Believe

[LightningClap0002]

This post may be more appropriate in another part of the forums, but I post it here because of my respect for those that frequent this particular area. I hope that it can foster deeper discussion than is normal around here. If not... oh well.

I recently was asked if I believed in Jesus. I was raised a christian. Unlike many stories, I wasn't ever "just going through the motions." I made my faith personal and real. I accepted Jesus and dedicated my life to love.

Well I went through a period of doubt. My dedication to love never failed, but my faith was almost gone. I had questions that I couldn't answer, there were problems that just kept getting swept under the rug. It seemed like the answers that were forthcoming were all so empty.

Anyways, someone finally was able to answer one of the most fundamental questions I was wrestling with. I thought I had moved past that stage of doubting. Until I was asked "do you believe in Jesus? I mean really truly believe?" I instantly thought "YES! I believe." But before I was able to respond it hit me. I don't think I really can say that. I believe the Bible is truth. I believe that sin is...well, sinful. I believe the devil is there tempting us. I believe we are free from sin and that we have been forgiven. I even believe that Jesus lived and died exactly as the Bible says. But do I believe in Jesus? I wasn't so sure. All I really knew was that I believed that I needed to believe in Jesus.

So what do you guys think? Is my mind just over-complicating something simple? Is believing in Jesus more than a sum of the parts? Am i just inventing a difference between believing in Jesus and believing that you need to believe? Is this just the devil messing with me? What does it really mean to believe IN Jesus?

 

[Ritter]

Belief in Jesus is accepting a reality. It doesn't need all the bells and whistles commonly associated with conversion. It is a moment that is quiet and subtle yet life-changing. It is something that we can only attempt to put into words (ie the sinners prayer).

I understand your dialectic. My faith is the same way. I keep going back and forth with questioning. As I was walking to my car today I went so far as to think that this world is too screwed up and always has been too screwed up to be created by a God with a mind for order. This is something I still have difficulty with, but I still believe there is a God. I still believe there is a law. Why? I truly don't know.

If you'd like I could spit apologetics out right now that answers that question, but all that really keeps me in Christ's camp is an unrelenting call home.

The act of belief is simple, but we riddle it with complexity. Faith is looking that complexity in the eye and believing in spite of it all.

 

[Relena7]

I struggle with questioning and overcomplicating things as well, as some might have picked up off my other posts here.

I believe that Jesus is real, and died for us.
What confuses me right now is how God talks to us in such a "left-brained" way in the bible, especially in the old testament, like we need all kinds of rigid rules and everything is in black and white and there are laws for many things with intimidating stern warnings.
But he also created us with an imaginative and intuitive "right brain", and according to the bible, he made us in His image. So having a right brain isn't "evil" or anything, and some of us have got these artistic odd ball talents that can create great beauty if we feel no fear. He MUST have given us for some amazing reason. But in order to create, we must forget rules exist, to open the doors of non-criticism and natural flow. But the bible is full of rules, therefore God Himself must be full of rules...*head explodes*....

Therefore I feel stuck when I think about God these days. Like I'm not supposed to use my talents...but I know that's not true or else I wouldn't have been like this since I was a small child.


(Forgive my rambling, this is a weird time of life for me. I've had a lot of epiphanies in a short amount of time lately and things are still messy and settling in my brain.)

 

[Jullianna]

God's "rules" are not as mind blowing as we so often make them out to be. As with any true parent, God doesn't want us doing anything that will be hurtful to us in any way, even if we don't see the hurtfulness of the thing because of our limited view. And because He created all of us and loves us all, He doesn't want us doing anything that will hurt anyone else either. Even when we can't grasp how our actions might hurt someone else at some point in time (the so-called gray areas), if not immediately. This is what Jesus was talking about when He summed up the law thusly:

MATTHEW 22: 37 Jesus replied: “‘Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.’[c] 38 This is the first and greatest commandment. 39 And the second is like it: ‘Love your neighbor as yourself.’[d] 40 All the Law and the Prophets hang on these two commandments.”

Do I believe in Jesus? Absolutely. Not only do I believe in Him, I know Him intimately. That's what He wants. He reveals Himself to us along the way. "From glory to glory" as the old folks say. Each time He takes us by the hand and leads us or silently allows our faith to develop, not by what we see or feel, but because we know what IS, we find Him there. Like any other relationship, it takes an investment. If we want to know Him, we need to spend time with Him. Walking with God in the garden is not a matter of dimension, but an attitude of the heart. Once we get that down deep inside of us, there is no more question as to whether we believe. We know that we know that we know. He is. I wouldn't even want to try to make it through one single day without Him.

God didn't create this world as ugly as it is. He created a perfect world. We're the ones who trashed it, even when He clearly warned us. And He's done absolutely everything that needed to be done to redeem it as well. We have no basis to blame Him. A couple of years ago I became very angry about the abuse of children and cried out to God about it. He showed me that I only see a small portion of it. He sees every single horrific event imaginable every second of everyday all over the planet. And yet He doesn't nuke it. If I were Him, I would have by now. The fact that He hasn't shows me clearly what a patient, merciful God He is for allowing us to live.

