Obedience REQUIRED
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human beings were never perfect nor will we be ever perfect. no person in history has ever always obeyed God. if we all became unsaved because we didn't obey God, no one would be in heaven! "eternal salvation"! what does that mean? it means FOREVER! look at John 10:28! God teaches us 3 times that we have eternal life: "& I give unto them ETERNAL LIFE, & they shall NEVER PERISH, NEITHER SHALL ANY MAN PLUCK THEM OUT OF MY HAND"!!! God tells us 3 times in 1 verse that we have eternal life we are born again. 1st John 5:10 is the top verse of all: "these things have we written unto you that BELIEVE ON THE NAME OF THE SON OF GOD, THAT YOU MAY KNOW YOU HAVE ETERNAL LIFE & that you may believe on the name of the Son of God"!!!!
Well the reformers are teaching a different gospel and a different jesus than the One in the Bible.
I quoted the part that needs to be addressed. If you feel the need to justify what all you said then you are of course free to do so.
That's part of the false doctrine of the false teachers who refuse to accept all the Lord says in His Word.
The fact of the matter is there are people how have been legitimately saved and then fell away later and spent eternity apart from the Lord according to scripture.
No, the Lord teaches in His Word that those who do not abide in Him baring fruit are taken away by the Father.
Read John 15 and explain to the Lord how He does not know what He's talking about
You are suggesting that a saved person can in fact live in disobedience to the Lord and still be saved.
That's not only false doctrine, it's a trick of the devil that ensnares those who don't believe all of God's Word
The key here is to abide in Christ.
You should really look in to learning how to do that and depart from living in sin.
1 John 1:7
But if we walk in the light as He is in the light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus His Son cleanses us from all sin.
1 John 3:6
Whosoever abideth in him sinneth not: whosoever sinneth hath not seen him, neither known him.
1 John 5:18
We know that whosoever is born of God sinneth not; but he that is begotten of God keepeth himself, and that wicked one toucheth him not.
The Lord speaks about all the people that take joy in living in sin insisting that they are sinners
1 John 3:8
He that committeth sin is of the devil
These people might want to turn away from sin and turn back unto the Lord quickly.
No, those claiming they can live in sin and still be saved are causing others to stumble which is sinful behavior.
The Lord recommends that you cease and desist from living in sin and teaching others to live in sin.
Speaking of sin that is on our record since we have all sinned.
God's Word literally teaches Christians are to sin not, so you're going to have to learn to rightly discern the Word of Truth
Here's a few instructional passages for you to meditate on:
1 John 3:8 - He that committeth sin is of the devil
John 8:34 - Whosoever committeth sin is the servant of sin.
1 John 3:7 - Little children, let no man deceive you: he that DOES righteousness is righteous, even as he is righteous.
1 John 3:9 - Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.
1 John 3:6 - Whosoever abideth in him sinneth not: whosoever sinneth hath not seen him, neither known him.
1 John 5:18 - We know that whosoever is born of God sinneth not; but he that is begotten of God keepeth himself, and that wicked one toucheth him not.
1 Corinthians 15:34 - Awake to righteousness, and sin not; for some have not the knowledge of God: I speak this to your shame.
1 John 2:1 - My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not.
1 John 1:7 - But if we walk in the light as He is in the light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus His Son cleanses us from all sin.
Galatians 5:16 - Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfil the lust of the flesh.
Galatians 5:24 - they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts.
2 Peter 1:4 - Whereby are given unto us exceeding great and precious promises: that by these ye might be partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust.
2 Peter 2:14,15 - Having eyes full of adultery, and that cannot cease from sin; beguiling unstable souls: an heart they have exercised with covetous practices; cursed children:
Which have forsaken the right way, and are gone astray, following the way of Balaam the son of Bosor, who loved the wages of unrighteousness;
Romans 6:1,2 - What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound?
God forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein?
Romans 6:16 - Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?
Romans 6:7 - for he who has died hath been set free from the sin.
