What if repentance is not about feeling guilty, regretful or ashamed? How do you define repentance?

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I'm very happy with "insights" as long as the are the "insights" of the Lord Jesus



I don't have my own dogma, instead I have access to the Mind of Christ - 1 Corinthians 2:16
Some people need to learn to die to self and abide in Christ and see things from His perspective
Why I chose to use the word insight is that i have been a bible student since I was 12 yrs old. My Sunday School bible study was far more rigorous that my grade school work. My dad never asked about school, but he called by Sunday School teacher at least monthly to determine if I was applying myself.

Obviously, I was raised in a bible believing and bible studying church. So as I look back over these last 68 yrs I continuously find new insights (understandings) that come from my continuing bible scholarship. I started off, like most, with dogmas my church held as a common set of beliefs both in the "formulas, "standards" and "beliefs" that are "inherent" and "self-evident" in the bible.

Over the course of a lifetime I have found many of those former dogmas wanting and inadequate to the deeper meaning of both the Hebrew Bible and the New Testament. The methaphor that drives my education is a voyage of discovery. It is the excitement of new insights that come as knowledge about the history, politics and societies of the New Testament narrative deepen my understanding of the background and to some degree context of the events of first century Christianity thought the last 2,000+ years of Christian history.

I have read and reread the Hebrew Bible and always found myself wrestling with the history and processes by which the books were written and the context that gives real meaning to the events after 800 BC. I spent 2.5 yrs researching and writing a essay for myself that attempts to capture a framework into which to set the Hebrew Bible. It has no exegesis. The major headings are Geopolitical Dynamics, Geography, Archeological Life Sciences, Historic and Geographic Ideology and Religious Practices.

I pass this along as a way of helping you understand that my entire life has been a quest to learn more i.e. insights.
 
When someone's "insights" are not what the Lord teaches in His Word it's not unfortunate to depart from said "insights"
In the end it's only the Lord's point of view that matters.



If a person truly repents and changes their mind which is changing their understanding from being carnally which is death (separation from God) minded to being spiritually minded (which is life and peace, Romans 8:6) then their behavior will change as a result.

But, the tares among us advocate for being able to be carnal minded, living in sinful behavior and they falsely claim they are still in right standing with the Lord when they do so.

1 John 3:8 - He that committeth sin is of the devil

1 John 3:7 - Little children, let no man deceive you: he that DOES righteousness is righteous, even as he is righteous.

James 1:22 - Be ye doers of the word, and not hearers only, deceiving your own selves

John 12:46 - I am come a light into the world, that whosoever believeth on me should not abide in darkness.

It's always sad to see people claiming that they are Christians as they actively advocate for sinful behavior, claiming that does not disqualify them from being accepted by the Lord.

2 Timothy 2:12
if we endure, we will also reign with Him. if we deny Him, He also will deny us

The change isn't just being spiritually minded, but believing on the Lord Jesus Christ. He then seals the believer through the Holy Spirit indwelling them.

From this point they will then be corrected, taught, empowered by the Holy Spirit and have a new nature, through the Holy Spirit, but still have human nature which is flawed.
 
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The change isn't just being spiritually minded, but believing on the Lord Jesus Christ. He then seals the believer through the Holy Spirit indwelling them.

Hello! Being spiritually minded is believing on the Lord and actually taking Him at His Word and walking in agreement with Him based on His Word. He's going to judge us based on what He has said in His Word. His Word is the standard and Jesus is the Word.


they will then be corrected, taught, empowered by the Holy Spirit

Not if they don't choose to submit themselves to the Lord they won't.

Unless people believe God goes around forcing people to live for Him and if a person doesn't live for the Lord it's God's fault since He failed to force them to repent live for Him (that's some reformed garbage that teaches this)

Romans 6:16 - Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?
 
The change isn't just being spiritually minded, but believing on the Lord Jesus Christ. He then seals the believer through the Holy Spirit indwelling them.

From this point they will then be corrected, taught, empowered by the Holy Spirit and have a new nature, through the Holy Spirit, but still have human nature which is flawed.

When someone's "insights" are not what the Lord teaches in His Word it's not unfortunate to depart from said "insights"
In the end it's only the Lord's point of view that matters.



If a person truly repents and changes their mind which is changing their understanding from being carnally which is death (separation from God) minded to being spiritually minded (which is life and peace, Romans 8:6) then their behavior will change as a result.

But, the tares among us advocate for being able to be carnal minded, living in sinful behavior and they falsely claim they are still in right standing with the Lord when they do so.

1 John 3:8 - He that committeth sin is of the devil

1 John 3:7 - Little children, let no man deceive you: he that DOES righteousness is righteous, even as he is righteous.

James 1:22 - Be ye doers of the word, and not hearers only, deceiving your own selves

John 12:46 - I am come a light into the world, that whosoever believeth on me should not abide in darkness.

It's always sad to see people claiming that they are Christians as they actively advocate for sinful behavior, claiming that does not disqualify them from being accepted by the Lord.

2 Timothy 2:12
if we endure, we will also reign with Him. if we deny Him, He also will deny us
ScooterJackson,
As you have been unwilling to share with us your thoughts on the many disputed issues, let me ask you what do you understand Jesus to be saying when He says "He that does righteous is righteous. I thought righteousness came with letting Jesus into your heart made one "righteous" with God. What do you consider doers of the word do?
 
Hello! Being spiritually minded is believing on the Lord and actually taking Him at His Word and walking in agreement with Him based on His Word. He's going to judge us based on what He has said in His Word. His Word is the standard and Jesus is the Word.




