Oh i get it now. You want it to be like the old days where the woman has no say. Its just your my wife now.
Why Are So Many Christians Still Single?
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Oh i get it now. You want it to be like the old days where the woman has no say. Its just your my wife now.
Yeah. People are, most likely, not going to change their mind about whether or not they're attracted to you. And they can't really, because we don't really choose who we're attracted to or not. It's just something that happens when you start spending time around interesting and good-looking people, haha.
Unfortunately, when the people we like turn us down, we can start to hope that this will be the case. That's usually where my own mind races to whenever I get turned down, but it takes time to process bad experiences like rejection so that you can move on. It's like the stages of grief, sometimes.
Attraction isn't really a choice. We don't really choose who we find good-looking or interesting. But we can certainly choose how we treat these people after they turn us down.
So, yeah, once you're in the "friend-zone"......you're done.
True lol.
And I want to thank all the people who make it clear that they only want to be friends. That saves us from wasting our time and emotional energy that could be best invested in someone who actually does want to be with us.
More accurately, Lovette doesn't want anyone to marry, because he, personally has no desire for it and doesn't understand why some people want it or value it.
From what I've gathered on the other threads, Lovette, personally has no desire for marriage, and he finds it puzzling that, of about eight billion people on the planet, they're not all exactly like him.
There's only 2 real possibilities for that extreem line of thinking. One is a couple of traumatizing rejections or he thinks women need to sit down and shut up cause men run the world.
Id say more than likely reason two has led to lots of reason ones. And its oh so infuriating.
I don't understand why some people are opposed to the act of dating or to people dating. When I say dating, I don't mean immoral dating.
When I've gotten into a relationship, it has happened organically. We happened upon each other (either at work or online) and after spending time together and realizing we wanted to be in a relationship, then the fun stuff happens...going on dates together. Lunch out, hiking together, picnics, museums, etc. You get to know each other and grow together...or realize you aren't for each other. But, it's very important to spend time together before marriage (if that's your mutual goal). It's especially a bad idea these days to hop into a marriage quickly without really getting to know each other, imho.
Generally speaking dating in western culture is going out with various people within the same time period, sometimes people will say they are dating exclusively which is a bit closer to courtship.
I think courtship has a marriage focus, dating may or may not be.
I hope I'm not interrupting in any way, but just wanted to add in another perspective on the "friend-zone" topic.
One of my best friends is a guy I met in real life (he's never been on CC,) and we've been friends for almost 25 years. I joke with him that we're practically an old married couple and don't even know it, lol. The general reason we've never dated is because we always had distance between us that was impossible to work out.
I never thought we'd make it as a couple; for a while he thought we would. But life changed over so many years, and I'm glad "we" (as a couple) didn't work out because so many factors changed. Several years ago, he did talk about what if we eventually got married someday, but it just doesn't seem to be in the deck.
Our lives are very separate, very different, and still across the country from each other. Neither can move due to family situations. But the friendship has gone on for all this time, and at this point, it's looking like a "'til death do us part" situation, lol.
I think what sealed things for us is that we were so young that we kind of emotionally dragged each other through the toughest times of our lives. As strange as it sounds, I think that's part of why our friendship has been so successful -- we never had relationship issues that took priority or clouded our judgment.
We used to fight like cats and dogs in a volcano that was hit by a hurricane, just because we had different ideas of how to approach certain situations, lol. We both have very strong personalities -- but if I hadn't met him, I wouldn't know that friendships can survive even the bitterest of strife. But we each made our own decisions, whether or not we listened to each other, and even if it didn't work out, we didn't hold it over the other person's head. If either of us made a decision about finances or moving or a big life decision, it didn't drag the other one along.
We were very young when we met with a very limited scope in life. Over the years, he's become very successful and has a lot of 20-something Instagram gold diggers after him now, lol. I tease him about it all the time. But is not attracted at all to superficial women or those who don't work, and that's another part of what kept up our friendship. We encourage each other as we each work to meet our life goals.
He's been a huge blessing in my life and there would definitely feel like something is missing without him.