Romans 11:22 - Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God: on them which fell, severity; but toward thee, goodness, if thou continue in his goodness: otherwise thou also shalt be cut off.
Romans 8:1 - There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.
Romans 8:6 - For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace.
Romans 8:13,14 - For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.
For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.
2 Timothy 2:21 - If a man therefore purge himself from these, he shall be a vessel unto honor, sanctified, and meet for the master's use, and prepared unto every good work.
Romans 12:1 - I beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that ye present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, which is your reasonable service.
James 1:22 - Be ye doers of the word, and not hearers only, deceiving your own selves
I would respectfully suggest that the point still needs to be demonstrated from the text itself.
The warning passages certainly speak of people who fall away, but the question under discussion is whether those individuals were truly saved unto eternal life or whether they had experienced the blessings and influences of the covenant community without possessing saving faith.
Scripture contains both warnings and promises, so we should be careful not to emphasize one set of passages at the expense of the other.
For example, John writes, "They went out from us, but they were not of us" (1 John 2:19), while Jesus says of His sheep, "I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish" (John 10:28).
Therefore, if one concludes that a genuinely saved person can ultimately be lost, that conclusion should account for these passages as well.
The warnings are real and should be taken seriously, but their existence alone does not settle the question.
The proper approach is to examine all the relevant texts together and allow Scripture to define how the warnings and promises fit with one another.
Wow, so no need to abide in Christ then?
We can all go back to living in sin and still be saved then, right?
Are you back again ScooterJackson aka JayWalker aka HigherGospel aka DallasMan aka Stan_the_Man aka JimmyTheLock? Your MO is the same.
Istead of trolling and carpet bombing me with numerous passages of scripture that you filtered through your eisegesis, why don't we discuss one or two of those verses at a time. I will start off.
Now John is not teaching sinless perfection as you may suppose. 1 John 3:9 - Robertson's Word Pictures in the New Testament:
Doeth no sin (αμαρτιαν ου ποιε). Linear present active indicative as in verse 1 John 3:4 like αμαρτανε in verse 1 John 3:8. The child of God does not have the habit of sin.
His seed (σπερμα αυτου). God's seed, "the divine principle of life" (Vincent). Cf. 1 John 3:1.
And he cannot sin (κα ου δυνατα αμαρτανειν). This is a wrong translation, for this English naturally means "and he cannot commit sin" as if it were κα ου δυνατα αμαρτειν or αμαρτησα (second aorist or first aorist active infinitive). The present active infinitive αμαρτανειν can only mean "and he cannot go on sinning," as is true of αμαρτανε in verse 1 John 3:8 and αμαρτανων in verse 1 John 3:6.
For the aorist subjunctive to commit a sin see αμαρτητε and αμαρτη in 1 John 2:1. A great deal of false theology has grown out of a misunderstanding of the tense of αμαρτανειν here. Paul has precisely John's idea in Romans 6:1 επιμενωμεν τη αμαρτια (shall we continue in sin, present active linear subjunctive) in contrast with αμαρτησωμεν in Romans 6:15 (shall we commit a sin, first aorist active subjunctive).
StudyLight.org https://www.studylight.org/commentaries/eng/rwp/1-john-3.html
I was thinking the same, I am also wondering if LightBeamRider is a second account here?
Are you denying it? LightBeamRider is a second account for who?I was thinking the same, I am also wondering if LightBeamRider is a second account here?
Not denying,
I stated I am thinking the same as you, meaning I agree, I just wonder about the other account, I find the expressive style and dogmatic approach very similar, just conjecture on the other.
1 John 1:7 - if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin
By default your eisegesis claims we are still in right standing with the Lord even if we walk in darkness not abiding in Christ.
1 John 1:6 - If we say that we have fellowship with him, and walk in darkness, we lie, and do not the truth
Straw man argument. 1 John 1:6 - If we say that we have fellowship with Him, and walk in darkness, we lie and do not practice the truth. 7 But if we walk in the light as He is in the light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus Christ His Son cleanses us from all sin.