Not if they don't choose to submit themselves to the Lord they won't.

Unless people believe God goes around forcing people to live for Him and if a person doesn't live for the Lord it's God's fault since He failed to force them to repent live for Him (that's some reformed garbage that teaches this)

Romans 6:16 - Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?
Hello! Being spiritually minded is believing on the Lord and actually taking Him at His Word and walking in agreement with Him based on His Word. He's going to judge us based on what He has said in His Word. His Word is the standard and Jesus is the Word.




Not if they don't choose to submit themselves to the Lord they won't.

Unless people believe God goes around forcing people to live for Him and if a person doesn't live for the Lord it's God's fault since He failed to force them to repent live for Him (that's some reformed garbage that teaches this)

Romans 6:16 - Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?
Wattie:
So if a person sincerely "lets Jesus into his/her heart" they are saved.....except, like most they continue as before serving themselves, their families, their schools ect. What "obedience" are they lacking.

Here are Jesus Commandments (also see Matthew 25)
Let Your Light Shine
“Let your light so shine before men, that they may see your good works, and glorify your Father which is in heaven” (Matthew 5:16).
Be Reconciled
“Therefore, if you are offering your gift at the altar and there remember that your brother or sister has something against you, leave your gift there in front of the altar. First go and be reconciled to them; then come and offer your gift. (Matthew 5:23–25).
Do Not Lust
“You have heard that it was said, ‘You shall not commit adultery.’ But I tell you that anyone who looks at a woman lustfully has already committed adultery with her in his heart. If your right eye causes you to stumble, gouge it out and throw it away. It is better for you to lose one part of your body than for your whole body to be thrown into hell. And if your right hand causes you to stumble, cut it off and throw it away. It is better for you to lose one part of your body than for your whole body to go into hell. (Matthew 5:28–30).
Be a Giver
“You have heard that it was said, ‘Eye for eye, and tooth for tooth.’ But I tell you, do not resist an evil person. If anyone slaps you on the right cheek, turn to them the other cheek also. And if anyone wants to sue you and take your shirt, hand over your coat as well. If anyone forces you to go one mile, go with them two miles. Give to the one who asks you, and do not turn away from the one who wants to borrow from you. (Matthew 5:38–42).
Love Your Enemies
“You have heard that it was said, ‘Love your neighbor i and hate your enemy.’ But I tell you, love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you, that you may be children of your Father in heaven. He causes his sun to rise on the evil and the good, and sends rain on the righteous and the unrighteous. If you love those who love you, what reward will you get? Are not even the tax collectors doing that? And if you greet only your own people, what are you doing more than others? Do not even pagans do that? Be perfect, therefore, as your heavenly Father is perfect.” (Matthew 5:44–46).
Give to the Needy
“Be careful not to practice your righteousness in front of others to be seen by them. If you do, you will have no reward from your Father in heaven. So, when you give to the needy, do not announce it with trumpets, as the hypocrites do in the synagogues and on the streets, to be honored by others. Truly I tell you, they have received their reward in full. But when you give to the needy, do not let your left hand know what your right hand is doing, so that your giving may be in secret. Then your Father, who sees what is done in secret, will reward you. Matthew 6:1–18).
Seek God’s Kingdom
“Seek ye first the kingdom of God, and his righteousness; and all these things shall be added unto you” (Matthew 6:33).
Don’t Judge Others
“Do not judge, or you too will be judged. For in the same way you judge others, you will be judged, and with the measure you use, it will be measured to you. “Why do you look at the speck of sawdust in your brother’s eye and pay no attention to the plank in your own eye? How can you say to your brother, ‘Let me take the speck out of your eye,’ when all the time there is a plank in your own eye? You hypocrite, first take the plank out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to remove the speck from your brother’s eye. (Matthew 7:1–3).
Ask, Seek, Knock
“Ask and it will be given to you; seek and you will find; knock and the door will be opened to you. For everyone who asks receives; the one who seeks finds; and to the one who knocks, the door will be opened. (Matthew 7:7–8).
Do Unto Others
“Therefore, all things whatsoever ye would that men should do to you, do ye even so to them: for this is the law and the prophets” (Matthew 7:12).
Take My Yoke
“Come to me, all you who are weary and burdened, and I will give you rest. Take my yoke upon you and learn from me, for I am gentle and humble in heart, and you will find rest for your souls. For my yoke is easy and my burden is light.” (Matthew 11:28–30).
Honor Your Parents
“For God commanded, saying, Honor thy father and mother: and, he that curses father or mother, let him die the death” (Matthew 15:4).
Deny Yourself
“If any man will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross daily, and follow me. For whoever will save his life shall lose it: but whoever will lose his life for my sake, the same shall save it. For what good is it for a man, if he gain the whole world, and lose himself, or be cast away?” (Luke 9:23–25).
Go to Offenders
“If your brother or sister sins, go and point out their fault, just between the two of you. If they listen to you, you have won them over. But if they will not listen, take one or two others along, so that ‘every matter may be established by the testimony of two or three witnesses.’ If they still refuse to listen, tell it to the church; and if they refuse to listen even to the church, treat them as you would a pagan or a tax collector. (Matthew 18:15–17).
Forgive Offenders
“Then came Peter to him, and said, Lord, how oft shall my brother sin against me, and I forgive him? till seven times? Jesus saith unto him, I say not unto thee, Until seven times: but, Until seventy times seven” (Matthew 18:21–22).
Honor Marriage
“And he answered and said unto them, Have you not read, that he which made them at the beginning made them male and female, and said, For this cause shall a man leave father and mother, and shall cleave to his wife: and the two shall be one flesh? Wherefore they are no more two, but one flesh. What therefore God has joined together, let no man put asunder” (Matthew 19:4–6).
Be a Servant
“. . . Whosoever will be great among you, let him be your minister; and whosoever will be chief among you, let him be your servant: even as the Son of man came not to be ministered unto, but to minister, and to give his life a ransom for many” (Matthew 20:26–28).
Bring In the Poor
Then Jesus said to his host, “When you give a luncheon or dinner, do not invite your friends, your brothers or sisters, your relatives, or your rich neighbors; if you do, they may invite you back and so you will be repaid. But when you give a banquet, invite the poor, the crippled, the lame, the blind, and you will be blessed. Although they cannot repay you, you will be repaid at the resurrection of the righteous.” (Luke 14:12–14).
Love the Lord
“Jesus said unto him, You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, and with all your soul, and with all you mind. This is the first and great commandment” (Matthew 22:37–38).
Love Your Neighbor
“And the second [commandment] is like it, You shall love your neighbor as yourself. On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets” (Matthew 22:39–40).
Be Born Again
“Very truly I tell you, no one can see the kingdom of God unless they are born again. (John 3:5–7).
Keep My Commandments
“If ye love me, keep my commandments” (John 14:15)
Baptize My Disciples
“Go therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost” (Matthew 28:19).
Make Disciples
“Go therefore, and teach all nations . . . teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you always, even unto the end of the world. Amen” (Matthew 28:19–20).
 