 

[LightningClap0002]

God's "rules" are not as mind blowing as we so often make them out to be. As with any true parent, God doesn't want us doing anything that will be hurtful to us in any way, even if we don't see the hurtfulness of the thing because of our limited view. And because He created all of us and loves us all, He doesn't want us doing anything that will hurt anyone else either. Even when we can't grasp how our actions might hurt someone else at some point in time (the so-called gray areas), if not immediately. This is what Jesus was talking about when He summed up the law thusly:

MATTHEW 22: 37 Jesus replied: “‘Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.’[c] 38 This is the first and greatest commandment. 39 And the second is like it: ‘Love your neighbor as yourself.’[d] 40 All the Law and the Prophets hang on these two commandments.”

Do I believe in Jesus? Absolutely. Not only do I believe in Him, I know Him intimately. That's what He wants. He reveals Himself to us along the way. "From glory to glory" as the old folks say. Each time He takes us by the hand and leads us or silently allows our faith to develop, not by what we see or feel, but because we know what IS, we find Him there. Like any other relationship, it takes an investment. If we want to know Him, we need to spend time with Him. Walking with God in the garden is not a matter of dimension, but an attitude of the heart. Once we get that down deep inside of us, there is no more question as to whether we believe. We know that we know that we know. He is. I wouldn't even want to try to make it through one single day without Him.

God didn't create this world as ugly as it is. He created a perfect world. We're the ones who trashed it, even when He clearly warned us. And He's done absolutely everything that needed to be done to redeem it as well. We have no basis to blame Him. A couple of years ago I became very angry about the abuse of children and cried out to God about it. He showed me that I only see a small portion of it. He sees every single horrific event imaginable every second of everyday all over the planet. And yet He doesn't nuke it. If I were Him, I would have by now. The fact that He hasn't shows me clearly what a patient, merciful God He is for allowing us to live.

Well... I think you may have mistakenly answered my questions. Your focus on knowing Jesus reminded me of something.

Belief must precede everything else. How could I pray to Jesus if I didn't believe? How could I thank Him and praise Him if I didn't believe? How could I love Him if I didn't believe? How could I attribute anything that happens in my life to Him if I don't believe?

I do all of these things, so yes, I absolutely must believe in Jesus.

(Wow, this thread took much fewer posts than I expected to get to some sort of answer, guess I picked the right place)

 

[Jullianna]

Redeemer Lyrics
Artist(Band):Nicole C. Mullen

Who taught the sun where to stand in the morning?
and Who told the ocean you can only come this far?
and Who showed the moon where to hide 'til evening?
Whose words alone can catch a falling star?

Well I know my Redeemer lives
I know my Redeemer lives:
Let all creations testify
Let this, life within me cry
I know my Redeemer lives, yeah.

The very same God that spins things in orbit
runs to the weary, the worn and the weak
And the same gentle hands that hold me when I'm broken
They conquered death to bring me victory

Now I know my Redeemer lives
I know my Redeemer lives
Let all creations testify
Let this life within we cry
I know my Redeemer, He lives
To take away my shame
And He lives forever, I'll proclaim

That the payment for my sin
Was the precious life He gave
But now He's alive and
There's an empty grave.

And I know my Redeemer lives
I know my Redeemer lives
Let all creations testify
Let this life within me cry
I know my Redeemer,

I know my Redeemer
I know my Redeemer lives
I know my Redeemer lives
I know that I know that I know that I know that I know my redeemer lives
Because He lives I can face tomorrow
I Know I know
He lives He lives yeah, yeah I spoke with him this morning
He lives He lives, the tomb is empty,
He lives I gotta tell everybody
​

Nicole C. Mullen - My Redeemer Lives - YouTube <--------------------listen to the song here

Sounds like you've moved on from "I believe. Lord, help me with my unbelief" (Mark 9:24) to I know that I know that I know.

Awesome!

God bless!

 

[Catlynn]

I think that (don't quote me cause my memory tends to fail me) "believe" essentially means "by your life." in other words, you show your belief in something or someone through your actions and the way you live your life. From what I've read so far, you most certainly believe in Jesus. I think that we can easily slip into a negative mindset about our walk with God if we aren't constantly and consistently in the word and in prayer. I know it happens to me as well.
God bless, my friend! I'm glad God's speaking to you and showing you new things!

 

[Ritter]

He showed me that I only see a small portion of it. He sees every single horrific event imaginable every second of everyday all over the planet. And yet He doesn't nuke it. If I were Him, I would have by now. The fact that He hasn't shows me clearly what a patient, merciful God He is for allowing us to live.

Very good point! If I were him I would've went Dr. Strangelove on this globe sometime between Adam biting the Apple and the dawn of the first Muslim Caliphate.

The thought that always gets me is where do we get our conception of order and fairness if not from God? His conduct with us shows this.