What I like best is that although life and God shaped us, we both had our lives shattered early on and had to rebuild from the ground up, but even after all these decades, our core principles haven't changed -- and that seems to be what preserves our friendship.
Very interesting discussion!!!
I'm enjoying reading each other's thought processes behind their decisions.
I can definitely see why, in a lot of cases, "trying to be friends" might seem like a waste of time, because the one who keeps holding out hope is eventually going to feel jilted.
Why, I've even have to put aside my popcorn (but only temporarily!!!) so that I can keep up!
One of my best friends is a guy I met in real life (he's never been on CC,) and we've been friends for almost 25 years. I joke with him that we're practically an old married couple and don't even know it, lol. The general reason we've never dated is because we always had distance between us that was impossible to work out.
I never thought we'd make it as a couple; for a while he thought we would. But life changed over so many years, and I'm glad "we" (as a couple) didn't work out because so many factors changed. Several years ago, he did talk about what if we eventually got married someday, but it just doesn't seem to be in the deck.
Our lives are very separate, very different, and still across the country from each other. Neither can move due to family situations. But the friendship has gone on for all this time, and at this point, it's looking like a "'til death do us part" situation, lol.
I think what sealed things for us is that we were so young that we kind of emotionally dragged each other through the toughest times of our lives. As strange as it sounds, I think that's part of why our friendship has been so successful -- we never had relationship issues that took priority or clouded our judgment.
We used to fight like cats and dogs in a volcano that was hit by a hurricane, just because we had different ideas of how to approach certain situations, lol. We both have very strong personalities -- but if I hadn't met him, I wouldn't know that friendships can survive even the bitterest of strife. But we each made our own decisions, whether or not we listened to each other, and even if it didn't work out, we didn't hold it over the other person's head. If either of us made a decision about finances or moving or a big life decision, it didn't drag the other one along.
We were very young when we met with a very limited scope in life. Over the years, he's become very successful and has a lot of 20-something Instagram gold diggers after him now, lol. I tease him about it all the time. But is not attracted at all to superficial women or those who don't work, and that's another part of what kept up our friendship. We encourage each other as we each work to meet our life goals.
He's been a huge blessing in my life and there would definitely feel like something is missing without him.
What I like best is that although life and God shaped us, we both had our lives shattered early on and had to rebuild from the ground up, but even after all these decades, our core principles haven't changed -- and that seems to be what preserves our friendship.
Very interesting discussion!!!
I'm enjoying reading each other's thought processes behind their decisions.
I can definitely see why, in a lot of cases, "trying to be friends" might seem like a waste of time, because the one who keeps holding out hope is eventually going to feel jilted.
Why, I've even have to put aside my popcorn (but only temporarily!!!) so that I can keep up!
If people don't get to know each other in friend zone, then how to decide attractive or not?
I think exclusive friend zone is good to find out if attractive to each other. 3 to 6 month friend zone, exclusive, meeting in real person, in many group settings. If both agree to pursue more seriously, bring in pastoral counciling.
I think exclusive friend zone is good to find out if attractive to each other. 3 to 6 month friend zone, exclusive, meeting in real person, in many group settings. If both agree to pursue more seriously, bring in pastoral counciling.
I think some people have the idea that dating is somehow too "worldly" or something, and thus not something that Christians should be doing. I mean, the Bible does talk about marriage, but it doesn't actually say anything, really, about how to get married, or how people should get married. The Bible doesn't even mention "praying for your future spouse."
According to some people, you shouldn't date at all, and instead pray for God to lead you to the "right one." Which implies that there's some sort of "soulmate" out there who God intended just for you. Of course, the Bible doesn't teach us anything about "soulmates" (see 1 Corinthians 7:39, for instance)
That's how people came up with "courtship," because it just seemed "holier." They might have said things like "Dating isn't in the Bible, you know." OK. Is "courtship" in the Bible?
So sure, you could conclude that dating is wrong and that the only way to find God’s "one and only match" is to wait for some sort of "sign from God." I'm sure lots of people who go that route end up waiting.....and waiting....and waiting.....