What do you consider doers of the word do?

For starters, chew on these a while:

1 John 1:7 - But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin.

Romans 8:13 - For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live

2 Timothy 2:19 - Let everyone that nameth the name of Christ depart from iniquity

1 John 1:6 - If we say that we have fellowship with him, and walk in darkness, we lie, and do not the truth

James 1:22 - But be ye doers of the word, and not hearers only, deceiving your own selves.

John 14:23 - Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him.
 
For starters, chew on these a while:

1 John 1:7 - But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin.

Romans 8:13 - For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live

2 Timothy 2:19 - Let everyone that nameth the name of Christ depart from iniquity

1 John 1:6 - If we say that we have fellowship with him, and walk in darkness, we lie, and do not the truth

James 1:22 - But be ye doers of the word, and not hearers only, deceiving your own selves.

John 14:23 - Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him.
So the answer to the question i asked of what does a doer do and your answer is is "doers do."???
 
So the answer to the question i asked of what does a doer do and your answer is is "doers do."???

My answer is to actually submit yourself to the Lord and walk in agreement with Him.

If someone is not doing the Word of the Lord, they are by default doing the lies of the devil.

Choose wisely instead of ignoring what God says in His Word.
 
Wattie:
So if a person sincerely "lets Jesus into his/her heart" they are saved.....except, like most they continue as before serving themselves, their families, their schools ect. What "obedience" are they lacking.

