith to believe, everyone would believe. To think otherwise is to boast. Why are WE so smart, so moral, so humble, to accept the Truth, but all those that reject Him aren’t?

That is THE question we need to ask ourselves.

That dude was you and I at one time my friend.

Speaking for myself, I know the sins I committed were bad, and wrong, yet I never got to the point where my conscious was seared to the point that the Truth had no effect on my me. Praise God for that! Not me, I would’ve gotten continually worse if not for HIS intervention.

 

[Cameron143]

once again, if this was true no one would be saved.

You and I both would be lost. because until we are saved, we were in our natural state..

What it demonstrates is that salvation is more than understanding. It is a coming of God to an individual wherein He converts an individual and makes him a partaker of the divine nature.

 

[Cameron143]

Yes. God draws you

and brings you to the point you either recieve him, or you continue to reject him

When God draws a person, it is for the purpose of saving them. They hear His voice and follow Him.

 

[HeIsHere]

Some do that, but I didn't.

Well there it is an attempt to tarnish your testimony, sad.

Yes we are persuaded by the truth of the Good News of Christ Jesus, His finished work, His gift of salvation AND in humility we receive what He desires to give!!!

 

[Everlasting-Grace]

Again, recognizing they deserve death, and believing in the need for a Savior, are two completely different things. And even if there is the recognition, they certainly don’t have the faith to believe Jesus is that Savior.

I would not assume things brother

Death row inmates are a great example of this. Interesting to read their last words.

Some, have genuinely repented, and are remorseful, and even speak the Name of Christ.

Others, know they deserve death, have zero remorse, and say things like, “ you can kiss my a$$!”

People do this with God also. thats what romans 1 is all about.

Some have repented. some have not.. But unless their sentence is paid for (redemption) they will still suffer their fate

In your senerio. Jesus paid the sentence they all desire..

Some repent.

Some do not

Those who do not will suffer their fate

Same answer. God granted repentance. He did it.

I did nto say otherwise.

God grants repentance and faith.

If everyone had the faith to believe, everyone would believe.

If everyone repented, everyone would believe.

Not everyone has faith. hence why they are left in the condemned state

To think otherwise is to boast. Why are WE so smart, so moral, so humble, to accept the Truth, but all those that reject Him aren’t?

Again. Who can boast because they became like the tax collector and cried out to Jesus. This literally makes no sense to me.

That is THE question we need to ask ourselves.

Yes..

So can I boast if I recieved gods grace in faith.

or can I boast that God chose to save me, and not my neighbor. and God did not even give him any possibility to be saved. he hid the truth from him

Speaking for myself, I know the sins I committed were bad, and wrong, yet I never got to the point where my conscious was seared to the point that the Truth had no effect on my me. Praise God for that! Not me, I would’ve gotten continually worse if not for HIS intervention.

he drew you

But he did not chose you over a million other people who chose not to even help.

 

[Everlasting-Grace]

What it demonstrates is that salvation is more than understanding. It is a coming of God to an individual wherein He converts an individual and makes him a partaker of the divine nature.

no again why do you boast That God chose you and not others?

God draws. we must chose..

to live in sin and unbelief

to continue to try to save ourselves

To deny we need saved, while knowing we do

To cry out to God to save us.

 

[Everlasting-Grace]

When God draws a person, it is for the purpose of saving them. They hear His voice and follow Him.

Not everyone choses to follow him though

Many are called few are chosen.

who are chosen? Those who trust him.

 

[Cameron143]

no again why do you boast That God chose you and not others?

God draws. we must chose..

to live in sin and unbelief

to continue to try to save ourselves

To deny we need saved, while knowing we do

To cry out to God to save us.

All of this is true from a human perspective. What it doesn't take into account is the activity of God.

Read Acts 2:23. Who is responsible for the crucifixion of Jesus?

 

[Magenta]

If you are given a choice to follow the wide road to destruction or the rarrow road to salvation.

Are we allowed to choose which road we walk?

IF? Perhaps you ought to clarify.

 

[reneweddaybyday]

After Adam and Eve sinned, God said they know both good and evil. Under scenarios provided in this thread, it appears some believe man can only know evil ... never the good God said man was capable of knowing.

The Word of God is life. The Word of God is life-giving. The gospel of Christ is the power of God unto salvation ...

