Man imputed Jesus with sin on the cross, not God.

[Cameron143]

Not subject in God's eyes. Because the God I see described in scripture is not vindictive, not demanding bloody sacrifice and that sinners suffer for their sins against Him, but His mercy triumphs over judgment. As David understood Him to be.

Psa 51:16
For thou desirest not sacrifice; else would I give it: thou delightest not in burnt offering.
Psa 51:17
The sacrifices of God are a broken spirit: a broken and a contrite heart, O God, thou wilt not despise.

Who do you believe required bloody sacrifice in the first place? Wasn't it God who set up the sacrificial system? Did God not kill animals and shed blood to provide a covering for Adam and Eve? Did God not cut an animal in pieces to secure a covenant with Abraham? Have you not read Hebrews 9:22...without the shedding of blood, there is no forgiveness of sins.

 

[ATG]

The Bible tells us that we are "justified by His blood" (e.g. Romans 5:8-10 cf Hebrews 9:22, 10:4),

Correct. We are now justified by His blood shed on a cross.

Rom 5:9
Much more then, being now justified by his blood, we shall be saved from wrath through him.

Heb 9:14
How much more shall the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered himself without spot to God, purge your conscience from dead works to serve the living God?

No man was justified by His blood at the cross, by unlawfully shedding it.

1Pe 1:2
Elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through sanctification of the Spirit, unto obedience and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ: Grace unto you, and peace, be multiplied.

The sprinkling and washing of Jesus' blood upon any soul, is not bodily from the cross, but only by the Spirit through His resurrection from the dead.

It is the Spirit's blood and life of resurrection, that can now be shed and sprinkled upon any man, that repents for Jesus' sake.

And also by obedience do we drink His blood to have the Spirit's life in us:

Jhn 6:54
Whoso eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood, hath eternal life; and I will raise him up at the last day. For my flesh is meat indeed, and my blood is drink indeed.

Jhn 6:63
It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.

The blood of the flesh is naturally shed at the cross. The blood of the Spirit is spiritually sprinkled at repentance.

Rom 4:25
Who was delivered for our offences, and was raised again for our justification.

1Pe 1:18
Forasmuch as ye know that ye were not redeemed with corruptible things, as silver and gold, from your vain conversation received by tradition from your fathers; But with the precious blood of Christ, as of a lamb without blemish and without spot:

In a similar manner, the Lord Jesus chose to be covered by/condemned for our sins,

Not by God, but only unustly by men.

Isa 53:3
He is despised and rejected of men; a man of sorrows, and acquainted with grief: and we hid as it were our faces from him; he was despised, and we esteemed him not. Surely he hath borne our griefs, and carried our sorrows: yet we did esteem him stricken, smitten of God, and afflicted.

Jesus chose to obey the Father and submitted to the condemnation of men, who covered Him with His own blood by stripes, affliction, and smiting.

and for a brief moment in time, He was made sin for us (not a sinner),

Already responded to this part, where men falsely made Him a sin and curse on a tree, because he submitted to them meekly by will of the Father.

As Commander of the Son, the Father therefore made Him to be imputed a sinner by unbelief and false accusation.

and died because

Because His body was beaten and crucified to death.

He was (however, as the Scriptures make clear for us, the grave could not hold Him, because He, Himself, was never guilty of sinning).

Self contradiction of false tradition: First wrongly saying He was condemned for our sins, and then rightly saying he was never guilty of sinning.

Acts 2​

22 Men of Israel, listen to these words: Jesus the Nazarene, a man attested to you by God with miracles and wonders and signs which God performed through Him in your midst, just as you yourselves know— ​

23 this Man, delivered over by the predetermined plan and foreknowledge of God, you nailed to a cross by the hands of godless men and put Him to death. ​

24 But God raised Him up again, putting an end to the agony of death, since it was impossible for Him to be held in its power. ​

He rose again to be declared Son of God by the Spirit, because He was not blaspheming God, when calling Himself the Son equal to God.

~Deuteronomy

2 Corinthians 5​

21 ~God~ made Him who knew no sin ~to be sin~ on our behalf, so that we might become the righteousness of God in Him. ​

He was made to be sin before men by unbelief in Him, that we might become righteousness of God by faith in Him.

 

[ATG]

@ATG, if Jesus is NOT the spotless Lamb of God (1 Peter 1:17-21) who was crucified and then died to atone for our sins and redeem us from them (so that our sins could be forgiven and we could be saved), in what (other) way, then, do you believe that our sins can be atoned for

I wouldn't know. If anyone is saying Jesus is NOT the spotless Lamb of God, then you can ASK them.

who was crucified and then died to atone for our sins and redeem us from them (so that our sins could be forgiven and we could be saved),

Now, if all He did was die on a cross by hands of men, then He would only be another righteous man wrongly executed by false accusation.

Only with His resurrection from the dead is Jesus Christ the spotless Lamb of God forgiving and atoning and saving us from sinning, that repent from our sins and trespasses against Him:

Rom 4:25
Who was delivered for our offences, and was raised again for our justification.

Rom 10:9
That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.

The atonement of sacrifice is not made by killing the lamb alone, but also by sprinkling the blood upon the people.

Heb 9:18
Whereupon neither the first testament was dedicated without blood, For when Moses had spoken every precept to all the people according to the law, he took the blood of calves and of goats, with water, and scarlet wool, and hyssop, and sprinkled both the book, and all the people. Saying, This is the blood of the testament which God hath enjoined unto you.

Only by resurrection from the dead can the spotless Lamb of God sprinkle us with the blood of His eternal Spirit, to atone for our sinning against Him at the cross.