Here are Jesus Commandments (also see Matthew 25)
Let Your Light Shine
“Let your light so shine before men, that they may see your good works, and glorify your Father which is in heaven” (Matthew 5:16).
Be Reconciled
“Therefore, if you are offering your gift at the altar and there remember that your brother or sister has something against you, leave your gift there in front of the altar. First go and be reconciled to them; then come and offer your gift. (Matthew 5:23–25).
Do Not Lust
“You have heard that it was said, ‘You shall not commit adultery.’ But I tell you that anyone who looks at a woman lustfully has already committed adultery with her in his heart. If your right eye causes you to stumble, gouge it out and throw it away. It is better for you to lose one part of your body than for your whole body to be thrown into hell. And if your right hand causes you to stumble, cut it off and throw it away. It is better for you to lose one part of your body than for your whole body to go into hell. (Matthew 5:28–30).
Be a Giver
“You have heard that it was said, ‘Eye for eye, and tooth for tooth.’ But I tell you, do not resist an evil person. If anyone slaps you on the right cheek, turn to them the other cheek also. And if anyone wants to sue you and take your shirt, hand over your coat as well. If anyone forces you to go one mile, go with them two miles. Give to the one who asks you, and do not turn away from the one who wants to borrow from you. (Matthew 5:38–42).
Love Your Enemies
“You have heard that it was said, ‘Love your neighbor i and hate your enemy.’ But I tell you, love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you, that you may be children of your Father in heaven. He causes his sun to rise on the evil and the good, and sends rain on the righteous and the unrighteous. If you love those who love you, what reward will you get? Are not even the tax collectors doing that? And if you greet only your own people, what are you doing more than others? Do not even pagans do that? Be perfect, therefore, as your heavenly Father is perfect.” (Matthew 5:44–46).
Give to the Needy
“Be careful not to practice your righteousness in front of others to be seen by them. If you do, you will have no reward from your Father in heaven. So, when you give to the needy, do not announce it with trumpets, as the hypocrites do in the synagogues and on the streets, to be honored by others. Truly I tell you, they have received their reward in full. But when you give to the needy, do not let your left hand know what your right hand is doing, so that your giving may be in secret. Then your Father, who sees what is done in secret, will reward you. Matthew 6:1–18).
Seek God’s Kingdom
“Seek ye first the kingdom of God, and his righteousness; and all these things shall be added unto you” (Matthew 6:33).
Don’t Judge Others
“Do not judge, or you too will be judged. For in the same way you judge others, you will be judged, and with the measure you use, it will be measured to you. “Why do you look at the speck of sawdust in your brother’s eye and pay no attention to the plank in your own eye? How can you say to your brother, ‘Let me take the speck out of your eye,’ when all the time there is a plank in your own eye? You hypocrite, first take the plank out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to remove the speck from your brother’s eye. (Matthew 7:1–3).
Ask, Seek, Knock
“Ask and it will be given to you; seek and you will find; knock and the door will be opened to you. For everyone who asks receives; the one who seeks finds; and to the one who knocks, the door will be opened. (Matthew 7:7–8).
Do Unto Others
“Therefore, all things whatsoever ye would that men should do to you, do ye even so to them: for this is the law and the prophets” (Matthew 7:12).
Take My Yoke
“Come to me, all you who are weary and burdened, and I will give you rest. Take my yoke upon you and learn from me, for I am gentle and humble in heart, and you will find rest for your souls. For my yoke is easy and my burden is light.” (Matthew 11:28–30).
Honor Your Parents
“For God commanded, saying, Honor thy father and mother: and, he that curses father or mother, let him die the death” (Matthew 15:4).
Deny Yourself
“If any man will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross daily, and follow me. For whoever will save his life shall lose it: but whoever will lose his life for my sake, the same shall save it. For what good is it for a man, if he gain the whole world, and lose himself, or be cast away?” (Luke 9:23–25).
Go to Offenders
“If your brother or sister sins, go and point out their fault, just between the two of you. If they listen to you, you have won them over. But if they will not listen, take one or two others along, so that ‘every matter may be established by the testimony of two or three witnesses.’ If they still refuse to listen, tell it to the church; and if they refuse to listen even to the church, treat them as you would a pagan or a tax collector. (Matthew 18:15–17).
Forgive Offenders
“Then came Peter to him, and said, Lord, how oft shall my brother sin against me, and I forgive him? till seven times? Jesus saith unto him, I say not unto thee, Until seven times: but, Until seventy times seven” (Matthew 18:21–22).
Honor Marriage
“And he answered and said unto them, Have you not read, that he which made them at the beginning made them male and female, and said, For this cause shall a man leave father and mother, and shall cleave to his wife: and the two shall be one flesh? Wherefore they are no more two, but one flesh. What therefore God has joined together, let no man put asunder” (Matthew 19:4–6).
Be a Servant
“. . . Whosoever will be great among you, let him be your minister; and whosoever will be chief among you, let him be your servant: even as the Son of man came not to be ministered unto, but to minister, and to give his life a ransom for many” (Matthew 20:26–28).
Bring In the Poor
Then Jesus said to his host, “When you give a luncheon or dinner, do not invite your friends, your brothers or sisters, your relatives, or your rich neighbors; if you do, they may invite you back and so you will be repaid. But when you give a banquet, invite the poor, the crippled, the lame, the blind, and you will be blessed. Although they cannot repay you, you will be repaid at the resurrection of the righteous.” (Luke 14:12–14).
Love the Lord
“Jesus said unto him, You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, and with all your soul, and with all you mind. This is the first and great commandment” (Matthew 22:37–38).
Love Your Neighbor
“And the second [commandment] is like it, You shall love your neighbor as yourself. On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets” (Matthew 22:39–40).
Be Born Again
“Very truly I tell you, no one can see the kingdom of God unless they are born again. (John 3:5–7).
Keep My Commandments
“If ye love me, keep my commandments” (John 14:15)
Baptize My Disciples
“Go therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost” (Matthew 28:19).
Make Disciples
“Go therefore, and teach all nations . . . teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you always, even unto the end of the world. Amen” (Matthew 28:19–20).
Walking after Jesus following salvation is sanctification, but it isn't justification. Justification occurs regardless of our good works, as a free gift, through the washing and regeneration of the Holy Spirit. Justification isn't sanctification..different things.
 
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Walking after Jesus following salvation is sanctification, but it isn't justification. Justification occurs regardless of our good works, as a free gift, through the washing and regeneration of the Holy Spirit. Justification isn't sanctification..different things.

But, our carnal works / walking after the flesh will disqualify is from salvation as this would be being a worker of iniquity

John 8:34,35 - Jesus answered them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Whosoever committeth sin is the servant of sin.
And the servant abideth not in the house for ever: but the Son abideth ever.

Matthew 13:41,42 - The Son of man shall send forth his angels, and they shall gather out of his kingdom all things that offend, and them which do iniquity; And shall cast them into a furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth.

John 15:1-2 - I am the true vine, and my Father is the husbandman. Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away: and every branch that beareth fruit, he purgeth it, that it may bring forth more fruit

Those that disagree are rejecting the Lord Jesus by rejecting what He says in favor of following philosophy, vain deceit, the traditions of men, and the rudiments of the world rather than following the Lord Jesus.

In other words all they got is dead dried up man made religion.
 
Walking after Jesus following salvation is sanctification, but it isn't justification. Justification occurs regardless of our good works, as a free gift, through the washing and regeneration of the Holy Spirit. Justification isn't sanctification..different things.
So your insight is the dogmas of Martin Luter is the "truth." My challenge is this: Jesus said "He that endures to the end will be saved, and in support of 1518 Luter - who later changed his name to Luther - you buy lock and barrel his justification/sanctification dogma.

Far be it from me to disagree with sacred Luther.....but lets look at Matthew 25 and explain to me how one "is Justified" without ever being Sanctified. Let's start with Paul who tells us that you may have "faith" to move mountain but do not have love you are just making noise to God and in Galatians 5 describes the fruits of the Spirit. Although Luther was all about conversion of life, his modern day followers, wanting instant salvation, put instant salvation waaay ahead of what they claim is "justification"... Fortunately, Luther did not die on the cross for our sins.