... those who suppress the truth in unrighteousness receive the consequence of having suppressed, resisted, rejected.

... those who do not suppress the truth in unrighteousness receive the blessed promise.

Romans 1:16-19

16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.

17 For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith.

18 For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness;

19 Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them.

.

 

[Everlasting-Grace]

All of this is true from a human perspective. What it doesn't take into account is the activity of God.

actually it does..

Read Acts 2:23. Who is responsible for the crucifixion of Jesus?

we all are..

if you think otherwise. something is wrong.

 

[Cameron143]

actually it does..



we all are..

if you think otherwise. something is wrong.

Did you bother to read the passage? Please do and tell me who God says from the passage who is responsible.

 

[reneweddaybyday]

Did you bother to read the passage? Please do and tell me who God says from the passage who is responsible.

Acts 2:22-23

22 Ye men of Israel, hear these words; Jesus of Nazareth, a man approved of God among you by miracles and wonders and signs, which God did by him in the midst of you, as ye yourselves also know:

23 Him, being delivered by the determinate counsel and foreknowledge of God, ye have taken, and by wicked hands have crucified and slain

According to the passage ...

God ... by the determinate counsel and foreknowledge of God

ye = Israelites ...

wicked (Greek = anomos = without law) hands = those without the law (gentiles)

... all were involved.

.

 

[Everlasting-Grace]

Did you bother to read the passage? Please do and tell me who God says from the passage who is responsible.

ok so you deny he died for you..got it

 

[Cameron143]

Acts 2:22-23

22 Ye men of Israel, hear these words; Jesus of Nazareth, a man approved of God among you by miracles and wonders and signs, which God did by him in the midst of you, as ye yourselves also know:

23 Him, being delivered by the determinate counsel and foreknowledge of God, ye have taken, and by wicked hands have crucified and slain

According to the passage ...

God ... by the determinate counsel and foreknowledge of God

ye = Israelites ...

wicked (Greek = anomos = without law) hands = those without the law (gentiles)

... all were involved.

.

Correct. Men killed Jesus, but unseen, in the spiritual realm, God orchestrated the event. He chose the time...in the fulness of time...Galatians 4, He chose the method...Psalm 22.

And we find this same pattern throughout the Bible. History is under divine control. It is following a divine plan and timetable. And it is concerned with the unfolding of the kingdom of God into the world. Regardless of what men do in the natural realm, God is controlling it from the spiritual realm.

This is true from a macro perspective...Daniel 7 for example, and from a micro perspective...Ephesians 2. At all times, God is in control and guiding history for His purposes and to His glory.

 

[Cameron143]

ok so you deny he died for you..got it

Grace and peace.

 

[PennEd]

he drew you

But he did not chose you over a million other people who chose not to even help.

EVERY one He draws WILL come to Jesus, and no one can come to Him unless the Father draws Him.

Seems like ballgame to me.

John 6
37 All that the Father gives Me will come to Me, and the one who comes to Me I will by no means cast out. 38 For I have come down from heaven, not to do My own will, but the will of Him who sent Me. 39 This is the will of the Father who sent Me, that of all He has given Me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up at the last day.

44 No one can come to Me unless the Father who sent Me draws him; and I will raise him up at the last day. 45 It is written in the prophets, And they shall all be taught by God.’ Therefore everyone who has heard and learned from the Father comes to Me.

 

[lrs68]

Acts 2:22-23

22 Ye men of Israel, hear these words; Jesus of Nazareth, a man approved of God among you by miracles and wonders and signs, which God did by him in the midst of you, as ye yourselves also know:

23 Him, being delivered by the determinate counsel and foreknowledge of God, ye have taken, and by wicked hands have crucified and slain

According to the passage ...

God ... by the determinate counsel and foreknowledge of God

ye = Israelites ...

wicked (Greek = anomos = without law) hands = those without the law (gentiles)

... all were involved.

.

This merely proves that before Creation God created a Plan of Salvation because God made man and Angels with the ability to fall from Grace into darkness. Because God made man this way God provided a way to return back to Grace.

 

[Genez]

EVERY one He draws WILL come to Jesus, and no one can come to Him unless the Father draws Him.

Seems like ballgame to me.

Jesus needed to say that because many in the crowd were constantly seeking more works to do to be saved.

Jesus simply told them that God does the work of drawing men into salvation.