1Pe 1:18
Forasmuch as ye know that ye were not redeemed with corruptible things, as silver and gold, from your vain conversation received by tradition from your fathers; But with the precious blood of Christ, as of a lamb without blemish and without spot:

1Pe 1:2
Elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through sanctification of the Spirit, unto obedience and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ: Grace unto you, and peace, be multiplied. Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, which according to his abundant mercy hath begotten us again unto a lively hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,

Thanks

~Deuteronomy
p.s. - our sins are imputed or reckoned or credited to the Lord Jesus's account by God, in the same way that God imputes, reckons or credits the Lord Jesus' righteousness, the righteousness of God, that is, to our accounts.

And so, we see how rejecting the prophecy of Scripture of who imputed Jesus with sin and guilt, leads to the false tradition and lie of men against God, that the Father imputed His only begotten Son with sin on the cross.

Isa 53:34
He is despised and rejected of men; a man of sorrows, and acquainted with grief: and we hid as it were our faces from him; he was despised, and we esteemed him not. Surely he hath borne our griefs, and carried our sorrows: yet we did esteem him stricken, smitten of God, and afflicted.

Despised and rejected of men, not of God. Faces of men hid from Him, not God. Esteemed guilty of sin and smitten of God by men, not God.

And as elsewhere, such false tradition also ends in self-contradiction: If God imputing with sin, does not make anyone a sinner, then God imputing with righteousness, does not make anyone righteous.

If God imputing with sin, does not make anyone a sinner, and imputing with righteousness, does not make anyone righteous, then imputation of God is made of none effect upon anyone on earth.

Jesus was never a sinner but, for a brief moment in time, He stood in our place ~as one~ (on the Cross) FOR us,

Already corrected enough times.

according to His Father's predetermined plan and will, to redeem us and finally make forgiveness and salvation a reality for us!

Finally by His resurrection from the dead at the right hand of God, not by His death alone at the cross.

 

[ATG]

Whoops, I also meant to say (in my last post above) that "we" cannot impute or credit Jesus' account with our sins any more than "we" can impute or credit our own accounts with Jesus' righteousness, only God can do that!

The Scripture says otherwise.

Isa 53:3
He is despised and rejected of men; a man of sorrows, and acquainted with grief: and we hid as it were our faces from him; he was despised, and we esteemed him not. Surely he hath borne our griefs, and carried our sorrows: yet we did esteem him stricken, smitten of God, and afflicted.

We can wrongly impute sin to another, which does not make them imputed with sin by God. We can also wrongly impute righteousness to another, which does not make them imputed with righteousness by God.

1Sa 22:15
Did I then begin to enquire of God for him? be it far from me: let not the king impute any thing unto his servant, nor to all the house of my father: for thy servant knew nothing of all this, less or more.

2Sa 19:19
And said unto the king, Let not my lord impute iniquity unto me, neither do thou remember that which thy servant did perversely the day that my lord the king went out of Jerusalem, that the king should take it to his heart.

To impute is to reckon someone to be righteous or sinful, so that they are made innocent or guilty before men, not necessarily before God.

And God does not impute sin without it making us a sinner, but imputes righteousness with it making us righteous...

 

[ATG]

You are making an interesting argument, but as it stands you fail.

If you want to choose one point made, and show how it fails to properly argue the Scripture quoted, then I'd be glad to see it.

If you truly wish to make this argument, then you need to stress different passages

6 quoted Scriptures in the first argument should be sufficient.

and also, very likely, present a different concept of sin to enable your argument to make sense.

Show how I argue a different concept of sin from the Scriptures and argument given. Thanks.

I do show plainly by quoted prophecy of Scripture how the concept of God imputing Jesus with sin is wrong.

But, sin remains sinning against God. Jesus did not sin against God nor man, and so God cannot impute Him with sin.

But to change the concept of sin involves changing many other concepts also. It really would not be an easy or fast project.

The project begins with you showing how the argument changes the definition of sin. Sin is against God and man. Simple.

You can alsobegin the project of how any Scripture quoted is wrongly argued by me. It should be easy enough. Thanks.

Perhaops you're just projecting these things to me? As imputing me with a failed argument and changing definition of sin?

 

[rewriter]

If you want to choose one point made, and show how it fails to properly argue the Scripture quoted, then I'd be glad to see it.


6 quoted Scriptures in the first argument should be sufficient.



Show how I argue a different concept of sin from the Scriptures and argument given. Thanks.

I do show plainly by quoted prophecy of Scripture how the concept of God imputing Jesus with sin is wrong.

But, sin remains sinning against God. Jesus did not sin against God nor man, and so God cannot impute Him with sin.



The project begins with you showing how the argument changes the definition of sin. Sin is against God and man. Simple.

You can alsobegin the project of how any Scripture quoted is wrongly argued by me. It should be easy enough. Thanks.

Perhaops you're just projecting these things to me? As imputing me with a failed argument and changing definition of sin?

You have cited several scriptures, it is true, but have you reconciled them with what can be learned from Psalm 23? I highly doubt it as very few people have learned enough to recognize just how important that psalm is to theology.

Now making its importance clear to someone who does not see it takes a lot of time, not a single post here, nor even ten. Rather it requires unlearning a lot and then relearning from a different point of view. But you are correct that sin involves both God and other humans, but the question becomes, how does it involve them? Genesis gives hints but we humans tend to ignore them, just as we ignore the insights available form Psalm 23 and Romans 1:25. What these passages say is simply too upsetting for most people and thus avoided.