So, in your ancient model, where is someone who is "justified" who has no love, exhibits no "fruits of the Spirit" and could not be picked out of a crowd of heathens by their live style and priorities and commitments? Are you and Luther suggestion that "Justification" without "Sanctification" is exactly the same as "once saved always saved" without any Justification? If not, then isn't Justification the real source salvation validation? Everyone can claim salvation without justification because Luther et. al. said if you are justified then you will experience life long devince sanctification and if you don't, you were never sanctified in the first place. Circular logic where you have zero assurance of salvation until you live out a set-apart holy life in justification. By inference, if you claim salvation without justification you are deluding yourself.

Matthew 7: 21 "Not everyone who says to me, 'Lord, Lord,' will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. (Justification before sanctification) 22 Many will say to me on that day, 'Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name and in your name drive out demons and in your name perform many miracles?'23 Then I will tell them plainly, 'I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!'" Obedience in life trumps any claim of salvation you might make. Essentially you are judged by what you do (justification) and not only by what you claim to "believe." (sanctification) Even Luther was adamant that truely converted Christ followers will live lives bearing much fruit, if not, they deceived themselves.

So, what are the components of "justification?"
Love God and love your neighbor as yourself - and in the story of the Good Samaritan - your neighbor is anyone you can physically and financially help.
“And he saith unto them, Follow me, and I will make you fishers of men” (Matthew 4:19).
Rejoice
“Blessed are you when people insult you, persecute you and falsely say all kinds of evil against you because of me. 12Rejoice and be glad, because great is your reward in heaven, for in the same way they persecuted the prophets who were before you. (Matthew 5:11–12).
Let Your Light Shine
“Let your light so shine before men, that they may see your good works, and glorify your Father which is in heaven” (Matthew 5:16).
Be Reconciled
“Therefore, if you are offering your gift at the altar and there remember that your brother or sister has something against you, leave your gift there in front of the altar. First go and be reconciled to them; then come and offer your gift. (Matthew 5:23–25).
Do Not Lust
“You have heard that it was said, ‘You shall not commit adultery.’ But I tell you that anyone who looks at a woman lustfully has already committed adultery with her in his heart.
Be a Giver
“You have heard that it was said, ‘Eye for eye, and tooth for tooth.’ But I tell you, do not resist an evil person. If anyone slaps you on the right cheek, turn to them the other cheek also. And if anyone wants to sue you and take your shirt, hand over your coat as well. If anyone forces you to go one mile, go with them two miles. Give to the one who asks you, and do not turn away from the one who wants to borrow from you. (Matthew 5:38–42).
Love Your Enemies
“You have heard that it was said, ‘Love your neighbor i and hate your enemy.’ But I tell you, love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you, that you may be children of your Father in heaven. He causes his sun to rise on the evil and the good, and sends rain on the righteous and the unrighteous. If you love those who love you, what reward will you get? Are not even the tax collectors doing that? And if you greet only your own people, what are you doing more than others? Do not even pagans do that? Be perfect, therefore, as your heavenly Father is perfect.” (Matthew 5:44–46).
Give to the Needy
“Be careful not to practice your righteousness in front of others to be seen by them. If you do, you will have no reward from your Father in heaven. So, when you give to the needy, do not announce it with trumpets, as the hypocrites do in the synagogues and on the streets, to be honored by others. Truly I tell you, they have received their reward in full. But when you give to the needy, do not let your left hand know what your right hand is doing, so that your giving may be in secret. Then your Father, who sees what is done in secret, will reward you. Matthew 6:1–18).
Don’t Judge Others
“Do not judge, or you too will be judged. For in the same way you judge others, you will be judged, and with the measure you use, it will be measured to you. “Why do you look at the speck of sawdust in your brother’s eye and pay no attention to the plank in your own eye? How can you say to your brother, ‘Let me take the speck out of your eye,’ when all the time there is a plank in your own eye? You hypocrite, first take the plank out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to remove the speck from your brother’s eye. (Matthew 7:1–3).
Ask, Seek, Knock
“Ask and it will be given to you; seek and you will find; knock and the door will be opened to you. For everyone who asks receives; the one who seeks finds; and to the one who knocks, the door will be opened. (Matthew 7:7–8).
Do Unto Others
“Therefore, all things whatsoever ye would that men should do to you, do ye even so to them: for this is the law and the prophets” (Matthew 7:12).
Take My Yoke
“Come to me, all you who are weary and burdened, and I will give you rest. Take my yoke upon you and learn from me, for I am gentle and humble in heart, and you will find rest for your souls. For my yoke is easy and my burden is light.” (Matthew 11:28–30).
Deny Yourself
“If any man will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross daily, and follow me. For whoever will save his life shall lose it: but whoever will lose his life for my sake, the same shall save it. For what good is it for a man, if he gain the whole world, and lose himself, or be cast away?” (Luke 9:23–25).
Go to Offenders
“If your brother or sister sins, go and point out their fault, just between the two of you. If they listen to you, you have won them over. But if they will not listen, take one or two others along, so that ‘every matter may be established by the testimony of two or three witnesses.’ If they still refuse to listen, tell it to the church; and if they refuse to listen even to the church, treat them as you would a pagan or a tax collector. (Matthew 18:15–17).
Forgive Offenders
“Then came Peter to him, and said, Lord, how oft shall my brother sin against me, and I forgive him? till seven times? Jesus saith unto him, I say not unto thee, Until seven times: but, Until seventy times seven” (Matthew 18:21–22).
Humility
“. . . Whosoever will be great among you, let him be your minister; and whosoever will be chief among you, let him be your servant: even as the Son of man came not to be ministered unto, but to minister, and to give his life a ransom for many” (Matthew 20:26–28).
Bring In the Poor
Then Jesus said to his host, “When you give a luncheon or dinner, do not invite your friends, your brothers or sisters, your relatives, or your rich neighbors; if you do, they may invite you back and so you will be repaid. But when you give a banquet, invite the poor, the crippled, the lame, the blind, and you will be blessed. Although they cannot repay you, you will be repaid at the resurrection of the righteous.” (Luke 14:12–14).
Love Your Neighbor
“And the second [commandment] is like it, You shall love your neighbor as yourself. On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets” (Matthew 22:39–40).
Be Born Again
“Very truly I tell you, no one can see the kingdom of God unless they are born again. (John 3:5–7).
Keep My Commandments
“If ye love me, keep my commandments” (John 14:15)
Baptize My Disciples
“Go therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost” (Matthew 28:19).
Make Disciples
“Go therefore, and teach all nations . . . teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you always, even unto the end of the world. Amen” (Matthew 28:19–20).
 