Sure, dating is more of a cultural phenomenon than a "Biblical" one. But just because it’s not found in the Bible doesn’t mean that we can’t apply biblical truth to our dating relationships.
If you try to look up the differences between "dating" and "courtship," well, it can get kinda weird. Apparently, if you choose to date, you're not committing to marriage. In contrast, if you choose to "court," it means you're both prepared to make a commitment to marriage.
Huh?
I don't know if the whole "courtship" movement is still around, but it seems to me that the people who pushed that also pushed the idea that dating is for heathens, pagans, etc. If you choose to date, well, it means that you're selfish, impulsive, immature, don't care about commitment or boundaries. Weird how this stuff became normalized in some churches during that period. Courtship also seemed to involve the convenient and comforting idea that God will orchestrate some epic love story without the Christian having to lift a finger. Gee, wouldn't that be nice?
And, of course, lots of women have been taught that a "real man" should be the one to make the first move, and if he doesn't, then he's unworthy of consideration. Now, I do, personally, think that guys should initiate, just because that's what, according to statistics at least, women do, expect, but, again. A lot of this stuff is more "cultural" than "biblical."
Of course you can date while honoring God. And you don't have to engage in weird rules about side hugs, no kissing, chaperones, or committing to marriage on your first date.
Oh, OK, interesting.
Yeah, I guess I can't help thinking like a man.
Still, I just think there's a difference between, on one hand, forming a friendship with the opposite sex through group interactions first (like a church young-adult group) and then having mutual interest grow, and, on the other hand, being attracted to someone and then trying to form a friendship in the hope that she'll change her mind later and decide she wants something more. That just seems a bit manipulative to me, but perhaps it does happen that way sometimes.
Hi Rod, I do see where you're coming from and it could just be a difference in personality (I'm not a standard female in a lot of ways so my viewpoint obviously wouldn't represent all women).
To me, there's a huge difference between "just friends" and "friends first "
"Just friends" would mean someone I have no romantic interest in. Either we have explored the possibility and one of us found it untenable, or I know him well enough to know it would never work so I'm not going to let anything romantic continue or get started in the first place. Guys should not invest emotionally in those situations.
"Friends first" is (to me personally) very different. It means I am interested in the guy but want to get to know him better before actually dating. It's my way of saying that I'm interested but don't want him to invest too deeply. I would even be fine with him approaching other women during this stage. Both guys I have dated were "friends first" for about 6 months. In both cases I had no idea if the guys were interested in more than friendship but I knew that I was.
The "friends first" stage can probably be skipped if both parties are spending time regularly in a group setting (such as a mixed Bible study), that would be ideal for sure but not everyone has that option. And I'm definitely not going to date a guy I don't know at all, it's a good way to pick up a stalker
.
Why, I've even have to put aside my popcorn (but only temporarily!!!) so that I can keep up!
This forum is working wonders for your local popcorn economy, I'm sure.
I think some people have the idea that dating is somehow too "worldly" or something, and thus not something that Christians should be doing. I mean, the Bible does talk about marriage, but it doesn't actually say anything, really, about how to get married, or how people should get married. The Bible doesn't even mention "praying for your future spouse."
According to some people, you shouldn't date at all, and instead pray for God to lead you to the "right one." Which implies that there's some sort of "soulmate" out there who God intended just for you. Of course, the Bible doesn't teach us anything about "soulmates" (see 1 Corinthians 7:39, for instance)
That's how people came up with "courtship," because it just seemed "holier." They might have said things like "Dating isn't in the Bible, you know." OK. Is "courtship" in the Bible?
So sure, you could conclude that dating is wrong and that the only way to find God’s "one and only match" is to wait for some sort of "sign from God." I'm sure lots of people who go that route end up waiting.....and waiting....and waiting.....
Sure, dating is more of a cultural phenomenon than a "Biblical" one. But just because it’s not found in the Bible doesn’t mean that we can’t apply biblical truth to our dating relationships.