*Walking in darkness is DESCRIPTIVE of children of the devil. Walking in the light is DESCRIPTIVE of children of God. Only those who are saved/born again believers are in the light.
Acts 26:18 - to open their eyes, in order to turn them from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan to God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins and an inheritance among those who are sanctified by faith in Me.
2 Corinthians 6:14 - Do not be unequally yoked together with unbelievers. For what fellowship has righteousness with lawlessness? And what communion has light with darkness?
Ephesians 5:8 - for you were formerly darkness, but now you are Light in the Lord; walk as children of Light. Children of the devil walk in darkness, not in the light. Children of God walk in the light, not in darkness. IF confirms these positions in verses 6 and 7. It's one or the other.
In 1 John 2:9, we read - He who says he is in the light, and hates his brother, is in darkness until now. In vs. 11 - But he who hates his brother is in darkness and walks in darkness, and does not know where he is going, because the darkness has blinded his eyes.
*Compare with 1 John 3:10 - In this the children of God and the children of the devil are manifest: Whoever does not practice righteousness is not of God, (compare with 1 John 1:6 - does not practice the truth) nor is he who does not love his brother.
*Notice that walks in darkness, hates his brother is DESCRIPTIVE of children of the devil. *HERMENEUTICS.
Sorry, st first I thought that I was responding to ScooterJackson. lol
That is not true for many of the bible's uses of the word "flesh".
Some times it is a worldly oriented man that is described as "flesh".
Other times flesh is just skin and bones, and they cannot make anyone commit a sin.
John the Baptist wasn't.
Until the advent of the Mosaic Law nobody was born under the Law of sin and death.
If.
Isn't our reaction to hearing the message of Christ the divider of saved from unsaved ?
I agree, and that step is repenting from sin and being baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of past sins.
It is followed by the gift of the Holy Ghost.
I agree.
Thanks be to God, my behavior manifests from Whom I have been reborn.
Everyone's behavior manifests from whose seed they have been born.
Sinners have not been reborn from God's seed.
You are talking out of both sides of your mouth, it seems.
First you are rebuking the faithfully obedient, and then you acknowledge that some are empowered by God to remain faithfully obedient !
Which is it going to be ?
But totally forgot to consider the verse instructing Christians to not sin. Weird!
What do you do with those instructions in God's Word telling us to not sin anyhow?
Your rebuke so far is very weak and has advocated not acknowledging all the Lord says in His Word.
1 John 1:7 - if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin.
How about you? Do you walk in the Light?
Freed18, yes, it is true. You asked me what I meant when I used the word flesh and that is what I meant
You are trying to have it both ways. You cannot claim that human reaction, repenting, and water baptism are the dividers that cause salvation, and yet turn around and agree that salvation is an unalterable spiritual family affair based strictly on a relationship established in eternity past between the Father and His spiritual children.
A child's reaction or behavior does not cause its own birth. Yet you claim that our reaction to hearing the message is the divider, and that repenting and water baptism are the necessary steps to get placed under the law of the Spirit of life. You may think that because John the Baptist was filled with the Holy Spirit in the womb - that he was exempt from Adam's sin. But John was conceived of the natural seed of Zacharias and Elizabeth. He was born under the law of sin and death by physical nature. The presence of the Holy Spirit was not a physical virgin birth; it was spiritual regeneration applying salvation to a passive recipient.
Luke 1:15 flatly states he was filled with the Holy Ghost even from his mother's womb, and Luke 1:41 shows him quickened and leaping for joy before birth. An unborn infant cannot hear an earthly sermon, execute human willpower, or be baptized in water. Yet John was justified and regenerated before birth because from eternity past, he belonged to God's spiritual family. From that pre-existing eternal spiritual relationship, the regeneration, the quickening, the repenting, and the faith came. But they were not the cause of it. If salvation depends on man's actions in any sense to obtain or maintain it, then Christ is not the Savior and man saves himself. You either stand on a complete Savior who perfectly provided salvation and everything associated to salvation, or you stand on human willpower - it can/must only be one way or the other, but not both.