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So your insight is the dogmas of Martin Luter is the "truth." My challenge is this: Jesus said "He that endures to the end will be saved, and in support of 1518 Luter - who later changed his name to Luther - you buy lock and barrel his justification/sanctification dogma.

Far be it from me to disagree with sacred Luther.....but lets look at Matthew 25 and explain to me how one "is Justified" without ever being Sanctified. Let's start with Paul who tells us that you may have "faith" to move mountain but do not have love you are just making noise to God and in Galatians 5 describes the fruits of the Spirit. Although Luther was all about conversion of life, his modern day followers, wanting instant salvation, put instant salvation waaay ahead of what they claim is "justification"... Fortunately, Luther did not die on the cross for our sins.

So, in your ancient model, where is someone who is "justified" who has no love, exhibits no "fruits of the Spirit" and could not be picked out of a crowd of heathens by their live style and priorities and commitments? Are you and Luther suggestion that "Justification" without "Sanctification" is exactly the same as "once saved always saved" without any Justification? If not, then isn't Justification the real source salvation validation? Everyone can claim salvation without justification because Luther et. al. said if you are justified then you will experience life long devince sanctification and if you don't, you were never sanctified in the first place. Circular logic where you have zero assurance of salvation until you live out a set-apart holy life in justification. By inference, if you claim salvation without justification you are deluding yourself.

Matthew 7: 21 "Not everyone who says to me, 'Lord, Lord,' will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. (Justification before sanctification) 22 Many will say to me on that day, 'Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name and in your name drive out demons and in your name perform many miracles?'23 Then I will tell them plainly, 'I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!'" Obedience in life trumps any claim of salvation you might make. Essentially you are judged by what you do (justification) and not only by what you claim to "believe." (sanctification) Even Luther was adamant that truely converted Christ followers will live lives bearing much fruit, if not, they deceived themselves.