If you try to look up the differences between "dating" and "courtship," well, it can get kinda weird. Apparently, if you choose to date, you're not committing to marriage. In contrast, if you choose to "court," it means you're both prepared to make a commitment to marriage.
Huh?
I don't know if the whole "courtship" movement is still around, but it seems to me that the people who pushed that also pushed the idea that dating is for heathens, pagans, etc. If you choose to date, well, it means that you're selfish, impulsive, immature, don't care about commitment or boundaries. Weird how this stuff became normalized in some churches during that period. Courtship also seemed to involve the convenient and comforting idea that God will orchestrate some epic love story without the Christian having to lift a finger. Gee, wouldn't that be nice?
And, of course, lots of women have been taught that a "real man" should be the one to make the first move, and if he doesn't, then he's unworthy of consideration. Now, I do, personally, think that guys should initiate, just because that's what, according to statistics at least, women do, expect, but, again. A lot of this stuff is more "cultural" than "biblical."
Of course you can date while honoring God. And you don't have to engage in weird rules about side hugs, no kissing, chaperones, or committing to marriage on your first date.
I get called a heathen just for the music I listen to, I could care less if I'm called me a heathen when comes to how I go about acquiring a relationship. I actually haven't really dated before labeling ourselves as being in a relationship, which probably really sounds like I'm a heathen
I just personally feel more comfortable going about it the organic way. If/when I end up in a relationship again, it will come about organically as is the norm for me.
I definitely don't want the weird rules of courting. I don't need nor want a chaperone and I'm perfectly fine with kissing and embracing (actually, those are requirements for me! lol). And I certainly am not going to commit to marriage on the first date or early on. Someone suggested marriage to me within 2 weeks of being in a relationship. That's way too soon. As a guy friend that I used to swap relationship advice with once told me, "When things are rushed, they go wrong."
This forum is working wonders for your local popcorn economy, I'm sure.
Business is a popping, that's for sure!!
Hi Rod, I do see where you're coming from and it could just be a difference in personality (I'm not a standard female in a lot of ways so my viewpoint obviously wouldn't represent all women).
To me, there's a huge difference between "just friends" and "friends first "
"Just friends" would mean someone I have no romantic interest in. Either we have explored the possibility and one of us found it untenable, or I know him well enough to know it would never work so I'm not going to let anything romantic continue or get started in the first place. Guys should not invest emotionally in those situations.
"Friends first" is (to me personally) very different. It means I am interested in the guy but want to get to know him better before actually dating. It's my way of saying that I'm interested but don't want him to invest too deeply. I would even be fine with him approaching other women during this stage. Both guys I have dated were "friends first" for about 6 months. In both cases I had no idea if the guys were interested in more than friendship but I knew that I was.
The "friends first" stage can probably be skipped if both parties are spending time regularly in a group setting (such as a mixed Bible study), that would be ideal for sure but not everyone has that option. And I'm definitely not going to date a guy I don't know at all, it's a good way to pick up a stalker
Yeah. I mean I'm sure it's happened, where people are friends first, and then it evolves into more. i don't doubt that at all.
And now that I'm thinking about it, I do have a few couples in my friends circle that started out that way, usually from meeting each other in group settings, like a young-adult Bible study.
This makes sense though, because they probably didn't go into the situation looking for someone. They just happened to bump into each other in life, became friends, and then further feelings came about. I don't personally look at that as a friend zone situation.
Thank you so much!!!
Yup, that's me right there in the picture in my post, holding all that corn right over that piping-hot volcano!!
Everyone get your popcorn buckets ready!!
It took me a while to grow the scruffy facial hair, but I'm sure @CarriePie will approve.
(Seriously, thank you, I appreciate the kind words.)
Maybe we should also ask why are so many Christians divorced?
I hear that a lot. I often hear it when Christians are trying to "caution" young singles about marriage. However, apparently, according to some studies I've seen, Christians that are active in their Christian life and go to church regularly actually have significantly lower rates of divorce than non-Christians.
People who "nominally" identify themselves as Christians divorce at similar rates, though.