So, what are the components of "justification?"
Love God and love your neighbor as yourself - and in the story of the Good Samaritan - your neighbor is anyone you can physically and financially help.
“And he saith unto them, Follow me, and I will make you fishers of men” (Matthew 4:19).
Rejoice
“Blessed are you when people insult you, persecute you and falsely say all kinds of evil against you because of me. 12Rejoice and be glad, because great is your reward in heaven, for in the same way they persecuted the prophets who were before you. (Matthew 5:11–12).
Let Your Light Shine
“Let your light so shine before men, that they may see your good works, and glorify your Father which is in heaven” (Matthew 5:16).
Be Reconciled
“Therefore, if you are offering your gift at the altar and there remember that your brother or sister has something against you, leave your gift there in front of the altar. First go and be reconciled to them; then come and offer your gift. (Matthew 5:23–25).
Do Not Lust
“You have heard that it was said, ‘You shall not commit adultery.’ But I tell you that anyone who looks at a woman lustfully has already committed adultery with her in his heart.
Be a Giver
“You have heard that it was said, ‘Eye for eye, and tooth for tooth.’ But I tell you, do not resist an evil person. If anyone slaps you on the right cheek, turn to them the other cheek also. And if anyone wants to sue you and take your shirt, hand over your coat as well. If anyone forces you to go one mile, go with them two miles. Give to the one who asks you, and do not turn away from the one who wants to borrow from you. (Matthew 5:38–42).
Love Your Enemies
“You have heard that it was said, ‘Love your neighbor i and hate your enemy.’ But I tell you, love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you, that you may be children of your Father in heaven. He causes his sun to rise on the evil and the good, and sends rain on the righteous and the unrighteous. If you love those who love you, what reward will you get? Are not even the tax collectors doing that? And if you greet only your own people, what are you doing more than others? Do not even pagans do that? Be perfect, therefore, as your heavenly Father is perfect.” (Matthew 5:44–46).
Give to the Needy
“Be careful not to practice your righteousness in front of others to be seen by them. If you do, you will have no reward from your Father in heaven. So, when you give to the needy, do not announce it with trumpets, as the hypocrites do in the synagogues and on the streets, to be honored by others. Truly I tell you, they have received their reward in full. But when you give to the needy, do not let your left hand know what your right hand is doing, so that your giving may be in secret. Then your Father, who sees what is done in secret, will reward you. Matthew 6:1–18).
Don’t Judge Others
“Do not judge, or you too will be judged. For in the same way you judge others, you will be judged, and with the measure you use, it will be measured to you. “Why do you look at the speck of sawdust in your brother’s eye and pay no attention to the plank in your own eye? How can you say to your brother, ‘Let me take the speck out of your eye,’ when all the time there is a plank in your own eye? You hypocrite, first take the plank out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to remove the speck from your brother’s eye. (Matthew 7:1–3).
Ask, Seek, Knock
“Ask and it will be given to you; seek and you will find; knock and the door will be opened to you. For everyone who asks receives; the one who seeks finds; and to the one who knocks, the door will be opened. (Matthew 7:7–8).
Do Unto Others
“Therefore, all things whatsoever ye would that men should do to you, do ye even so to them: for this is the law and the prophets” (Matthew 7:12).
Take My Yoke
“Come to me, all you who are weary and burdened, and I will give you rest. Take my yoke upon you and learn from me, for I am gentle and humble in heart, and you will find rest for your souls. For my yoke is easy and my burden is light.” (Matthew 11:28–30).
Deny Yourself
“If any man will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross daily, and follow me. For whoever will save his life shall lose it: but whoever will lose his life for my sake, the same shall save it. For what good is it for a man, if he gain the whole world, and lose himself, or be cast away?” (Luke 9:23–25).
Go to Offenders
“If your brother or sister sins, go and point out their fault, just between the two of you. If they listen to you, you have won them over. But if they will not listen, take one or two others along, so that ‘every matter may be established by the testimony of two or three witnesses.’ If they still refuse to listen, tell it to the church; and if they refuse to listen even to the church, treat them as you would a pagan or a tax collector. (Matthew 18:15–17).
Forgive Offenders
“Then came Peter to him, and said, Lord, how oft shall my brother sin against me, and I forgive him? till seven times? Jesus saith unto him, I say not unto thee, Until seven times: but, Until seventy times seven” (Matthew 18:21–22).
Humility
“. . . Whosoever will be great among you, let him be your minister; and whosoever will be chief among you, let him be your servant: even as the Son of man came not to be ministered unto, but to minister, and to give his life a ransom for many” (Matthew 20:26–28).
Bring In the Poor
Then Jesus said to his host, “When you give a luncheon or dinner, do not invite your friends, your brothers or sisters, your relatives, or your rich neighbors; if you do, they may invite you back and so you will be repaid. But when you give a banquet, invite the poor, the crippled, the lame, the blind, and you will be blessed. Although they cannot repay you, you will be repaid at the resurrection of the righteous.” (Luke 14:12–14).
Love Your Neighbor
“And the second [commandment] is like it, You shall love your neighbor as yourself. On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets” (Matthew 22:39–40).
Be Born Again
“Very truly I tell you, no one can see the kingdom of God unless they are born again. (John 3:5–7).
Keep My Commandments
“If ye love me, keep my commandments” (John 14:15)
Baptize My Disciples
“Go therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost” (Matthew 28:19).
Make Disciples
“Go therefore, and teach all nations . . . teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you always, even unto the end of the world. Amen” (Matthew 28:19–20).
I didn't say they wont exhibit fruit from being saved. Galatians fruit shows this. And i haven't read any of martin luther
 
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I didn't say they wont exhibit fruit from being saved. Galatians fruit shows this. And i haven't read any of martin luther
wattie, that is the problem. Ancient 16th century - 20th century theologists detailed their conceptualizations of a theology as opposed to Catholicism and Eastern Orthodoxy. Little do most know that their words are now our words. Their theology is now our theology. We are told "it comes directly from the bible" but they established all the filters, all the "must believes" all the linking theological proof texts.

Many are exposed to bible study in secret alignment with these ancient thinkers who were never planning a new Christian religion only a modification of Catholic dogma. Their banner of "sola scriptura (only the scriptures you can read for yourself) Sola Fide (salvation by faith alone) Sola Gratia (grace alone). Solus Christus (Christ alone). Soli Deo Gloria (Glory to God Alone).

The 16th Century lived in full confidence that anyone could read the Bible and come to the exact same faith and agreement.

Today, worldwide, there are approx 450,000 different versions of Christianity all claiming "just read the bible and you will agree with us with the unstated provision, that you must understand what you read has to be exactly what we "believe" to be the "truth." Thus the Christian world is full of people who value the "truth" of the bible not realizing their "truth" has been filtered through 500 yrs of text filters, explanations, proof texts and "must believes."
 
wattie, that is the problem. Ancient 16th century - 20th century theologists detailed their conceptualizations of a theology as opposed to Catholicism and Eastern Orthodoxy. Little do most know that their words are now our words. Their theology is now our theology. We are told "it comes directly from the bible" but they established all the filters, all the "must believes" all the linking theological proof texts.

Many are exposed to bible study in secret alignment with these ancient thinkers who were never planning a new Christian religion only a modification of Catholic dogma. Their banner of "sola scriptura (only the scriptures you can read for yourself) Sola Fide (salvation by faith alone) Sola Gratia (grace alone). Solus Christus (Christ alone). Soli Deo Gloria (Glory to God Alone).

The 16th Century lived in full confidence that anyone could read the Bible and come to the exact same faith and agreement.

Today, worldwide, there are approx 450,000 different versions of Christianity all claiming "just read the bible and you will agree with us with the unstated provision, that you must understand what you read has to be exactly what we "believe" to be the "truth." Thus the Christian world is full of people who value the "truth" of the bible not realizing their "truth" has been filtered through 500 yrs of text filters, explanations, proof texts and "must believes."

Justification: Romans 5:8, John 3:16, 3:36, 5:24, 6:40 etc etc

Sanctification.. James 2, Hebrews hall of fame of faith.. etc etc..

Eternal life is given at salvation..eternal life..not temporary.

The right response then..as per Romans 6 etc.. is to serve Jesus back.
 
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Say thank you Martin. Proof texts are part of the ancient package. "he who endures to the end will be saved" Said Jesus in Matthew 24:13 seems to say the opposite of immediate eternal salvation based on your new way of thinking i.e. theoretical "faith." "Yeah I believe in God's ability and willingness to save me." All I have to is pray a special prayer and heaven is immediately guaranteed. I'm in for the cheap cost. If cost me nothing to get a guarantee of heaven while I get to live my life just like before, but now I have a guarantee of heaven.

On the other hand, we have to face Jesús's longest conversation after the sermon on the mount, Matthew 25 defines how we will be judged. By our claims of faith? By our Justification? By our anemic Sanctification?

How do you incorporate this long dissertation by Jesus on the criteria by which we will all be judged?

31 “When the Son of Man comes in his glory, and all the angels with him, he will sit on his glorious throne. 32 All the nations will be gathered before him, and he will separate the people one from another as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats. 33 He will put the sheep on his right and the goats on his left. 34 “Then the King will say to those on his right, ‘Come, you who are blessed by my Father; take your inheritance, the kingdom prepared for you since the creation of the world. 35 For I was hungry and you gave me something to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me something to drink, I was a stranger and you invited me in, 36 I needed clothes and you clothed me, I was sick and you looked after me, I was in prison and you came to visit me.’ 37 “Then the righteous will answer him, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry and feed you, or thirsty and give you something to drink? 38 When did we see you a stranger and invite you in, or needing clothes and clothe you? 39 When did we see you sick or in prison and go to visit you?’ 40 “The King will reply, ‘Truly I tell you, whatever you did for one of the least of these brothers and sisters of mine, you did for me.’ 41 “Then he will say to those on his left, ‘Depart from me, you who are cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels. 42 For I was hungry and you gave me nothing to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me nothing to drink, 43 I was a stranger and you did not invite me in, I needed clothes and you did not clothe me, I was sick and in prison and you did not look after me.’ 44 “They also will answer, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry or thirsty or a stranger or needing clothes or sick or in prison, and did not help you?’ 45 “He will reply, ‘Truly I tell you, whatever you did not do for one of the least of these, you did not do for me.’ 46 “Then they will go away to eternal punishment, but the righteous to eternal life.”
 
You are the one claiming we should all be following some man as being our teacher.

Not following.
But ... Learning from what God gives his chosen man to teach.

OK then.... Should be simple enough.

What does your Holy Spirit anointing show you concerning the following to mean?


For the grace of God has appeared that offers salvation to all people.
It teaches us to say “No” to ungodliness and worldly passions, and to
live self-controlled, upright and godly lives in this present age.

Titus 2:11-12
 
Say thank you Martin. Proof texts are part of the ancient package. "he who endures to the end will be saved" Said Jesus in Matthew 24:13 seems to say the opposite of immediate eternal salvation based on your new way of thinking i.e. theoretical "faith." "Yeah I believe in God's ability and willingness to save me." All I have to is pray a special prayer and heaven is immediately guaranteed. I'm in for the cheap cost. If cost me nothing to get a guarantee of heaven while I get to live my life just like before, but now I have a guarantee of heaven.

On the other hand, we have to face Jesús's longest conversation after the sermon on the mount, Matthew 25 defines how we will be judged. By our claims of faith? By our Justification? By our anemic Sanctification?

How do you incorporate this long dissertation by Jesus on the criteria by which we will all be judged?

31 “When the Son of Man comes in his glory, and all the angels with him, he will sit on his glorious throne. 32 All the nations will be gathered before him, and he will separate the people one from another as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats. 33 He will put the sheep on his right and the goats on his left. 34 “Then the King will say to those on his right, ‘Come, you who are blessed by my Father; take your inheritance, the kingdom prepared for you since the creation of the world. 35 For I was hungry and you gave me something to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me something to drink, I was a stranger and you invited me in, 36 I needed clothes and you clothed me, I was sick and you looked after me, I was in prison and you came to visit me.’ 37 “Then the righteous will answer him, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry and feed you, or thirsty and give you something to drink? 38 When did we see you a stranger and invite you in, or needing clothes and clothe you? 39 When did we see you sick or in prison and go to visit you?’ 40 “The King will reply, ‘Truly I tell you, whatever you did for one of the least of these brothers and sisters of mine, you did for me.’ 41 “Then he will say to those on his left, ‘Depart from me, you who are cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels. 42 For I was hungry and you gave me nothing to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me nothing to drink, 43 I was a stranger and you did not invite me in, I needed clothes and you did not clothe me, I was sick and in prison and you did not look after me.’ 44 “They also will answer, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry or thirsty or a stranger or needing clothes or sick or in prison, and did not help you?’ 45 “He will reply, ‘Truly I tell you, whatever you did not do for one of the least of these, you did not do for me.’ 46 “Then they will go away to eternal punishment, but the righteous to eternal life.”
Mathew 24 He who endures to the end will be saved has context of being saved from trials and tribulations. It is a different kind of 'saved' to eternal salvation.

Christians also do get their works judged by God, but that isn't about eternal life , but temporal judgment on earth.

For eg..Matthew 18 process of discipline.